Ass of Can Whooping
Member
For those stating that MS never said what the FTC claims in the EU regarding the Zenimax/Bethesda acquisition. This is the very conclusion in their official document sent to the EU regulators:
Oof
Microsoft / Activision Deal Approval Watch |OT| (MS/ABK close)
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Oof
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
For those stating that MS never said what the FTC claims in the EU regarding the Zenimax/Bethesda acquisition. This is the very conclusion in their official document sent to the EU regulators:
R3claimer117
Member
It didn't thought you can still buy deathloop and ghost wire on there one of those games which isn't even available for purchase on its own platform yet due to Sony exclusivity.For those stating that MS never said what the FTC claims in the EU regarding the Zenimax/Bethesda acquisition. This is the very conclusion in their official document sent to the EU regulators:
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
For those stating that MS never said what the FTC claims in the EU regarding the Zenimax/Bethesda acquisition. This is the very conclusion in their official document sent to the EU regulators:
But Zenimax games *are* still available for purchase on rival consoles.
This is not a gotcha
Banjo64
cumsessed
Uh oh MS - caught with their pants down there. Surprised their lawyers didn't highlight this when they were discussing making Zeni games exclusive.For those stating that MS never said what the FTC claims in the EU regarding the Zenimax/Bethesda acquisition. This is the very conclusion in their official document sent to the EU regulators:
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
What part of "limit making" is hard for you to absorb?But Zenimax games *are* still available for purchase on rival consoles.
This is not a gotcha
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
It's easy to absorb, the statement directly says cease or limit making zenimax games available for purchase on rival consoles.
Numerous zenimax games are available to purchase on rival consoles.
Is there a statement in the conclusion that they will continue to develop new games for rival consoles ?
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Now for the "limit making" part?
DarkMage619
$MSFT
Remember when Deathloop and Ghostwire Toyko were blocked on PlayStation as soon as MS purchased Bethesda? Me either. Pants down indeed.
The lawsuit from the FTC will have to be supported in court. Looking forward to seeing the laws broken by this acquisition.
xHunter
Member
I think this is just badly worded. Can be interpreted as "we wont stop selling current ZeniMax games" and "we wont stop selling new ZeniMax games" on other platforms. Might be wrong though since english is not my native language.For those stating that MS never said what the FTC claims in the EU regarding the Zenimax/Bethesda acquisition. This is the very conclusion in their official document sent to the EU regulators:
Banjo64
cumsessed
you're just talking in double speak at this point - it's a massive shame as well. Did Microsoft sign the exclusivity deal for Deathloop and Ghostwire? No? Ok then, we can all wipe our ass with that comment.
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
They didn't limit making them available, just like the statement says.
If there is any other corroborating statement in the entire conclusion that says otherwise, please I'm all ears.
Could an argument be made that they are doing the "associated cost" of marketing or development for that single release therefore it's ok too? They don't make it exclusive for free. Not really different in its aim of excluding competitors is it though? Shrinking others to grow, especially when it's already established IPs. You are growing xbox by shrinking a competitors output indefinitely. In the latter it's even worse wouldn't you say?
Besides, as I said, even just counting deals, not acquisitions, Ms has made deals to exclude PS, they aren't short of those and I'd say they even have had more of those with big publishers/games than Sony:
Xbox one gen:
Dead rising 4
Tomb raider
Titanfall
Plants vs Zombies: Garden warfare
PUBG
Elite Dangerous
The people who are now bringing the Sony game exclusive deals up which aren't even that plentiful during this massive consolidation have an axe to grind, to try and paint their company as virtuous while they do the big indefinite exclusions. 360 gen isn't even a contest with that strategy. They were making deals with literally everybody out there, a lot with established IPs. Who was calling them out like this then?
It's being brought out as a whataboutism for something worse happening today. Before anybody gets the idea that it's different now it really isn't either. you already have examples of it with The Medium, CrossfireX, Ark 2, Warhammer, STALKER2, etc. Add the acquisitions like Hellblade 2, Outer Worlds 2, most Zenimax IPs like Elder Scrolls, Fallout, etc and maybe soon Activision Blizzard IPs. You can't talk about others growing their platform by shrinking others when you're shrinking others like that to grow yours, and all your fans can do is point to a 3 game deal with Square Enix or skins as the real unfair anticompetitive thing. Doesn't make sense.
Snowdonhoffen
Member
I know statements aren't like definitive proof of anything, but all this Bethesda talk reminds me when Phil said:
"This deal was not done to take games away from another player base" and months later he was like "This deal was all about delivering great exclusive games"
And then MS saying that Redfall and Starfield will be exclusive because there isn't an existing fanbase or demand, then The Elder Scrolls VI being exclusive kinda contradicts this, lol.
"This deal was not done to take games away from another player base" and months later he was like "This deal was all about delivering great exclusive games"
And then MS saying that Redfall and Starfield will be exclusive because there isn't an existing fanbase or demand, then The Elder Scrolls VI being exclusive kinda contradicts this, lol.
3liteDragon
Member
What a cringe way to word it lol
R3claimer117
Member
It further stated: "Microsoft will not make any existing ZeniMax games exclusive to Xbox. They will continue to be available for purchase for PCs and other gaming hardware for which they are currently available, which will ensure that they continue to be available to current players of those games. Microsoft will not be removing players' access to any current games, no matter where they currently play." (Microsoft ZeniMax Form CO, January 29, 2021, at p. 13)
For future games, Microsoft also maintained its position: • In its merger notice to the European Commission on ZeniMax, Microsoft stated:
"Future decisions on whether to distribute ZeniMax games for other consoles will be made on a case-by-case basis, taking into account player demand and sentiment. Factors that will inform Microsoft's decision-making on future games include consumer demand and preference and the willingness of third parties to work with Microsoft to launch games for their devices." (Microsoft ZeniMax Form CO, January 29, 2021, at p. 5).
Maybe you guys shouldn't do selective quotations. The FTC is absurd this is what they promised.
intheinbetween
Member
And the more and more the date for June 2023 to close the deal makes more sense.
Btw, thank god if Sony acquired Square they would be releasing every title on other platforms besides PS and EGS
Btw, thank god if Sony acquired Square they would be releasing every title on other platforms besides PS and EGS
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MisterXDTV
Member
Ass of Can Whooping
Member
They convinced them of the low likelihood that they'd engage in an input foreclosure. Oops
You should probably just stop posting
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Banjo64
cumsessed
What is your point sorry? Is this what you think has happened with Starfield, TES 6 and Redfall?
DarkMage619
$MSFT
Did MS sign an agreement to put Redfall and Starfield on PlayStation?
"Starfield is a new game under development by Bethesda Game Studios. It will be available on the
Xbox console and PC. Starfield, however, is yet to be released; Xbox has announced that it will be
coming in 2023. It is a single-player game. It has no pre-existing sales, revenue, or community of
gamers on any console, much less PlayStation, that would be impacted by an exclusivity decision."
"Redfall is a new game under development by Arkane Studios Austin. It will be available on the Xbox
console and PC. Redfall, however, is yet to be released; Xbox has announced that it will be available
in 2023. It is a single-player game with multi-player capabilities. It has no pre-existing sales, revenue,
or community of gamers on any console, much less PlayStation, that would be impacted by exclusivity decision."
Yup pants totally down.
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
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Ass of Can Whooping
Member
Damn shame there's non existent games headlining PS Plus this month ...
You guys can't be this stupid.
Banjo64
cumsessed
Would not have the incentive to cease or limit Zenimax games available for purchase on rival consoles
You seem to be having a hard time understanding but that means they told EU regulators they don't have the incentive to stop selling games on PlayStation. That doesn't mean already released games. That doesn't mean games where a deal is in place like Ghostwire and Deathloop. That was a sweeping statement about ALL Zenimax games, which the FTC (and the CMA and EU will follow suit) have deemed to be deliberately misleading and will be suing over it.
xHunter
Member
So appearently this was submitted 5 months after they told the EC that they would decide the exclusivity on Bethesda games on a case by case basis:
108. and 109. makes it seem like them making Bethesda Zenimax games exclusive would be highly "implausible" and yet their next 2 games were announced as exclusive titles.
108. and 109. makes it seem like them making Bethesda Zenimax games exclusive would be highly "implausible" and yet their next 2 games were announced as exclusive titles.
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feynoob
Banned
The Federal Trade Commission is seeking to block technology giant Microsoft Corp. from acquiring leading video game developer Activision Blizzard, Inc. and its blockbuster gaming franchises such as Call of Duty, alleging that the $69 billion deal, Microsoft's largest ever and the largest ever in the video gaming industry, would enable Microsoft to suppress competitors to its Xbox gaming consoles and its rapidly growing subscription content and cloud-gaming business.
In a complaint issued today, the FTC pointed to Microsoft's record of acquiring and using valuable gaming content to suppress competition from rival consoles, including its acquisition of ZeniMax, parent company of Bethesda Softworks (a well-known game developer). Microsoft decided to make several of Bethesda's titles including Starfield and Redfall Microsoft exclusives despite assurances it had given to European antitrust authorities that it had no incentive to withhold games from rival consoles.
"Microsoft has already shown that it can and will withhold content from its gaming rivals," said Holly Vedova, Director of the FTC's Bureau of Competition. "Today we seek to stop Microsoft from gaining control over a leading independent game studio and using it to harm competition in multiple dynamic and fast-growing gaming markets."
Microsoft's Xbox Series S and Series X are one of only two types of high performance video game consoles. Importantly, Microsoft also offers a leading video game content subscription service called Xbox Game Pass, as well as a cutting-edge cloud-based video game streaming service, according to the complaint.
Activision is one of only a very small number of top video game developers in the world that create and publish high-quality video games for multiple devices, including video game consoles, PCs, and mobile devices. It produces some of the most iconic and popular video game titles, including Call of Duty, World of Warcraft, Diablo, and Overwatch, and has a combined 154 million monthly active users around the world, according to the FTC's complaint. Activision currently has a strategy of offering its games on many devices regardless of producer.
But that could change if the deal is allowed to proceed. With control over Activision's blockbuster franchises, Microsoft would have both the means and motive to harm competition by manipulating Activision's pricing, degrading Activision's game quality or player experience on rival consoles and gaming services, changing the terms and timing of access to Activision's content, or withholding content from competitors entirely, resulting in harm to consumers.
The Commission vote to issue the complaint was 3-1, with Commissioner Christine S. Wilson voting no. A copy of the administrative complaint will be available shortly.
NOTE: The Commission issues an administrative complaint when it has "reason to believe" that the law has been or is being violated, and it appears to the Commission that a proceeding is in the public interest. The issuance of the administrative complaint marks the beginning of a proceeding in which the allegations will be tried in a formal hearing before an administrative law judge.
The Federal Trade Commission works to promote competition, and protect and educate consumers. You can learn more about how competition benefits consumers or file an antitrust complaint. For the latest news and resources, follow the FTC on social media, subscribe to press releases and read our blog.
MisterXDTV
Member
So appearently this was submitted 5 months after they told the EC that they would decide the exclusivity on Bethesda games on a case by case basis:
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108. and 109. makes it seem like they making Bethesda Zenimax games exclusive would be highly "implausible" and yet there next 2 games were announced as exclusive titles.
But remember they do it to give players more choice.....
LOL
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
So appearently this was submitted 5 months after they told the EC that they would decide the exclusivity on Bethesda games on a case by case basis:
108. and 109. makes it seem like them making Bethesda Zenimax games exclusive would be highly "implausible" and yet their next 2 games were announced as exclusive titles.
Read the highlighted part. Bethesda's games are being primed as system sellers, and there weren't any assurances unlike this CoD case about guaranteed availability.
You guys are using this as a gotcha, it really isn't
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Fess
Member
Bold move. Look at the current stock movements, it's all about reactions from this, there is too much uncertainty now, I'd say it's better to buy at drops and sell if it bounce up between the drops.I'm holding ALL stock.
This is how all this ends. A deal that is fought for in court is better than a deal approved in which the regulatory body tries to damage the value of the deal. The FTC likely tried to impose some rule with regards to Game Pass, and Microsoft wasn't having it.
https://www.cnbc.com/2019/02/26/appeals-court-upholds-decision-allowing-att-to-buy-time-warner.html#:~:text=Investing Club-,AT&T's merger with Time Warner will stand, after DOJ loses,appeal and drops the case&text=In June, U.S. District Court,AT&T formally closed the deal
ChiefDada
Member
Based on their behavior and baseless reasoning over the past few days, it is entirely possible they are.
MasterCornholio
Member
It still can go through. It's just going to take longer to get a verdict now.
feynoob
Banned
Its going to go through, since it went to court. FTC block was already anticipated due to lina.
I am just going to enjoy this lawsuit. We would get gold mine info.
xHunter
Member
Read the highlighted part. Bethesda's games are being primed as system sellers, and there weren't any assurances unlike this CoD case about guaranteed availability.
You guys are using this as a gotcha, it really isn't
Literally the next sentence. They made it seem like they wouldnt make them exclusive. This is what the FTC is referencing.
Also i dont know why you think everything is a "gotcha". People are discussing the case. If you cant handle it, maybe ignore the thread.
kyliethicc
Member
DarkMage619
$MSFT
You see the difference between you and me is I accept that Sony can conduct business any way they want. I am free to complain about price hikes and bad service like I would about any company though. It's business.
I think that buying a studio and paying for its upkeep forever is a permanent investment in a platform. That is true when Sony does it and it is true when MS does it. It is business but I am not going to sit here and say it's fine when Sony buys the permanent rights for Street Fighter 5 and Final Fantasy 7 for PlayStation but it's bad when MS buys a studio that makes Starfield.
Like I said before the PlayStation is one of the largest brands on Earth it is almost impossible to find a major studio that has never made a game on their platforms. Sony will survive without Hellblade and the Outer World and they can survive with CoD(but won't have to in CoDs case). None of this changes their market position. There are still PLENTY of exclusive titles that are on PlayStation so they are hardly hurting. Competition is good for the industry.
Jen_yakzua
Member
Where's the lie
Banjo64
cumsessed
It really is because this Zenimax statement to the EU reads very similarly to their submissions to the CMA re; ABK. You can take 'not incentivised' to now mean 'once that 10 year deal is over CoD's exclusive' using their own past submissions and behaviour against them.
Read the highlighted part. Bethesda's games are being primed as system sellers, and there weren't any assurances unlike this CoD case about guaranteed availability.
You guys are using this as a gotcha, it really isn't
Elog
Member
I believe it all depends on how/what the EU does as well. If the EU also moves as hard as the FTC, the execution risk goes through the roof (not impossible, just very unlikely).
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NickFire
Member
Sometimes people use PR and corporate speak to send a message without saying it (to give them an out later). It's a solid strategy but also a double edge sword, like it seems to have been in this case. Remember all the debates on whether Starfield would really be exclusive? Why was it so vague until after the purchase I wonder? And if they couldn't talk about future plans then, why were they able to before this deal closed?But Zenimax games *are* still available for purchase on rival consoles.
This is not a gotcha
Neofire
Member
This is PR talk, it didn't make sense to remove Starfield and Elder Scrolls from the Playstation platforms when they got were excited to come to those ecosystems but MS did it lol.
Who knows which IPs MS would lock down if given free rein to gobble up ABK and all of it's titles.
Ass of Can Whooping
Member
Excluding Xbox*
feynoob
Banned
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3liteDragon
Member
Gonna be interesting to see where the CMA & the EU go with this, I think that's where all eyes should be on tbh.
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akimbo009
Gold Member
"Microsoft has already shown that it can and will withhold content from its gaming rivals," said Holly Vedova, Director of the FTC's Bureau of Competition. "Today we seek to stop Microsoft from gaining control over a leading independent game studio and using it to harm competition in multiple dynamic and fast-growing gaming markets."
Clearly doesn't play FF7...
Clearly doesn't play FF7...
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