Why is it viewed as negative if a developer can use Game Pass to help them reach profitability faster?

Spukc said:
Again dumb edge case.
And people will not be ok with this.
And yes i would pirate the fuck out of my console if this ever happens
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Fact remains you are still renting your games.

Heck with the recent Nintendo news people will kind of just be renting their Switch 2s since Nintendo can brick them if they see fit enough

I guess same goes with Sony and Xbox to a degree
 
It's simple - believe in your product or don't - putting a game on gamepass devalues your work to ZERO - why should anyone pay for something they can obtain play finish for FREE
 
lastmessiah said:
Game Pass is free?
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Awkward Bad News GIF


Yep there is an ENTIRE thread how you can continuously sub unsub get a full refund so yes FREE
 
rofif said:
because gamepass ruins the industry, devalues games and we dont even know how much they make out of it compared to just selling the game
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I have a great news for you, if you want to support the devs you have the option of buy the game at full price… Like i did with Lies Of P and Expedition 33, and done.
 
LordOcidax said:
I have a great news for you, if you want to support the devs you have the option of buy the game at full price… Like i did with Lies Of P and Expedition 33, and done.
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I do that on ps5 on disc.
I even bought the indiana slop jones on steam
 
rofif said:
I do that on ps5 on disc.
I even bought the indiana slop jones on steam
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Indiana Jones is own by Microsoft, they are going to be ok. For Indies is a lot more important. Indiana Jones was a meh game for me, thanks God GP exists.
 
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LordOcidax said:
I have a great news for you, if you want to support the devs you have the option of buy the game at full price… Like i did with Lies Of P and Expedition 33, and done.
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You still pay for bad games with your gamepass subscription. Without you, bad games would be less funded. No?

You can still buy games, and support companies but:

A. Overall many people will decide not to buy games they play on gamepass to save money, thus reducing the funding for good games overall
B. By paying for gamepass you are supporting many games that you, your friends, us, and most everyone probably hates. You fund those with gamepass

I'm not mad about it, but them's the breaks. It also shrinks the industry by reducing the overall spend on gaming, but that part is just my speculation.
 
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Zacfoldor said:
You still pay for bad games with your gamepass subscription. Without you, bad games would be less funded. No?

You can still buy games, and support companies but:

A. Overall many people will decide not to buy games they play on gamepass to save money, thus reducing the funding for good games overall
B. By paying for gamepass you are supporting many games that you, your friends, us, and most everyone probably hates. You fund those with gamepass

I'm not mad about it, but them's the breaks. It also shrinks the industry by reducing the overall spend on gaming, but that part is just my speculation.
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We had big video games companies going bankrupt before the gamepass was a thing… And is not going to change with or without GP around… For me as a player GP is a great thing… IMO.
 
Just want to reiterate that it is Sony's fault that Game Pass is not on PlayStation. It is Sony's decision to keep it away from PlayStation users.
 
Bboy AJ said:
Just want to reiterate that it is Sony's fault that Game Pass is not on PlayStation. It is Sony's decision to keep it away from PlayStation users.
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Today's reminder that it's Apple's fault that Google Play isn't on iOS. It is Apple's decision to keep it away from iOS users

More relevant for gaming: Apple kept Fortnite off iOS for 5 years while fighting with Epic Games in court over 30% payments for apps and games
 
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I have used gamepass since 2019 without interruption. As long as I can get it for roughtly 60-70 bucks a year, I will likely stay subbed.

But it has definitely diminished my willingness to buy games day one. I only do it for games I absolutely want to play. If I have interest, but not huge one, I just...wait for gamepass.

As much as I like a good deal, it undeniably leads to devaluation of games. But then again so do EGS giveaways, steam sales, humble choices...that ship has sailed.
 
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I pay for a month of GP here and there. It doesn't really stop me from buying games.

What does stop me from buying games day one is years of Steam sales. No way I'm paying full price for a game anymore unless it's from a very select group of developers.
 
because microsoft owns gamepass, and if your game relies on gamepass, Microsoft has full control on how much to charge your games lol
 
I think Game Pass benefits games that don't already have huge hype or established brand power. That way you get more people to try your game, share on social media to build awareness, and then get actual purchases on the other platforms.


That's why I think a new unknown like Clair Obscur slays, and Doom The Dark Ages has those big total player numbers but not good Steam concurrents.

Elder Scrolls Oblivion Remake also benefits from the shadow drop surprise, which if Sony is smart they should do with Bloodborne.
 
Wasn't the argument that devs aren't making enough money from MS because they put their game on gamepass?

I think it's a wanting cake and eat it too situation.
 
Isn't buying a games exclusivity the same thing as this?

Paying for the development costs and also provide marketing for the title? I have always wondered why that was bad
 
Really though, I've never understood the hate for it. You either are interested and subscribed, or you're not. But the negativity revolving around it and people that use it is pretty strange to me. Developers and publishers are not being forced at gunpoint to be included on Game Pass, it's a decision made by them. Unless they're owned by Microsoft, then they may not have much say, lmao. But considering the amount of developers and publishers that have been involved, surely there's some kind of benefit that comes out of it for them. If there wasn't, I'm sure they wouldn't have done it in the first place, and more wouldn't continue to want to be on Game Pass.

I've just been confused about this obsession with sales analytics, CCU, etc. as of late.
 
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HeisenbergFX4 said:
Tom Cruise What GIF
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imagine your game relies on gamepass to generate revenue.
People getting used to play your games via subscription aka "free".

Now Microsoft says "i think ill charge you twice for this sequel".
You either take it, or leave it and try to sell your game in traditional way.
 
lh032 said:
imagine your game relies on gamepass to generate revenue.
People getting used to play your games via subscription aka "free".

Now Microsoft says "i think ill charge you twice for this sequel".
You either take it, or leave it and try to sell your game in traditional way.
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Oh you are implying Devs pay MS to get their games on Gamepass?
 
HeisenbergFX4 said:
Oh you are implying Devs pay MS to get their games on Gamepass?
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wait its free? i thought there are certain fees you have to pay for your game to be on gamepass?
I guess im wrong then.

But then... assuming if Microsoft is the one paying the devs to be on gamepass, Microsoft could pay less for the sequel, that is another issue.
 
lh032 said:
wait its free? i thought there are certain fees you have to pay for your game to be on gamepass?
I guess im wrong then.

But then... assuming if Microsoft is the one paying the devs to be on gamepass, Microsoft could pay less for the sequel, that is another issue.
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MS pays the devs usually lump sums

It was reported last year MS spent a billion getting 3rd party games on the service
 
I disliked Xbox and their Gamepass thing more, when it seemed that they were harming the industry by spending tons of money to give away games for cheap, thereby harming competitors, only to start charging more after enough damage had been inflicted, leaving us with a dark empire of meh games helmed by Phil Spencer.

But the dust settled, and they suck at it. Now it's just a benign rental service. I'd use it more, but I already own so many digital games that I haven't even played yet, I don't really need it. If I want to sample a random game I've never played before I can just open my epic or gog library.
 
I don't really care if investors make money back faster. Not my problem. I don't know if other outlets are getting the games "day one" if Microsoft run premium advance access sales.
 
Baemono said:
Yes.

Financing a game to have it exclusive to a console = gives more value to the said console, better exposure for exclusive games, more attention, and sometimes better sales.

For eg: Monster Hunter Rise was a Switch exclusive, and was a success, and pushed Nintendo Switch sales even further.

But in the case of Game Pass deals, as you can subscribe for 1$ trial, you don't even need to buy the game, nor the service, just play it and even can get a refund. And you don't even need to buy an Xbox to play the game
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MH Rise is literally on every platform. What am I missing here? So is every Sony money hat save for Bloodborne.
 
Zacfoldor said:
In our capitalist society things succeed and fail based on their own merit.

Thus we benefit from this evolution, as it were, of the hobby. Good games will grow and iterate and bad or unpopular games will die on the vine.

When we remove natural selection from game development we start to get games not based around our needs but rather the needs of the publisher or the developer.

Allowing bad games to fail is required in order to allow us, the consumer to continue to have say in how our hobby progresses.

For example, if Concord was on Gamepass it would still exist and a sequel would be in the works and many games who since changed course would still be woke. It's true. If you want the real answer here it is. We can't vote with our wallet on gamepass and we mustn't trust a company enough to allow them to take that power away from us.
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If Game Pass kept Concord alive and there were enough people playing it to justify a sequel then it wasn't a bad game after all. I doubt Redfall is getting a sequel. Bad logic. The better games would still be more successful and we can play those while ignoring games the same way I ignore Fortnite. I have no interest in it, but I can see why people like it.
 
In all my time coming to GAF I've never seen PlayStation Plus criticised for the same reasons. I've always wanted to poll those who come into every Gamepass conversation with arguments about principles and devaluation whether they subscribe and use the service, though I think I know the answer.
 
People hate that? I understand the negativity towards being paid for exclusivity by Epic and releasing on PC only in their store. But Game Pass? You can still buy it elsewhere if you want to have the game in your library.
 
Have Microsoft/Xbox put out numbers that show Game Pass is profitable for developers? Do you think that their deliberate consistent communication about 'players' is an indicator that perhaps, the dollar numbers, aren't that great?
 
HeisenbergFX4 said:
Ahh if they are digital then you don't really own them, you own a license to use the content, not the content itself

So the whole Gamepass equals renting thing is null and void if your purchased library is mostly digital
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There is a little difference if you get something for "unlimited" time or get something for a month. In my country the law says if you buy something for unlimited time its called a "purchase". If you buy something for a specific limited time....its called a rent. Gamepass is definitely "renting"...nothing else. And buying on a store like steam or gog is more like a purchase, because there is just no expiry condition to yr purchase. I agree, that this digital "buying" is not 100% full ownership, as things like "reselling" are not really possible (i can live with that). But if thats yr problem, than gamepass/subscriptions is the complete wrong direction to go. It just make things more worse in that regard....instead of making anything better.
 
Gamers understand gameplay is the number on priority, others like Kojima understand cutscenes as a movie maker, not as a gamer. If you apply this rule in real life, many people in the industry will get cooked.
 
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I guess the idea is that since gp can be cheaper than buying a game, people view as a cheap game, and so, crappier one.

Sounds weird, but when people have some money, they stop chasing the smallest value possible, and actually want to buy premium to feel premium with the money they have. It's like going to the super market, and if you see a brand of honey selling for half the others, you don't think "wow, so cheap that I will take that one", you think "hmmm, what's wrong with it? What is the catch?"

With game pass people have to judge games by deeper parameters. They have to think more, and people hate thinking. So they hate on gp instead.
 
Zacfoldor said:
In our capitalist society things succeed and fail based on their own merit.

Thus we benefit from this evolution, as it were, of the hobby. Good games will grow and iterate and bad or unpopular games will die on the vine.

When we remove natural selection from game development we start to get games not based around our needs but rather the needs of the publisher or the developer.

Allowing bad games to fail is required in order to allow us, the consumer to continue to have say in how our hobby progresses.

For example, if Concord was on Gamepass it would still exist and a sequel would be in the works and many games who since changed course would still be woke. It's true. If you want the real answer here it is. We can't vote with our wallet on gamepass and we mustn't trust a company enough to allow them to take that power away from us.
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Don't download it. word of mouth will get out that a game is bad and people will skip it.
 
jufonuk said:
Don't download it. word of mouth will get out that a game is bad and people will skip it.
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But you already paid for it with yr monthly fees. It doesnt matter if you download something or not. Thats why these "engagement" numbers are so dumb and meaningless! All what matters is that M$ get their fees. And you have zero influence how they distribute the money afterwards. I dont like this whole system.
 
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