infinitys_7th
Member
Good for them. This is the sort of responsible reporting the country needs. There is plenty to report on Trump about, good and bad, without resorting to low standards.
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Responsible Reporting: Associated Press apologizes for out-of-context reporting on Trump calling MS-13 "animals"
- Thread starter infinitys_7th
- Start date
Good for them. This is the sort of responsible reporting the country needs. There is plenty to report on Trump about, good and bad, without resorting to low standards.
Vicetrailia
Banned
Trump shouldn't be calling anyone animals though. MS-13 = animals is so generalized if you are familiar with gangs and how they influence impoverished communities.
But I guess he othered them to rile the base.
But I guess he othered them to rile the base.
LegendOfKage
Member
You can certainly have a conversation as to who should and shouldn't be called animals, but it helps to have that conversation in the proper context. It was good for the AP to correct that.
NickFire
Member
Title is misleading. I don't see an apology in the tweet. And regardless, responsible reporting would consist of never pushing the false narrative in the false place. Creating what they knew was a false narrative, and letting it stew for two news cycles (evening and morning), and then tweeting that it was deleted the next day, is not responsible reporting.
Vicetrailia
Banned
To be fair the hottake was just too hot. Coulda, woulda, shoulda, but they're competing for attention. Better to apologize later. It's pretty sad actually.
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lil puff
Member
Well they should apologize for taking that one out of context. It's not even necessary.
I was watching CNN Wolf Blitzer (during a commercial, I was watching something else!) and he segued over to this topic in between discussing 2 separate topics with the panel. They ALL (libs) shut him down, and after he tried to make some sorry analogy, he immediately changed the subject. It was so funny to watch. That guy is horribly obtuse.
I was watching CNN Wolf Blitzer (during a commercial, I was watching something else!) and he segued over to this topic in between discussing 2 separate topics with the panel. They ALL (libs) shut him down, and after he tried to make some sorry analogy, he immediately changed the subject. It was so funny to watch. That guy is horribly obtuse.
Spheyr
Banned
I don't care how poor you are, if you're a violent gangbanger you're less than a person.
Vicetrailia
Banned
Surprse, surprise.
Spheyr
Banned
Imagine that, someone who lives around gangbangers in the ghetto doesn't feel sympathy for them having been exposed to their shit for years.
Vicetrailia
Banned
I grew up in the same place and have a general sympathy, a certain type.
There's a difference between that and calling people less the human. I wouldn't be comfortable with my country's leader dehumanizing any group of people. It doesn't help anything and is just dismissive.
Autoignition
Member
Cowards. Stick to your guns.
This is currently my favorite Twitter thread about the whole "animals" matter.
This is currently my favorite Twitter thread about the whole "animals" matter.
Vicetrailia
Banned
This is damned good.
infinitys_7th
Member
If you like reading pseudointellectual sophist drivel, I suppose. Such as:
Deliberately ignoring the context of Trump's statement being a response to someone talking about MS-13 is apparently not disingenuous.
He also compares Heather Heyer's murder to the actions of MS-13, a multinational gang which murders, kidnaps, rapes, and sex traffics across Mexico and, increasingly, the US.
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ickythingz
Banned
You support gangs? wow.....
TheShadowLord
Member
Wasn't the time and place to go after Trump as he was talking about MS13. However, his comments on the Haitian people and the speech he delivered about Mexicans in 2015 are the things you could criticize him for.
EDIT: and maybe calling climate change a hoax created by the chinese
EDIT: and maybe calling climate change a hoax created by the chinese
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Vicetrailia
Banned
Yes I love gangs, LOVE THEM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Autoignition
Member
God forbid the people in power receive criticism. It's easier to punch down, anyway.
Spheyr
Banned
I'm not in power
BANGS
Banned
Oh dear god with this awful logic...
TrainedRage
Banned
Wait, I have powers? How do I use them? What is my origin story?
TheLaughingStock
Member
What makes it responsible?
The main reason why the media and pundits misconstrued Trump's response to the official's question about MS-13 is to create a perception that Pres. Trump is generalizing about all or most undocumented immigrants. Moreover, that the dark picture he's painting of these gang members isn't real and is overblown. What other real motive could there be except that there's nothing to see here?
Or put another way, Pres. Trump doesn't have a point to make about who's coming across the border. These are people who believe more or less things should stay the way are. They know virtually no one is going to see the correction and that once you plant the seed that Trump called people "animals" that it will take on a life of it's own.
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Autoignition
Member
Your party is.
You got an argument packed somewhere in that post, buddy?
Roll for stats first.
Spheyr
Banned
BANGS
Banned
There is no need to argue reality, it's right in front of you. Open your eyes...
Gun Animal
Member
Buddy, you think punching down is easier? Really?
fake edit: I've been kicked out of every comedy club in the tri-county area for committing the "horribly offensive" "crime" of "making fun of cripples and burn victims" but still I press on! Some fights need to be fought.
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Autoignition
Member
BANGS
Banned
It means that punching in the name of anything other than justice is wrong, doesn't matter which direction your perception allows. Stop doing backflips and look ahead...
Autoignition
Member
... You do realize I didn't mean a literal physical punch, right? It was a turn of phrase.
Airola
Member
That's very good of Associated Press.
Trump talks about how there are truly awful criminals they are deporting. He is talking about criminals. MS13 is brought up. Trump tells some people they are deporting are animals.
The reaction to that goes like this:
"Trump says immigrants are animals!"
Like, how the fuck does anyone make that kind of a jump to a conclusion? The only reason has to be pure antipathy without any sense of realism.
And when told that he isn't talking about immigrants, then people start saying:
"But he can't say that about gang members!"
"He deep down thinks it's about the immigrants even if he didn't say it!"
"Haven't you heard what he has said about minorities before! Trump has done this and that and that and this!"
That comes from pure antipathy and from nothing else. They want to see the country being divided even more. They want Trump to be even a bigger piece of shit than he already in their minds is. They want these types of news. They feed on misery. And they don't even realize how much more this makes people want to call out "fake news." There is absolutely nothing good that comes out of this type of nonsense. And no, Trump being an ass isn't a reason to find demons where there aren't any.
Really, for fuck's sake...
I'm absolutely applauding The Associated Press for making a correction like that. Not that it really helps anything because the ones who wanted to be angry will be angry no matter what and no matter how much this will get corrected. The damage has already been done, but at the very least they are showing example on how to act when you fuck up. And that is so much more than what most are doing.
Trump talks about how there are truly awful criminals they are deporting. He is talking about criminals. MS13 is brought up. Trump tells some people they are deporting are animals.
The reaction to that goes like this:
"Trump says immigrants are animals!"
Like, how the fuck does anyone make that kind of a jump to a conclusion? The only reason has to be pure antipathy without any sense of realism.
And when told that he isn't talking about immigrants, then people start saying:
"But he can't say that about gang members!"
"He deep down thinks it's about the immigrants even if he didn't say it!"
"Haven't you heard what he has said about minorities before! Trump has done this and that and that and this!"
That comes from pure antipathy and from nothing else. They want to see the country being divided even more. They want Trump to be even a bigger piece of shit than he already in their minds is. They want these types of news. They feed on misery. And they don't even realize how much more this makes people want to call out "fake news." There is absolutely nothing good that comes out of this type of nonsense. And no, Trump being an ass isn't a reason to find demons where there aren't any.
Really, for fuck's sake...
I'm absolutely applauding The Associated Press for making a correction like that. Not that it really helps anything because the ones who wanted to be angry will be angry no matter what and no matter how much this will get corrected. The damage has already been done, but at the very least they are showing example on how to act when you fuck up. And that is so much more than what most are doing.
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Gun Animal
Member
Have you been paying attention at all for the last two years? Either you're wrong about punching down (in the political, social and comedic senses) being easier, or Trump is not as high a target as you think he is.
Autoignition
Member
Not a high target? He's the President.
Gun Animal
Member
KarneeKarnay
Member
The context of the question was gangs, the context of Trump's response wasn't. The question was about an already established gang in the US. Why did he feel the need to comment on people coming into the country? Either he has a supremely bad choice in words, or he was commenting on immigrants, rather than gangs, which would be pretty fucking racist.
Also to those that agree with the more charitable interpretation, why do you think gang member are animals?
Also to those that agree with the more charitable interpretation, why do you think gang member are animals?
MS 13 members are coming over the border illegally which is why he brought them up.
Why do I think they are animals? Go on their wikipage and see the brutal acts that they have done, stabbing someone 40 times and ripping their heart out just to name one instance of why I would refer to them as "animals"
KarneeKarnay
Member
Sure, but they are also an established gang in the US. Listening to the quote does make it sound better, but I would still say his choice of words is poor.
Can we add the video to the OP, I feel people taking this out of context only hurts the matter.
As to why you think they are animals, do you think put in the exact same situation as a member of MS-13, you would be different and if so why?
finowns
Member
People who say gang members are like animals don't mean they are physically animals. But that they act inhumanly or don't have characteristics we admire in humans: empathy for example. Some of their actions are so heinous and stomach turning that anyone who would associate themselves with MS-13 can be called an animal.
What's the strongest pejorative you'd use to describe them?
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Gun Animal
Member
"Mexican" isn't a race. Hispanic/Latino is not a race. "Immigrant" is not a race. That you tie your shoelaces each morning is a small miracle.
yes but, somewhat paradoxically, dehumanizing people is a characteristic that is discouraged in humans (at least in the post-war western world (note that i do not necessarily agree with this standard, only that i abide it)).
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KarneeKarnay
Member
It wouldn't be animal. I think that sort of language only serves to reduce empathy and understanding behind a person motive/actions. To create distance. It's easier for us to call them animals, because then we don't have to acknowledge that we could have made the same choices they did to get to perform that action.
finowns
Member
Can you explain this a bit more? Is there some condition MS-13 members are facing to cause them to act the way they do? Certainly other people are under even worse conditions and don't murder.
KarneeKarnay
Member
I was about to ask why are you being a bitch, but instead I'm curious. What do you think race is?
infinitys_7th
Member
"Why did Trump comment on people coming into the country in context to MS-13?"
Maybe because MS-13 is a growing problem in this country because they are coming into the country from Mexico?
Not hard to figure out.
Airola
Member
Behaviorally constricted people who don't know better but act unfavorably because of social issues.
Gun Animal
Member
watch every latin drug cartel execution video you can find in an hour and then get back to me on walking their moccasins
KarneeKarnay
Member
Sure. I don't believe in Free Will. I think presented a similar situation, humans are largely predictable. Being Poor is just one factor into why some people choose to become members of MS-13. I think if you want to reduce these gangs or violent crimes, you need to understand the reasoning behind it and address it.
infinitys_7th
Member
The fact that CBS refers to violent gang members as "some illegal immigrants" is out-of-context with reality.