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[Slaythe]

I mean, sorry but this whole debate is a bit preposterous. It's always been like this.

That's like blaming Goku for being shit when Raditz showed up.

If you don't have a clear idea what the next level is, it's basically impossible to reach it.

They always worked like that in Dragon Ball. It's only after being confronted with a power far higher than theirs that they were able to reach then surpass it.

I guess one exception would be SSJ3 but this had huge draw backs and was obtained through unnatural means.

In the future, Gohan had no idea what to aim for since he couldn't feel 17's power and 17 was actively deceiving Gohan to make his fun last longer.
17 hadn't even used 50% of his power (which means it could be 25%) so Gohan aimed for what he thought was more than enough, and paid the price for it.

 

[ElFly]

I mean, sorry but this whole debate is a bit preposterous. It's always been like this.

That's like blaming Goku for being shit when Raditz showed up.

If you don't have a clear idea what the next level is, it's basically impossible to reach it.

...

...

should I quote your avatar

 

[VDenter]

Yeah lots of things could have played out differently like where where is everyone in the afterlife? Did the Androids make it to Kami's Lookout? Did 17/18 make it to Penguin Village?

Whats worse is the fact that they all could have been wished back to life since New Namek exists. But for some reason no one ever mentions this simple solution because reasons?

 

[L Thammy]

Yeah lots of things could have played out differently like where where is everyone in the afterlife? Did the Androids make it to Kami's Lookout? Did 17/18 make it to Penguin Village?

Apparently there are no Sensu Beans in the future, so maybe? But I don't know if that's an anime thing.

I think Penguin Village isn't really a proper part of the Dragonball universe and isn't there unless it's there. Dr. Slump's setting is very different from Dragonball.

 

[wisdom0wl]

Whats worse is the fact that they all could have been wished back to life since New Namek exists. But for some reason no one ever mentions this simple solution because reasons?

Isn't it because they don't know where New Namek is?

 

[Slaythe]

...

...

should I quote your avatar

17 was in the exact same situation, he was the strongest before being instantly passed within 2 hours, and never had the chance the improve since he got absorbed.

 

[caliph95]

Isn't it because they don't know where New Namek is?

I'm probably confused because of Abridged i don't think they knew yeah except probably Goku who has IT

 

[Branson]

Pretty excited for that Kai Final Chapter Blu-Ray that just showed up. Only way I can watch the English dub now. Been watching Kai again to get caught up. Still so good.

 

[VDenter]

Isn't it because they don't know where New Namek is?

Goku and King Kai can easily locate it from other world like they can later in the Cell arc. Plus Urunai Baba could have brought back Goku to earth for a day and probably everybody else like she brought back Gokus grandpa back in DB.

 

[ElFly]

Apparently there are no Sensu Beans in the future, so maybe? But I don't know if that's an anime thing.

I think Penguin Village isn't really a proper part of the Dragonball universe and isn't there unless it's there. Dr. Slump's setting is very different from Dragonball.

Penguin Village is odd because it would fit perfectly with all the other sagas EXCEPT the FT one, where the androids v specifically go around the world destroying everything

it is believable that Arale and his pals are largely ignorant of what's going on in the world and they get continuously blown up and resurrected by the dragon balls

and what's more, the existence of Arale herself makes the whole conceit of extremely powerful androids very plausible...but she should have been dealt with by the androids themselves

the Dr Slump chapter in Super is telling us the old Penguin Village episodes in the Red Ribbon saga were just a cameo we shouldn't take seriously

17 was in the exact same situation, he was the strongest before being instantly passed within 2 hours, and never had the chance the improve since he got absorbed.

...and now he is SSB level after only ever fighting guys with guns?

 

[caliph95]

Penguin Village is odd because it would fit perfectly with all the other sagas EXCEPT the FT one, where the androids v specifically go around the world destroying everything

it is believable that Arale and his pals are largely ignorant of what's going on in the world and they get continuously blown up and resurrected by the dragon balls

and what's more, the existence of Arale herself makes the whole conceit of extremely powerful androids very plausible...but she should have been dealt with by the androids themselves

Arale is God level

 

[ElFly]

Arale is God level

still bitter the zeno friend was not Arale

 

[Slaythe]

...and now he is SSB level after only ever fighting guys with guns?

Frieza got up there fighting Tagoma, a sub Ginyu level, in 4 months.

17 had 13 years.

On top of that,

1) 17 had never trained before, his infinite stamina probably allowed him to push himself harder than most normal beings.

2) 17 said "he didn't just sit around relaxing", that implies putting some effort into training. Fighting guys with guns is his job, not his training. We don't know what his training was. He was completely unfazed by Kaioh's gravity. It'd be cool if we could see how he trained, but stop implying it was just "guys with gunz lolz".

 

[L Thammy]

Penguin Village is odd because it would fit perfectly with all the other sagas EXCEPT the FT one, where the androids v specifically go around the world destroying everything

it is believable that Arale and his pals are largely ignorant of what's going on in the world and they get continuously blown up and resurrected by the dragon balls

and what's more, the existence of Arale herself makes the whole conceit of extremely powerful androids very plausible...but she should have been dealt with by the androids themselves

the Dr Slump chapter in Super is telling us the old Penguin Village episodes in the Red Ribbon saga were just a cameo we shouldn't take seriously

I'm reading Dr. Slump now. While some things are similar like the animal people, you also have thing likes Senbei releasing a balloon to make the Sun jealous and pop the balloon, and use the sun's sweatdrop to wake up wake up a bird. You have Akane whacking a crow with her own sound effect. You have Senbei not hearing what Arale says because he covers up her word balloon. You have Arale crawling out of her panel to talk to Senbei.

The closest thing is in the fight with Yamcha, where Goku hits him so hard he bounces off the top of the frame.

Also, it's distinctly a modern setting aside from Senbei's wacky technology, whereas Dragonball tends towards fantasy and retro-futuristic.

 

[ElFly]

at least we know Freeza trained

more importantly the guy he trained with also became more powerful

meanwhile at the island, we don't know nothing about 17's past

maybe he trained! but since the series has said nothing about it I'm gonna assume he did not

until the series cares to fill up his story a little I will not bother fanfictioning up what the hell happened. it just looks p bad right now. at least the Black saga tried to justify a little Trunks' power level. here we have nothing to work with

I'm reading Dr. Slump now. While some things are similar like the animal people, you also have thing likes Senbei releasing a balloon to make the Sun jealous and pop the balloon, and use the sun's sweatdrop to wake up wake up a bird. You have Akane whacking a crow with her own sound effect. You have Senbei not hearing what Arale says because he covers up her word balloon. You have Arale crawling out of her panel to talk to Senbei.

The closest thing is in the fight with Yamcha, where Goku hits him so hard he bounces off the top of the frame.

Also, it's distinctly a modern setting aside from Senbei's wacky technology, whereas Dragonball tends towards fantasy and retro-futuristic.

eh I've read Dr Slump too. it is wacky as fuck, in ways that Dragon Ball is not, but back in the Red Ribbon saga it looked plausible the General Blue was defeated by Arale (or whatever. I hate the RR saga and I've wotch it once I think). I mean...the original Dragon Ball doesn't work without those chapters cause we don't know what the hell happened to that guy without them

meanwhile in DBSuper you can largely ignore the Arale episode and everything fits

 

[RocknRola]

he must have seen some horrible stuff after he was a SSJ in the FT timeline and yet...no further powerup

edit: this is mostly about how he had to have seen something worse than the head of 16 being stepped on. the whole 16 head issue is p random

Maybe, but then we wouldn't have a proper badass adult Gohan soooooo.... it all kinda works out I guess haha

 

[Slaythe]

at least we know Freeza trained

more importantly the guy he trained with also became more powerful

meanwhile at the island, we don't know nothing about 17's past

maybe he trained! but since the series has said nothing about it I'm gonna assume he did not

until the series cares to fill up his story a little I will not bother fanfictioning up what the hell happened. it just looks p bad right now. at least the Black saga tried to justify a little Trunks' power level. here we have nothing to work with

Still, 4 months vs 13 years.
17 is the ultimate warrior, simple answer.

At least I got you to agree that it is currently a mystery and not "ololz guys with guns lolz" .

 

[Morlas]

Actually if Freiza were to actually train for years like these guys he would easily be the strongest in U7...if not all universes excluding perhaps the Grand Priest.

 

[wisdom0wl]

Actually if Freiza were to actually train for years like these guys he would easily be the strongest in U7...if not all universes excluding perhaps the Grand Priest.

Didn't Frieza peak after those 4 months tho?

 

[Icyflamez96]

I don't understand why one would willingly chose to assume something that doesn't make sense when you could just as easily assume the other option that makes things make a bit more sense. You have to want to have more to complain about at that point.

 

[Linkstrikesback]

Didn't Frieza peak after those 4 months tho?

Unlikely? I mean, we won't know because we won't find out if he could get stronger than that, but he could have at least trained more to get over the golden stamina drain.

 

[Host Samurai]

I think Penguin Village is probably set in another dimension in Dragonball and probably tough to get too. My theory is that it's a place that you just stumble upon for no reason. That might be why the Androids possibly never made it there.

 

[caliph95]

I think Penguin Village is probably set in another dimension in Dragonball and probably tough to get too. My theory is that it's a place that you just stumble upon for no reason. That might be why the Androids possibly never made it there.

If they did we probably wouldn't have a future trunks arc, plus the whole thing is a gag

 

[Real Hero]

Arale really need to be a fighter in the next game. Monaka too but he should be really hard to unlock

 

[Kagari]

New Heroes cards and such: http://www.carddass.com/dbh/sdbh/cardlist/?search=true&category=418004

 

[Hero]

Unlikely? I mean, we won't know because we won't find out if he could get stronger than that, but he could have at least trained more to get over the golden stamina drain.

Goku told him that Frieza would've won if he had trained more and gotten his body used to the new form so it wasn't so taxing. Presumably Frieza unlocked the Golden form and then came to Earth to fight.

 

[Skeeter49]

Isn't it because they don't know where New Namek is?

King Kai could communicate with Trunks. Future Goku has a one day to live pass. Z Goku knows where New Namek is. Future Shin could find it.

 

[Zolo]

New Heroes cards and such: http://www.carddass.com/dbh/sdbh/cardlist/?search=true&category=418004

Hey! They remembered Tien!

 

[Skeeter49]

Tien's the strongest human.

Spoiler

in the future timeline

 

[Real Hero]

those heroes cards are fucking cool.

 

[Jason's Ultimatum]

Still, 4 months vs 13 years.
17 is the ultimate warrior, simple answer.

At least I got you to agree that it is currently a mystery and not "ololz guys with guns lolz" .

17 is jobber for allowing Cell to absorb him.

 

[Slaythe]

17 is jobber for allowing Cell to absorb him.

Cell absorbed millions of people to get above Piccolo and 17. If anything that's Piccolo's fault, not 17's.

 

[RocknRola]

Hmm. Now that I think of it, how will they play off Tien? As in, will he be an experient, smart fighter a la Krillin/Roshi? Will they also make him*strong*? Will he be the new Yamcha?!

 

[ArchedThunder]

Hmm. Now that I think of it, how will they play off Tien? As in, will he be an experient, smart fighter a la Krillin/Roshi? Will they also make him*strong*? Will he be the new Yamcha?!

My guess is that he'll be able to cancel any ki blast like he did to Kamehameha and will have incredibly powerful ki attacks that punch above his own strength.

 

[ElFly]

who cares if Tenshinhan is strong

I wanna know whether he smashed Lunch

 

[L Thammy]

Actually, speaking of Dr. Slump. I feel like Gohan in high school hit a similar note wherein Gohan is a superpowered freak trying to fit into regular human society while having little context to what regular society is.

I think that's why I've had little interest in most of the between-arc stuff in Super. The ordinarily life heartwarming stuff seems at odds with a cast of unusual people who live unusual lives. It doesn't seem like Dragonball to me. On the other hand, that's why I loved the baseball episode, because it's this thing that becomes a silly event because of who is involved.

Not talking about the Universe 6 pre-tournament stuff because that's clearly making a point of establishing why these fighters are fit for their tournament; it's not as slice-of-life-y. Don't have a big issue with it.

who cares if Tenshinhan is strong

I wanna know whether he smashed Lunch

I want to know what his relationship with Chiaotzu is.

 

[Skeeter49]

17 was stronger than Cell until he absorbed millions of people.

It's kind of Krillins, Trunks and Vegeta's fault for following Cell's and Piccolo's power. Cell wouldn't had run away if it wasn't for them

 

[caliph95]

17 was stronger than Cell until he absorbed millions of people.

It's kind of Krillins, Trunks and Vegeta's fault for following Cell's and Piccolo's power. Cell wouldn't had run away if it wasn't for them

It was almost everybodies fault for cell

 

[ElFly]

Actually, speaking of Dr. Slump. I feel like Gohan in high school hit a similar note wherein Gohan is a superpowered freak trying to fit into regular human society while having little context to what regular society is.

the jokes about Gohan trying to look normal are extremely similar to the jokes of the first time Arale goes to school

I think that's why I've had little interest in most of the between-arc stuff in Super. The ordinarily life heartwarming stuff seems at odds with a cast of unusual people who live unusual lives. It doesn't seem like Dragonball to me. On the other hand, that's why I loved the baseball episode, because it's this thing that becomes a silly event because of who is involved.

Not talking about the Universe 6 pre-tournament stuff because that's clearly making a point of establishing why these fighters are fit for their tournament; it's not as slice-of-life-y. Don't have a big issue with it.

eh dunno

*Mr Satan punches Goku dot gif*

 

[Linkstrikesback]

who cares if Tenshinhan is strong

I wanna know whether he smashed Lunch

Tenshinhan is the eternal virgin of dragonball. Having an adopted child probably doesn't help.

 

[Real Hero]

who cares if Tenshinhan is strong

I wanna know whether he smashed Lunch

Tien has not and will never have sex. He's like piccolo but by choice

 

[L Thammy]

Tenshinhan is the eternal virgin of dragonball. Having an adopted child probably doesn't help.

He also doesn't masturbate even though he has four arms. That's the source of his superpowers.

 

[DiipuSurotu]

If Tenshinhan marries Lunch would he finally let his hair grow?

 

[RareFantasy64]

Going off the fantastic screen time 17 has had these past two episodes, I think if he continues to be handled well he will become one of the most beloved members of the cast. What's not to love? He is disciplined, is a simple man with a cool/distant aura to him. He's neither another over done saiyan, (or another alien), he isn't a pure human, he's more unique; an android. He can hang with the super saiyans as well. What's not to like about him? I think bringing him back into the story is the best thing Super has done so far.

who cares if Tenshinhan is strong

I wanna know whether he smashed Lunch

Speaking of Tenshinhan and Lunch, anyone here feel strong about wanting Lunch back as a consistently seen supporting cast member? If so, ideas on what sort of role she could offer?

 

[Real Hero]

Speaking of Tenshinhan and Lunch, anyone here feel strong about wanting Lunch back as a consistently seen supporting cast member? If so, ideas on what sort of role she could offer?

I want to her back just because she one of the original gang. It feels weird that she's not at least hanging around like basically everyone else goku ever met. I don't think she would really have a role outside the occasional gag though

 

[ElFly]

Speaking of Tenshinhan and Lunch, anyone here feel strong about wanting Lunch back as a consistently seen supporting cast member? If so, ideas on what sort of role she could offer?

well Toriyama couldn't make her fit v well in the original either; she was always in the background, good for a few jokes but was never even close to important

but given they have pushed p hard for the pilaf gang to be omnipresent....I guess she could go back to be a member of the Muten Roshi circle; Bulma seems p good at keeping close to her female friends, we see her shopping with Chichi and 18 all the time, so it could be that too, the spinster friend of Bulma

the easiest is that she marries someone in the main cast and becomes a regularly appearing wife

still holding hope Goku didn't recognize Launch's photo when 17 showed him his wife

 

[rrc1594]

The Bangs are back baby!

 

[L Thammy]

Launch should marry Yamcha. They're both halfway to being relevant, maybe if they combine their genes their offspring will actually matter.

 

[ElFly]

here's hoping Vegeta reacts to 17 being SSB level

Vegeta: Kakarot, why did you bring this doll? he is a weakling who couldn't even stand up to Cell!!!

Goku: um actually he is on our level and I am not sure if he is stronger

Vegeta: *kkkkkkKKkk sounds forever*

 

[RocknRola]

My guess is that he'll be able to cancel any ki blast like he did to Kamehameha and will have incredibly powerful ki attacks that punch above his own strength.

That would actually be kinda badass!

who cares if Tenshinhan is strong

I wanna know whether he smashed Lunch

lol

Ah, the question that keep the DB fanbase going! hehehe