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[scy]

Lol... no way

"Mortar" - Exclusively anti-ranged, melee doesn't even get hit by it.
"Missile Dampening" - Exclusively anti-ranged, doesn't even effect melee.
"Vortex" - Exclusively anti-ranged, doesn't even effect melee
"Fast" - Anti-kiting, if you're not kiting their run speed increase is null.
"Waller" - Anti-kiting and most directly screws with ranged classes and glass canons.
"Jailor" - Anti-kiting and shouldn't even effect someone in melee range as it simply immobilizes you.
"Teleporter" - Anti-kiting and doesn't even effect someone already in melee range

Knockback, Thorns, Nightmarish, and Vampiric are really the only ones that fuck with melee more than ranged. Molten maybe if you don't run after you kill the mob.

Mortar can hit melee if enemies aren't bunched up, though this is an issue ranged deal with too. Waller sucks with Arcane Enchanted, Plagued, Desecration, etc. hard and this applies to Jailer as well. Teleport is annoying but that's more from a group perspective.

Also, Molten can hit you while meleeing so it's not just the explosion. The damage on the damage abilities are intense and there's a wall that gear hits on keeping you alive through it. Generally speaking, only Missile Dampening of those you listed is god awful for a ranged class.

For the record, I have a Monk and DH :x

Edit: Also, Invulnerable is bullshit for everyone and, as a Monk, I hate Shielding as it stops my Spirit generation which means I die :x

And does the weapon speed also dictate how fast you cast spells? If so, all DPS being equal, wouldn't a caster want a slower, harder hitting weapon to save on mana?

Cast speed is linked to your Attack Speed.

Hmm, maybe ill give this a try... I haven't had much issue with death so far going into act 3 though so I haven't really seen this viewpoint before. Ive been using serenity + the first rune, and i rarely have to heal beyond that.

To be fair, Normal and Nightmare are practically /afk to victory.

 

[Won]

Am I the only DH here that uses grenades? Seem like the least popular choice.

They are simply not fun to use in the long run. That's why they get so much hatred reg. So you don't have to use that crap too often and can get back to the fun part.

 

[Technosteve]

Duders for a good laugh go look at the official diablo 3 forums, sub forum Barbarian

Spoiler

it's all true =( =( i'm nothing more then a meat shield with a death wish

 

[Houston3000]

:lol :lol :lol
Those all fuck melee equally bad. Fuck they can even mortar you if you're meleeing them!

No they can't, on my Witch Doctor I intentionally go into melee so the mortar's arch over me... works every time.

If there are multiple mobs and they're all mortaring you when you're meleeing another, well yeah.

 

[-Pyromaniac-]

Ya the attack animation blows. But 8 hatred per toss, or constant stunlock is awesome.

yeah but you can slot in a better primary move like hungering arrow and just use bat companion for an extra 3 hatred regen a second. Or use entangling shot with the 6 hatred rune and also a bat to give you another 3. That'll stack to 9 just about every second you use it.

 

[sorijealut]

Duders for a good laugh go look at the official diablo 3 forums, sub forum Barbarian

Spoiler

it's all true =( =( i'm nothing more then a meat shield with a death wish

LOL that's my poor Barb. Except you can hardly last 4 seconds.

 

[Ferrio]

They are simply not fun to use in the long run. That's why they get so much hatred reg. So you don't have to use that crap too often and can get back to the fun part.

Spamming cluster arrow is fun though.

yeah but you can slot in a better primary move like hungering arrow and just use bat companion for an extra 3 hatred regen a second. Or use entangling shot with the 6 hatred rune and also a bat to give you another 3. That'll stack to 9 just about every second you use it.

True, though grenades will always be the highest hatred, and really the only way you can use cluster arrow. I hate entangling a lot... low damage single target if you used the hatred rune.

 

[Einbroch]

Lol... no way

"Mortar" - Exclusively anti-ranged, melee doesn't even get hit by it.
"Missile Dampening" - Exclusively anti-ranged, doesn't even effect melee.
"Vortex" - Exclusively anti-ranged, doesn't even effect melee
"Fast" - Anti-kiting, if you're not kiting their run speed increase is null.
"Waller" - Anti-kiting and most directly screws with ranged classes and glass canons.
"Jailor" - Anti-kiting and shouldn't even effect someone in melee range as it simply immobilizes you.
"Teleporter" - Anti-kiting and doesn't even effect someone already in melee range

Knockback, Thorns, Nightmarish, Fire Chain, and Vampiric are really the only ones that fuck with melee more than ranged but, except for thorns and knockback even they're back for ranged. Molten maybe if you don't run after you kill the mob.

You do know that melee still requires kiting, right? Because once melee uses their cooldowns they run away like chickens. I DPS for about six seconds then run around for ten (so my bubble is back up).

So those still effect melee about 50% of the time. Especially Jailer and Waller.

 

[Forsaken82]

To be fair, Normal and Nightmare are practically /afk to victory.

I would agree with that about normal so far lol.

 

[raphier]

Fuck Whoever came up with chain fire laser spiders.

 

[SnakeswithLasers]

What's the video card? It kinda sounds like you have something integrated.

GTS 360M (It's listed on the D3 page as being a supported "high performance" card: http://us.battle.net/support/en/art...C85043EFCE763B83709DA.blade36_05_bnet-support)

 

[Anoregon]

What skills are you using to get 4 skills on a cooldown?

Hex with heal rune, Spirit walk with heal rune, Soul harvest with, you guessed it, heal rune, and for my 4th slot I kind of mix it up because I can't settle on a skill, but right now it's Mass Confusion with the everything takes 20% extra damage rune.

 

[TommyT]

Am I the only DH here that uses grenades? Seem like the least popular choice.

I don't use them but can see a build that uses them and has skills that build around it for successful group dps. You'd essentially become a melee range/short range DH.

True, though grenades will always be the highest hatred, and really the only way you can use cluster arrow. I hate entangling a lot... low damage single target if you used the hatred rune.

Entangling is quite possibly the best primary for bosses. You don't need to really have a high dps primary when all you're wanting his hatred for a SUPER high dps secondary.

 

[Ferrio]

I don't use them but can see a build that uses them and has skills that build around it for successful group dps. You'd essentially become a melee range/short range DH.

They have a decent range... like 20-30.

Entangling is quite possibly the best primary for bosses. You don't need to really have a high dps primary when all you're wanting his hatred for a SUPER high dps secondary.

Ya, I use the hatred grenades on bosses.

 

[reggieandTFE]

What kind of damage & health should I have as level 29 demon hunter on normal mode? Some one just told me I'm crazy underpowered.

 

[-Pyromaniac-]

True, though grenades will always be the highest hatred, and really the only way you can use cluster arrow. I hate entangling a lot... low damage single target if you used the hatred rune.

I dislike entangling as well (except maybe for bosses) that's why I stick to hungering and devour rune. Do you really need that much hatred though? Also never underestimate hungering + devour. I'm pretty sure the devour rune bonus stacks on individual targets, so potential damage is extreeeeeme.

 

[TommyT]

They have a decent range... like 20-30.

Well yeah, but it's still a paltry range compared to attacking from a full screen away :lol

 

[Tacitus_]

No they can't, on my Witch Doctor I intentionally go into melee so the mortar's arch over me... works every time.

If there are multiple mobs and they're all mortaring you when you're meleeing another, well yeah.

I sure got mortared by skeletons in Inferno. Was so much bullshit.

 

[scy]

No they can't, on my Witch Doctor I intentionally go into melee so the mortar's arch over me... works every time.

If there are multiple mobs and they're all mortaring you when you're meleeing another, well yeah.

Which is the issue as the dead zone range is pretty small. If you have a Ranged enemy with Mortar, you're going to get hit if you don't have a way to keep them bunched together (like, literally on top of each other). Character distance apart is generally enough to get you in Mortar's damage range in melee (e.g., You <---> Enemy <---> Enemy2).

For the most part, it's not until Hell that combinations become stupid. There's the occasional one in Nightmare but the deck is really stacked against melee in Hell with how fast you die to certain abilities on top of getting beat on by the enemy.

 

[Cheech]

Home this afternoon from work, and the ping is amazing. I'm getting 127! Hah.

Blizzard still has work to do on the bandwidth issue.

 

[Houston3000]

You do know that melee still requires kiting, right? Because once melee uses their cooldowns they run away like chickens. I DPS for about six seconds then run around for ten (so my bubble is back up).

So those still effect melee about 50% of the time. Especially Jailer and Waller.

For a caster who has to kite pretty much 99% of the time then you can see how bad that would be. Getting walled in with a pack of Champions or Jailed if you aren't far enough away when you have 1/100th of the armor value of half the classes and less than half the HP is much worse.

 

[shintoki]

Fuck Whoever came up with chain fire laser spiders.

Amateur Hour there. Lets go with Invincible Toads. Where the lead one you are supposed to kill disappears.

 

[Ferrio]

I dislike entangling as well (except maybe for bosses) that's why I stick to hungering and devour rune. Do you really need that much hatred though? Also never underestimate hungering + devour. I'm pretty sure the devour rune bonus stacks on individual targets, so potential damage is extreeeeeme.

I gain 30 hatred per second on bosses (not including passive regen).

I use cluster arrow as my secondary attack (40 hatred cost).

Ya I need that much hatred.

 

[Fugu]

You do know that melee still requires kiting, right? Because once melee uses their cooldowns they run away like chickens. I DPS for about six seconds then run around for ten (so my bubble is back up).

So those still effect melee about 50% of the time. Especially Jailer and Waller.

What? Melee does not involve kiting. The term "kiting" comes from the act of pulling a kite; key to its definition is that the target (in the analogy, the kite) is kept a certain distance from you at all times, and that distance never shrinks to a meaningful degree. Running away is not kiting in the same way that running away from a kite is not flying a kite.

 

[scy]

For a caster who has to kite pretty much 99% of the time then you can see how bad that would be. Getting walled in with a pack of Champions or Jailed if you aren't far enough away when you have 1/100th of the armor value of half the classes and less than half the HP is much worse.

I trio with a Wizard and WD. I have 21k HP, the Wizard has 20k, and the WD has 17k. Don't use defensive skills until oh shit moments. My DH doesn't have any trouble in Hell thus far with a paltry 6k HP since it's so easy to just Smokescreen away from death forever.

Edit: Getting caught tends to be instant death, yes. "Getting caught" is pretty hard, though.

 

[-Pyromaniac-]

I gain 30 hatred per second on bosses (not including passive regen).

I use cluster arrow as my secondary attack (40 hatred cost).

Ya I need that much hatred.

that explains it, I never use cluster arrow. I stick to ball lightning because of how cheap it is for beating mobs hatred wise, the value is insane on that shit. My one strong attack is impale.

 

[SnakeswithLasers]

anyone annoyed with the randomization of maps? the fact that i know where things are going to "randomly" generate or that i see the same static barrel every time at teh same entrance is pretty irritating.I think blizz botched this aspect up as well as every other major aspect.

Also every dungeon feels the same with a straight shot hallway with a few rooms branched off. theres just TOO much negative space when I look at them map. d2's dungeons were all interconnected rooms and deadends and mazes. this is like let me run and gun down the hallway. ignore the rooms because i know it will lead me to nothing... not even another room....

you can see it in every map in d3. the only time i enjoy exploring is when it is outside. and even then the cellars become an effing nuisance, please have a variety of names and not teh same L shape in each.

that said. i am still enjoying the game... too bad it's going to end up as the bastard child of the series.

Ya, I'm already pretty tired of the maps (except for a couple) and it's the second week. They don't actually feel random at all. Which is...weird. Plus, they all run at 10FPS so that isn't helping much.

 

[eek5]

Finally killed butcher solo in inferno after so many tries. I guess I'm pretty much done with this character now because there is zero possibility of me making it through act 2 unless I somehow hit the jackpot and come across 20 million gold in a chest or soemthing :lol

 

[Houston3000]

Which is the issue as the dead zone range is pretty small. If you have a Ranged enemy with Mortar, you're going to get hit if you don't have a way to keep them bunched together (like, literally on top of each other). Character distance apart is generally enough to get you in Mortar's damage range in melee (e.g., You <---> Enemy <---> Enemy2).

For the most part, it's not until Hell that combinations become stupid. There's the occasional one in Nightmare but the deck is really stacked against melee in Hell with how fast you die to certain abilities on top of getting beat on by the enemy.

It's not stacked against melee. It's just as bad for ranged, believe me.

We don't have the viability to stand toe to toe with one Mortar Champion, let alone three. Similarly something like Teleport really fucks up ranged, and Vortex absolutely cripples us if we don't have a good evasive skill on cooldown when we're pulled into melee range. Stuff you're barely effected by in melee is rather critical for ranged. You don't know anything about patience until you fight Missile Dampening + Extra Health with a ranged character... and that's only two affixes. I'm in Hell as well with my Witch Doctor - it's not pretty.

 

[Lombax]

anyone have a link to a good inferno stream?

 

[Krauser Kat]

some posted this on reddit... also everything in this game looks cooler in german

 

[DJ Lushious]

Well, no Diablo 3 for me until Comcast can identify why I'm getting packet loss and exceptionally high latency. The issue just cropped up with in the past day, too. :-(

 

[Hoo-doo]

Currently waiting in front of the skeleton king (hell) for my latency to return to normal.

I'm not going to jump in with 900ms latency.
Anyone else on EU servers with lag issues?

 

[shintoki]

We don't have the viability to stand toe to toe with one Mortar Champion, let alone three. Similarly something like Teleport really fucks up ranged, and Vortex absolutely cripples us if we don't have a good evasive skill on cooldown when we're pulled into melee range. Stuff you're barely effected by in melee is rather critical for ranged. You don't know anything about patience until you fight Missile Dampening + Extra Health with a ranged character... and that's only two affixes. I'm in Hell as well with my Witch Doctor - it's not pretty.

Have you tried getting right next to them if they are Mortar Champions? I do it while in game and stack up right behind our tank. And it seems like that is an area their Mortar's couldn't target.

 

[Z3M0G]

Sorry if old, but it looks like today's maintenance might have addressed a bug which was stopping Damage Reduction from working properly in Inferno for Melee Classes:

http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/5270829377?page=3

 

[scy]

It's not stacked against melee. It's just as bad for ranged, believe me.

We don't have the viability to stand toe to toe with one Mortar Champion, let alone three. Similarly something like Teleport really fucks up ranged, and Vortex absolutely cripples us if we don't have a good evasive skill on cooldown when we're pulled into melee range. Stuff you're barely effected by in melee is rather critical for ranged. You don't know anything about patience until you fight Missile Dampening + Extra Health with a ranged character... and that's only two affixes. I'm in Hell as well with my Witch Doctor - it's not pretty.

Like I said, I have a DH who's rolling through Hell since it's a joke. I think you're underestimating how fast you die in melee range when 2k+ DPS fields are dropped on you in the middle of a group of enemies that can still hit for 1k through my mitigation (~50% Armor, ~16% Resistances,).

That said, I think this is more your class than anything; DH and Wizard can keep distance far better than the WD so kiting for them is a lot easier.

 

[PoweredBySoy]

Fuck Whoever came up with chain fire laser spiders.

 

[LowParry]

some posted this on reddit... also everything in this game looks cooler in german

I can do better.

 

[Tacitus_]

Have you tried getting right next to them if they are Mortar Champions? I do it while in game and stack up right behind our tank. And it seems like that is an area their Mortar's couldn't target.

I've gotten mortared while meleeing them. If you're at max melee range with a 2h, you will be hit by the very edge of the splash.

Sorry if old, but it looks like today's maintenance might have addressed a bug which was stopping Damage Reduction from working properly in Inferno for Melee Classes:

http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/5270829377?page=3

If that's true, no wonder melee classes had so much difficulty in Inferno.

 

[Koroviev]

GTS 360M (It's listed on the D3 page as being a supported "high performance" card: http://us.battle.net/support/en/art...C85043EFCE763B83709DA.blade36_05_bnet-support)

It's not really a bad card, but I'm not sure if I'd call it high-performance. Here's where it ranks according to Tom's Hardware: http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/gaming-graphics-card-review,3107-7.html

Regardless, you should be managing more than 10 fps.

 

[joelseph]

Well, no Diablo 3 for me until Comcast can identify why I'm getting packet loss and exceptionally high latency. The issue just cropped up with in the past day, too. :-(

I am curious where you are located. I too have noticed packet drops from Comcast over the last few days...

 

[SDBurton]

I want to try a Dual Wield Guardian's Path + Sixth Sense + Mantra of Evasion spam build with Cyclone Strike's +Evasion but ... don't think it'll pan out, honestly. Still better just going Armor/Resistances with supplemental Dodge in the end :/

Tried this yesterday.

Spoiler

It doesn't.

Going to try a new setup when I get home, here's what I'm looking at.

Crippling Wave - Concussion (enemies hit by crippling wave do 20% less damage for 3 seconds)

Inner Sanctuary - Circle of Protection (while standing in the circle you take 35% less damage)

Serenity - Peaceful Repose (healed when activated)

Mantra of Evasion - Hard Target (increases Armor by 20%)

Breath of Heaven - Infused with Light (generate an additional 6 spirit with spirit generating attacks)

Mystic Ally - Air Ally (chance to generate 100 spirit for you)

Passive Skills:

Resolve: Damage you deal reduces enemies damage by 25% for 2.5 secs

Transcendence: You are healed when you spend spirit

Seize the Initiative: Armor is increased by 100% of your Dexterity.

I have Mystic Ally for more or less a shield that can take the focus off me as I wait for my skills to come off their cooldowns. I'll post an update on how this pans out later. I checked the Blizzard forums and apparently Concussion and Resolve weren't working before but are now.. I think. We'll see.

 

[tycoonheart]

Sorry if old, but it looks like today's maintenance might have addressed a bug which was stopping Damage Reduction from working properly in Inferno for Melee Classes:

http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/5270829377?page=3

This is good to hear.

 

[scy]

I checked the Blizzard forums and apparently Concussion and Resolve weren't working before but are now.. I think. We'll see.

wut. I used them all game and noticed dying more often without them up. I may have to go back to my Crippling Wave/Resolve setup. Though, I just got to the point that I'm comfortable with my Crit Rate for Quickening ... hm.

Edit: On that note, does Sanctuary even work that well? Every time I've popped up, things just ran off so I couldn't figure out a good use for the "in field" debuff parts. Maybe I didn't try it on Elites and stuff though.

 

[Einbroch]

For a caster who has to kite pretty much 99% of the time then you can see how bad that would be. Getting walled in with a pack of Champions or Jailed if you aren't far enough away when you have 1/100th of the armor value of half the classes and less than half the HP is much worse.

You think we don't? Even with the reduced damage taken, melee drops like no one's business. Taking ~40% less damage doesn't matter when enemies kill you in two hits regardless of reduction.

WD's have Spirit Walk, DH's have Smoke Screen, Wizard's have Diamond Skin. Everyone has defensive abilities for oh shit moments. While my bubble is amazing, it's not an oh shit button, because in order to do damage I have to use it. If I don't, I'm dead.

Range has such an advantage it's stupid. My damage is atrocious because I have to build so defensive. Every single one of my abilities on my bar is defensive except one. A couple pieces of armor don't even have 40 DEX on them.

 

[Jasoneyu]

Tried this yesterday.

Spoiler

It doesn't.

Going to try a new setup when I get home, here's what I'm looking at.

Crippling Wave - Concussion (enemies hit by crippling wave do 20% less damage for 3 seconds)

Inner Sanctuary - Circle of Protection (while standing in the circle you take 35% less damage)

Serenity - Peaceful Repose (healed when activated)

Mantra of Evasion - Hard Target (increases Armor by 20%)

Breath of Heaven - Infused with Light (generate an additional 6 spirit with spirit generating attacks)

Mystic Ally - Air Ally (chance to generate 100 spirit for you)

Passive Skills:

Resolve: Damage you deal reduces enemies damage by 25% for 2.5 secs

Transcendence: You are healed when you spend spirit

Seize the Initiative: Armor is increased by 100% of your Dexterity.

I have Mystic Ally for more or less a shield that can take the focus off me as I wait for my skills to come off their cooldowns. I'll post an update on how this pans out later. I checked the Blizzard forums and apparently Concussion and Resolve weren't working before but are now.. I think. We'll see.

I am going to try this build and see if I can survive longer than 5 seconds. God damn laser beams of death bLEHHH

 

[Dina]

Hex with heal rune, Spirit walk with heal rune, Soul harvest with, you guessed it, heal rune, and for my 4th slot I kind of mix it up because I can't settle on a skill, but right now it's Mass Confusion with the everything takes 20% extra damage rune.

And your passives?

 

[parasight]

Sorry if old, but it looks like today's maintenance might have addressed a bug which was stopping Damage Reduction from working properly in Inferno for Melee Classes:

http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/5270829377?page=3

I played a bit today and it did seem a little easier. Monk redeemed!

Just passed

Spoiler

Spider Queen

in Act I Inferno.

 

[eek5]

You think we don't? Even with the reduced damage taken, melee drops like no one's business. Taking ~40% less damage doesn't matter when enemies kill you in two hits regardless of reduction.

WD's have Spirit Walk, DH's have Smoke Screen, Wizard's have Diamond Skin. Everyone has defensive abilities for oh shit moments. While my bubble is amazing, it's not an oh shit button, because in order to do damage I have to use it. If I don't, I'm dead.

Range has such an advantage it's stupid. My damage is atrocious because I have to build so defensive. Every single one of my abilities on my bar is defensive except one. A couple pieces of armor don't even have 40 DEX on them.

I have 2 offensive skills slotted right now and one of them is my fury generator :lol

All 3 of my passives are ones I don't want to use but have to just so I don't get 1 shotted. Instead I get 2 shotted.

My entire gameplay revolves around me coming up to a group, stunning them, shouting to get fury because meleeing is way too risky in case they come out of their stun and then seismic slam kiting. I do like 8000 damage per slam because all my armor is geared towards defense and I'm way too poor to get equipment with +str, +armor, +resist all, +vitality on the same pieces.

In act 1 I could sometimes tank a group with stuns, revenge and frenzy but it was always risky and there would be coin flip moments where I'd either die or barely escape.

Anyone who says ranged have it as hard as melee haven't played a barb in act2 inferno :lol

 

[cpp_is_king]

"Waller" - Anti-kiting and most directly screws with ranged classes and glass canons.

Wallers, the "I'm not stuck in here with you. You're stuck in here with me" champions.

Knockback, Thorns, Nightmarish, Fire Chain, and Vampiric are really the only ones that fuck with melee more than ranged but, except for thorns and knockback even they're back for ranged. Molten maybe if you don't run after you kill the mob.

Desecrators, Molten, and Arcane are pretty bad for me as barb.