Marvel Comics' 2012 crossover event: Avengers vs. X-Men
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Byakuya769
Member
Gambit is going to be hard to beat with his new powers of bending and stretching!
AvX #1 cover, featuring the cliched face-off composition:
If this cover is to be taken literally, all the Westchester X-Men except Wolverine and Beast will side with Cyclops. (Don't take it literally.)
Okay ignoring the fact they stupidly had Wolverine Vs Cap in the Teaser totally douching Cyke again (hell and I don't even like this guy) they have Wolverine again facing off against the X Men in this picture.
So I'm going to guess that he is indeed siding with Cap or at the least is going to be stuck in th middle over siding with the X Men.
Tatsumaki Senpuukyaku!
Member
I'm guessing that he's going to side with the Avengers initially and come to his senses and join the mutants near the end. IMO Wolverine not siding with mutants would be terribly out of character even if he does hate Cyclops right now.
See this is kinda not true for me.
Wolverine respects and looks up to Cap more then any character since his early days with Xavier.
As it stands it will be very odd for current Logan to turn and fight against Cap.
Blackace
if you see me in a fight with a bear, don't help me fool, help the bear!
being a bit out of the loop, I find this to be crazy.. I followed the whole Xmen split via the Internet but really Wolvie an Avenger instead of an X-man? nuts..
Escape Goat
Member
That would be dumb if he didn't. Wolveirne is a mutant and an X-Man. He's had 40 years history with them and hes effectively been integrated into X-Men canon as a staple member. There would have to be something majorly screwy if every X-Man joined Cyke except for Wolverine.
He got mad over Cyke not giving up Omega, then not only that he took him and ASKED Cap for his permission to take and watch over him.
Even as he was leaving he said that Cap was Cap and he could do anything he wanted. When was the last time we really heard Wolverine talk that way to anyone that wasn't Kitty, Jubbs, or X-23? The only one I can remember him giving that level of respect to, on this regular of a basis was Xavier.
Even back at the start of Schism Logan said to Scott how he will follow someone if he believes he should (which was probably the single greatest Scott and Logan moment ever to me) and he has stuck to Cap for a while now. I just can't believe Cap would do something that would really turn Wolverine against him at this stage.
Tatsumaki Senpuukyaku!
Member
He's always sided with his race (for lack of a better term) over anything else. He looks up to Cap but he wouldn't hesitate to cut his throat if Cap tried to make mutants register or something like that (I say this not knowing the AvX is about btw).
Agreed, he would. However that is the thing, Cap has never done anything on that level, in fact he has fought against anything that would cause these kinda things at every turn.
My issue isn't Wolverine VS X-Men so much as what it would take to turn Wolverine VS Cap and I just don't see them doing anything that would cause this.
Tatsumaki Senpuukyaku!
Member
Well that's true. Cap is the man. One of my favorite issues of the New Mutants was the one where Magneto had just become their leader and the Avengers tried to arrest him. All the other Avengers were acting like self righteous douchebags but Cap knew something had changed with Magneto. I could see Cap siding with the mutants in the end too actually (depending on what direction the plot takes).
bigboss370
Member
wouldn't Hulk destroy half the X-men from the get-go? >_>
Not to mention Red Hulk and Thor.
HollovVpo1nt
Banned
I wonder how the writers will keep magneto and iron man separated..
Blackace
if you see me in a fight with a bear, don't help me fool, help the bear!
Iron Man made some crap in his armor long ago.... oh it's a pun...
HomerSimpson-Man
Member
Yeah.
Plus using mental attacks against Hulk, can make things potentially worse! Especially the mental feedback from the attack seemed to shockwave all those around him cause them pain instead.
Read World War Hulk: Xmen and it's all pure beatdown.
Woo, a good cover for a change.
I don't really think WWH is an accurate measurement of what would happen seeing as how Hulk was just massively overpowered, he pretty much wrecked everyone he came across since you know, that was the whole point of that storyline.
Okay, now this is a badass cover that works for Wolverine's current character.
I want that book.
HomerSimpson-Man
Member
Pffftt!! Just come up with some non-magnetic strong polymer alloy armor, done. Those Marvel egghead characters probably come up with this stuff in their sleep.
Was that the issue penciled by Kyle Baker, and Magik teleported Cap's shield away? I loved that one!
Wasn't his Extremis armour made of some plastic polymer or something? Can he still use that?
Does this even matter any more?
Wasn't it made canon that Mags even has the power over the whole electromagnetic spectrum, and could even control us because the minerals in our bodes?
So what would it matter if he had platstic armor, couldn't Mags just rip up Tony?
HomerSimpson-Man
Member
Perhaps, but his own son Skaar(dude freakin' knocked Juggernaut into the atmosphere) is already overpowered (can move tectonic plates and draw from the power of the earth to increase his strength) and Hulk too him on with attacks that would level mountains, and this after WWH.
At other times he does much less.
Hulk is purely an absolutely character plot device for strength that changes on the writer/plot calls for it.
HomerSimpson-Man
Member
Marvel does a lot of things. Like Hulk holding matter and antimatter apart by sheer strength, which is impossible. Whats electromagnetism in the grand scheme of things in all this silliness.
Parallax
best seen in the classic "Shadow of the Beast"
watch tony create some feedback emp that fucks with mags abilities, while dusting off that ceramic armor of his.
Hulk's Strength is about the same as Wolverine's healing factor at this point. He is as strong as they want when they need him to be, and as weak as they need him to be.
Funny to me that Hulk is also the best instance of Wolverine healing factor in the Ultimate line.
Though I don't know if Hulk is the worst. Thor's power seems to have MASSIVE Ups and downs as well.
Fair enough, I would just find it funny if the plastic armor is what they fell back on.
Escape Goat
Member
Wasn't Wolverine's healing factor downgraded significantly a year or two ago?
Yeah, but depending on how which book you read you can already see it on the up kick.
Granted no more single cell nonsense, but you just read some of the X Force books. I won't put any spoilers but it is not uncommon for Wolverine to have mulitiple bones and inards showing and he is still talking or bitching at X-23 and the others.
Hell even before the fall out they had a battle against the Dark Avengers and they send Omega at Wolverine and he takes him head on while getting full blasts to the mug and he comes out squeaky clean from it.
Two more:
Is it bad that I thought their mouths were Photoshopped on as part of some kind of new internet meme that I'm not aware of yet?
Black_Stride
do not tempt fate do not contrain Wonder Woman's thighs do not do not
Ohhh a good cover!
I like pretty much everything about this...Wolverine is torn between Cyke and Captain, though honestly Marvel rarely if ever has Cap doing something immoral so im pretty sure Wolverine will side with the Avengers during this arc. (or will find a way to get everyone to shut the fuck up)
Thor is definitely worse....he is at Cosmic level strength one moment and then hes back to "just super" the next.
When you consider Beta Rey is Cosmic 99% of the time it doesnt really make sense that Thor ever has trouble on earth looking at what Beta does on a daily basis.
Destroying planets for fun and all.
DonasaurusRex
Online Ho Champ
Hulk has always been limitless strength though, there was a period when he was grey, and of all times the 90's when he wasnt as extreme. But other than that, he's been unstoppable save for Thor being his nigh equal due to having some of odins power in mjolnir, and other cosmic guys like that *surfer* , namor in the water. Limitless rage into str ...is the Hulk.
Thor is another character that somehow got gimp in the extreme 90's *after the infinite crossovers , Starlin knew what was up* but as of late...he's been uber powerful Son of Odin like we all remember from classic runs like Simonson, and his early JIM feats. And remember Thor has been at half power taking names for much of his comic book run, he was punished by Odin early on for getting into midgards affairs. Later on in his comics he was basically Odin after the multiple Ragnarok story arcs during the last 40 years and he was no longer limited.
Wolverine has become his healing factor. Sucks but true, he used to be , as follows:
One of the best fighters - he and cap were by themselves in this regard others were masters of one or a few they were masters of many combat styles. This was his most powerful attribute the man was a life long, brain washed, war torn, assassin, cia agent, recon, military weapon X , counter intelligence, samurai 2 life times worth of experience ass kicking machine.
Superhuman physiology- so even with the healing he's already got beyond human ...well everything not really in shape , peak human bs people keep saying, super fucking human. thats part of why he got the adamantium, not just surviving the process but could actually move with the metal on his skeleton.
Enhanced senses and nervous system - wolverine used to get the drop on other people if you can believe that , traps, security systems, and stealth were a waste on him in his earlier days. He still seems to be a great tracker though.
Healing Factor - on top of being a superhuman, he was a healing mutant, it was never this damn strong , part of his comics was him using guile and stalling to heal up if he got banged up in a fight. I think the change happened when they amped up his HF during his adamantium-less run to compensate, they never changed it back. I find it funny how much dmg he incurs these days but poisons and gases work like clockwork on him where as before they were a nuisance to his toned down healing factor.
Agility- if you've only been reading wolverine for the past 5 years or so your like wtf? but when he debuted he was a whirling deverish of ass kickery, he didnt go blow for blow with the hulk , he out fought him. Along with any other character he came up against that was far stronger than he was.
Adamantium- Ah yes this was the equalizer not only was this relatively weak *super hero powers wise* character now UNBREAKABLE but his claws meant if you could bleed out he could kill you. Before wolverine didnt always take alot of dmg because of this, now its like a gore comic he's getting cut up like deli meat....must have some truely precise enemies these days because most shit should clang off him.
UXF does him very well though, no insta healing from massive trauma, lots of fighting skill on display , etc etc, but Remender is that dude so no surprise there. He really "gets" the characters he puts in his books.
echoshifting
Banned
Okay, now that's a cover.
I am kind of in the same boat. I'm trying to put together a list of trades I need from the past several years to catch up. I stopped at House of M and have been on a steady diet of envious internet voyeurism ever since.
I am kind of in the same boat. I'm trying to put together a list of trades I need from the past several years to catch up. I stopped at House of M and have been on a steady diet of envious internet voyeurism ever since.
The change in Wolverine has been odd. I won't say bad like alot of people but certainly one that I hadn't expected 10 years ago.
I still remember Beast talking about how smart Wolverine was despite his berserker rages, and how he was one of the top three if not the greatest fighters on the planet.
They still bring htis up from time to time so it seems like it is still meant to be part of his character, that said it seems like Wolverine really mirrors the writers in his current form.
I mean if he can tank and just soak up damage to the point that Cyclops or Omega can blast him point blank in the face and he can keep trucking, then what is the point of trying other means even if he is better at them?
Sadly at this point Wolverine is used more like a Colossus or Thing. I always thought of Wolverine as a more scary and deadly version of someone like Phsylock so him becoming pure brusier has been an odd choice, or was.
It's really scary that X Force is the exception and it comes across as Odd to me personally that Wolverine is more stealthy and less tank and spank.
As for Hulk and Thor, they always seemed like they were meant to be the very top when pushed to the limits, well as far as mainstream characters go. Just their powers go up and down so much it's hard to take them seriously at times.
One thing I do disagree with is it was just the Healing Factor that caused this, it might have been a big thing, but I believe it was the reduction in the metals power.
By that I mean Add has become less and less powerful. As it was you had to either be on Hulk or Thor's level to just be so strong as to ignore the claws or Cap's sheild so you equaled the claws. As it stands *just* having Metal bones that are supposed to be unbreakable has become nothing special.
The weirdest part was Wolverine's big ace in the whole, his metal bones became weak in compairsion to everyone around him, at least with how these characters were presented.
Outside of X Force when was the last time Wolverine was treated as any kind of danger? You have Hulk straight ripping him in half, tons of people that can nuke him from a mile away.
I think the most in character with Wolverine's creation he has been was actually Enemy of the State, he got help but his healing factor and claws as well as how he approached things made it so he took out all those heroe's, and he didn't need to regenerate from a single cell.
Maybe that is why I love it so much, his personality may have been fucked, but his powers made since as he was in the 90's.
echoshifting
Banned
That is one powerful shit that Iron Fist is taking.Maybe not.
A tie? They'll probably set aside their differences and unite under the guise of defeating a stronger enemy.
OMG!!
Blackace
if you see me in a fight with a bear, don't help me fool, help the bear!
Maybe not.
yuck...
BenjaminBirdie
Banned
Undoubtedly. Phoenix will go cray and they'll all team up to take it down, then there'll be a scene where they walk off to their respective corners, changed, but begrudgingly committed to working together. One of them says "This isn't over," and then they pan over to a manhole, open just a smidge, where we see two glowing eyes in the darkness.
"No," the mysterious figure says. "It isn't."
Blackace
if you see me in a fight with a bear, don't help me fool, help the bear!
I know it's a cover, but cap's pretty much dead right there
Blackace
if you see me in a fight with a bear, don't help me fool, help the bear!
wow...the writing... (T ^ T)
Banana Kid
Member
The Ultimates basically kicked the shit out of the X-Men, then captured Professor X while the rest of the team escaped.
Then the X-Men took down Magneto and everything was cool.
Parallax
best seen in the classic "Shadow of the Beast"
Not really. If he can raise his shield before cykes can get a shot off, he'll be fine(minus the force of the blast of course)
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