Senators Announce Agreement on Russia Sanctions

GameAddict411 said:
Considering how old some of the GOP in the congress, they have witnessed the bitterness of the cold war and also the continuous risk of the nuclear war. They know that Russia is significant risk that should not be ignored, or it might be that a broken clock is right twice a day kinda deal. Anyhow, this dampens any plans to lift eh sanctions. I guess their plans with Donald Trump as their puppet have failed for the most part. I don't think they can get much out of him. Maybe some stupid tweet from time to time.
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One of the only good reasons why we have long-serving members in congress.
 
Stinkles said:
Hopefully a few of the GOP folks are looking for ways to exit the shadow of Trump
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After Donny tried to fuck over the house votes he pulled into Trumpcare, this is going to have even more house support.

The veto aspect will be interesting.

I'm glad they think they can turn over a veto but we will see.
 
Ithil said:
Folks like him might be spineless and fall in line when it comes to protecting the GOP's interests, but there's no benefit to the GOP refusing to punish Russia for their actions in 2016, so they're all for it. There's no reasonable way to refuse to impose these sanctions.

It's the "uncovering that Trump's campaign was complicit in it" part they are trying to hinder.
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Also, they're preparing to blame EVERYTHING about this on Trump to help ignore how parts of the GOP were heavily complicit in it.

They're going to scapegoat Trump just like they did to Dubya.
 
FlutterPuffs said:
Looking like it's happening.

I think the investigations has reach a level where GOP leaders realise they are fucked if they keep trying to defend Trump.
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Something keeps happening during the closed door sessions of the investigation committee. You could see it in the Sessions session, and the specific wording to keep the president from changing this on his own.


His ego will play a part. He might (and should) take this as a personal shot at him and may try to veto regardless of predicted success for his ego but is risking the entire congress giving him the finger.

Who were those sycophant turds blowing Sessions during the testimony? I want to check how they voted.
 
StaticJam said:
They're basically baiting the fuck out of Donny, I love it.
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For a lot of the GOP, it's probably a way they think may give him an out too to help clear his reputation. Trump would have to be really dumb to not sign a bill that will override his veto anyway.
 
kirblar said:
Also, they're preparing to blame EVERYTHING about this on Trump to help ignore how parts of the GOP were heavily complicit in it.

They're going to scapegoat Trump just like they did to Dubya.
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They are maybe finally wising up to the fact that Trump will throw them under the bus in a heartbeat and is not reliable. Like what he just did to the entire GOP House over AHCA
 
Zolo said:
For a lot of the GOP, it's probably a way they think may give him an out too to help clear his reputation. Trump would have to be really dumb to not sign a bill that will override his veto anyway.
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There's no way he signs this. He's going to kick and scream about working with Russia against terrorism.
 
BoogieWoogie said:
FYI, the two senators who voted against this were Rand Paul and Mike Lee.
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What I quickly found on Mike Lee was pretty much all about collusion and how there is none.

Here's what was quickly found on Rand Paul from Wikipedia.

In response to political turmoil in Ukraine in early 2014, Paul initially said that the US should remain mindful of the fact that although the Cold War is over, Russia remains a military power with long-range nuclear missiles. He said that the US should try to maintain a "respectful relationship with Russia" and avoid taking actions that the Russians might view as a provocation, such as seeking to have Ukraine join NATO or otherwise interfering in Russia's relationship with Ukraine.[124] Two weeks later, after the Russian parliament authorized the use of military force in Ukraine[125] and Russian President Vladimir Putin ordered military exercises along Russia's border with Ukraine,[126] Paul began taking a different tone.[127] He wrote: "Vladimir Putin's invasion of Ukraine is a gross violation of that nation's sovereignty and an affront to the international community.... Putin must be punished for violating the Budapest Memorandum, and Russia must learn that the U.S. will isolate it if it insists on acting like a rogue nation."[128] He said that the US and European allies could retaliate against Russia's military aggression without any need for military action. He urged that the US impose economic sanctions on Russia and resume an effort to build defensive anti-missile installations in Poland and the Czech Republic. He also called for the US to take steps as a counterweight to Russia's strategic influence on Europe's oil and gas supply, such as lifting restrictions on new exploration and drilling for fossil fuels in the United States along with immediate approval of the controversial Keystone Pipeline, which he said would allow the US to ship more oil and gas to Europe if Russia attempts to cut off its own supply to Europe.[128]
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Sources cited on wiki page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rand_Paul

Also recently:

Asked about how the U.S. should respond to Russian hackers, Paul said during an interview, "I'm really not in favor of new sanctions against Russia now or new sanctions on Iran."

He added, "Everything we say Russia's done wrong. So China does," before listing off examples of cyber-espionage, suppressing freedom of speech and human rights violations.
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http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/r...-its-just-tweaking-their-nose/article/2625902
 
That is somewhat surprising about Rand Paul. His quote at the end there makes it seem like "well we can't do anything about it and everyone else is doing it so we should just deal with it".

While I am mostly ok with that as far as foreign issues go, when they start screwing around with our government by rigging elections they need to answer for it one way or another.
 
Rex Tillerson might as well resign now. He can't get that pipeline going.

Trump not getting paid now either. Guess Russia will just leave the wrecking ball to it and take a different sort of win. Release the tape when things get boring. How will Donnie ever pay his bills now if he gets impeached nod FBI take down his business.
 
jmdajr said:
Gonna be so hype signing this.
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He will forget like that other time when Pence lapdog had to go and bring it through to another room. Won't be allowed to see Trump's heart skip a beat as reality sets in and Russia want their money back.
 
SG-17 said:
The Senate must have heard enough in closed sessions to justify this.
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I'd be suspicious of that, but with only 2 dissenting votes, i'll agree and i'd wager there was significant information of some kind.

Rand Paul hates the US interfering in anything regardless of the reason, so that vote was expected.
Mike Lee on the other hand... I don't know enough about him.
 
The best news in a long time. Considering what happened in France, and what's happening in places like Germany, I wonder if this will spur our European friends to jump on board the Russian sanction train.
 
There's multiple reasons Scalise being shot this morning sucks, including the basic someone getting shot, but it sucks this news is being drowned out because of this. This is the first major FU the GOP has shot Trump's way.
 
Zolo said:
For a lot of the GOP, it's probably a way they think may give him an out too to help clear his reputation. Trump would have to be really dumb to not sign a bill that will override his veto anyway.
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Simultaneously, it gives themselves an opportunity to potentially distance themselves from the administration and the Russia investigation if that ever transpires into anything.
"We're not traitors! We made sure the President couldn't let Russia off the hook!"
 
Dude Abides said:
I hope this wasn't the trade off for not obstructing the health care bill.
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How would that make any sense? Democrats lack the numbers to obstruct the health care bill.

These sanctions have been in the works for some time. According to recent articles, the Senate first considered them months ago, when the rumor mill said that Trump would lift sanctions and return the Russian compounds. They suspended discussion when Rosenstein appointed Mueller, but now they've revisited these new sanctions because of the continuing focus on Russia.
 
BobTheFork said:
Something keeps happening during the closed door sessions of the investigation committee. You could see it in the Sessions session, and the specific wording to keep the president from changing this on his own
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What happened during the Sessions session that hinted at that?
 
Autodidact said:
How would that make any sense? Democrats lack the numbers to obstruct the health care bill.
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They can withhold unanimous consent, boycott committee meetings, generally refuse to conduct business, etc. Anything to slow it down so there is no vote until after the July recess.
 
Dude Abides said:
They can withhold unanimous consent, boycott committee meetings, generally refuse to conduct business, etc. Anything to slow it down so there is no vote until after the July recess.
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They've been shut out of the Healthcare bill. Ryan didn't consult them and the senate is even keeping their own out.

There is not much they can do.

@greek

Where is it being reported that this is happening?
 
The Greek Freak said:
If this is the rumored trade off for the usual spineless DNC to let the GOP gut healthcare while keeping quiet FUCK ALL OF THEM.
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The only place I have seen an active trade mentioned is Sputnik News. (via a friend RTing without checking sources.)

Where the hell are you getting your news from?
Dude Abides said:
They can withhold unanimous consent, boycott committee meetings, generally refuse to conduct business, etc. Anything to slow it down so there is no vote until after the July recess.
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All McConnell has to do is change the rules. It won't matter.
 
Wet Bloodfart said:
there's no fucking way this is true.
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The original reporting from normal US political media was that aides were worried that going nuclear both a) wouldn't amount to anything and b) would screw up things like Russia Sanctions and other things that they needed to get passed.

Not that they were actively trading tit for tat w/ the GOP.
 
theWB27 said:
They've been shut out of the Healthcare bill. Ryan didn't consult them and the senate is even keeping their own out.

There is not much they can do.

@greek

Where is it being reported that this is happening?
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Yes, they can refuse to conduct any business whatsoever unless the GOP adheres to usual order on healthcare. There were rumors that they were refraining from doing that to get this sanctions bill done, which is what prompted my post.
 
Zolo said:
What I quickly found on Mike Lee was pretty much all about collusion and how there is none.

Here's what was quickly found on Rand Paul from Wikipedia.
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Nerazar said:
Because the sanctions are too soft on Russia?
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Reckless Abandon said:
That is somewhat surprising about Rand Paul. His quote at the end there makes it seem like "well we can't do anything about it and everyone else is doing it so we should just deal with it".

While I am mostly ok with that as far as foreign issues go, when they start screwing around with our government by rigging elections they need to answer for it one way or another.
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As noted already in this thread, Paul has spent the last month plus opposing the underlying Iran sanctions*.

Eight Democratic Senators were opposed to this bill (and seven voted against bringing it to the floor) before they amended it with the Russia sanctions.

*
last week said:
US Senator Rand Paul has warned the administration of Donald Trump against imposing new economic sanctions on Iran, saying "new sanctions are a fool's errand, and they will not work."

...

Senator Paul urged the US government not to impose sanctions on Iran on the pretext of ballistic missile program, which Iran says is defensive.

He wrote that it is not fair to punish Iran when the Islamic Republic's all hostile neighbors like Saudi Arabia, the UAE and Israel have advanced missile programs.

"As we look at the ballistic missile section, we recall that Saudi Arabia also has ballistic missiles, the Dong Feng-3s and -21s. Where are they pointed? Tel Aviv and Tehran," he wrote.

"Our CIA inspected the DF-21s and said they are not currently nuclear capable. But are they convertible? Are they nuclear capable? Yeah, they are nuclear capable, and they are pointed at Israel and Iran," he added.

Senator Paul called on the United States to curb Saudi Arabia's ballistic missile program and Israel's nuclear weapons program in order control arms proliferation in the Middle East region, otherwise "these sanctions [against Iran] will have [no] effect."

...

"So, if you wanted to influence the behavior of Iran, you might consider sanctioning Saudi Arabia in equal fashion," he said.

"Another way of doing it would be to withhold the $350 billion worth of new weapons and missiles to Saudi Arabia until both sides come together to discuss an arms control treaty. Perhaps you could say we are going to withhold that offer until Saudi Arabia agrees to negotiate with Iran," he argued.
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Sens. Bernie Sanders (I-VT) and Dianne Feinstein (D-Calif.) issued statements saying now is the wrong time to vote on the sanctions, which are aimed at punishing Tehran for its human rights violations and its support of terrorist-designated groups.
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Dude Abides said:
Yes, they can refuse to conduct any business whatsoever unless the GOP adheres to usual order on healthcare. There were rumors that they were refraining from doing that to get this sanctions bill done, which is what prompted my post.
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That doesn't sound like a tradeoff. Sounds more like an or else.

Guess we'll see though.
 
kirblar said:
The only place I have seen an active trade mentioned is Sputnik News. (via a friend RTing without checking sources.)

Where the hell are you getting your news from?

All McConnell has to do is change the rules. It won't matter.
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Heard it second hand yesterday and dismissed it as nonsense until this happened with a 97-2 vote.

I don't even have a source but the DNC have been so spineless as a whole the last 5 years that this seems like something they would be excited about.
 
According to Business Insider, Sherrod Brown says the white house is already pushing back.

http://www.businessinsider.com/senate-russia-sanctions-trump-2017-6

Democratic Sen. Sherrod Brown, one of the bill's cosponsor, told reporters on Wednesday that the White House was already beginning to lobby against the measure.

"I know that some people in the White House are pushing back," Brown said. "People in the White House, we hear, are making calls in the House to try to stop it, slow it, weaken it, dilute it."

A White House official told Business Insider on Wednesday that the administration thinks the bill, in its current form, "poses a number of risks to the administration's ability to conduct foreign policy." The official noted, however, that the White House was "still reviewing" the legislation and will not put out a position until it is amended in the House and lands on Trump's desk.

"Generally speaking, sanctions policies should be carefully calibrated by the foreign policy experts in the executive branch," the official added, noting that the administration "remains committed" to the existing sanctions.
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I'm guessing there'll be at least one call to Paul Ryan asking to not bring up the bill for a vote.
 
I still think it was shitty not to send this up as a separate bill rather than hooking it onto Iran sanctions the White House and Congress want.

Especially if you're going to get 90 votes anyway.
 
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