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[Wolf Akela]

Path of Exile has a very similar same thing. It has a "map system" where a map item opens a new small dungeon for you to explore. You can also apply currencies to modify the map item to make it harder, but drop more/better loot. The difference is that all of them cannot be purchased as MTX and you'll have to get them as drops or trade with other players.

This is just a greedy way by having a chance to fail when it comes to converting real cash to in-game credit. :/

 

[ClosingADoor]

Honest question for my curiosity. What do you want developers/publishers(whoever makes this decision) to do? Obviously the cost of making games is getting out of hand. People seem to want unlimited support and constant delivery of features or installments completely free of charge which is impossible.

At first it was paid add-ons/expansion packs, then DLC/season passes. Now it's microtransactions/loot boxes. If a developer is going to support a game post launch for years afterwards, how should they pay for those expenses?

Expansion packs can be done. Add new cars, tracks, modes, etc. You can also charge for tokens, but have people buy what they want with it, not this random stuff. And never lock stuff behind these boxes that were available in previous installments for free (the extra credits for less assists thing). That's just strange.

 

[Goalus]

It works in this industry too as everyone is chasing zero-hour clicks so half the reviews are rushed and shat out as it is. Can't even test MP? Who cares, just get that review out so people will click and rush to your score.

I bet that's how Halo 5 was "reviewed" two years ago.

 

[Audioboxer]

Path of Exile has a very similar same thing. It has a "map system" where a map item opens a new small dungeon for you to explore. You can also apply currencies to modify the map item to make it harder, but drop more/better loot. The difference is that all of them cannot be purchased as MTX and you'll have to get them as drops or trade with other players.

This is just a greedy way by having a chance to fail when it comes to converting real cash to in-game credit. :/

I read Path of Exile is actually one of the better F2P games. As I said on the last page I just tend to stay away from F2P games. I've played Neverwinter for a while now and have a bit of money in it, but my interest has just dropped as I've witnessed over the course of a year how devs of a F2P game can never escape the shackles of "we need to keep monetizing and hurting the game balance/loot/drops because we're... F2P". Every time there is a new patch for Neverwinter there is outrage as the devs fuck something else up that makes the grind worse or pushes everyone to open their wallet. It becomes a chore to play the game, but people find it hard to quit psychologically if they have invested money in the game. Especially when it's an MMO, as they're addictive gameplay wise before we even talk money.

When it comes to MMOs, just expect to go with a paid monthly sub one to avoid non-stop nonsense. Even then, I know most sub MMOs still push MTs hard these days.

I bet that's how Halo 5 was "reviewed" two years ago.

Can't say I know much about Halo 5 reviews. I'll guess there were MP server issues no review picked up on. That would be pretty standard for MP games these days with reviews that come out before servers can even be publicly tested.

 

[Fitts]

Not surprised. Horizon 3 was my first Forza game in a while (got from a pricing error near launch) and the monetization in that game was a huge turnoff. Go into the auction house to bid on something and... just kidding! You're prompted to buy the DLC.

 

[Guileless]

Legal gambling for people's over the age of 18 in the US. What if they want all games labeled AO if they include paid loot boxes?

The video game violence fiasco lasted longer than Columbine. The ESA made efforts to increase screenings of M rated purchases near the mid 2000s when people were losing their minds about Grand Theft Auto. Hell, we literally had a Supreme Court case in 2011 saying games were protected under the 1st amendment over violent video games. So I don't know where this "It's old news" comment is coming from.

Also, video games are an easy target for politicians.

I agree with you that videogames have been easy targets. I think that's changing though as more Boomers die off and Gen X people who grew up in arcades/playing Ataris make up most of the electorate. Hell, people born after the Dreamcast released in the US will be voting in the 2018 midterms.

With violence, you could show a clip of violent gameplay to get people riled up. It's a lot harder to explain loot boxes and get people fired up. And I think the moral argument against gambling is an extreme minority position now in the US. The gambling prohibitionists have been routed.

 

[MrTroubleMaker]

I really hate this trend ...

 

[Montresor]

Damn why can't Microsoft just make things easy for themselves for once and not fuck something up. *shakes head*

Is it true that VIP pass is a consumable? It stops giving you credits after 25 races? What happens after that? You buy another VIP pass?

VIP on Forza Horizon 3 gave you a permanent double spin bonus. What about in Forza 7?

 

[Gek54]

Im all for this as long as none of the advertised game is locked behind a pay wall and can be earned in game.

Seems like a lot of faux outrage.

 

[danowat]

PoE is a brilliant free to play game, there is no comparison here.

 

[Smokey_Run]

I agree with you that videogames have been easy targets. I think that's changing though as more Boomers die off and Gen X people who grew up in arcades/playing Ataris make up most of the electorate. Hell, people born after the Dreamcast released in the US will be voting in the 2018 midterms.

With violence, you could show a clip of violent gameplay to get people riled up. It's a lot harder to explain loot boxes and get people fired up. And I think the moral argument against gambling is an extreme minority position now in the US. The gambling prohibitionists have been routed.

Sure, people have relaxed about gambling in the states, but you still have to be 18 to do it or be on the floor. Loot boxes are no better than a slot machine, but you don't see 12 year olds pumping quarters into the slot machines at casinos.

Ultimatley, it doesn't have to be the US government that goes after them. China has already started to crack down on loot boxes. I'm not familiar with the various European countries and their stances on gambling, but it could any one of those countries too.

 

[JP]

I'm not sure I'm surprised, to be honest.

As much as I absolutely love these games, the Horizon series in particular but of the past couple of years the DLC situation has become really obnoxious with both series. Forza Horizon 3 really was the last straw for me, I haven't and won't buy this and I also won't buy the next Horizon either.

It won't be easy for me to not buy the next Horizon at launch but they've lost me now and I won't buy another one until they sort this stuff out. I really hate how they've made me feel about one of my favourite franchises.

 

[CrazyHal]

I never played a Forza game, but from what i understood its not just cosmetics this time, these lootboxes are actually affecting gameplay.

This is so wrong on a $60 game, how can some people actually defend this?

Low seft esteem.

 

[Audioboxer]

Damn why can't Microsoft just make things easy for themselves for once and not fuck something up. *shakes head*

Is it true that VIP pass is a consumable? It stops giving you credits after 25 races? What happens after that? You buy another VIP pass?

VIP on Forza Horizon 3 gave you a permanent double spin bonus. What about in Forza 7?

Yeah it's a consumable now

VIP credit perks are now consumable mods. Previously, VIPs received permanent credit boosts in Forza titles. Now, players receive enough to use for 25 races (or less, if they want to stack the mods). After that, one of the perks of VIP membership is gone for good.

https://www.gtplanet.net/turn-10-confirms-microtransaction-plans-forza-7/

Talk about greed. This is an example of changing gameplay to try and pressure people into MTs.

 

[fbutron]

Did not want to post in a Forza game but this is next level of greed, incredibly way to give your hardcore fans a stab in the back....

 

[JaffeLion]

costumes

Who gives a shit? I dont need it. Let others pay for it. I dont give a damn. I will not pay for costumes.

 

[Alebelly]

Im all for this as long as none of the advertised game is locked behind a pay wall and can be earned in game.

Seems like a lot of faux outrage.

Always enjoy people who dont give a shit are always bothered enough to tell you they dont give a shit.

 

[Liliana Eileen]

Always enjoy people who dont give a shit are always bothered enough to tell you they dont give a shit.

He's right though. Just like Destiny 2 (which is worse than this), No one will be talking about this in a few weeks except for people desperately trying to bump the topic.

 

[Maintenance]

 

 

[Liliana Eileen]

Destiny is not worse than this.

Yes, it is. When you get that hard cap and you get +5 mods from a bright engram to put in your gear (which is the easiest way to push past the cap and get higher power level blues to drop), it sure as fuck can give you an advantage thay won't get unless you wait for weekly reset for the powerful gear milestones, otherwise you're grinding public events the Entire day praying for blue mods to drop (to convert to purple, this only applies to 280+ PL) or the right slotted exotic.

And especially in a game with multiplayer (iron banner is soon) and world firsts, compared to Forza which THROWS cars and credits at you. I have over 70mil credits in Horizon 3 and 200-300 cars and never even saw a popup anywhere for spending real money, and I'm casual as fuck. I wouldn't know it's a thing if I didn't read it here.

There may be rightful criticism or annoyed people but a lot of this is purely faux outrage, like he said.

 

[Maintenance]

I don't need to read it here, I have the game. Payout is garbage so far.

You want to do that race that gives more money? Too bad, need a tier 4 car. You want a tier 4 car? Too bad, buy more cars. You wanna buy more cars? Too bad, get more money.

Even Horizon 3 gave more than FM7 is giving right now. But that shouldn't be a surprise, since it had VIP double money, Horizon Edition cars that doubled the standard payout (not the small % that current ones have), bonuses for disabling assists.

 

[iRAWRasaurus]

Fuck this paid loot box bullshit.

That's my take.

.

 

[Alebelly]

He's right though. Just like Destiny 2 (which is worse than this), No one will be talking about this in a few weeks except for people desperately trying to bump the topic.

Absolutely useless, why are you here?

 

[Liliana Eileen]

I don't need to read it here, I have the game. Payout is garbage so far.

You want to do that race that gives more money? Too bad, need a tier 4 car. You want a tier 4 car? Too bad, buy more cars. You wanna buy more cars? Too bad, get more money.

Even Horizon 3 gave more money.

...

What? I'm talking about not knowing they exist and you're talking about payout from doing races.

I haven't played Motorsport in a few years but I don't remember being showered in credits when I started off, neither. So what's the problem? That they have MTX and someone could theoretically not have to race as much as, say, you?

If it's about the VIP change, that I agree on.

 

[staticneuron]

This sounds a lot like Destiny 2's system. My solution is to not spend money and just play the base game.

Not even remotely true. This mod systems they are describing was in Forza 6. And in Destiny 2, the only thing you could pay for is more silver to buy bright engrams. Bright engrams contain, shaders, emblems, speeders, transmat animations, emotes and ships. All cosmetic things.

You can get mods from gunsmith or drops. And you will get a metric ton of that over normal gameplay. You don't pay money for gunsmith mats.


The complaint about Destiny 2 is overblown and now to compare it to things that actually change gameplay by a great amount is just false.

Yes, it is. When you get that hard cap and you get +5 mods from a bright engram to put in your gear (which is the easiest way to push past the cap and get higher power level blues to drop), it sure as fuck can give you an advantage thay won't get unless you wait for weekly reset for the powerful gear milestones, otherwise you're grinding public events the Entire day praying for blue mods to drop (to convert to purple, this only applies to 280+ PL) or the right slotted exotic.

And especially in a game with multiplayer (iron banner is soon) and world firsts, compared to Forza which THROWS cars and credits at you. I have over 70mil credits in Horizon 3 and 200-300 cars and never even saw a popup anywhere for spending real money, and I'm casual as fuck. I wouldn't know it's a thing if I didn't read it here.

There may be rightful criticism or annoyed people but a lot of this is purely faux outrage, like he said.

I have three characters over 300. This is how much a non-issue this is. Before you hit 280 you will have an army of blue mods (praying for blue mods my ass) you also get the mods when you turn in weapon parts and collect gunsmith engrams. But the soft cap of game is around 265-270. Which means if you hit level 20 before beating game, all you need to do is go to lost sectors or do public events to get to that level. Beat the game after wards and you are either going to be near 280 or past it. Then you can do the milestones.

People dong milestones right after hitting 20 basically kneecapped themselves. And mods from Bright engrams are rare unlike from gunsmith where you get them all the time.

 

[Trogdor1123]

Is this a full price game? Cause that's bs

 

[sense]

Microsoft gotta eat bros. if not they can't keep the studio and crank these games out every other year as they are not huge sellers. I was gonna say these don't sell like halo or gears but those games have fallen far from their peaks as well.

 

[Liliana Eileen]

Not even remotely true. This mod systems they are describing was in Forza 6. And in Destiny 2, the only thing you could pay for is more silver to buy bright engrams. Bright engrams contain, shaders, emblems, speeders, transmat animations, emotes and ships. All cosmetic things.

You can get mods from gunsmith or drops. And you will get a metric ton of that over normal gameplay. You don't pay money for gunsmith mats.


The complaint about Destiny 2 is overblown and now to compare it to things that actually change gameplay by a great amount is just false.

Do you even play Destiny? You CAN get mods from bright engrams. And no, legendary +5 mods don't drop a "metric ton."

This makes your last point null.

 

[Poster#1]

Forza 7 |OT| Hit the GaaS

Deserves more love.

MS is one of the worst companies when it comes to Microtransactions.

 

[Gek54]

I don't need to read it here, I have the game. Payout is garbage so far.

You want to do that race that gives more money? Too bad, need a tier 4 car. You want a tier 4 car? Too bad, buy more cars. You wanna buy more cars? Too bad, get more money.

Even Horizon 3 gave more than FM7 is giving right now. But that shouldn't be a surprise, since it had VIP double money, Horizon Edition cars that doubled the standard payout (not the small % that current ones have), bonuses for disabling assists.

That's the kind of progression I want. Having credits and cars thrown at me is insulting. I want the satisfaction that comes from working for my rewards.

If people would rather used their hard earned real life cash instead, good on these developers for allowing that freedom.

 

[NullPointer]

There may be rightful criticism or annoyed people but a lot of this is purely faux outrage, like he said.

Different people will have different reactions, which is fine. Articles like the one in the OP and the threads that spawn from them are just canaries in the coal mine.

Some people really want to know if games include this kind of thing (put me in that group), and I'm sure there are at least some folks who were eyeing the ultimate edition only to learn that the credit bonuses are consumables this time around. So, whether some consider it faux outrage or not, its at least worth bringing to people's attention.

MS is one of the worst companies when it comes to Microtransactions.

Their continuous push for things like this in all of their exclusives is pushing me away from the Xbox for sure. And I expect them to keep pushing.

 

[Liliana Eileen]

Different people will have different reactions, which is fine. Articles like the one in the OP and the threads that spawn from them are just canaries in the coal mine.

Some people really want to know if games include this kind of thing (put me in that group), and I'm sure there are at least some folks who were eyeing the ultimate edition only to learn that the credit bonuses are consumables this time around. So, whether some consider it faux outrage or not, its at least worth bringing to people's attention.

Agreed, but my following posts points still stands.

 

[Lothars]

Yes, it is. When you get that hard cap and you get +5 mods from a bright engram to put in your gear (which is the easiest way to push past the cap and get higher power level blues to drop), it sure as fuck can give you an advantage thay won't get unless you wait for weekly reset for the powerful gear milestones, otherwise you're grinding public events the Entire day praying for blue mods to drop (to convert to purple, this only applies to 280+ PL) or the right slotted exotic.

And especially in a game with multiplayer (iron banner is soon) and world firsts, compared to Forza which THROWS cars and credits at you. I have over 70mil credits in Horizon 3 and 200-300 cars and never even saw a popup anywhere for spending real money, and I'm casual as fuck. I wouldn't know it's a thing if I didn't read it here.

There may be rightful criticism or annoyed people but a lot of this is purely faux outrage, like he said.

Okay so you actually don't know what your talking about. This isn't anything to do with Forza Horizon 3. This is Forza 7 and the shitty changes to the systems including VIP.

The things talked about here are much worst than anything in destiny.

Do you even play Destiny? You CAN get mods from bright engrams. And no, legendary +5 mods don't drop a "metric ton."

This makes your last point null.

No it's doesn't his last point is right on point. They do drop fairly regularly.

That's the kind of progression I want. Having credits and cars thrown at me is insulting. I want the satisfaction that comes from working for my rewards.

If people would rather used their hard earned real life cash instead, good on these developers for allowing that freedom.

You are the only one than. These are terrible changes and not a good thing for anyone.

 

[Maintenance]

 

 

[Freeman76]

Vote with your wallet or zip it. Anything else is bullshit.

9 pages of arguments and guess what?

NOTHING HAS CHANGED.

Fucking get on with life. Dont like it, dont buy it.

 

[staticneuron]

Do you even play Destiny? You CAN get mods from bright engrams. And no, legendary +5 mods don't drop a "metric ton."

This makes your last point null.

No blue mods drop a ton and you can turn 3 of them into legendaries without a cost. What I am saying is from experience and time invested in game across 3 characters. What are your stats?

Anyways back to topic at hand, I am not sure how this is a "new low" when Forza 6 already had a mechanic like this. I am not seeing what they changed from 6 to make it worse. Then again, I was planning on sitting this forza entry out as I still have not cleared most of 6 nor Horizon 3.


EDIT:

I don't need to read it here, I have the game. Payout is garbage so far.

You want to do that race that gives more money? Too bad, need a tier 4 car. You want a tier 4 car? Too bad, buy more cars. You wanna buy more cars? Too bad, get more money.

Even Horizon 3 gave more than FM7 is giving right now. But that shouldn't be a surprise, since it had VIP double money, Horizon Edition cars that doubled the standard payout (not the small % that current ones have), bonuses for disabling assists.

I am sorry for missing this. So the payout is worse to encourage spending real money. This is more like that 2K18 situation isn't it?

 

[Audioboxer]

Vote with your wallet or zip it. Anything else is bullshit.

9 pages of arguments and guess what?

NOTHING HAS CHANGED.

Fucking get on with life. Dont like it, dont buy it.

Trying to oppose or reverse bullshit in the gaming industry doesn't equal a 180 in a matter of hours lol. Even MS didn't 180 the Xbox One in a matter of hours!

I'll tell you what does produce a future gaming industry where there isn't ANY 180s or compromise at all. A subservient gaming population who are either too lazy or all get told to shut up and never criticise.

You can complain and vote with your wallet at the same time. Most people complain because they do actually want to buy a game, but are put off by something the developers or publishers are doing. It's worthwhile voicing what it is you don't like that's making you not buy a game so the creators know.

Publishers or developers just love it when it's other gamers who tell fellow gamers to be quiet and stop criticising. It's like free PR without them having to make any effort.

 

[Maintenance]

 

 

[Fox Mulder]

It might get better, maybe, but as far as I've seen I don't have high hopes.

Keep in mind that I'm talking about 20/40/50 lap races, that are hours long. If the player is planning on racing smaller races I have zero hopes whatsoever.

A one hour race on Horizon 3 Goliath would get you around a million credits in a non horizon edition car.

 

[Maintenance]

 

 

[D'ultimate]

Different people will have different reactions, which is fine. Articles like the one in the OP and the threads that spawn from them are just canaries in the coal mine.
Some people really want to know if games include this kind of thing (put me in that group), and I'm sure there are at least some folks who were eyeing the ultimate edition only to learn that the credit bonuses are consumables this time around. So, whether some consider it faux outrage or not, its at least worth bringing to people's attention.

Count me as one of them. Was going to get the Deluxe edition specifically for the VIP but no longer.

This is kind of strange to me. They were bound to turn off a good percentage of the base with this. The people that are willing to spend anywhere from $20-$50 to get Deluxe and Ultimate editions. That is essentially money that doesn't need to be made with rng/loot crates.

Yet, that wasn't enough. They would rather alienate the faithful, face the backlash from the media (they had to know its coming) just to set up a system that encourages more microtransactions.

They couldn't leave well enough alone with the VIP and assist systems alone and add to it.

Shameful!

 

[Neith]

Because people don't want to pay premium passes for DLC this is what it will come to. And it will get even worse I am sure.

People bitch about Battlefield and how premium divides the player base.

It does, and they give you shitloads of content for that premium pass, and they also let your friends play that content with you for free. and it's even on sale after a while.

But no, give me schemes like loot boxes and 5 maps over two years because HEY the community is so awesome then and not divided or bored of the game. Just look at the wild success of Uncharted 4 and other AAA games that went the free maps route. SO MUCH CONTENT. And here we go with BOTH scheme now lol.

People are gonna bitch either way. Fuck it I don't care anymore. If this is what they want so be it.

The sad fact here is there is gonna be a season pass too I bet. There probably is one I have not checked.

 

[NullPointer]

Yet, that wasn't enough. They would rather alienate the faithful, face the backlash from the media (they had to know its coming) just to set up a system that encourages more microtransactions.

The messed up part of these kinds of upsells is that people willing to buy ultimate editions are probably far more likely to buy additional microtransactions. Just like its better to show ads to people paying for Xbox Live Gold or PS+ rather than otherwise. That's the demographic they want to reach.

 

[etta]

Cancelled the pre-order, all I do in Motorsport is Nordschleife in the rain, and that can wait until a Christmas sale.

 

[KeyboardThug]

Count me as one of them. Was going to get the Deluxe edition specifically for the VIP but no longer.

This is kind of strange to me. They were bound to turn off a good percentage of the base with this. The people that are willing to spend anywhere from $20-$50 to get Deluxe and Ultimate editions. That is essentially money that doesn't need to be made with rng/loot crates.

Yet, that wasn't enough. They would rather alienate the faithful, face the backlash from the media (they had to know its coming) just to set up a system that encourages more microtransactions.

They couldn't leave well enough alone with the VIP and assist systems alone.

Shameful!

These two things needed to be fixed. I was about to get a refund but I have hope Turn 10 will listen to us and restore our faith.

 

[Liliana Eileen]

Okay so you actually don't know what your talking about. This isn't anything to do with Forza Horizon 3. This is Forza 7 and the shitty changes to the systems including VIP.

The things talked about here are much worst than anything in destiny.

No it's doesn't his last point is right on point. They do drop fairly regularly.

You are the only one than. These are terrible changes and not a good thing for anyone.

You literally posting nothing. Like you have no sense of coherency and just started blabbing pure nothingness.

He said it's not worse than Destiny 2, and I gave valid reasons why it is. How does that mean I dont know what I'm talking about? Especially when you contribute NOTHING to the topic except telling me that the things are not worse than Destiny without explaining why not?

You're doing nothing except saying "no, you're wrong" and "yes, they do." And you're also full of bullshit, because no, +5 mods do not drop regularly. You're probably talking about crappy blue mods, and trying to agree with him just to be as contrarian as possible.

You clearly have no idea what you're talking about.

No blue mods drop a ton and you can turn 3 of them into legendaries without a cost. What I am saying is from experience and time invested in game across 3 characters. What are your stats?

I said, in my ORIGINAL post, that you have to be PL 280 or higher to turn blues into legendary. If you read my post you will see that. You know that stump you get around PL 260~ because of the soft cap? Yeah. Getting +5mods got me to break 290 PL first week of release and be higher than the vast majority for Calus. My stats? PL 304, but now were going off topic.

You said it's only cosmetic items from bright engrams, and I proved you wrong. Now you're saying it's not a big deal because blues drop frequently and you can turn them to purples after PL 280...?

 

[GHG]

Cancelled the pre-order, all I do in Motorsport is Nordschleife in the rain, and that can wait until a Christmas sale.

Thumbs up.

I originally felt bad about working the system to buy the game with Rubles but upon reading this (and Dan's tweet) I feel fine about it. First time I haven't got the VIP all generation and I don't feel like I'm missing out on a thing.

Time for consumers to fight back before it goes too far.

 

[R_thanatos]

This is false. They have been delaying MTs ever since they started doing them in FH2. The NEVER degraded the experience when they turned on MTs, When they turn them on the experience doesnt change for the non-paying end user at all. The ingame economy stays the same.

What is different now is The incentive to buy them IS ALREADY in the game (the lack of bonus for turning off assists)- the option to pay, just hasn't been turned on. The inability to play skillfully to progress faster will be just as problematic when MTs come as they are now.

I'm not even talking about the game economy here .
Like, you know what ? I'll just quote you , and put a bookmark , so i could come back and at least be able to laugh when payments will be live for loot boxes . You think they won't make a pop-up or a new bright section on a menu to NOTIFY you that they'll be there.

Every game on the market with dlc feels the need to tell the user that there are dlc or new dlc. , F7 won't be any different when payments will be live.
A bad experience made worse.
Certainly not degraded at all. /sarcasm

 

[Spartancarver]

Just don´t buy the loot boxes and move on. Jesus.

How have people still not figured out that adding paid loot boxes like this almost always alters the balance of unlocks across the entire game to make paying for them with real money an attractive option?

Hand-waving it away like this is beyond disingenuous

 

[phantasmic_glaive]

Yes, it is. When you get that hard cap and you get +5 mods from a bright engram to put in your gear (which is the easiest way to push past the cap and get higher power level blues to drop), it sure as fuck can give you an advantage thay won't get unless you wait for weekly reset for the powerful gear milestones, otherwise you're grinding public events the Entire day praying for blue mods to drop (to convert to purple, this only applies to 280+ PL) or the right slotted exotic.

And especially in a game with multiplayer (iron banner is soon) and world firsts, compared to Forza which THROWS cars and credits at you. I have over 70mil credits in Horizon 3 and 200-300 cars and never even saw a popup anywhere for spending real money, and I'm casual as fuck. I wouldn't know it's a thing if I didn't read it here.

There may be rightful criticism or annoyed people but a lot of this is purely faux outrage, like he said.

Everyone I play with in D2 is at least 309* and haven't bought a single bright engram. You can literally play every week and get there with all 3 classes, like right now without buying silver. It's there for people who want to skip he grind..

Even if that was the case it's still not this bad. Nice try tho.

It is what it is though. A lot of games have micro transactions, if this is how they wanna do it ...hey.. don't hate player, hate the game (wait) ...In this case, don't hate the game, hate the player for buying this shit (the dlc).