Dating-Age |OT3| Positivity, Confidence, and Not Being a "Nice" Guy

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I'm at about four or five now who actually said "wow, oh, no. Yeah, no."

And quite a few others who make the "oh god how can I get out of here????" face.

Haha. Oh well. Maybe therapy will help.

Alright, serious answer - is there a common thread between these guys you're asking about? A lot of the time, people end up asking out what is essentially the same person, when what they really need to do is try out a different kind of person.
 
Well, your own happiness is always the best place to start at, we say this here all the time! But I agree with the other guys, they must be the rotten eggs of Vancouver. You'll always be welcome in here to talk if you need it, you know it.

:)

Alright, serious answer - is there a common thread between these guys you're asking about? A lot of the time, people end up asking out what is essentially the same person, when what they really need to do is try out a different kind of person.

Nah, no one was particularly similar. I've been turned down by a spectrum of men. Haha.
 
So, uh, I had a date this weekend. We only planned to meet up for some drinks at a fancy place in town, talk and get to know each other. I ordered in a bottle of wine and ffffuuuuck what a boring chick. I was the one talking basically, coming up with new things to talk about etc.

Anyway, for some weird reason we met last night at my place.
I showed her my apartment, she sat down on the couch while i was getting snacks and drinks in the kitchen - then we watched a movie. I said "i got alot of movies, so maybe you wanna see a movie you haven't seen before?" - and she picked Cloverfield. At the end of the movie i asked her what she thought of it and she said "that was a weird movie!". I said - "well did you like it or was it bad... I mean, what do you mean by weird?", and she told me the "weird" part and i facepalmed (mentally). After that i put on some music (Atmosphere) and she instantaneously said "eeh could you put on something else?". That girl kept racking up bad scores that entire evening. I got so bored i _faked_ being tired and said that i got a thing in the morning and that we should call it.

... She texted me like 5 minutes after she left and - "did you think i was superboring? i felt i was...". I didn't answer it and today she texted me again and said that she wants to see me again. I don't... WHAT? How can she not see how boring those dates were?

Do you mean you put on Atmosphere by Joy Division?! Becuase if so wow, that shit doesn't come out until AFTER you've made out and are feeling remorseful!!

I hope they will. If anything, even if the therapist can't figure out how to get guys to stop thinking I'm gross, at least I'll learn to be happy on my own. :)

Well, to be honest, being happy on your own is a good way to become attractive to guys. You should never look for a relationship as a way to make you happier with yourself. It's not a terrible thing to be alone and regain some confidence and become comfortable with yourself. The good thing is its easy! You only have to please yourself!
 
I hope they will. If anything, even if the therapist can't figure out how to get guys to stop thinking I'm gross, at least I'll learn to be happy on my own. :)



Vancouver area.

I knew it , not sure why I just had a feeling. I'm also from Vancouver, do you normally go out on weekends at all? If yes, where are you going? lol this is not a stalker question I'm curious about the places you go because some just have crappy crowds that can be tough to loosen up in.
 
Hey guys. Long time lurker, first time poster (in this thread).

So I've been dating this girl for a couple of months, and lately it seems like maybe she's not as into it as she was at the beginning. While she's never been great at coming up with plans, she would at least initiate our dates at least 1 in 3 times, or at least just text me every other day or so to say hi or see what was up. But then I realized that over a period of a couple of weeks, I was always the one contacting her, so I put it to the test and went a week without calling... and heard nothing from her in turn.

Anyways, I really like this girl, so I called her to ask her out again, and she had excuses. We ended up going about two weeks without seeing each other, and when we finally made plans again she seemed far less enthusiastic than what I was used to from her. We went out for dinner this past Wednesday and actually had a pretty good time, though when I dropped her off at home she didn't invite me in like she usually does. Anyhow, as I dropped her off I asked if she wanted to hang out this weekend, and she said maybe Monday we could do something, but "we'll talk soon." I haven't heard anything from her since.

Basically what I'm asking is, is this doomed? We never decided to become exclusive or anything. Maybe that's the problem? I don't know if she expected to me to make some declaration of boyfrienditude or something. We never really talked about any of that stuff. We just had a good time together, and since I'm pretty sure neither one of us was dating anyone else on the side, I figured I'd let things flow naturally.

Did I fuck up? Should I go no contact and wait to see if she comes to me, or should I try to set up another date and find out where things stand? I know, I know, oneitis and play the field and all that, but I like this girl quite a lot, and would like to salvage things if possible.
 
I knew it , not sure why I just had a feeling. I'm also from Vancouver, do you normally go out on weekends at all? If yes, where are you going? lol this is not a stalker question I'm curious about the places you go because some just have crappy crowds that can be tough to loosen up in.

Nah, I don't go out. If I ever do talk to guys, it's in coffee shops or things like that.

Well, to be honest, being happy on your own is a good way to become attractive to guys. You should never look for a relationship as a way to make you happier with yourself. It's not a terrible thing to be alone and regain some confidence and become comfortable with yourself. The good thing is its easy! You only have to please yourself!

Well, I mean, a lot of my sadness is my perpetual alone status, haha. I used to be okay with being alone and had generally accepted it, but it's been getting to me a lot lately. Who knows! I will talk with my new therapist on Thursday and maybe she can help me. :)
 
I'm just a realist. Do you hear the shit that guy is saying? He's so quiet, and he's mumbling over his words. He doesn't look confident at all. Look at how much that model is giving him. She's spilling her guts out over every single question, even ones with simple answers. Even if she was into him, she wouldn't be giving answers as long as War and Peace about some of these random-ass questions.
Not true. The other night when I was waiting in line to close out tabs or get more rounds I'd just chat up the girls in front or behind me, and just simple questions would elicit long-winded responses. Get this--some would even control the conversation and start asking ME question! And if you saw my pictures, you'd see I'm not a very good-looking guy! If you're slim and don't have jacked-up face, you can pretty much get ten times this sort of response....if you lose your shitty attitude, that is.
 
General rant, not aimed at you Midnights.

Hell yeah there are plenty of ways to do it wrong. What’s the point of getting a girls number if she’s going to flake or give you the wrong one? That’s my main problem with Simple Pickup. They’re there for entertainment purposes but they don’t fucking teach you anything. They’ll show you extreme situations and then are like, yeah go do that, just “normal”. Okay… well what does that mean? What the fuck is normal? Why does this work vs that etc. I’m going to be brutally honest; going up and talking to a girl is incredibly easy, going up and asking for her number is easy. Being good at it is not. They give dudes a sense that it’s going to be effortless and a quick fix to their problems; and when they inevitably fail, they think it’s a scam. That’s where I can understand people’s skepticism that pickup works because it isn’t that simple. There is so much that goes on in between beginner to experienced, and I wish SP would go into that; but they never will because it goes against their entire brand.

I think you misunderstand what their message is, I think a lot of people in this thread misunderstands their message.

All about confidence. You can say the most fucked up shit in the entire world and still get numbers. And as long as you can brush off rejection and keep throwing out attempts.

They don't suggest you actually go out and use their lines, and if you watch a lot of their videos, a lot of these 'themes' are challenges from guys. Guys who say "Oh yeah, I bet you can't get a girl if you say this, or that, or this other thing" and they go out and show that they can.

There is soooo much wisdom in that simple idea. That you shouldn't be afraid of taking chances, should brush off failures, and what you say when you want to meet someone new doesn't really matter all that much, as long as you can go in with confidence.

They do edit their videos, but they have a video of all their failures as well. There are tons.
 
I think you misunderstand what their message is, I think a lot of people in this thread misunderstands their message.

All about confidence. You can say the most fucked up shit in the entire world and still get numbers. And as long as you can brush off rejection and keep throwing out attempts.

They don't suggest you actually go out and use their lines, and if you watch a lot of their videos, a lot of these 'themes' are challenges from guys. Guys who say "Oh yeah, I bet you can't get a girl if you say this, or that, or this other thing" and they go out and show that they can.

There is soooo much wisdom in that simple idea. That you shouldn't be afraid of taking chances, should brush off failures, and what you say when you want to meet someone new doesn't really matter all that much, as long as you can go in with confidence.

They do edit their videos, but they have a video of all their failures as well. There are tons.

Well it depends do people in here want to date women or "pick up" women.
 
So, I talked to a therapist the other day. Not gonna stick with her (she was very airy fairy and into spiritual healing; not what I need) and she thought the reason I hadn't been on a date before was because I had no "mentors" growing up, but I don't think that's my problem... I live vicariously through lots of my friends and my younger sister and such, so it's not like I'm dating-clueless. I just...never have them.

I don't know why the typical response to me asking a guy out is "ew, god, no. Wow, no", but...I dunno. Have a different therapist on Thursday and she seems more down to earth so... Guess I'll see.

Anyway, you guys have been witness to a lot of my crazy, so I'll let you know how it goes, eventually. Maybe someday a man will find me non-repulsive! That's the goal. Haha. Me happy and maybe being able to date someone.

You're always so hard on yourself, and it tears me up because not only are you goddamn gorgeous, you seem like a genuinely enjoyable person to be around.

Maybe the problem is Canada? That's usually the problem in my experience :P

Woah woah woah, she's from Canada? Yo Leeness...

Well it depends do people in here want to date women or "pick up" women.

Shouldn't matter - that message should be universal. If you're on OKCupid, don't spend an hour trying to craft a message to a girl and get devastated when you don't get a response. Just send messages to as many girls as you find interesting, and see if you get a bite - if you don't, shrug it off and don't let it slow you down.

If you know a girl, a friend even, that you want to date - don't toil about it forever and wonder about the ethical ramifications, don't try to think of the best way to approach it wasting your time away. Just approach her, ask her out, and if she says no thanks - brush it off and head to the next one.

If every guy in here could embody that ideology, this thread would be for women only. (Then women should start embodying that ideology as well)
 
^This. They have the entertaining videos, actual tip videos, and they have videos of failures to show that it doesn't always work out, but they keep trying.
 
I don't know if anyone else but me follows the Project Go stuff that Simple Pickup does but stuff is actually super instructional and informative since it's long uncut conversations (both successful and unsuccessful, on purpose) without the gimmicks from their 4 minute videos.
 
I hope they will. If anything, even if the therapist can't figure out how to get guys to stop thinking I'm gross, at least I'll learn to be happy on my own. :)



Vancouver area.

Well I've always wanted to marry a Canadian princess so if you want to have the Canadian equivalent of a green card marriage, let me know. :)
 
Shouldn't matter - that message should be universal. If you're on OKCupid, don't spend an hour trying to craft a message to a girl and get devastated when you don't get a response. Just send messages to as many girls as you find interesting, and see if you get a bite - if you don't, shrug it off and don't let it slow you down.

If you know a girl, a friend even, that you want to date - don't toil about it forever and wonder about the ethical ramifications, don't try to think of the best way to approach it wasting your time away. Just approach her, ask her out, and if she says no thanks - brush it off and head to the next one.

If every guy in here could embody that ideology, this thread would be for women only. (Then women should start embodying that ideology as well)

Eh I just feel like a lot of PUA is trying to cater to an image through shitty tactics instead of just improving oneself. And pretending to be someone they're not will get people into trouble later.
 
I think you misunderstand what their message is, I think a lot of people in this thread misunderstands their message.

All about confidence. You can say the most fucked up shit in the entire world and still get numbers. And as long as you can brush off rejection and keep throwing out attempts.

They don't suggest you actually go out and use their lines, and if you watch a lot of their videos, a lot of these 'themes' are challenges from guys. Guys who say "Oh yeah, I bet you can't get a girl if you say this, or that, or this other thing" and they go out and show that they can.

There is soooo much wisdom in that simple idea. That you shouldn't be afraid of taking chances, should brush off failures, and what you say when you want to meet someone new doesn't really matter all that much, as long as you can go in with confidence.

They do edit their videos, but they have a video of all their failures as well. There are tons.

Oh, I very well understand their message. What I’m saying is it’s deeper than that. Like I said, walking up and talking to a girl, easy. Getting her number, easy. But what the fuck is the point if she’s a flake? If you actually want to date these girls you have to be better than what SP is providing. It’s a completely different conversation then just be confident.


Eh I just feel like a lot of PUA is trying to cater to an image through shitty tactics instead of just improving oneself. And pretending to be someone they're not will get people into trouble later.

Cool avatar Devo.

And what you said is false.
 
Eh I just feel like a lot of PUA is trying to cater to an image through shitty tactics instead of just improving oneself. And pretending to be someone they're not will get people into trouble later.

Confidence, being willing to take risks and brushing off rejection I think are amazing traits that everyone should striving to have.

And if you don't have them? Fake it till you make it.

Oh, I very well understand their message. What I’m saying is it’s deeper than that. Like I said, walking up and talking to a girl, easy. Getting her number, easy. But what the fuck is the point if she’s a flake? If you actually want to date these girls you have to be better than what SP is providing. It’s a completely different conversation then just be confident.

Oh -dating- a girl is a completely different situation than -getting- a girl. I don't think anything in the Easy pick up/PUA message has to do with keeping a girlfriend. Psh... having a healthy relationship is a never ending battle. For example, I just learned in the last little while the importance of not trying to break situations down to their base components to try and fix them. It's great a lot of the time, but not -all- the time. Sometimes, if your girlfriend is upset, just focus on comforting her - not analysing the situation and figuring out how to avoid it in the future (although this is something you should do for pretty much any serious situation, I still think).
 
I don't know why you'd want to be fake with someone, or "figure out what they want to hear". Eventually your chickens will come home to roost. Don't know why you'd want to sell someone that isn't you just to get someone.
 
Confidence, being willing to take risks and brushing off rejection I think are amazing traits that everyone should striving to have.

And if you don't have them? Fake it till you make it.

Fake it til you make it is nice for random hookups in your general shotgun approach of putting yourself out there with as many people as possible. Cool.

But that goes directly back to dating =/= random hookups.

Fake it til you make it in order to try to meet someone you want to see more than twice a month is a lot different.
 

Already addressed this.

You also see a lot of people who even scoff at the idea that "game" works. They hear words like "mystery method" and "ioi's" and think it's a joke. You also have fucks like Paul Janka who have some how become the real worlds interpretation of the community. Pickup provides you with the tools to do something most people won't. If I see a pretty girl walking down the street I have no issue at all in approaching and talking to her. Most people (especially those without some prior knowledge on game) would. That's what game is to me. To someone else; it could be having the ability to bring home girls every night from a bar. Game could also be improving ones life and turning them into that social, extroverted person. Pickup has many interpretations, and everybody wants something different out of it. Someone with severe social issues can be taught game, trust me on this. It's not something that requires you to be a pretty boy, or have money, or any other stereotype you would like to fit in there. It's just something that improves you as a person (most of the time) and forces you to take chances.


Oh -dating- a girl is a completely different situation than -getting- a girl. I don't think anything in the Easy pick up/PUA message has to do with keeping a girlfriend. Psh... having a healthy relationship is a never ending battle. For example, I just learned in the last little while the importance of not trying to break situations down to their base components to try and fix them. It's great a lot of the time, but not -all- the time. Sometimes, if your girlfriend is upset, just focus on comforting her - not analysing the situation and figuring out how to avoid it in the future (although this is something you should do for pretty much any serious situation, I still think).


What the fuck are you talking about?
 
Fake it til you make it is nice for random hookups in your general shotgun approach of putting yourself out there with as many people as possible. Cool.

But that goes directly back to dating =/= random hookups.

Fake it til you make it in order to try to meet someone you want to see more than twice a month is a lot different.

Which is what people in here are asking for tips on and why I don't recommend PUA garbage.
 
Eh I just feel like a lot of PUA is trying to cater to an image through shitty tactics instead of just improving oneself. And pretending to be someone they're not will get people into trouble later.

Honestly, everything they say has been true in my personal exprience. I used to be overweight and never got any girls, so I got into shape and realized that being better looking did nothing for me in terms of meeting women so....

I watched their videos, read this thread and started to not give a fuck and It's been amazing. The fact of the matter is just having the guts to walk up to a girl and say "hi" seems to startle several of them off the bat because it shows you have confidence.

The hardest part by far is dealing with the rejections but in all honesty I don't really set myself up to be rejected because I just say "hi" then I ask tons of questions all about the girl, the majority of the girls I appropach are respectful and polite and end up talking for a while. This gives you the opportunity to judge if they're actually interested which is when you offer a drink and then gradually get to the dance floor where all hell breaks loose. But if a girl is too good to even engage you after simply saying "hi" you don't want anything to do with her anyways so move on to the next one you see.

The videos seem stupid, but in reality it really is as simple as they say. My main problem is I need booze to help me get my swag out which I don't mind because I love drinking but it's getting expensive.
 
I don't know why you'd want to be fake with someone, or "figure out what they want to hear". Eventually your chickens will come home to roost. Don't know why you'd want to sell someone that isn't you just to get someone.

Well, I think this is one of those things that I want to focus on.

I would never (and I think most of these PUA like videos are the same) suggest that you should fake being some particular persona to get girls. Especially not trying to figure out what they'd like and pretend to be interested in it or anything, that absolutely isn't necessary and if you start thinking this is the message, you are veering in a very negative direction.

That being said - everyone has to understand you just can't 'be yourself' and hope everything works itself out. If 'being yourself' is making you miserable and has lead to you being lonely and alone, there are things about you that you should change.

Gain confidence and a sense of self worth - there are tons of things you can do to do this, but when all is said and done, at one point you need to just start -acting- the role of a confident version of yourself. Eventually, after some time of positive reinforcement in this role, you will -become- confident. You can't just sort of sit there and hope to become confidence, and confidence in being good at some cool activity doesn't translate 1:1 to communicating with women.

If you on some level think you are ready, but are nervous, or have been rejected too often, or you think that you need to say or do the right thing... that specifically is when the PUA videos are -ideal- for you.

Stop dancing around the issue, making excuses for your inaction, and take action.

What the fuck are you talking about?
Responding almost directly to your comment about PUA stuff being useless when it comes to actually dating. Basically what I am saying is, picking up/getting girls is one thing, dating a girl is something else. Then I dropped some dating wisdom in there I've noticed through personal experience. Where did you get lost?
 
Already addressed this.

How about not a canned response to a question asked last week?

A lot of this PUA stuff is nothing more than gimmicks, party magic, and trying to talk some random person into liking you instead of presenting who you are as *gasp* a person who has their shit together.

There's a difference between "game" as what you're describing, this illustrious ability to make panties disappear, and real social skills - which apply to most any situation and go well beyond just what you can do at friday night house party. The vast majority of people here don't need "game". They need to stop trying to read minds and look into things that aren't there and simply learn to say what's on their minds without coming off like douchebags or weirdos.
 
Responding almost directly to your comment about PUA stuff being useless when it comes to actually dating. Basically what I am saying is, picking up/getting girls is one thing, dating a girl is something else. Then I dropped some dating wisdom in there I've noticed through personal experience. Where did you get lost?

Yeah, no.

I'm talking about just because you got a girls number doesn't make you successful and doesn't guarantee you anything. You still have to know what you are doing to actually get a girl out on a date and that's what SP ignores. As far as a relationship? Yeah no shit that's different.
 
Well, I think this is one of those things that I want to focus on.

I would never (and I think most of these PUA like videos are the same) suggest that you should fake being some particular persona to get girls. Especially not trying to figure out what they'd like and pretend to be interested in it or anything, that absolutely isn't necessary and if you start thinking this is the message, you are veering in a very negative direction.

Yeah, but this isn't a race. Other people that care if I've been with a woman yet are frankly putting their nose and offering an opinion on something that is none of their concern. I'm trying to put this in a way that doesn't sound hipster, but I realized in my later teen years that I don't need to please what I think the rest of society wants, especially anyone that makes a remark about it I'm never going to see again. I'll get there, it's just a matter of when. When I ask someone out, it's just to see if things would work. I don't try to fake what I'm not, because it's obvious and if that person does like me for that, I then either have to keep faking it or go "Oh wait, I actually lied about that, sorry".
 
Fake it til you make it is nice for random hookups in your general shotgun approach of putting yourself out there with as many people as possible. Cool.

But that goes directly back to dating =/= random hookups.

Fake it til you make it in order to try to meet someone you want to see more than twice a month is a lot different.

I think people give the message of a lot of these PUA videos and whatnot too much power. If you are an absolutely un-confident person, who hates themselves and needs to really work on themselves first - getting a girl isn't going to fix that, and yeah - faking all the right steps and getting a girl is bad news.

PUA is under the assumption that you are a well put together guy already, at least somewhat confident, somewhat well kempt and at a point in your life where you can be a good SO. It doesn't do the before or after - the before and after are very important in this thread, 100% agree there - but the picking up part is something a lot of guys here need help with, which is exactly when the Simple Pickup message needs to be put on repeat.

Be confident, don't worry about rejection, don't get all up in your head about what to say and just say -something-.

Yeah, no.

I'm talking about just because you got a girls number doesn't make you successful and doesn't grantee you anything. You still have to know what you are doing to actually get a girl out on a date and that's what SP ignores. As far as a relationship? Yeah no shit that's different.

So because SP doesn't tell you what to do -after- you get a number, or -after- you talk to a girl, the advice is useless? Looking for an all in one solution is silly. After you get a girls number, or whatever, there are tons of other steps you -can- take, and usually the advice in confusing situations is a lot more nuanced, and should be.
 
Nah, I don't go out. If I ever do talk to guys, it's in coffee shops or things like that.



May I ask why? is it because you don't have enough friends to go out with? or do you just hate that scene?

I'm by no means an expert but I was in a similar situation to yourself and I personally wouldn't go to therapy but to each their own. I feel like if you would put yourself in more situations that you are just talking with guys to get comfortable with that scenario you will be amazed at how confident and proficient you become after some experience. Everyone in this thread has told you that you're attractive, I really hate to say this but go out get drunk and just talk to people, no expectations just talk and get some positive energy flowing out of you.

You have to get out of your comfort zone and own it, it's annoying as hell at first but it's the only way to grow out of the person you are.
 
I think people give the message of a lot of these PUA videos and whatnot too much power. If you are an absolutely un-confident person, who hates themselves and needs to really work on themselves first - getting a girl isn't going to fix that, and yeah - faking all the right steps and getting a girl is bad news.

PUA is under the assumption that you are a well put together guy already, at least somewhat confident, somewhat well kempt and at a point in your life where you can be a good SO. It doesn't do the before or after - the before and after are very important in this thread, 100% agree there - but the picking up part is something a lot of guys here need help with, which is exactly when the Simple Pickup message needs to be put on repeat.

Be confident, don't worry about rejection, don't get all up in your head about what to say and just say -something-.

It's like you didn't even watch that show on VH1.
 
Yeah, but this isn't a race. Other people that care if I've been with a woman yet are frankly putting their nose and offering an opinion on something that is none of their concern. I'm trying to put this in a way that doesn't sound hipster, but I realized in my later teen years that I don't need to please what I think the rest of society wants, especially anyone that makes a remark about it I'm never going to see again. I'll get there, it's just a matter of when. When I ask someone out, it's just to see if things would work. I don't try to fake what I'm not, because it's obvious and if that person does like me for that, I then either have to keep faking it or go "Oh wait, I actually lied about that, sorry".

I'm not sure what you mean? What do you think videos like SP are telling you to fake? What are they telling you to rush?

It's like you didn't even watch that show on VH1.
I don't get VH1!
 
That was a lot of back and forth over nothing.

Its almost like she was right in the first place :|
 
That was a lot of back and forth over nothing.

Its almost like she was right in the first place :|

I'm not following 100%, but I give the not put together guys all different advice :p. The ones on GAF who's main problem in this thread sound like "GAF, I have a decent job and I am happy with my life, but I don't know how to approach women?! How do I just go up to a girl and say hi? It's so hard/don't know what to say/afraid of rejection" - that's when SP steps the fuck in.

Oh are the people all crazy in this show? That would be bad.

Yeah, as a disclaimer - if your shit is falling apart, don't go looking for a woman/man to fix your problems by pretending you're someone you're not! Fix your shit, get some confidence, and get out there.
 
I think people give the message of a lot of these PUA videos and whatnot too much power. If you are an absolutely un-confident person, who hates themselves and needs to really work on themselves first - getting a girl isn't going to fix that, and yeah - faking all the right steps and getting a girl is bad news.

PUA is under the assumption that you are a well put together guy already, at least somewhat confident, somewhat well kempt and at a point in your life where you can be a good SO. It doesn't do the before or after - the before and after are very important in this thread, 100% agree there - but the picking up part is something a lot of guys here need help with, which is exactly when the Simple Pickup message needs to be put on repeat.

Be confident, don't worry about rejection, don't get all up in your head about what to say and just say -something-.



So because SP doesn't tell you what to do -after- you get a number, or -after- you talk to a girl, the advice is useless? Looking for an all in one solution is silly. After you get a girls number, or whatever, there are tons of other steps you -can- take, and usually the advice in confusing situations is a lot more nuanced, and should be.

Absolutely correct sir, the initial pick-up /getting to a point to even get her number is considered to be the toughest part of the game. look at this thread for example so many people are affraid to approach a stranger that's why it's great advice.
 
I'm not sure what you mean? What do you think videos like SP are telling you to fake? What are they telling you to rush?

It treats other people as trophies to be collected than looking for a relationship, or faking it. As someone who has actual diagnosed agoraphobia which I still go talk to counselors for when I have the money, it'd be very VERY obvious for anyone like me to go into "pickup" mode, especially when I'm not interested in one-night-stands, because I'm a social retard. It'd be like a big nordic guy trying to ride a unicycle.

I do just straight up ask people now, which was better than my high school days of ~GRAND PLAN TO ASK A GIRL OUT~, but treating it like a game seems a bit unhealthy and treating it like a skill infers that someone is lacking if they aren't going for one night stands.
 
Well I've always wanted to marry a Canadian princess so if you want to have the Canadian equivalent of a green card marriage, let me know. :)

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How about not a canned response to a question asked last week?

A lot of this PUA stuff is nothing more than gimmicks, party magic, and trying to talk some random person into liking you instead of presenting who you are as *gasp* a person who has their shit together.

There's a difference between "game" as what you're describing, this illustrious ability to make panties disappear, and real social skills - which apply to most any situation and go well beyond just what you can do at friday night house party. The vast majority of people here don't need "game". They need to stop trying to read minds and look into things that aren't there and simply learn to say what's on their minds without coming off like douchebags or weirdos.



Dy, I honestly don't know what you're expecting me to say. You're hell bent on this idea in your head that pickup is gimmicks and party magic when that's simply not the case. Most of game first and foremost is self improvement, making sure you are confident in yourself, and have your shit together before you even think about approaching. I can't help but feel like all the scenarios in your head are revolving around clubs scenes when I'm talking about day game so maybe that's why we're off. And what the hell is "real social skills"?
 
Dy, I honestly don't know what you're expecting me to say. You're hell bent on this idea in your head that pickup is gimmicks and party magic when that's simply not the case. Most of game first and foremost is self improvement, making sure you are confident in yourself, and have your shit together before you even think about approaching. I can't help but feel like all the scenarios in your head are revolving around clubs scenes when I'm talking about day game so maybe that's why we're off. And what the hell is "real social skills"?
I don't even
 
It treats other people as trophies to be collected than looking for a relationship, or faking it. As someone who has actual diagnosed agoraphobia which I still go talk to counselors for when I have the money, it'd be very VERY obvious for anyone like me to go into "pickup" mode, especially when I'm not interested in one-night-stands, because I'm a social retard. It'd be like a big nordic guy trying to ride a unicycle.

I do just straight up ask people now, which was better than my high school days of ~GRAND PLAN TO ASK A GIRL OUT~, but treating it like a game seems a bit unhealthy and treating it like a skill infers that someone is lacking if they aren't going for one night stands.

I think that sometimes you need to figure out if there is particular advice that works for you, and then apply it to yourself. If you have some deep seeded issues that need therapy to resolve, then maybe something like SP isn't going to give you the advice you need.

That being said, try not to worry too much about the message SP gives. It really shouldn't be about how you consider your fellow humans, or whatnot - it's all about having the confidence to talk to people. That's the most important message it gives, and I don't think a single person in this thread would say otherwise.

If you are the sort of person who thinks that it's really really hard to get a number, or that there is a particular song and dance that you -have- to follow to pick a girl up - just watch SP and take from it that it's not about singing and dancing, and it's not extremely difficult. It's about confidence, simply put.
 
So because SP doesn't tell you what to do -after- you get a number, or -after- you talk to a girl, the advice is useless? Looking for an all in one solution is silly. After you get a girls number, or whatever, there are tons of other steps you -can- take, and usually the advice in confusing situations is a lot more nuanced, and should be.

It's building on bad fundamentals.

Serious question, do you approach?
 
Enlighten me. You think pickup is a joke but say people need real social skill. What's. The. Difference?

You've turned pickup and "game" into some mythological entity that is rival to the speed force from dc comics.

Social skills mean that you can, consistently, communicate with people around you. Teaching or emphasizing PUA stuff is putting the cart way the fuck out front of the horse. To the point where people will ignore their real issues, shortcomings, and social quarks in preference to what will get them rare attention and positive feedback for coming off like something that they almost never are. Social skills mean you can talk to a waitress. And not get the idea in your head that she wants you when you left her a bigger than usual tip. Social skills mean you don't flip the fuck out over how to return a phone call. Social skills help you figure out when your foot is in your mouth. Social skills keep you from saying YOLO at work.

"Game" is not this big entity that people need to divert energy on. Its slang. Its irrelevant in the grand scheme of things. Its just a stupid name that people assign to one small aspect of social skills and communication. You can't put all that energy into just one thing and forget about everything else that goes into building relationships with people. Romantic or not.
 
It's building on bad fundamentals.

Serious question, do you approach?

What bad fundamentals? Be confident, don't stress and overworry about what you are saying, and rejection is okay?

Approaching isn't in the equation for me any more. But yeah, when I had to the advice I got from SP was absolutely fundamentally important. I was always SO fucking chicken shit about about just going up to a girl and talking to them, whether I was at a bar or a club. I didn't do it -all- the time, or even enough times, but I took risks and WAY more than half of them paid off and then some.
 
Yeah Pick Up Artistry sure is cool:

Anti-slut Defense

ASD is a conscious or unconscious process that women, especially younger women, go through to avoid the perception of being “slutty” or “too easy.” Women will often go out of their way to portray themselves as “nice girls,” even going so far as to proclaim indifference or even aversion to sex, when in fact the opposite is true. AFCs will often take such proclamations at face value, instead of considering the sub-communication. This leads to frustration for both parties.

Examples of ASD include women emphasizing the romantic aspects of a relationship, while downplaying the sex; underestimating the number of sexual partners they’ve had in the past; or making statements like “I don’t usually do this!” to maintain the image that they are good girls.

Before sex, anti-slut defense often manifests as token resistance put up by the woman to demonstrate that they resisted the sexual advances, which helps absolve them of their guilt of sex, which originates mostly from social programming. Post-sex ASD often involves justifications for the sex act: “It just happened,” “he wouldn’t give up,” “I was really drunk,” etc. PUAs should take this tendency of women into consideration, and make sex as easy for her as possible by taking the lead and responsibility for sex, and providing her with convenient excuses for sleeping with them.

Older and more experienced women (such as cougars) are often more comfortable with their sexuality, and less concerned with others’ perception of them. They will put up less of an ASD facade, although most will maintain some pretense for respectability’s sake.

Oh yeah, real swell thing they got goin' on. Between this and Last Minute Resistance, so much class.
 
You've turned pickup and "game" into some mythological entity that is rival to the speed force from dc comics.

Social skills mean that you can, consistently, communicate with people around you. Teaching or emphasizing PUA stuff is putting the cart way the fuck out front of the horse. To the point where people will ignore their real issues, shortcomings, and social quarks in preference to what will get them rare attention and positive feedback for coming off like something that they almost never are. Social skills mean you can talk to a waitress. And not get the idea in your head that she wants you when you left her a bigger than usual tip. Social skills mean you don't flip the fuck out over how to return a phone call. Social skills help you figure out when your foot is in your mouth. Social skills keep you from saying YOLO at work.

"Game" is not this big entity that people need to divert energy on. Its slang. Its irrelevant in the grand scheme of things. Its just a stupid name that people assign to one small aspect of social skills and communication. You can't put all that energy into just one thing and forget about everything else that goes into building relationships with people. Romantic or not.

lol Dy, we're talking about the same thing. You call it "real social skill" everyone else calls it pickup. They're the same thing dude, sorry to disappoint you.
 
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