they most definitely had a choice. they chose the wii strategy again. worked out for them last gen, and they're betting it'll work out for them again.
Wii U clock speeds are found by marcan
- Thread starter Pooya
- Start date
they most definitely had a choice. they chose the wii strategy again. worked out for them last gen, and they're betting it'll work out for them again.
Vane_MagicCity
Banned
It is underpowered, there is no question about it considering the CPU.
IHaveCandy
Banned
DS
Wii
DSi
3DS
WiiDS
Wii
DSi
3DS
WiiDS
It doesn't take a lot of money to make a console that beats 360/PS3. It's been 7 years. Moore's law makes low end beat 7 year old high end for the cheap.
Thunder Monkey
Banned
That was a joke.
Vane_MagicCity
Banned
Oh sorry, I see it now.
Thunder Monkey
Banned
Saint Gregory
Member
No, that's not really what I mean. I mean that Nintendo's focus as a publisher first, hardware maker second sometimes makes them a little adversarial with 3rd parties. I imagine that EA wanted too much control over Nintendo properties or perhaps too much of a slice of digital sales for Nintendo's liking which made their online plans fall apart. The CD add-on situation was definitely a case of Sony wanting too much control over Nintendo's properties but that still could have been handled better by both sides.
I'm not really sure what Nintendo could have done really in either situation but I think being such a successful publisher places them in an odd situation when dealing with other 3rd party publishers.
I do think that working with smaller independent studios like Platinum is a good idea for them. If the games they work on together are successful it could start to build a foundation that leads other independent dev houses to see Nintendo as a viable partner.
Edit: Just to make things clearer I'm not talking about a situation where hypothetically EA wants to make Battlefield:Mushroom Kingdom, I'm talking more about a situation where let's say EA wants to co-publish 3D Mario with Nintendo because of their theoretical online intergration with WiiU.
Outside title fans, launches aren't about one game justifying the console. It's about what you expect and hope you'll play over the lifetime and how you think it will satisfy your gaming needs. Wii didn't, but I hope Wii U does.
8bitForLife
Member
Has any company's said they would be releasing patches for these games to maybe fix any of these bugs or fps issues or is it not possible to fix them at all because its the cpu's speed.
I been saying that current Wii U hardware serves exactly Nintendo softwares needs, no more no less, Nintendo will not develop a game that means big budgets outside of Wii U range. Third partys be damned, but it's always that way with Nintendo, they develop hardware for its first party titles first and foremost.
Gamer @ Heart
Member
You are right, but i think he meant more along the lines that increasing budgets is not going to help matters.
I really wish one publisher would have the balls to change the $60 model. THQ tried and failed once with some DLC centric 30 dollar Motorcross game. Sad, but i just dont think THQ was the right company to try to cross that bridge.
Gamer @ Heart
Member
Come on now.
AC3 runs as good if not better than the PS3 version. Uninspiring considering UBI were some of if not the first to actually get dev kits outside of nintendo. Its about time and money.
If they dont, its because the port's budget has been spent and they dont plan to see money there.
Barack Lesnar
Banned
How does Sony deal with the exchange rate situation? or is it different for them
Gamer @ Heart
Member
They get hammered too.
Dreamwriter
Member
The games all play well, just not quite as well as on XBox 360. And I don't think much of it is due to the CPU speed - for example, a study showed that BLOPS II's framerate differences were caused by the programmers choosing to turn on VSync and unlocking the framerate from 30fps. So it'd be easy to fix, BUT, the developers choose to do that to their game, these really aren't things that would accidentally happen in most cases. And as I said, the framerates aren't terrible or the games bad, just not quite as good as on 360. So I doubt the publisher would be interested in fixing it. They won't see it as broken, they'll see it as just little platform differences.
Freezie KO
Banned
I might be wrong, but my understanding is that Sony's financials are a step above Greece.
Alpolio
Member
What's wrong with the DS in console form comparison?
The DS was the best system last gen with the PSP second. If all devs do are copy and paste what they did with the DS then I could not be happier if they did that with the Wii U and its GamePad. Even if devs become "lazy" and all they do is leave a map on the GamePad, it's still gonna be the greatest thing ever lol. Ocarina of Time 3D was exactly that. It's just OoT N64, but brighter colors and with a map on the 3DS bottom screen. And it's truly a godsend. So simple too!
The DS was the best system last gen with the PSP second. If all devs do are copy and paste what they did with the DS then I could not be happier if they did that with the Wii U and its GamePad. Even if devs become "lazy" and all they do is leave a map on the GamePad, it's still gonna be the greatest thing ever lol. Ocarina of Time 3D was exactly that. It's just OoT N64, but brighter colors and with a map on the 3DS bottom screen. And it's truly a godsend. So simple too!
BlockheadBrown
Member
Sega All Star Racing Transformed had some reportedly serious frame rate issues before launch. Sometime after they got updated kits, the FPS increased dramatically. I can tell you from first-hand experience that it plays better on the Wii U than on the 360 (demo). That said, it's really up to the devs/pubs if they want to release updates. I'm fairly certain that there have been some already released.
KojiKnight
Member
Additional buttons on the bottom screen make OoT a much better game... Not having to switch out items every few minutes in a dungeon stream lined that game a lot.
shinra-bansho
Member
People on B3D seem to be running with the notion that the CPU is literally 3 modified Broadway cores at 45nm; while some on here afaict are maintaining that this is a more modern CPU that has been modified to be compatible?
Is there any reason the latter is more likely than the former?
Is there any reason the latter is more likely than the former?
KojiKnight
Member
People have been saying the latter here? Marcan made it pretty clear that they are 3 modified Broadways. Early "theories" were of the latter, but I don't think anyone still thinks it.
The Power750 line has always been really strong and low wattage, it's not a surprise that Nintendo would be continuing down that rabbit hole.
shinra-bansho
Member
I could have read the posts wrong - that seemed to be the implication.
In any event, if we are now running with the idea that it's essentially 3 modified die-shrunk Broadway cores at 1.25 GHz...
...then why do people keep chiming in like all we've been told is the clockspeed and that's all people are reacting to.
Doesn't this knowledge and information available on Broadway combined with previous leaks about Espresso give a good general indication of what should be expected from the CPU? (i.e. in relation to Xenon for example)
Teletraan1
Banned
I like the 3/DS a lot. I never found the second screen features to be anywhere as innovative as motion controls were the first time I used them. Is a map or inventory screen a bad thing to have on the pad? I am not saying that at all, but it seems that a lot of the cost of this system is related to the Gamepad. I don't think the price of the DS was so hampered by the second screen as the Gamepad is to the Wii U. Personally I dont feel that tradeoff of either paying more for the hardware or getting less powerful hardware for this price was worth a map or an inventory screen unless we get something more out of it then that. My original point was that I dont expect that "something more" since they have had since 2004 with this concept and never really produced anything more than that with it. Anyone have any ideas what they could use the second screen for that would scream "you have to buy this" like motion controls did for the Wii?
It doesn't make any sense at all to me - this idea that magically this core tech is dramatically faster per core.
PowerPC was ditched by major players years ago.
Intel over nearly a decade invested tens of billions to make their current CPU core tech 3x faster than late P3 early P4 cores. Just imagine if Intel abandoned x86, and someone picked up the Pentium 4 design, ran it at 1.25 GHz...why are we to believe it's running faster than a P4 at 3.2 GHz?
Everything we know suggests that it's weak.
DeuceGamer
Member
Honestly, there are a lot of games I'd be completely content with utilizing the Gamepad as an inventory screen or interactive map. Borderlands 2, AC3, etc.... If they were available on Wii U and were identical but offered just an inventory/map on the Gamepad they would be the definitive version, for me.
Dreamwriter
Member
Why are folks saying that a modified CPU core would be exactly completely the same as an unmodified one? Modified does NOT mean the same, last I heard, and could mean substantially better. Or substantially different.
IrishNinja
Member
most definitely - previously mentioned subscription models aside, i think going over $400 is kinda sending it to die, unless you've got something you really think will move that unit (maybe MS gets super confident in kinect 2 or something). maybe i shouldn't say die but honestly, even with the economy hopefully struggling back a bit a year from now, a $500 gaming device - even media hub, where we have other options already for that - feels unwise at best.
edit: i liked your joke
BladeoftheImmortal
Member
Because substantially improving a CPU core tech takes billions of dollars, and a lot of time.
Dreamwriter
Member
And last I heard, IBM was broke and the Wii U was developed in 6 months...
IBM would be broke if it just tossed billions of dollars into an old CPU tech out of kindness. It also takes rare technical talent. Why would they put resources on old CPU core tech?
Getting 3x a Pentium 4 core took Intel about 6-7 years. That's not 6-7 years of contract work, but full time salaried experts in their field meticulously improving the execution engine, branch prediction, designing parts of silicon by hand.
shinra-bansho
Member
Well for one thing "Espresso" on B3D who was first (?) to state it over a year ago, wrote as such.
"It is not really a new core."
"It's directly descended from the CPU core in the Wii, there are just more of them and they are clocked a little faster. It does come up about the same as Xenon for processing power, but the clock is much, much closer to Wii than X360."
"It is the same core as Wii, with 3 of them and larger L2's, clocked a little bit faster."
It was roundly dismissed at the time. But it seems like far more than coincidence now.
Someone should ask that guy about other systems. Seems legit.
But isn't Nintendo footing the bill?
That jibes with everything we've seen and read. So, yeah, it's 3xbroadway. :-(
Thunder Monkey
Banned
rohlfinator
Member
If the Wii U is bottlenecked by its CPU (which kind of seems to be the case based on early impressions), I don't think modern pixel shaders are going to make up the difference... you can't really scale down CPU usage in the same way you can scale down graphical fidelity.
I get 15.4, if there are no improvements to the floating point throughput and the information I found about Broadway is correct.
(FWIW, a single Cell SPE achieves a theoretical maximum of 25.6 GFlops)
I think WRT something that's actually complicated like the Wii U you DO need to play with it before you can form an opinion. Its like people who don't like videogames and think they are stupid and a waste of time even though they have never really played them. We all know people like that and we know videogames are much more than just kids in their rooms hiding away from the world.
It really depends on the game and what you're using the CPU for. If you're using it to try and put the entire world into a physics model, then yeah you might hit a wall with optimisation where you can't get it faster and a slow CPU is shit out of luck. If you're doing a game that requires intense AI and simulation you might also be in trouble. However I do think things can be done to alleviate the problem.
The Wii U version might not have as many destructibles. The AI or simulation might just take longer in a turn based game. If in the end the developer can't or won't sacrifice their game they'll just have to choose not to put it on the system and I guess Wii U might miss out.
So, if this guy is to be believed, as powerful as the 360 with CPU, a much better GPU.
Wow...that's not impressive.
Thunder Monkey
Banned
Wow... that's an understatement if I ever read one.
The Abominable Snowman
Member
As marcan explained, if the Broadway and Xenon were clocked the same, outside of SIMD operations, the Xenon would look very, very poor. In practice they aren't clocked the same, though.
Thunder Monkey
Banned
No Vaga is talking about the B3Der that leaked Espresso.
"It's directly descended from the CPU core in the Wii, there are just more of them and they are clocked a little faster. It does come up about the same as Xenon for processing power, but the clock is much, much closer to Wii than X360."
The Abominable Snowman
Member
*edit* i go by a name very similar to Vagabundos elsewhere....