Forza Horizon - Fall 2012 - Developed by PlayGround Games
- Thread starter Zeouterlimits
- Start date
Not long at all now, I'd hope a lot of your questions will be answered in the next round of coverage we have coming up.
drugstore_cowboy
Member
Any idea when the next behind the scenes episode will arrive?
I also would like to know this. I just love those videos and/or when they show their work places, etc.
It's on the showfloor too, which is good because I want to play it but don't have an Xbox anymore
Hello, nice to meet you.Hi all,
Finally got my username changed (thanks duckroll)!
Hopefully you guys are liking the daily car reveals? There's still plenty more to come
Official answer: why no track DLC for FM4?
Thanks.
-bakalhau-
Member
Hey there
It's weird to see you with that avatar after so many years reading all you said at various Codemasters forums and here. But I'm glad you're still with us!/off-topic
I hope we get more out of it than from PAX. Also glad to be back to a normal discussion
People are overreacting as hell there. F1 2012 demo is amazing.
soundscream
Member
That's the gif that keeps on giving. Fantastic!
Well we've got Ralph Fulton from Playground Games doing the developer session at Eurogamer Expo later this year.
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-09-13-forza-horizon-developer-session-at-eurogamer-expo
eso76
Member
Oh, they had many DLC tracks ready for FM4.
One day they got curious to see how many miles they would amount to if joined together.
And that's how Forza Horizon was born.
CaptainRizla
Member
The more I see, the more I want.
This and NFS are going to keep me very happy for a long time
This and NFS are going to keep me very happy for a long time
Microsoctober? Has a nice ring to it.
Steve McQueen
Member
Any word on a possible demo?
NullPointer
Member
Demo confirmed for sometime in October is all we know so far.
Edit: Can we get one of these in Horizon? That we can actually drive this time?
Steve McQueen
Member
Great! Very eager to play this
soundscream
Member
Demo confirmed for sometime in October is all we know so far.
Edit: Can we get one of these in Horizon? That we can actually drive this time?
With a working turret so we can shoot all those damn Econo Boxes driving around
Be careful what you wish for, even in jest. Soccer and bowling started off as a joke post on fm.net, and the rest is history.With a working turret so we can shoot all those damn Econo Boxes driving around
I wake up
It starts again
It starts again
It starts again...
This is for Australia, and it was the first two sites I checked to see if they had preorders. There's probably another for EB as well.
Not that it matters, but Playground/T10/MS have just locked themselves out of a preorder, I'll wait until it bombas shortly after release and grab a cheap UK import copy. I'll wait for the preorder DLC to come out in a few months for less than the price I saved by not preordering.
It starts again
It starts again
It starts again...
This is for Australia, and it was the first two sites I checked to see if they had preorders. There's probably another for EB as well.
Not that it matters, but Playground/T10/MS have just locked themselves out of a preorder, I'll wait until it bombas shortly after release and grab a cheap UK import copy. I'll wait for the preorder DLC to come out in a few months for less than the price I saved by not preordering.
-MikePriester-
Member
Won't be waiting for the bomba price, but I won't be getting any DLC Cars for the game after Forza 4.
I wasn't pleased when I found 1 car per packed was locked out when it was usually the car I wanted most (duh).
I wasn't pleased when I found 1 car per packed was locked out when it was usually the car I wanted most (duh).
To be honest, the cars aren't as important for me in a game like this. It's the action,racing,exploring,events..etc that should be the stars.
However, IF the customization and upgrades process is huge compared to Forza, then I'll be inclined to buy DLC. If it isn't, then I'll be fine with the on disc offerings.
Tangelo is now my new favourite fruit...
However, IF the customization and upgrades process is huge compared to Forza, then I'll be inclined to buy DLC. If it isn't, then I'll be fine with the on disc offerings.
Tangelo is now my new favourite fruit...
soundscream
Member
1st of all having a warthog with a working turret would be awesome.
2nd I never understand why you guys get so up tight over a couple of features like bowling and soccer. They didn't take anything away from the game.
"Don't ye be puttin any fun in me Forza"
brotkasten
Member
2nd I never understand why you guys get so up tight over a couple of features like bowling and soccer. They didn't take anything away from the game.
"Don't ye be puttin any fun in me Forza"
Because it's like putting MP into a SP game. Even if it's done by a different team, it costs time and money to implement it. Resources that could've been spent on better, more important parts of the game.
Like fixing some of the car models.
soundscream
Member
Lets be honest, you actually think the reason some car models weren't fixed was because of the addition of bowling.
brotkasten
Member
No and that's not what I said. I'm saying that the money they spent on football and bowling, could've been better used to fix the car models. Instead of having 20 people working on those modes, they could've payed 10 people to fix the models in that time.
So no, those modes didn't take anything away from the final game, but it took resources during the development that could've been spent better.
That's all I'm saying.
soundscream
Member
And what I'm saying is that those people most likely would have been doing something else if the had not been working on the bowling etc. I dont think they feel fixing models is worth the effort since only a half of a percent of the people playing notice.
Jamesways
Member
I heard Spa and Bathurst were almost done and to be added, but they ultimately were set aside as T10 caved to the fan pressure instead. The fans had spoken, everyone preferred bowling and soccer given the choice.
Yeah, that's what happened.
True story.
Please put those resources back to working on new circuits for fm5. Or at least ANOTHER fictional mountain course to showcase the graphics.
I know, I'm full of sarcasm today.
It's hard to compare creating a few game modes/models to recreating an entire track, that's a massive undertaking time-wise. Not saying I agree with the decision to not do DLC/more tracks for Forza 4 of course, but hopefully Forza 5 will get 5+ new tracks at least...otherwise it's going to get stale pretty quickly.
soundscream
Member
Sure they could have done that, but you should come to terms as to why they didn't.
There is probably a white board full of ideas that would have been added to the game if they didn't add all those new features.
I dont think anyone has ever not bought the game because of a incorrectly modeled Ferrari or Zonda. But there is somone who might have bought it because they liked the idea of Top Gear bowling, and that's the overall reason why they add these things to expand the audience.
Now of course I would love for the game to have everything done perfectly, but I also dont want it to become like the GT series and have such a long wait between games
that game was still full of issues after all those years
DonasaurusRex
Online Ho Champ
...the ideas weren't terrible it was the execution that fell flat on its face, that game coulda been amazing.
Neuromancer
Member
No. The people who implemented the different MP modes like bowling and soccer and modeled the warthog had, in all probability, completely different knowledge, skills and experience (not to mention job descriptions) than the people who designed and created the game's tracks. To assume otherwise shows, in my opinion, a lack of knowledge about how video games are made.
Resources doesn't necessarily = people, though. He's not saying the same people who implemented feature X could've worked on improving Y instead, just that the money that went into it could've been better spent elsewhere at development time... or not at all, and perhaps funneled into DLC later on down the line. And given that one issue apparently seems to be that track DLC isn't profitable is *completely* relevant.
Thanks Shaneus, that's exactly what I was saying, and why I spoke about 'resources' and not 'people'.
And I've got to say, Neuromancer - I found your assumptions very patronising.
Yeah, I do still wrestle with the dichotomy of Dan's vision, and don't think I'll ever really come to terms with a serious sim having slapstick game modes. I get why he does it (gamers <-> car lovers = wider audience = more sales) and I do need to suck it up and get over it if I don't want to let it taint my overall experience. I dunno, maybe (hopefully) Horizon will be the default outlet for the Keystone Cops stuff like that from now on. Or maybe the vocal majority on FM.net will convince Dan to concentrate less on a race-day experience with a wide and varied selection of circuits, and more on finding ways to drop four-wheeled vehicles into bar-room games. It'll certainly be very interesting to see what FM5 delivers this time next year.
They came across as patronising to me as well, which is why I felt the need to respond. I'd have thought that the point of your post was fairly obvious, but I guess that every so often, someone only sees what they want to see in a post.
I'm beginning to think now that his "vision" is more erring on the side of trying to appeal to many aspects of the gaming market (both casual and "hardcore") as possible, but winding up being the jack of all trades and master of none. The thing I don't understand is that there's the inclusion of all these modes to attract the more casual gamer, yet the sales of FM4 were dwarfed by GT5 despite the latter being infinitely less casual user-friendly. I hope they take something away from that... the idea that you should have a clear focus for your product and trust that people will follow. If you build it, they will come, so to speak.
On that note, I'd love to know if they're logging or monitoring how many hours total are being spent in the Kinect driving mode. Because that'd give them the best indication of just how casual their audience is. Or even, what controllers people actually use (whether they're gamepads, the wireless wheel or the Fanatec stuff).
REMEMBER CITADEL
Banned
Indeed. Besides, many people (including a number of reviewers and even sim racing nuts) were complaining that Forza games felt sterile and lacked variety. So they fixed that somewhat, but now other folks complain. You can never please everyone.
Looking at it long term, attracting a wider audience by making a game more accessible and more fun to more people while keeping the sim core intact can only be a good thing since it means better series recognition and bigger budgets for everything, including sim features and tracks.
When it comes to tracks, I think limited DVD space has been a much bigger issue for Turn 10 than additions of car soccer and bowling.
Yes, they can take away that GT is a much bigger name with a significantly larger legacy, and people waited many years for the next game in the series. Many people bought their PS3s at the start of the generation precisely because of the prospect of another GT - even before Forza 2 came out. And the situation with racing wheels on the 360 couldn't have helped with racing sim fans either.
antiquegamer
Member
If you preorder this at Microsoft store (US), they are having promotion where you get 1600 MS points and coupon for $10.00 next purchase. Other games also available for pre-order with this promotion.
But how did they build that legacy up, though? Certainly not by throwing different, random game modes at it to see what stuck.
I have nothing against Turn 10 adding in bowling, soccer, darts or even car synchronized swimming.
Having said that, I would like to see a little more focus. Trying to cater to both worlds sounds good in theory, but ultimately, you are going to fall short on either end.
This is where a game like Forza Horizon comes in. It's undoubtedly going to appeal to a much wider audience then Forza's bowling or soccer ever will. It offers the 'fun' and variance that Dan tried to inject into the main game. Yes, it has FM4's physics at heart, but it has so much more to offer now that it isn't constrained by lap times and apexes.
This should mean that Turn 10 can finally concentrate on making FM5 a more focused racer without having to worry about attracting Grandma and Grandpa with shallow offerings of soccer and baseball.
In the end, for most car game lovers, this can only be a win win situation...
Having said that, I would like to see a little more focus. Trying to cater to both worlds sounds good in theory, but ultimately, you are going to fall short on either end.
This is where a game like Forza Horizon comes in. It's undoubtedly going to appeal to a much wider audience then Forza's bowling or soccer ever will. It offers the 'fun' and variance that Dan tried to inject into the main game. Yes, it has FM4's physics at heart, but it has so much more to offer now that it isn't constrained by lap times and apexes.
This should mean that Turn 10 can finally concentrate on making FM5 a more focused racer without having to worry about attracting Grandma and Grandpa with shallow offerings of soccer and baseball.
In the end, for most car game lovers, this can only be a win win situation...
The sterility I thought was more attributed to the detail in track environments and not specifically in game modes. I could be wrong, though. But I don't recall people saying that it needed more variety.
At launch, I thought the amount of tracks that the game came with was quite acceptable (taking into account I have a HDD in my 360, so I could actually use the second disc). It was the post-launch support that was a massive letdown and made me question the focus of the team. If there was *any* track DLC, I don't think I'd feel the need to question their vision for the franchise. But when the only after-sales improvements they've offered have been cars (which to myself, is barely more than offering player skins in an FPS for what it adds to the game's replayability) then every aspect of the game deserves to be scruitinised and analysed for issues improvements. Including things like car bowling and soccer.
(I hope the above gets my point across. I have a tendency to not be amazing at doing that.)
Oh, and when I compare cars essentially to player skins in an FPS game, it's that to me, that's how useless they are for how they affect my enjoyment and replayability of a game. I doubt I'd notice the difference between 600 cars in-game and 400 compared to, say, 15 racing locales against 10. Longevity in a game like FM4 most certainly relies more on the latter more than the former.
REMEMBER CITADEL
Banned
They built it primarily by making great games, but also by being the first serious console racing sim, by being on the market for almost a decade longer than Forza, and by shipping four main entries and god knows how many spin-offs, prologues and special editions before the first Forza game launched.
And it's not like GT doesn't have plenty of modes that are completely inessential to the racing experience. You could just as easily say that the resources spent on go-kart events, VW bus racing, B-Spec mode or fetishizing over the photo mode(s) could've been better spent on making more tracks, more premium cars or fixing some of the many problems that plagued the game at launch. But those games are what they are, for better or worse.
There's no need for hyperbole, those modes' purpose is not just "attracting Grandma and Grandpa". I think there's a bigger overlap of the arcade and sim audience than what many people believe, and I know a lot of serious racing fans enjoy those more casual diversions (hell, if I'm not mistaken, InsideSimRacing guys seemed fond of them, too). I'm all for them staying in and even expanding as long as the sim elements keep advancing as well.