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Theresa May Statement: June 8th General Election requested
- Thread starter Wvrs
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Huw_Dawson
Member
I mean it says as the first line on that page that he generally votes for gay rights.
That website is good for simple stuff but you do have to dig in to understand the whys and wherefores.
This is just smear stuff, good to see that the marching orders are already out and folks are scared of the party run by a Preston lad.
I think you need to go check what the definition of liberal means. We're not the USA, and the lib dems are absolutely liberal.
Liberal doesn't mean progressive. That's a uniquely American perspective.
Audioboxer
Member
I foresee a shit load of SNP campaigning in places with older populations. If there is anywhere that might flip Tory up here it's probably in such places. The "Better together" drum is going to be beating loud over the next few weeks as the best way to attack the SNP.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-39265997
Unlike some GAFers have said on here this is not a reason to exclude old people from voting, but trying extra hard to engage with them. It's not easy, even just studying psychology for a few years bombards me with how difficult it can be to influence an older mind. Politics ain't easy though, Mr Corbyn and Co are finding that out.
What is tragic to see, though, is young minds, which many on GAF will be, shouting about how they're staying at home or not voting in protest. That is one way to shoot yourself in the foot compared to 'old people'. They'll wheel themselves out of nursing homes to get down and vote. The very groundwork to getting change is to vote every single time you are able to vote, regardless of how bleak things are, and that will ingrain a positive mantra in your psyche and those around you.
El Psy Kongroo.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-39265997
Unlike some GAFers have said on here this is not a reason to exclude old people from voting, but trying extra hard to engage with them. It's not easy, even just studying psychology for a few years bombards me with how difficult it can be to influence an older mind. Politics ain't easy though, Mr Corbyn and Co are finding that out.
What is tragic to see, though, is young minds, which many on GAF will be, shouting about how they're staying at home or not voting in protest. That is one way to shoot yourself in the foot compared to 'old people'. They'll wheel themselves out of nursing homes to get down and vote. The very groundwork to getting change is to vote every single time you are able to vote, regardless of how bleak things are, and that will ingrain a positive mantra in your psyche and those around you.
El Psy Kongroo.
The polls might be in favour of Conservatives but maybe this wont just be your normal GE after the Brexit vote hopefully a lot more people actually vote.... if your in a Con seat then vote for the party in second
A vote for Lib Dems/Lab even if they dont win is better than voting no one as then we are guarenteed to end up with Conservatives
A vote for Lib Dems/Lab even if they dont win is better than voting no one as then we are guarenteed to end up with Conservatives
Huw_Dawson
Member
Liberal Democrat means progressive. You are not going to find many libertarians or small-state compassionate conservatives with us.
He abstained in the vote concerning equal marriage.
He later said he regretted doing it but eh.
what the fuck do we do.
if labour wins (they won't) and brexit goes tits up labour is dead.
if labour wins and if brexit goes well then thats good?
if labour loses they are dead.
if the tories win and brexit fucks up the tories can be bludgeoned with causing a mess with brexit.
if the tories win and brexit goes well then i'd argue thats overall good.
the UK needs a left alliance
but then i'd be worried of a retaliatory right alliance.
my outlook on life and society is practically dead
make sure to vote we need to fight for our values as hard as we can. you may not like corbyn but surely we can agree that the conservaties being in power is bad for our country and bad for our people, our friends, families and acquaintances.
if labour wins (they won't) and brexit goes tits up labour is dead.
if labour wins and if brexit goes well then thats good?
if labour loses they are dead.
if the tories win and brexit fucks up the tories can be bludgeoned with causing a mess with brexit.
if the tories win and brexit goes well then i'd argue thats overall good.
the UK needs a left alliance
but then i'd be worried of a retaliatory right alliance.
my outlook on life and society is practically dead
make sure to vote we need to fight for our values as hard as we can. you may not like corbyn but surely we can agree that the conservaties being in power is bad for our country and bad for our people, our friends, families and acquaintances.
OverBlood 3
Banned
I mean it says as the first line on that page that he generally votes for gay rights.
This is just smear stuff, good to see that the marching orders are already out and folks are scared of the party run by a Preston lad.
Smearing the guy? It's all true! I just don't see how anyone could vote for someone who thinks like that but yes he's a top lad from Preston who has not ruled out going into another coalition with the Tories.
There's no way back at all for Labour in Scotland if they even hint at an electoral quid pro quo with the Tories. I fully expect WULLIE RENNIE!!! and the Lib Dems to go along those lines though, being soft-spined quislings is that parties natural habitat.
AHA-Lambda
Member
Yeah, they've really handed the SNP that one
Randy Lanzarote
Member
That's how I've read this GE call. At the moment the Tories slim majority means they need the full backing of all party members to make sure stuff gets passed, which means having to cosy up to the right wing loons of the party. I'm sure this was done with the intention that that the Tories will return to parliament with a larger majority of moderates, she can then ignore the Jacob Rees-Moggs and John Redwoods of the party, and pursue a more moderate Brexit with access to the SM.
Charles Brandon
Member
Why is going into coalition with the Tories such a bad thing? If they were in coalition with the Tories now, brexit wouldn't have happened.
UtterlyPerplexed
Member
Nope.
It's more like a question of how much unfiltered power we're willing to give to Overlord May and her cabal to march into further negotiations from now on while the tight 2 yr clock is already ticking. Chances are, she'll emerge from the whole ordeal looking like she's hardly had to raise her knuckles, put her hands up and say "ah well, guess they weren't willing to concede to our demands. Let's row the island a further fifteen miles out to sea and make it a hard Brexit, lads".
Roberto Larcos
Member
Because being ideologically pure is better than being in power, and implementing some of your policies.
JonnyDBrit
Member
Well, maybe not at the moment, party of protest and all that. Thing is, with UKIP now, a lot of protest voters got to go there instead, while the Tories ate up a good chunk of the small c conservatives in 2015.
Part of what will make this election weird is that the usual dynamics aren't in play anymore.
As one of his constituents, I'd love any outcome that involves ignoring Redwood
Huw_Dawson
Member
He abstained on second reading, which he regrets, and he voted for the final bill.
There isn't an eh. He's the head of the most pro-LGBT party in British politics. Being jittery around Christians is understandable but Farron would not be where he is now if he wasn't pro-LGBT.
He's not going to suddenly go insane if he became PM, and the party would not let him even if he did.
Outside of the borders and East Renfrewshire I don't really see much scope for the Tories to pick up seats. Maybe one of the Edinburgh seat.
People forgot for all their 'resurgence' at Holyrood, they pretty much got stomped on all the FPTP elections in 2016.
This a cross post from UKPOLGAF
Looking at it, there 7 constituencies which you'd think could conceivably change.
Renfrewshire East - SNP have a 3700 lead over labour
Orkney/Shetland - Lib Dem have 820 vote lead over SNP
Berwick/Roxburgh/Selkirk - SNP have 330 vote lead over Tories
Dumfrieshire/Clydesdale/Tweedale - Tory 790 vote lead over SNP
Dunbartonshire East - SNP 2100 vote lead over Lib Dems
Edinburgh South - Labour 2600 vote lead over SNP
Edinburgh West - SNP 3200 vote lead over Lib Dem
In most of the other Constituencies SNP have over 50% of the votes, or very high 40+% which means tactical voting wouldn't make any real difference unless it's a real swing election or SNP turnout is well down (I don't see either occurring). I think the SNP have a good chance to lose Berwick, Dumfries, Renfrewshire and Dumbartonshire East and maybe pick up Orkney and Edinburgh South.
Probably worst case for the SNP is 50-52 seats and best case is probably 56.
Principate
Saint Titanfall
We basically need a coalition type scenario to keep the tories honest throughout this process and then deal with the aftermath of that. Tories having total control is a bad idea. Corbyn is an incompetent fool and thus Labour having total control is a bad idea as unlikely as that is to happen. best case is slimmer to no majority and corbyn out (but that seems like a bit of oxymoron at this point) or just slimmer majority that way whoevers in charge won't be able pass any and all bullshit they want.
Audioboxer
Member
Nope, but if anything will stir Unionist support up here it's the very real concern indyref2 might indeed succeed this time. So expect to see people in their 90's with one foot in the grave loaded onto buses to get down and vote Conservative in the GE. If any seats are getting flipped up here they are going Tory, not Labour. As much as 'Scotland' hates the Tories, and was Labour in the recent past, apathy for Labour is at such a high up here now there might well be a chance for the Conservatives to gain back seats as a protest against the Union being under threat. At one time you could have said Labour would pick up the votes against Scottish independence, but now it really looks like it'll be the Tories. Shows you how fucked Labour is UK wide.
The SNP have to campaign hard in areas with high older populations. Ayrshire is one such place (where I live). We nearly flipped the local elections to SNP last year, wiping out a Tory stronghold to hundreds of votes instead of thousands. It will be interesting to see if it can be flipped this local election which is coming up before the GE. Lots of students around where I live, which is definitely helping turn the tides (the young vs old mindset of pro independence a big player here). The SNP have done well to appeal to the younger adults, but they still face a lot of resistance from the older voters. Scare them around pensions and they'll crumble (and there is a lot of Unionist support in general as it's the UK they know).
All of this is a blessing for Ruth Davidson to avoid the rape clause scandal.
Guys, let's be real - Tim Farron is leader of a "major" party because he was one of seven people in a room who weren't Nick Clegg (and even then, serious consideration was given to Nick Clegg). He's not Barack Obama and if it weren't for Brexit we'd be taking odds on the Liberal Democrats disappearing entirely.
Between the Tories and... the DUP?
The reason a progressive alliance can't work is fourfold:
1) There is a progressive alliance - it's called the Labour Party.
2) Nobody trusts the Lib Dems, and they will run candidates against you in seats you could win and then complain when you do the same.
3) The Greens have one seat. This could jump up to two or reduce to zero.
4) Leftists don't like each other and will fight like a bag of cats at the slightest provocation.
The reason a right wing alliance can't work:
1) There is one - it's called the Conservative Party and it just ate UKIP.
Between the Tories and... the DUP?
The reason a progressive alliance can't work is fourfold:
1) There is a progressive alliance - it's called the Labour Party.
2) Nobody trusts the Lib Dems, and they will run candidates against you in seats you could win and then complain when you do the same.
3) The Greens have one seat. This could jump up to two or reduce to zero.
4) Leftists don't like each other and will fight like a bag of cats at the slightest provocation.
The reason a right wing alliance can't work:
1) There is one - it's called the Conservative Party and it just ate UKIP.
I didn't mean it as a critiscm. But liberal outside the states has a different meaning. The lib dems are not just just a more left wing version of labour (heck, the orange bookers still exist in some form!).
Liberal in economic terms, for example, means very different things.
JonnyDBrit
Member
Wokingham has never voted in a non-conservative candidate
(and I forgot how much the LDs lost in 2015. I expect them to swing back up to 2nd place here in 2017)
Charles Brandon
Member
axisofweevils
Holy crap! Today's real megaton is that more than two people can have the same first name.
Yep, there's no candidate without some skeletons in the closet. Given how terrible Tory rule is, I will happily vote for any party that can beat them. Remember the lesson from America... ."but her emails" indeed.
Labour should look to the future and steer hard into the wave of populism around at the moment. Get Michael Sheen elected as an MP and put him up for leader when Corbyn goes. Elections aren't about policy, they're about personality.
Have Gary Lineker run whilst you're at it. It's not like things could get any worse.
Have Gary Lineker run whilst you're at it. It's not like things could get any worse.
If it worked for Trump...
Royal_Phalanx
Member
So do I go vote for my long term (anti-Corbyn) Labour MP who voted against Article 50 against the whip in my London seat or protest vote Lib Dem? Choices, choices. Remainers better turn out for this one.
18-35's don't vote reliably however so we're still fucked. JUST GO AND VOTE FFS.
18-35's don't vote reliably however so we're still fucked. JUST GO AND VOTE FFS.
It's first past the post, so vote for whoever is most likely to beat the candidate you hate the most
axisofweevils
Holy crap! Today's real megaton is that more than two people can have the same first name.
No TV debates this time. https://t.co/b0ZWSnd85b
Roberto Larcos
Member
What's your constituency?
Royal_Phalanx
Member
Safe Labour seat anyway. So I'll just go for the incumbent Labour MP then. And it's London so hardly anyone voted Leave.
Haha yep, five years of darkness. No hope for Corbyn/Farron to get their voice out to the public outside of through the filter of newspapers/tv
Roberto Larcos
Member
If something crazy enough to put the Lib Dems or Greens into power happened, I think it would, yes. Otherwise, no.
Audioboxer
Member
My fee fees can't handle being challenged on National TV!
Said like a true career politician without a spine who doesn't want to be asked "hard questions".
Not that Corbyn is any good in debates, but that's beside the point. May can't handle being challenged without losing her shit. Politicians are supposed to "love" debating and standing up for what they believe in. That's if they have morals and aren't just in it for the money and power.
May can just sit at Number 10 twiddling her thumbs and she'll get an overwhelming majority. That's not really a good thing, it's nice to see the party leaders and candidates have some tough questions thrown at them, get challenged on matters.
Royal_Phalanx
Member
Unless people voted the Tories out, which isn't likely
At least Corbyn could be forced out if he loses big, I might not have to wait till I'm 35 to have a good government again if I can't leave the country
May is probably a worse retail politician that Corbyn. She's going to conduct a safe campaign via photo-op, soundbite and ad blitz.
The Tory party isn't going to elect more moderates. It's been quite clear since the Brexit vote that the vast majority of the party has gone on full.hard Brexit mode - and the MPs have always been more moderate than the base that will be selecting the potential MPs for this election.
May will have *more* lunatics, not less. But it does mean she won't have to balance the two - the moderates can be safely ignored now. Remember, her aim isn't about getting the best deal, it's about getting good headlines and press and being in power.
Lib Dems have come out this morning and said they will support brexit, haven't they?
And_Gignac
Member
The madwoman did it. Ugh. Despicable.
Goodbye Corbyn, he tried but Labour was beyond salvation.
Goodbye Corbyn, he tried but Labour was beyond salvation.
Damn it, I want my question time special!
Because I choose to vote for policies over personalities.
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