Kingdom Come: Deliverance Documentary (talk about development incl. "controversy")

Denton

Denton

Banned


Gameumentary are doing good work, hopefully with time they will have as big an audience as noclip, and bigger.
This doc features interviews with the Big Bad himself (yes, that is sarcasm), Dan Vávra, as well as Martin Klíma, Viktor Bocan, Aša Nowak (Warhorse historian) and others. Very interesting watch for any RPG or Kingdom Come fans.
 
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Not my kind of tea, but it's really impressive what a small, dedicated studio can achieve with stubbornness and persistence. To be honest, I though the project will be canned multiple times, yet after almost 5 years of development it finally had hit the market and was a great success.

And all that controversy around the director, Daniel Vavra? Well central Europe isn't as "progressive" as US, two different cultures. He didn't say nothing especially controversial in my geopolitical climate. But yeah, he's an evil supporter of GamerGate. Sure, why not.
 
Loved this game. The "controversy" around it always made me chuckle. Historical accuracy = racism . Which also meant Vavra was a Nazi. I LOVED how he refused to bow down to the SJW.
 
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Given NoClip's political leanings and actively insulting its members during the FMV release - I really hope these folk eclipse the shit out of NoClip. Great video.
 
Skyn3t said:
Not my kind of tea, but it's really impressive what a small, dedicated studio can achieve with stubbornness and persistence. To be honest, I though the project will be canned multiple times, yet after almost 5 years of development it finally had hit the market and was a great success.

And all that controversy around the director, Daniel Vavra? Well central Europe isn't as "progressive" as US, two different cultures. He didn't say nothing especially controversial in my geopolitical climate. But yeah, he's an evil supporter of GamerGate. Sure, why not.
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I'd say we (I am czech) are progressive enough, just not in regressive ways :)
The thing with Dan Vávra is, he can be a loudmouth. And sometimes a bit of an asshole, particularly when encountering stupidity. But his "support" for GG was strictly based around his distaste of game journalists insulting gamers and painting the gaming industry as inherently sexist and mysogynist. But of course, nuance is impossible with some people, so you tweeted few times in support of gamergate? You must hate women! It is stupid.

Same thing with the racism accusations...not including africans/japanese/eskymos in a game taking place in 16km2 rural bohemia 1403? Racist! Saddest thing though were some reviews, particularly Eurogamer one - I always though Robert Purchese was cool, but he disappointed me there so much.
 
Hallo there neighbour, Polish citizen here. You have amazing porn industry, real quality material ;) And yeah, the first Mafia game was cool :D
 
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Skyn3t said:
Hallo there neighbour, Polish citizen here. You have amazing porn industry, real quality material ;) And yeah, the first Mafia game was cool :D
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well I don't know anything about that...

:)

First Mafia is brilliant, but I like second and even third as well, even with their flaws..they still have great atmosphere.
Obviously nobody in Europe beats Poland though when it comes to game development..somehow your studios make even countries like UK or Germany cower in shame.
 
Great documentary. It's great seeing a company evolve from 10 awkward teenagers who can't even decide how they should listen to music to being able to rival AAA games, all while still maintaining their passion. The PR guy seemed very level-headed and handled the controversy perfectly.
 
Denton said:
Saddest thing though were some reviews, particularly Eurogamer one - I always though Robert Purchese was cool, but he disappointed me there so much.
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I'm glad that Eurogamer had the courage to point out the lack of diversity in this game. If I could, I'd shake the hands of all 17 middle class white blokes and 1 white woman that make up their staff.
 
Denton said:
well I don't know anything about that...

:)

First Mafia is brilliant, but I like second and even third as well, even with their flaws..they still have great atmosphere.
Obviously nobody in Europe beats Poland though when it comes to game development..somehow your studios make even countries like UK or Germany cower in shame.
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Took us a long time to achieve that though. Czech Republic is so much smaller and yet for so long they were spanking us silly :D I remember we were all playing Mafia, Operation Flashpoint and Hidden and Dangerous 1-2 and constantly thinking "will our devs ever be able to reach this level?".
 
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KonradLaw said:
Took us a long time to achieve that though. Czech Republic is so much smaller and yet for so long they were spanking us silly :D I remember we were all playing Mafia, Operation Flashpoint and Hidden and Dangerous 1-2 and constantly thinking "will our devs ever be able to reach this level?".
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Yeah our devs got out the gates with a hooorah - besides the ones you mentioned there were also the awesome Vietcong and Chameleon - but recently the AAA game scene is pretty dead here. 2K Czech - former Illusion - was gutted and mostly transfered to US, where the flawed (but still pretty good imo) Mafia 3 was made. Vatra made Silent Hill Downpour and died. There are some super awesome companies releasing super niche games - SCS with EuroTruck, Amanita with Samorosts, Keen with Medieval and Space engineers, obviously Bohemia with ArmA.

But the only ones making (or attempting) proper AAA awesomeness is Warhorse. Meanwhile you guys have CDP - best studio on the planet - Techland - another brilliant studio, and ton of others - Astronauts, Flying Wild Hog, 11bit, Bloober, People Can Fly, Reikon, Acid Wizard..way too many.
 
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Umm, Adrian Chmielarz, former boss of People Can Fly and current chief of The Astronauts is like the opposite of Daniel Vavra. A hardcore leftist, or what he likes to call himself - a libertarian. Had him in friends when I used Facebook and was really unimpressed by him pushing his political agenda, publishing photos from fancy restaurants and being an overall smartass douche. What's interesting, he almost didn't write about gaming as such, just the political bullshit. 4/10
 
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Skyn3t said:
Umm, Adrian Chmielarz, former boss of People Can Fly and current chief of The Astronauts is like the opposite of Daniel Vavra. A hardcore leftist, or what he likes to call himself - a libertarian. Had him in friends when I used Facebook and was really unimpressed by him pushing his political agenda, publishing photos from fancy restaurants and being an overall smartass douche. What's interesting, he almost didn't write about gaming as such, just the political bullshit. 4/10
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Hah, I like Adrian. May not agree about everything, but I liked a lot of what he wrote on his medium and astronauts blogs, mostly game design and analysis related.
Also, hardcore leftist is the opposite of libertarian. Libertarians are about small government, low influence on people's lives, low taxes, lot of freedom and personal responsibility. Leftists are the opposite of that.
 
I'm terrible in the political discourse. Sorry for mixing terms, I just plain and simple don't give a fuck about that stuff (31 years old, never voted).

I've read some stuff he wrote on Medium and found it to be, well, smartass douchery. I treat video games as fun, not really interested in all the "voodoo" behind the scenes. Of course if someone looks for a piece about game design, they might be good, but none entertainment value found there. I prefere outspoken and easy going megalomaniacs like Hideki Kamiya ;)

 
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So media scream about lack of diversity in Kingdom Come Deliverance, yet didn't say jack shit about diversity in Ghost of Tsushima.

This is why game the current "progressive" game journalism is a joke.
 
Skyn3t said:
I'm terrible in the political discourse. Sorry for mixing terms, I just plain and simple don't give a fuck about that stuff (31 years old, never voted).

I've read some stuff he wrote on Medium and found it to be, well, smartass douchery. I treat video games as fun, not really interested in all the "voodoo" behind the scenes. Of course if someone looks for a piece about game design, they might be good, but none entertainment value found there. I prefere outspoken and easy going megalomaniacs like Hideki Kamiya ;)

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Ok I admit that Kamiya comics is funny as hell.
 
Skyn3t said:
Umm, Adrian Chmielarz, former boss of People Can Fly and current chief of The Astronauts is like the opposite of Daniel Vavra. A hardcore leftist, or what he likes to call himself - a libertarian. Had him in friends when I used Facebook and was really unimpressed by him pushing his political agenda, publishing photos from fancy restaurants and being an overall smartass douche. What's interesting, he almost didn't write about gaming as such, just the political bullshit. 4/10
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But he's exactly like Vavra in defending local creators' freedoms against SJW mobs, so just like Vavra he got labelled as Gator :)
 
Great documentary, still haven't played the game. But i bought a PS4 Pro, so now i do have a platform to run it. Is it technically competent, or better wait untill i get myself a gaming PC?

And a bit offtopic: nice East Europe representation here. Hi brothers!

And regarding Chmielarz: kind of a dick with his views and opinions, bit hey - can't be perfect. And can't back out of the left or the rest of the team will eat you.
 
Skyn3t said:
I'm terrible in the political discourse. Sorry for mixing terms, I just plain and simple don't give a fuck about that stuff (31 years old, never voted).

I've read some stuff he wrote on Medium and found it to be, well, smartass douchery. I treat video games as fun, not really interested in all the "voodoo" behind the scenes. Of course if someone looks for a piece about game design, they might be good, but none entertainment value found there. I prefere outspoken and easy going megalomaniacs like Hideki Kamiya ;)

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I really like Kamiya but what's up with this then?
My feeling is that games themselves… they're not just mass-produced things. They're art, they're part of the developer's personality. It's not like you just have the parts and a blueprint, then you assemble them like a car. I don't want games to be that way. I want games to be about each person's individuality so players can feel the creativity that comes from the person directing it.
That's the way I want to look at games, that's how they need to be made. Obviously, that comes at a cost – there's risk, you have to do thing iteratively. Everything you try that's never been done before can totally blow up in your face. Any time you leave something up to one person, maybe they're not getting it done the right way. There are so many different things that can happen, but if you can't get that director's color, if you can't do innovative things like that, ultimately you lose out.
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https://wccftech.com/hideki-kamiya-games-art-mass-produced/
 
MayauMiao said:
So media scream about lack of diversity in Kingdom Come Deliverance, yet didn't say jack shit about diversity in Ghost of Tsushima.

This is why game the current "progressive" game journalism is a joke.
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It's only bad when they're white.
 
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redHelios said:
One of the makers of this documentary went onto resetera to answer questions and get feedback.
https://www.resetera.com/threads/gameumentary-kingdom-come-deliverance-documentary.57542/
I'm honestly surprised he managed to keep his calm so much when discussing with people clearly trying to twist his words. Absolutely disgusting.
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This is hilarious. I feel bad for him, because he put in a lot of work and passion into that documentary and it always sting to be exposed to environments where that's dismissed or met with hostility.

Does this address Vavra's support of Gamergate?
I've only watched "the controversy" part, but it doesn't even seem to be mentioned?
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Does the documentary address the topic of rising nationalism in the Czech Republic and how national identity is formed these days?
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Shameful. In the year of our Lord, 2018, reviews are expected to include that lest they fundamentally fail as reviews.

My goal with Gameumentary is to not drive the narrative or push any political agendas. The games media has become so, so polarizing with that sort of stuff and I have no interest in taking part in any of that. I covered the controversy with this doc because I wanted to humanize the situation a bit and allow discussion without someone else putting words in anyone else's mouth.
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FOOL! "All documentaries are inherently political"! "In actively choosing to not engage in that debate [he] [has] made a stance. " "There is no way to be apolitical here."

But now "that him participating in the thread meant that he would be willing to answer a few questions. "
It's good vigilant vanguards of justice avoided in time "the rabbit hole this could drop down. i.e. this isn't a political piece so don't bring it up here."

Also no controversy ever existed about KCD's lack of PoC.

* : direct quotes
 
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redHelios said:
One of the makers of this documentary went onto resetera to answer questions and get feedback.
https://www.resetera.com/threads/gameumentary-kingdom-come-deliverance-documentary.57542/
I'm honestly surprised he managed to keep his calm so much when discussing with people clearly trying to twist his words. Absolutely disgusting.
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I don't know why i even remotely expected to see something different than the actual outcome. This is both hilarious and frightening. Remember - those.people.also have voting power, just like you.

EDIT:
God, how did i ever miss this pic:
 
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Watched it yesterday. It was a lot about the background beforehand and then got into the development, and the problems Warhorse faced in getting publishers on board with the project given it didn't fall into a pre-existing category being a Historical RPG versus a Fantasy one, and how Kickstarter proved a useful avenue not only in demonstrating positive public interest in the nature of the project but also in helping the Studio secure broader funding.

After that, it gets a lot into the design and development of the game world and the kind of philosophy behind it which is pretty interesting in terms of their approach. If you're a fan of the game,e I'd say it's worth a watch, though I'd turn on closed captions because some of those Czech accents are quite hard to decipher.
 
KonradLaw said:
Jesus Christ. Those people are mental.
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It is more sad than anything...when the ideology is so blinding that it allows for no nuance, no context, no benefit of the doubt, no understanding of sarcasm, no forgiveness, no nothing other than seething hatred for perceived slights.
 
Denton said:
well I don't know anything about that...

:)

First Mafia is brilliant, but I like second and even third as well, even with their flaws..they still have great atmosphere.
Obviously nobody in Europe beats Poland though when it comes to game development..somehow your studios make even countries like UK or Germany cower in shame.
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Rockstar says hello
 
Denton said:
Fair enough, scottish Rockstar is a powerhouse, then there is Playground games and few others, but point is not too shaken.
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Your point is not only shaken, it's been wrecked. Rockstar are so far ahead of anything that's come out of Poland it's almost unfair to even mention them. So, we'll put Rockstar to the side for the moment and we can look at what else the UK has produced. Batman, Forza, Elite Dangerous, Tomb Raider, Football Manager, GoldenEye, Burnout Paradise, Little Big Planet, Wipeout, No Man's Sky. Those are just the modern ones. Poland has The Witcher series and that's pretty much it. CDPR are great and I can't wait to play Cyberpunk but in terms of game development Poland aren't making anyone cower.
 
Snoopycat said:
Your point is not only shaken, it's been wrecked. Rockstar are so far ahead of anything that's come out of Poland it's almost unfair to even mention them. So, we'll put Rockstar to the side for the moment and we can look at what else the UK has produced. Batman, Forza, Elite Dangerous, Tomb Raider, Football Manager, GoldenEye, Burnout Paradise, Little Big Planet, Wipeout, No Man's Sky. Those are just the modern ones. Poland has The Witcher series and that's pretty much it. CDPR are great and I can't wait to play Cyberpunk but in terms of game development Poland aren't making anyone cower.
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I like GTA (finished every single one that has PC version), though for my money Witcher 3 wrecks anything Rockstar has ever put out (in quality/enjoyment, my own), although obviously not in monetary terms. Still it's one studio. You listed lot of good games, not denying that. But when I look at list of companies in UK (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_game_companies_in_the_United_Kingdom), the number of those that says "defunct" is pretty staggering...and a shame. Recently it doesn't seem like there are as many AAA games coming out of UK as there were in the past.
 
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