Dragon Ball Super |OT6| Put your back into it.
- Thread starter ArchedThunder
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Might I add, Vados is no less an audience mouthpiece than the GoDs in that scene. No where are we told that the angels knew any of this in advance. She's representing the part of the audience that you're in, extrapolating that "you know, if you think about it, Goku saved one universe" from the info she'd been given.
Because there is no guarantee it would have happened in the first place. Or that it would have been as many universes if it happened later, or that he wouldn't remember the tournament idea himself when he finally did remember to do it. Zeno is capricious and his attention for the time being was on other Zeno.
Because there is no guarantee it would have happened in the first place. Or that it would have been as many universes if it happened later, or that he wouldn't remember the tournament idea himself when he finally did remember to do it. Zeno is capricious and his attention for the time being was on other Zeno.
Icyflamez96
Member
Which would still be dangerous and unpredictable, like Whis and Beerus warned.
Reizo Ryuu
Member
This makes no sense sorry, instead of wiping everything out without notice, goku saving at least one universe is now a terrible thing somehow.
JadedWriter
Member
We VOTOMS now?
Icyflamez96
Member
As I said previously, his intentions were to ignore warnings of risk to those around him to fulfill his own selfish desires. That is assholish.
If Android 18 and 17 are fine and Whis didn't say anything plus the U3 Angel was there so i guess if it is part of them it's fine
Reizo Ryuu
Member
No his intentions were to go see a friend, because goku's pure heart doesn't see zen'o the way the others do, and this is confirmed by the actual interactions they have; it's unique from anything they know about zen'o, goku is a new variable and he's acting the way he's expected to as this new variable.
To be fair, the Grand Priest specified weapons being against the rules.
I could still see Beerus or another God, especially one who isn't relying on any modifications to win, complaining about it, whether it's against the rules or not.
Icyflamez96
Member
He disregarded Whis and Beerus's judgement, which would be much more informed than his, because he was so obsessed with the tournament and fighting strong guys. He was well aware of their concern and basically spit in their face and did what he want. Goku met him once. It's not like they said he Zeno is incapable of being "fine", just that he's very capable of being dangerous and unpredictable. Goku ignored that to get what he wants.
I just can't believe anything about it, that they wrote and actually animated that nonsense.
Now you're just making things up. Goku did not go to see Zero to "see a friend." He went to start a tournament because he was bored. He ignored warnings that doing so would be dangerous because he wanted to fight. In doing so he moved "maybe 9 universes are destroyed some time in the future if Zero remembes" up to "8 universes will be destroyed in 41 hours."
INK why you keep trying to whitewash Goku's actions. He did a bad thing with results that may have an upside. Stop trying to make this character something he's not. Even his creator says he's supposed to be selfish. Being selfish even though it's dangerous to others is being an asshole.
Goten and Trunks were more of a gag. This stuff is just kinda dumb/silly.
Reizo Ryuu
Member
It doesn't matter what they say though, a friend is a friend to goku.
I don't understand why just the warnings are taken as most important, when this common thread of goku's personality has been a very important part throughout all of DB and he has only been proven wrong once, when he showed mercy on freeza.
Second time is when he made gohan leader of this team.
Huh? Did they not shake hands after the champa saga? I'm pretty sure they did. Goku already had good vibes about zen'o then.
Eh but how else are you going to engage the transformation without berating someone or murdering their friends?
Whis would then remind him he has two modified humans on their teams and comedically shut up
or get this look:
Stop being obtuse. Goku did not go to Zen'o just to see him. He went to ask for a tournament.
They should have saved their transformations for the actual tournament IMO.
BlazinSkatinAxel
Member
Anyone think Vegeta reached Super Sayian Blue 2?
JadedWriter
Member
Super Sayajin Teal.
Reizo Ryuu
Member
That's not what I said?
I said he went to see a friend, as in, and I'm weirded out that I have to spell this out because I mentioned it before, he didn't go to see some 'terrifying universe destroyer' to ask about a tournament.
He went to see a friend to ask about the tournament, how can you not see how important this distinction is? There's no danger in goku's mind.
As dumb as that was, too, at least there wasn't some over-expository explaination that was completely unnecessary.
See previous bull pen analogy.
Reizo Ryuu
Member
Doesn't work sorry, goku doesn't "think" he has a rapport with zen'o, he literally has one.
Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan Blue Teal 2
ArchedThunder
Banned
A few days after the next episode.
Not one that stops the bull goring 8 people, one of them possibly being Goku himself. So what's that rapport really worth?
ArchedThunder
Banned
Frame by framed it, if there are any changes they are very minor.
ArchedThunder
Banned
I'm surprised how many people are upset about the Super Saiyan thing.
Cabba says that once you're used to it you can focus your strength in your back to make a tingly feeling to transform, Caulifla told him to just teach her that instead and Cabba said it's something you can't just do right away and then when she does it anyways Cabba is surprised. The focusing the energy in the back thing is how people who already have Super Saiyan are able to turn it on and off, Caulifla just doing it right away is supposed to show how incredible she is, not how easy Super Saiyan is to achieve.
Cabba says that once you're used to it you can focus your strength in your back to make a tingly feeling to transform, Caulifla told him to just teach her that instead and Cabba said it's something you can't just do right away and then when she does it anyways Cabba is surprised. The focusing the energy in the back thing is how people who already have Super Saiyan are able to turn it on and off, Caulifla just doing it right away is supposed to show how incredible she is, not how easy Super Saiyan is to achieve.
Reizo Ryuu
Member
...what? His rapport with zen'o has ensured the survival of one universe, or one less person "gored" according to your analogy.
So....it's worth a fuckton?
I've made this exact same point several times, but people don't care, they just hear "focus energy in your back lol easy" and not the rest of the scene that literally spells out what you, others and myself have mentioned.
SenjutsuSage
Banned
Exactly. It shows she's a true prodigy.
Thanks Arched. I live for my new episode titles.
That's prettymuch how I saw it aswell.
It does highlight Caulifla is a prodigee, plus we really don't need to see a super emotional breakthrough for each new super saiyan. It will make sense with Kabe because she has a special form, but we don't need to repeat goku's initial transformation every time, it would be boring. Toriyama was correct to say fuck it even the little kids can just do it now
Reizo Ryuu
Member
Man the scene was written in such a "let's explain everything clearly" way that I'm really surprised people still misunderstand:
1. rage gives saiyans access to a feeling they are unfamiliar with, this sensation is focused in the back.
2. saiyans are unable to transform without being familiar with the feeling first
3. saiyans aren't pissed off every time they transform after the first time, they just find the feeling they are now familiar with.
4. Cauli is the super prodigy because she found the feeling without being familiar with it.
That's all there is to it, not "lol ssj is easy".
It's going to be the new poachers
Exactly. I don't see anything controversial about that
You shouldn't be, plenty of people still think Krillin forced goku to turn into SSB because of that practice match
Reizo Ryuu
Member
right
It's how we got the 17 poachers meme and Krillin being God-tier. People take one thing out of context or just outright make something up and run with it.
The Dragon Ball fan base is denser than bricks.
Once again, it has ensured that 8 universes die for sure right now as opposed to maybe 9 at some point in the future if Zen'o ever remembered to do it.
Or as the analogy put it, 8 people gored now as opposed maybe 9 people who were planning on getting in the pen at some unspecified point in the future.
That does not somehow make the person who knowingly opened the gate in the first place not an asshole.
Eight that was going to die regardless and he will at least save one of them. And that analogy doesn't work since the bull was going to attack people regardless of the gate was opened.
And this narrator "Zen'o may have forgot" doesn't work since this was something Zen'o talked about often, unless you think the Grand Priest is lying.
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