Family of Florida boy killed by Neighborhood Watch seeks arrest

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JCreasy said:
Sorry to hurt your feelings but it's no secret that racists thrive in the Republican party. A party where a presidential nominee is congratulated for putting a minority Fox host "in his place" when he was questioned about racially tinged remarks he has made. Where the black presidential nominee was raked and maligned by his own white "supporters" for having an issue with the fact that one of his opponents maintained private property called "Niggerhead."

Now, today, this is the SAME party that has embraced the opportunity to smear the reputation of a dead black 17 year old kid because they'd rather believe that he had it coming. Even though we know the boy was doing NOTHING wrong on his way home, the fact that he was shot and killed doesn't disturb the bloggers of the Daily Caller, Bret Bart's site, Matt Drudge or Twitcy. They're digging up shit about school suspensions hoping to paint the kid as a future criminal WHEN THE DAMN SHOOTER IS THE ONE WITH THE FUCKING ARREST RECORD! ARE YOU FUCKING KIDDING ME? They even questioned if he might have stolen the skittles and tea he was found with just because there was no report of a receipt being found on his corpse.

Trayvon deserved to stand his ground too! But if you don't believe black people are worth as much as non-blacks, you won't be so eager to point that out. That'll be a nuance skipped over while making the case that Trayvon had pictures where he looked older and menacing enough to shoot.

http://www.salon.com/2012/03/30/trayvons_stand_your_ground_rights/singleton/



Not in the mind of some republicans.

http://www.salon.com/2012/04/02/why_rush_limbaugh_and_the_right_turned_on_trayvon_martin/singleton/



We've seen this attitude toward black people in the past and it's rooted in the ugly history of slavery. Yeah, slavery, sorry to bum you out. A time when blacks didn't count as real people. Chief Lee's handling of the case treated Trayvon Martin as if he wasn't a real person that deserved the full protection of the law.

If anything, his excuse harkened back to the tenets of fugitive slave law, when whites were told not to interfere with slave owners when they were in pursuit of their slaves.

http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/03/27/fugitive-slave-mentality/



This is what republicans are defending right now. THEY WANT TO TAKE ZIMMERMAN AT HIS FUCKING WORD, THOROUGH ANALYSIS OF THAT WORD BE DAMNED. And that only works if you don't give a shit about the dead black kid he killed.

Oh and the shit gets deep, because wouldn't you know it, the protection of self defense is not applied equally.

http://www.salon.com/2012/03/30/trayvons_stand_your_ground_rights/singleton/



So instead of being a moronic troll, ask yourself, why are republicans so eager to take Zimmerman at his word, the man WITH the arrest record they seem to wish Trayvon had. The man who stalked an innocent 17 year old kid because he was suspiciously black.
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THIS x a fucken billion. I have been saying from the very beginning. The ONLY person in that altercation that had any actual legal right to defend themselves due to fearing for his life, was Trayvon. Trayvon was a 17 year old high school kid who was being stalked at night! Fucking hell.
 
Trayvon went to 7-11 that night. I know this is irrelevant to the case, but since we don't have the full picture, there has to be a video footage of Trayvon buying skittles and Iced Tea. The information might be helpful to see what time he bought the snacks to accurately depict the time of this case.
 
This video makes it seem as if George did have an injury on the back of his head. I wonder how this will affect the grand jury on the 10th, if they'll see this wound as justification for self defense or if they'll think the wound was not enough.
 
slopeslider said:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cQGeq1x58aM
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Yes Soledad. The answer is yes. If it is a fact that the previous 8 robberies were young black males then yes Zimmerman would have been more suspicious of young black males at night wandering around the neighborhood. I'd be very skeptical of that claim though.

If Trayvon was a young male Hispanic, Asian or Caucasian he would still have been questioned by Zimmerman I'm sure. Young males at night in the rain arouse suspicion. At least I know I did, and sometimes for good reason in my case. My guess is if it was a young female of any ethnicity she might not have been, so Zimmerman is possibly sexist. If it was a senior citizen he might not have harassed them, so ageist? Too.

God damn it now this thread has me involved in the race BS. I came in to see what was up with Zimmermans new lawyer, I saw a flash on CNN saying he had a new one and he was "speaking out".
 
Bumblebeetuna said:
This video makes it seem as if George did have an injury on the back of his head. I wonder how this will affect the grand jury on the 10th, if they'll see this wound as justification for self defense or if they'll think the wound was not enough.
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Self defense by Trayvon. Right? Even by Zimmerman's own account, Trayvon was minding his own business, at worst, looking at peoples houses, as he walked to his father's girlfriend's place. It boggles my mind that anyone can actually entertain the idea that Zimmerman justifiably defended himself by stalking and killing an unarmed 17 year old who was doing absolutely nothing wrong.
 
slopeslider said:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cQGeq1x58aM
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If this case goes to trial, this guy could be pretty damning for George's defense. Since they are neighbors and apparently good friends, I am sure they have discussed this supposed rash of burglaries committed by young black males. Could go a long way towards showing Zimmerman racially profiled Trayvon.

I wonder what George is thinking, holed up somewhere, watching cable news and seeing all these fucking idiots coming out of the woodwork trying to defend him but really just making it worse for him in the public eye.
 
quadriplegicjon said:
Self defense by Trayvon. Right? Even by Zimmerman's own account, Trayvon was minding his own business, at worst, looking at peoples houses, as he walked to his father's girlfriend's place. It boggles my mind that anyone can actually entertain the idea that Zimmerman justifiably defended himself by stalking and killing an unarmed 17 year old who was doing absolutely nothing wrong.
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I don't think Trayvon fighting back warranted lethal force. I don't think that lethal force was justified even if Zimmerman got gashes on his head and a broken nose. I was just talking about a grand jury, would they see it the same way or would they force the prosecutors to file the charges themselves by deciding the lethal force was justified.
 
Bumblebeetuna said:
I don't think Trayvon fighting back warranted lethal force. I don't think that lethal force was justified even if Zimmerman got gashes on his head and a broken nose. I was just talking about a grand jury, would they see it the same way or would they force the prosecutors to file the charges themselves by deciding the lethal force was justified.
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Yeah, I realized you weren't implying that. Sorry if I made it sound like that. I just wanted to comment that I would be quite appalled by the grand jury if they side with Zimmerman, especially if you just look at the basic facts.
 
Bumblebeetuna said:
This video makes it seem as if George did have an injury on the back of his head. I wonder how this will affect the grand jury on the 10th, if they'll see this wound as justification for self defense or if they'll think the wound was not enough.
Click to expand...

I hope it doesn't effect the grand jury at all because that video does not make it seem as if anything, if you over saturate the reds then some shadows are going to look more red. It's the same stupid 'evidence' that Good Morning America ran and it's just as false.
 
Bumblebeetuna said:
If this case goes to trial, this guy could be pretty damning for George's defense. Since they are neighbors and apparently good friends, I am sure they have discussed this supposed rash of burglaries committed by young black males. Could go a long way towards showing Zimmerman racially profiled Trayvon.

I wonder what George is thinking, holed up somewhere, watching cable news and seeing all these fucking idiots coming out of the woodwork trying to defend him but really just making it worse for him in the public eye.
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I like how he realizes that he is saying that Zimmerman racially profiled Trayvon when the reporter tells him this, and tries to backpedal but he can't.

Also, if you plant corn you get corn. What the fuck.
 
marrec said:
I hope it doesn't effect the grand jury at all because that video does not make it seem as if anything, if you over saturate the reds then some shadows are going to look more red. It's the same stupid 'evidence' that Good Morning America ran and it's just as false.
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Past incidents are generally considered not relevant to a case especially in a grand jury panel.

This kind of material will not be brought up until an actual trial by the defense.
 
Some people act like if there was racism in play that they lose something...

There are still racist people in the world.. shocking
 
Bumblebeetuna said:
This video makes it seem as if George did have an injury on the back of his head.
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I still dont see how those injuries high up and to the side are consistent with someones head being bashed on the ground. Just having a hard time picturing the angle his head would have to be at. Clearly injuries though so add that to the list of initial misinformation that has turned out to be exactly wrong.
 
Blackace said:
Some people act like if there was racism in play that they lose something...

There are still racist people in the world.. shocking
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Welcome to Obama's America.

We wouldn't need racism if he would give up his muslin.


Maybe YOU'RE racist. Or reverse racist.
 
Dash27 said:
I still dont see how those injuries high up and to the side are consistent with someones head being bashed on the ground. Just having a hard time picturing the angle his head would have to be at. Clearly injuries though so add that to the list of initial misinformation that has turned out to be exactly wrong.
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Maybe during the fight he did a backflip but landed on his head. Tried to go all Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon or Kung Fu Hustle.

On a serious note: it will be interesting to see what evidence comes out during the trial, whether it will be similar to Casey Anthony where it was obvious she did it, but the evidence presented at trial was too weak to convict.

Or in Zimmerman's case the evidence leads to a lesser charge.
 
cametall said:
Maybe during the fight he did a backflip but landed on his head. Tried to go all Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon or Kung Fu Hustle.

On a serious note: it will be interesting to see what evidence comes out during the trial, whether it will be similar to Casey Anthony where it was obvious she did it, but the evidence presented at trial was too weak to convict.

Or in Zimmerman's case the evidence leads to a lesser charge.
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The situation is way different here. It's 100% clear who killed who and how.
 
ElFly said:
The situation is way different here. It's 100% clear who killed who and how.
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Yes but the evidence that comes out at trial may still be too weak to convict for the more serious murder charges (they're all serious). Evidence may affect how SYG is applied in this instance too (total speculation on my part).
 
cametall said:
Yes but the evidence that comes out at trial may still be too weak to convict for the more serious murder charges (they're all serious). Evidence may affect how SYG is applied in this instance too (total speculation on my part).
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It will be very difficult for them to get Zimmerman for 1st degree (not going to happen nor do I believe at all that it is 1st degree) or 2nd degree. This will likely be manslaughter if he gets convicted.
 
Scumbag Taaffe:

scumbag_taaffe2.jpg
 
cametall said:
Yes but the evidence that comes out at trial may still be too weak to convict for the more serious murder charges (they're all serious). Evidence may affect how SYG is applied in this instance too (total speculation on my part).
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I think that in the end, even if the defense proves that Zimmerman got attacked, the prosecution will have the argument that it was Trayvon that had the right to SYG cause he was harassed by Zimmerman first.

After that, if the judge admits the audio analysis evidence of Trayvon yelling for help for like half a minute, it'd be hard to escape cold blood murder charges.

IMHO the real problem is starting this lawsuit, cause the SYG argument from Zimmerman is making it difficult to even arrest him.
 
ElFly said:
I think that in the end, even if the defense proves that Zimmerman got attacked, the prosecution will have the argument that it was Trayvon that had the right to SYG cause he was harassed by Zimmerman first.

After that, if the judge admits the audio analysis evidence of Trayvon yelling for help for like half a minute, it'd be hard to escape cold blood murder charges.

IMHO the real problem is starting this lawsuit, cause the SYG argument from Zimmerman is making it difficult to even arrest him.
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I didn't think an arrest was required for a civil suit? I don't think Zimmerman would stand a chance against a lawsuit brought against him.
 
ElFly said:
I think that in the end, even if the defense proves that Zimmerman got attacked, the prosecution will have the argument that it was Trayvon that had the right to SYG cause he was harassed by Zimmerman first.

After that, if the judge admits the audio analysis evidence of Trayvon yelling for help for like half a minute, it'd be hard to escape cold blood murder charges.

IMHO the real problem is starting this lawsuit, cause the SYG argument from Zimmerman is making it difficult to even arrest him.
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This is Florida. See Casey Anthony.

Reasonable doubt is all it will take to not get a Murder conviction. I think it's doubtful they would try for Murder to begin with, most likely outcome of the grand jury would be manslaughter charges.

Zimmerman should face trial, but I fear the end result won't be to the liking of most people weighing in on this thread.
 
NervousXtian said:
This is Florida. See Casey Anthony.

Reasonable doubt is all it will take to not get a Murder conviction. I think it's doubtful they would try for Murder to begin with, most likely outcome of the grand jury would be manslaughter charges.

Zimmerman should face trial, but I fear the end result won't be to the liking of most people weighing in on this thread.
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Casey Anthony getting off had nothing to do with Florida laws. Convicting Anthony requires the same thing in any other state and there was no special Florida laws protecting her unlike this case which has specific self defense laws being brought into play.

Manslaughter is what I expect, as nothing being put out by anyone that appears to be actual evidence points to a higher murder charge, and if the do indict for a higher murder charge, it will be very difficult for the prosecution to actually prove it. Manslaughter is probably the only hope to convict Zimmerman.
 
Dash27 said:
If Trayvon was a young male Hispanic, Asian or Caucasian he would still have been questioned by Zimmerman I'm sure.
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why?

Where are you getting your confidence from, such that you are "sure"? Have you met Mr. Zimmerman? His neighbor seems to feel that racial profiling was a big part here and is actually justified for basing his assumptions and subsequent actions on the race of the victim. We have what appear to be racial epithets coming from Mr. Zimmerman's mouth as well.

What gives you so much confidence?


Eclipsis said:
Scumbag Taaffe:

scumbag_taaffe2.jpg
Click to expand...
real talk? 8 robberies in the same neighborhood in 11 months is a lot of fucking robberies. If my neighbors homes were being robbed at the pace of damn near one a month, I'd be looking to relocate. Fuck that noise.
 
Dude Abides said:
Stand your ground provides for civil immunity as well.
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I just don't see how stand your ground applies when you approach someone and initiate the confrontation like that.

On the 911 call you can HEAR Zimmerman running. Right before he states he's following him. Unless he is now claiming he was trying to run away....I think it's safe to say he was running to follow Treyvon. If that's the case, once again, how do you claim self defense when YOU are the aggressor?
 
Mammoth Jones said:
I just don't see how stand your ground applies when you approach someone and initiate the confrontation like that.

On the 911 call you can HEAR Zimmerman running. Right before he states he's following him. Unless he is now claiming he was trying to run away....I think it's safe to say he was running to follow Treyvon. If that's the case, once again, how do you claim self defense when YOU are the aggressor?
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If he ranup to the boy and attacked him right out then yes Zimmerman did not stand his ground. But if ran up to the kid and they "talked" and got into some argument, then the defense will try to state that at that point Zimmerman held his ground and felt "threatened" so he shot the kid. The whole stand your ground thing is a pain in the ass and without eye witnesses to the whole thing, it basically makes it that Zimmerman can make up any story he wants to how it went dow.
 
Dreams-Visions said:
why?

Where are you getting your confidence from, such that you are "sure"? Have you met Mr. Zimmerman? His neighbor seems to feel that racial profiling was a big part here and is actually justified for basing his assumptions and subsequent actions on the race of the victim. We have what appear to be racial epithets coming from Mr. Zimmerman's mouth as well.

What gives you so much confidence?
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I dont tend to operate from a default "everyone is racist". It's one of those hard to prove, hard to deny accusations. Havent seen any accurate information indicating he is racist, maybe I've missed it. I heard the supposed "coon" tape and I find that one absurd, it's clear to me he doesnt say coon. Have seen information that would seem to indicate he isnt racist about charity work and tutoring but who knows if that's even accurate.

What he did do was stalk and kill an unarmed kid. Best case scenario I can see for him at this point is he had no choice, but he was still at fault in my mind. As for the race thing though, I'm sure that's what some people believe, and that is certainly the ham fisted narrative being put out there but I've yet to see anyone demonstrate it.
 
Dash27 said:
I dont tend to operate from a default "everyone is racist". It's one of those hard to prove, hard to deny accusations. Havent seen any accurate information indicating he is racist, maybe I've missed it....blahblahblah
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I didn't ask you if you thought he was racist; I asked you why you're so sure racial profiling wasn't a factor here such that you would be so confident in your "sure" position.

Being racist and racial profiling are not one in the same.
 
Dash27 said:
I dont tend to operate from a default "everyone is racist". It's one of those hard to prove, hard to deny accusations. Havent seen any accurate information indicating he is racist, maybe I've missed it. I heard the supposed "coon" tape and I find that one absurd, it's clear to me he doesnt say coon. Have seen information that would seem to indicate he isnt racist about charity work and tutoring but who knows if that's even accurate.

What he did do was stalk and kill an unarmed kid. Best case scenario I can see for him at this point is he had no choice, but he was still at fault in my mind. As for the race thing though, I'm sure that's what some people believe, and that is certainly the ham fisted narrative being put out there but I've yet to see anyone demonstrate it.
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Its so absurd that his friend went on tv defending it by saying it is a term of endearment. That to me suggests that he said exactly what we think he said. Also, he stalked and killed an unharmed kid, yes. But why did he stalk this kid? Why did he find him suspicious? Why did he say he was on drugs? Come to think about it, Trayvon may not have smoke in a while if he passed the drug test police gave his dead body.
 
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