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[mrklaw]

To be fair, it's an impressive showing for what it is. I'm a lot more interested in it than I would be a new iPad. Not totally sold yet, but of course that's because I'm not crazy for a tablet like most other people.

The iPad changed the way we think about computing in many regards, so when I see the way a lot of people react as though they expected MS to reinvent the wheel, I can't help but laugh at them. This is MS jumping into that market. No more, no less.

The Steve Jobs cult will continue to carry on, but really, it's a legit product and has potential. Frankly, most of these consumers, bloggers, and journalists alike would never be satisfied because they're sheep for all things Apple, and it's sad.

The ipad changed how we think about computers but was really a logical extension of how we stopped working on our home computers and were far more about consuming - so the ipad fits that perfectly.

Windows 8 potentially takes that further - it recognises the need for the collation of information in an easily readable form to help us make sense of all the data that is around us, whereas ipad really is still a dumb bunch of icons (world leading, most and best apps, sure, but its still a grid)

I hope this gets some traction, and I also hope it shows apple that there are other ways of doing things. I think its possibly just the right balance between the control of apple and the openness of android (which can be too much sometimes). If it gets enough app support then its a completely viable alternative to an ipad.

 

[brotkasten]

Phwoah, dual CPUs!

You can never have enough CPUs in a tablet (the order was wrooong and you still forgot the pen )

 

[HollovVpo1nt]

In comparisons with the iPad, people are citing the resolution on this as unacceptable and off-putting, but how is even the great screen of the iPad comparable to having the Windows 8 desktop OS on your tablet? Am I missing something? Sorry I just woke up

Well the Windows 8 Desktop OS is stripped down for RT, but I agree with you in case of Windows 8 PRO. The screen resolution is 1080p, when hooped to a monitor it can go way beyond 1080p couse Ivy Bridge supports higher resolutions than 1080p.

 

[Hydrargyrus]

Looks pretty well but it looks like a zune tablet to me...

 

[DC R1D3R]

Looks good....will get!

 

[Ghost]

I understand all the people saying "uh, we've already seen lots of these, why are you excited?" I think though you have to see it in the wider context, Microsoft is making a PC. That's huge, and more than just implementing their own specifications like Google do with the nexus devices, they've actually brought some real innovation in terms of hardware design and accessories.

I also think it's very smart that they are aiming straight down the barrel of Apples line about tablets being about content creation, the Pro is a tablet that you can actually program tablet applications on, Android and iOS don't even come close to that.

So the excitement really, for me anyway, is that MS actually gets what they bring to the table, it's not about metro, it's about 'this is actual full blown Windows, and it's everywhere you want to be'.

 

[Windu]

Looks pretty well but it looks like a zune tablet to me...

the zune was a beautiful device.

 

[border]

Wow the Pro has an Ivy Bridge CPU. Ivy Bridges are also pretty decent GPU's right?

It kinda depends on what you mean by "decent", and whether you have the expectations of a tablet user, laptop user, ultrabook user, or desktop user. In the tablet world it's comparable to competitors. It is the same GPU that comes with all modern ultrabooks, so it's on par with those too. But it gets smoked pretty easily by GPUs that are included with much cheaper laptops.

 

[Cindres]

Wow, finally taken a look at this device and I'm actually quite impressed. I mean this is a windows device so you already know it'll run a bunch of stuff.
This device is exactly what W8 was made for. Will be keeping a close eye on it.

 

[Phantast2k]

The fact that they omitted the battery life from those specs (instead boasting with Wh) should be worrying to potential buyers.

 

[brotkasten]

I understand all the people saying "uh, we've already seen lots of these, why are you excited?" I think though you have to see it in the wider context, Microsoft is making a PC. That's huge, and more than just implementing their own specifications like Google do with the nexus devices, they've actually brought some real innovation in terms of hardware design and accessories.

I also think it's very smart that they are aiming straight down the barrel of Apples line about tablets being about content creation, the Pro is a tablet that you can actually program tablet applications on, Android and iOS don't even come close to that.

So the excitement really, for me anyway, is that MS actually gets what they bring to the table, it's not about metro, it's about 'this is actual full blown Windows, and it's everywhere you want to be'.

The Surface (R.I.P., old table) is pretty much the reference design for Windows RT and 8 tablets and I'm pretty sure the Surface Pro is going to be the giveaway at the next //build conference.

 

[funkystudent]

good job MS tossing a new contender into funkystudent's laptop quest.

Planning on getting something later in the year once Ivy Bridge gets out there more.

I guess its probably smart to skip the first generation of this like any new product but damn its tempting

 

[maharg]

Wow the Pro has an Ivy Bridge CPU. Ivy Bridges are also pretty decent GPU's right?

For a mobile chipset it's fine. http://gadgetmix.com/articles/intel-hd4000-compared/

 

[Sh1ner]

Is there a possibility to able to use one of these tablets with a wacom pen for painting? I am hoping for a cheap cintiq here!

 

[mrklaw]

I don't understand desktop mode in the RT version. Surely if its not a full computer, you'd code your office and IE to run as a tablet app, like all third party apps will.

Unless they're hoping to expand on that over time and have more apps in the desktop, encourage third parties to port PC apps to RT?

 

[chickdigger802]

Just how comprahensive is this device going to be in terms of talk of being a PC in tablet form?

Is Steam possible? Am I going to be able to play Football Manager on the toilet?

intel one, most definitely. (It is the desktop version of win 8)

i don't think the pc version of football manager is really touch friendly though. But it has been ages.

 

[Shogmaster]

It kinda depends on what you mean by "decent", and whether you have the expectations of a tablet user, laptop user, ultrabook user, or desktop user. In the tablet world it's comparable to competitors. It is the same GPU that comes with all modern ultrabooks, so it's on par with those too. But it gets smoked pretty easily by GPUs that are included with much cheaper laptops.

Cheaper laptops (sub $1000) probably won't have discrete GPU, so it's a wash. Integrated IGPs are all about the same ballpark.

 

[saltywalrus]

I also think it's very smart that they are aiming straight down the barrel of Apples line about tablets being about content creation, the Pro is a tablet that you can actually program tablet applications on, Android and iOS don't even come close to that.

Actually you can program apps on Android with AIDE (Java IDE for Android) and it works on all devices Android 2.2 or higher.

 

[Shogmaster]

Is there a possibility to able to use one of these tablets with a wacom pen for painting? I am hoping for a cheap cintiq here!

There is debate in the forums whether it's Wacom's or NTrig's EMR inside. From the pictures, the pen looks more Wacom than NTrig to me. Can't be sure though. Either case, it supports pressure sensitivity, but Wacom's pen is much better than NTrig's.

 

[mrklaw]

There has never been a tablet/laptop crossover like this though and if MS markets it right (I admit that is a BIG if) people's perceptions will change.

I'm not sure it changes that much. There are plenty of all-in-one PCs with touch screens, but they aren't setting the world on fire. So people don't seem to want to touch their PCs.

Its convenient to be able to browse/consume content without a keyboard, but if you need the 'full' PC part a lot, an ultrabook or laptop isn't a big deal really.

I think the main thing the ipad brought was the disconnect with real computing - by focusing on consumption it had a clearer purpose. By being all things to all people, the surface pro might lose some of that focus. you'll start complaining it doesn't game well, or that you really need a mouse to use it properly, or buying additional keyboards because the case is cute but not great for longer sessions.

 

[SteveWD40]

If they had the Pro out at Win8 launch I would be day one, but waiting till early 2013 for a tablet / laptop is a bit much, there will be things like the Asus with the keyboard dock before that...

 

[dude]

Surface Pro is the tablet of my dreams

 

[bjaelke]

intel one, most definitely. (It is the desktop version of win 8)

i don't think the pc version of football manager is really touch friendly though. But it has been ages.

Sega released Football Manager Handheld 2012 for andriod/iOS back in April. It had a touch friendly UI.

 

[JonnyBrad]

Will be interested in the RT model. If the price is the same as similar Android tabs. Unless google gets its act together at I/O getting companies to actually make tablet apps.

 

[border]

So the excitement really, for me anyway, is that MS actually gets what they bring to the table, it's not about metro, it's about 'this is actual full blown Windows, and it's everywhere you want to be'.

I think my reaction is a little muted because while the Pro is positioned as a desktop/laptop replacement, it will likely cost way more than I'd ever spend on a desktop or a laptop (at the same time providing less performance than a similarly priced desktop or laptop).

The RT model just seems like iPad Junior. A heavily regulated and locked down model that doesn't support all my desktop apps, and requires me to go through an app store for everything.

If I'm excited, it's not about the current Surface models. It's excitement at the thought that in 3-5 years from now I'll hopefully be able to get a real Windows tablet for $400-500.

 

[Jay Sosa]

That's a lot of money for a mirror.

 

[Peru]

I'm not sure it changes that much. There are plenty of all-in-one PCs with touch screens, but they aren't setting the world on fire. So people don't seem to want to touch their PCs.

Its convenient to be able to browse/consume content without a keyboard, but if you need the 'full' PC part a lot, an ultrabook or laptop isn't a big deal really.

I think the main thing the ipad brought was the disconnect with real computing - by focusing on consumption it had a clearer purpose. By being all things to all people, the surface pro might lose some of that focus. you'll start complaining it doesn't game well, or that you really need a mouse to use it properly, or buying additional keyboards because the case is cute but not great for longer sessions.

THat's a possibility.. and though I think either UI here is preferable as a tablet UI to ios and android, I'm not really sure what I want out of the device myself. Which is why I'm wondering if the RT or pro version is the right one for me.

 

[Windu]

sounds like you will only be able to buy Microsoft Surface at a Microsoft Store Retail location or at the Microsoft Store on the web.

I don't understand desktop mode in the RT version. Surely if its not a full computer, you'd code your office and IE to run as a tablet app, like all third party apps will.

Unless they're hoping to expand on that over time and have more apps in the desktop, encourage third parties to port PC apps to RT?

Microsoft does not allow you to install any applications on the Desktop on Windows RT (ARM) Its limited to Windows utilities, Office which is included and IE. Windows 8 (x86/64) of course, is the full desktop experience.

 

[f0lken]

sounds like you will only be able to buy Microsoft Surface at a Microsoft Store Retail location or at the Microsoft Store on the web.

That would be the biggest mistake they could make

 

[Acheteedo]

Hmm, between the keyboard and stylus addition, tablets are becoming almost appealing to me.

 

[f0lken]

BTW I just saw the conference and I am even more exited than before about this product, but I always forget what do Ballmer's voice sound like, in my mind he will always sound like John Di Maggio

 

[border]

Cheaper laptops (sub $1000) probably won't have discrete GPU, so it's a wash. Integrated IGPs are all about the same ballpark.

I shopped laptops earlier this year. There's plenty of models under $500 that have a Radeon chip in them. Nvidia's chips are more in the $500-$700 class.

 

[Windu]

That would be the biggest mistake they could make

i'm sure its to appease OEMs. And i bet they hate the retail experience that Best Buy etc.. give you. With the confusion of ARM vs. x86/64 they need some knowledgeable people selling it. Sadly, other OEMs will be going through the normal channels.

 

[Majine]

Man, the keynote really is bland. They spent like 3 minutes explaining how a kickstand works.

 

[strata8]

What's the mystery magnetic port on the right hand side of the Surface?

 

[Windu]

What's the mystery magnetic port on the right hand side of the Surface?

i think that is for the pen, it snaps to the device. Or it could be the thing you press to release the kickstand.

 

[f0lken]

i'm sure its to appease OEMs. And i bet they hate the retail experience that Best Buy etc.. give you. With the confusion of ARM vs. x86/64 they need some knowledgeable people selling it. Sadly, other OEMs will be going through the normal channels.

But that would limit big time their potential market, not only because there are so few of their stores but because that would also mean no not-USA launch

 

[Neko Mimi Mode]

Though doubtless I can't afford it, it's a game changer for sure. Stunning, innovative and functional in ways that really highlight how Apple have stagnated.

If it supports USB audio (so I can use an external DAC) then I'm in, budget be damned.

 

[Korey]

Nevermind

 

[saltywalrus]

i'm sure its to appease OEMs. And i bet they hate the retail experience that Best Buy etc.. give you. With the confusion of ARM vs. x86/64 they need some knowledgeable people selling it. Sadly, other OEMs will be going through the normal channels.

I think you're wrong. Steven announced it will be available online and at MS store. He didn't say that it would not be available anywhere else. I'm sure Best Buy, Amazon, etc will sell it.

 

[Shogmaster]

I shopped laptops earlier this year. There's plenty of models under $500 that have a Radeon chip in them. Nvidia's chips are more in the $500-$700 class.

Radeon moniker also covers their IGP solutions, which are similar to Intel's GPUs. Just because it's AMD and nVidia doesn't automatically mean more powerful than Intel GPUs. They both make low power IGP solutions.

 

[Typhoon_Ex]

This is exactly what I was waiting for. I barely play on my laptop and most of the stuff that I have for Steam will run on the Pro as well as the software that I use. I was just looking for the right device to jump to Windows 8 and tablets.

 

[brotkasten]

But that would limit big time their potential market, not only because there are so few of their stores but because that would also mean no not-USA launch

The Microsoft Online Store is available outside the US.

 

[bedlamite]

Intel i5, DisplayPort out, USB, full Windows and Office. WinRT isn't much to crow about, but for those of you that still haven't got it, MS have pretty much taken a PC and shrunk it into a tablet.

OK maybe that's a little hyperbolic, but this is an entirely plausible scenario: you bring the Surface into the office, connect it to your monitor and desktop mouse/keyboard and you're good to go for work, without skipping a beat. The hardware is nice, no doubt, but full Office + Windows are MS's trump cards.

 

[brotkasten]

Intel i5, DisplayPort out, USB, full Windows and Office. WinRT isn't much to crow about, but for those of you that still haven't got it, MS have pretty much taken a PC and shrunk it into a tablet.

OK maybe that's a little hyperbolic, but this is an entirely plausible scenario: you bring the Surface into the office, connect it to your monitor and desktop mouse/keyboard and you're good to go for work, without skipping a beat. The hardware is nice, no doubt, but full Office + Windows are MS's trump cards.

It's an Ultrabook in form of a tablet. Nothing we haven't seen at Computex this month.

 

[Steelyuhas]

lol

I just caught up on the thread after falling way behind during the event. Damn the posts piled up.

 

[Al-ibn Kermit]

The fact that they omitted the battery life from those specs (instead boasting with Wh) should be worrying to potential buyers.

It's hard to say how long the Pro tablet will last. They didn't say the price and they only hinted at the resolution. We don't even know if they'll have 3G/LTE.

The ARM tablet is basically identical in every way to the Transformer Prime, but a little bit bigger. I would expect it to get around 10 hours.

 

[Shogmaster]

BTW for all you interested in the pen in the Pro, I think it's Wacom. My reasons:

1. The tip of the pen in the pictures are like Wacom's in nib design. N-Trig has very bulky integrated tip, where as Wacom employs simple replaceable plastic nibs.

2. In the press briefing, they tout "600 DPI" number for the pen in the pro. That's closer to Wacom Penabled specs or 500+ lines per inch than N-Trig's 2500+ PPI for their duo sense pens.

 

[Ghost]

Actually you can program apps on Android with AIDE (Java IDE for Android) and it works on all devices Android 2.2 or higher.

That is an incredible app, but in terms of a full development environment where I can manage my source control, sign and upload builds, it's got a long way to go.

 

[trinest]

The Microsoft Online Store is available outside the US.

The Zune nor any other major Microsoft device of late hasn't been available outside the US.

I'm hoping its available in Australia in some form, I really like the look of the device and wouldn't mind picking the Pro up.