Support NeoGAF

[SturokBGD]

I've learned to stop caring about this stuff (at least in a defensive capacity). None of my family or peers or acquaintances or workers or anybody I know that matters really believes it. Also, nothing will ever come of it anyway because it's clearly not true. There is no link. It's completely irrelevant.

What does upset me is that time and money is spent on this nonsense that could be going towards the real issues.

 

[Sojgat]

"You want to know why. This may sound cynical, but here's why.

It's because of the way the media reports it. Flip on the news and watch how we treat the Batman theater shooter and the Oregon mall shooter like celebrities. Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris are household names, but do you know the name of a single *victim* of Columbine? Disturbed
people who would otherwise just off themselves in their basements see the news and want to top it by doing something worse, and going out in a memorable way. Why a grade school? Why children? Because he'll be remembered as a horrible monster, instead of a sad nobody.

CNN's article says that if the body count "holds up", this will rank as the second deadliest shooting behind Virginia Tech, as if statistics somehow make one shooting worse than another. Then they post a video interview of third-graders for all the details of what they saw and heard while the shootings were happening. Fox News has plastered the killer's face on all their reports for hours. Any articles or news stories yet that focus on the victims and ignore the killer's identity? None that I've seen yet. Because they don't sell. So congratulations, sensationalist media, you've just lit the fire for someone to top this and knock off a day care center or a maternity ward next.

You can help by forgetting you ever read this man's name, and remembering the name of at least one victim. You can help by donating to mental health research instead of pointing to gun control as the problem. You can help by turning off the news."

I was with you right up until the bolded Morgan, right up until the bolded.

 

[udivision]

Ignore him, stop talking about him, stop giving him exactly what he wanted.

If we did that, how would we know enough whether to blame video games/guns/his political affiliation/his religion/his race/his country of origin/his shoe size for what happened?

 

[plagiarize]

Because most of these studies are criticized within their own communities as having flaws. Get federal money involved and the top researchers who agree on the exact parameters of the study.

As for that chart, people are on here referring to it as if it's the be-all-end-all to this argument but it isn't unless we have sales statistics for those regions. I absolutely believe gun control should be the solution to this matter but why not see if there's anything else we can do?

can we be clear on what the problem is we're looking to a solution on?

and can we agree that singling out video games makes no sense at all?

 

[thekonamicode]

I love fake Morgan Freeman quotes. Here's one I made up.

"You see, the thing about $2 microwavable pizzas is that they generally taste better when you bake them in an oven. Sure, it might take longer, but if there's one thing I've learned throughout my life ... it's that some things are just worth waiting for."

-Morgan Freeman

 

[Boss Man]

It's a bad thing because:

1) using video games as the scape goat for these mass killings distracts from the real issues of gun control and treatment of mental disorders, which means that the real causes don't get adequately addressed and the problem continues. It ultimately costs more lives.

2) it's a waste of taxpayer dollars – which could surely be better used on other more pressing matters – on something that is rather irrelevant. Violent video games aren't marketed to children and children are already restricted from buying it. There are already studies in place showing very high compliance rates with ESRB ratings – higher than for movie ratings. And any studies on the effects of video games should be done impartially without government influence and should look at long-term effects. What these studies tend to do is only look at extremely short-term results of exposure in order to find the bad effects they're searching for. But short-term can't be extrapolated to long-term so it should never be the basis for legislation.

While I agree with like 99.9999% of your post, at the end of the day it's something that the public has obviously been clamoring for answers on. Even though it's a stupid question, it's still a question that's worth answering and getting it over with. It's unfortunate that it has to be done, but I think it does need to be done.

 

[Danj]

I love fake Morgan Freeman quotes. Here's one I made up.

"You see, the thing about $2 microwavable pizzas is that they generally taste better when you bake them in an oven. Sure, it might take longer, but if there's one thing I've learned throughout my life ... it's that some things are just worth waiting for."

-Morgan Freeman

You can oven-bake microwavable pizzas? Why would you want to?

Also, I wish they did full-size microwavable pizzas. All the full-size ones require oven baking, which as you correctly point out takes too damn long.

 

[Z_Y]

Oh, Jay. (He's not the brightest bulb in the bunch if you've ever met him) Here I thought Manchin was making us not look like idiots for once and Rockefeller has to go and fuck it all up.

No doubt. is this bizarro world?

 

[Eric C]

Yeah, they dug up this dead horse and started wailing on its lifeless, mushy corpse on ABC Nightline last night for about 10 minutes. They called out games like Call of Duty and said how the player is playing the role of "murderers" that go on killing sprees.

I thought that ABC Nightline news report last night was one of the better mainstream news reports that I've seen on this issue.

That ABC Nightline story also compared the blaming of videogames to the 1950s "comic book" scare mongering. And said older generations have a pattern of blaming "new forms of media" that they don't use or understand.

It also mentioned the US Supreme Court REJECTED the studies linking video games to violence and so did "every court to consider them, and with good reason: The do not prove that violent video games cause minors to act aggressively"

And ABC ended the news piece saying blaming video games was "an easy target amidst a moral panic" and "as a society if we focus in on the wrong issue, that can distract the national conversation from serious issues"

 

[Goldenroad]

The Washington Post had a piece on this yesterday, once again reinforcing that this is a ridiculous myth.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/worldviews/wp/2012/12/17/ten-country-comparison-suggests-theres-little-or-no-link-between-video-games-and-gun-murders/

Link this shit around, please.

But, "spent on video games" is a dollar value, right? It doesn't say time spent gaming...I still think there would be absolutely no correlation, but I don't see how how much a person spends on video games would effect anything. Games are just cheaper in the U.S. than in South Korea I take it.

 

[kliklik]

While I agree with like 99.9999% of your post, at the end of the day it's something that the public has obviously been clamoring for answers on. Even though it's a stupid question, it's still a question that's worth answering and getting it over with. It's unfortunate that it has to be done, but I think it does need to be done.

Then they should ask questions instead of introducing legislation, shouldn't they.

 

[Nome]

The more studies proving they don't cause violent behavior, the better. I'm for this bill at face value. Please read the OP before knee-jerking.

All of the studies I'm aware of shows that they DO cause increased aggression in the short term (as in, directly after). That means nothing though. I heard watching porn makes you randy... doesn't mean you're a nymphomaniac though.

An actual useful study would be whether there's long-term effects, and really, there's way too many confounding factors for that sort of study to ever happen. Not really a useful topic to give funding to.

 

[52club]

We live in a society where a tit on the TV is the end of the world, but an act of violence is often part of a heroic act. Sure video games aren't without fault, but they are only a symptom of the disease. Also they make a lot easier "target" than other topics.

 

[kliklik]

We live in a society where a tit on the TV is the end of the world, but an act of violence is often part of a heroic act. Sure video games aren't without fault, but they are only a symptom of the disease. Also they make a lot easier "target" than other topics.

Well tbf, taking off your clothes isn't exactly heroic. Super shower boy just doesn't sound impressive.

 

[Zaventem]

I was flipping channels this morning and all i heard were comments about call of duty, my eyes rolled so hard.

 

[Twenty7KVN]

I wish a federal study would just be done already so there would actually be some sort of conclusion either way for once.

But that's not going to stop this scapegoat way of thinking and that's the problem.Videogames are still the new kids on the block,when the next entertainment genre comes along that allows people to express themselves in any kind of way that's going blamed instead.It's a vicious cycles.

 

[DocSeuss]

Video games are as responsible as violence as guns are. I've seen people quoting stuff about how, say, gun violence is down in countries that control guns, but... so what? Are homicides down? I doubt it--some dude in China stabbed 22 kids and an elderly woman just the other day.

That Morgan Freeman quote is completely fabricated.

It appears to be an adaptation of Roger Ebert's statement on the matter.

 

[Ravidrath]

Like the Comics Code thing cited in the OP, I really think this is just a generational issue.

Old people don't play video games, thus they don't get it. Adam Lanza liked the Mass Effect games, apparently - if he had raped children and women instead, surely they would have pointed to that game's "depictions of sex" and how it "made him feel like he could control women just like in the video games he plays."

Also, I do feel there was a dramatic shift in the level of violence in video games when the Iraq and Afghanistan wars started. Does anyone else feel this way?

The culture will always reflect reality, and I think our national reality is dominated by wars I think you can also expect to see a noticeable uptick in violence depicted in the media. I'd actually really like to see someone like Gamasutra do some analysis of that.

That said, only something like 15% of all games are actually rated M.

But, "spent on video games" is a dollar value, right? It doesn't say time spent gaming...I still think there would be absolutely no correlation, but I don't see how how much a person spends on video games would effect anything. Games are just cheaper in the U.S. than in South Korea I take it.

With the exception of the odd Blizzard title, I believe that South Korea is almost completely dominated by F2P games now.

 

[antitrop]

Please stop copy/pasting the fake Morgan Freeman quote.

It was embarrassing the first day, now days later after newspapers and every media outlet has reported on how fake it is it's just inexcusable.

I still had idiot friends "Sharing" it on Facebook even yesterday, it's incredible.

 

[cheststrongwell]

Stay away from my video games, you filthy Democrats.

 

[ironcreed]

I love fake Morgan Freeman quotes. Here's one I made up.

"You see, the thing about $2 microwavable pizzas is that they generally taste better when you bake them in an oven. Sure, it might take longer, but if there's one thing I've learned throughout my life ... it's that some things are just worth waiting for."

-Morgan Freeman

 

[Dabanton]

Has their ever been a million gamer march?

 

[Khaz]

Well tbf, taking off your clothes isn't exactly heroic. Super shower boy just doesn't sound impressive.

Actually it can be. Ever heard of Femen? (NSFW)
Last time I heard of them in the news was when they protested against a far-right/religious manifestation against gay mariage in France. They were barechested with a wimple, got beaten pretty badly by skinheads.

 

[SturokBGD]

Actually it can be. Ever heard of Femen? <--- nsfw, boobs on front page
Last time I heard of them in the news was when they protested against a far-right/religious manifestation against gay mariage in France. They were barechested with a wimple, got beaten pretty badly by skinheads.

Link is NSFW, dude. You might want to mention that.

 

[Fonz72]

Please stop copy/pasting the fake Morgan Freeman quote.

It was embarrassing the first day, now days later after newspapers and every media outlet has reported on how fake it is it's just inexcusable.

I still had idiot friends "Sharing" it on Facebook even yesterday, it's incredible.

You know, just because Morgan Freeman didn't say it doesn't mean it rings any less true. This quote needs to be spread around...........................

 

[kliklik]

Actually it can be. Ever heard of Femen?
Last time I heard of them in the news was when they protested against a far-right/religious manifestation against gay mariage in France. They were barechested with a wimple, got beaten pretty badly by skinheads.

That's just using sex to sell your opinions and movement and draw attention to it. It's nothing new. PETA does it too. But...we're getting off topic.

 

[Goldenroad]

With the exception of the odd Blizzard title, I believe that South Korea is almost completely dominated by F2P games now.

Then why does that graph show them spending so much more money on video games than almost every other country?

 

[antitrop]

You know, just because Morgan Freeman didn't say it doesn't mean it rings any less true. This quote needs to be spread around...........................

I won't disagree with you. Pass it around attributed to "Anonymous", not Morgan Freeman.

 

[Corky]

The HELL is wrong with your country('s leaders)?!

I thought he killed all those kids with an assault rifle and not an unopened ( albeit pointy edged ) copy of CoD...

edit : Also I have no idea what to say other than I find the topic of gun "control" to be sad and laughable when it comes to a country with what? 200? 300 million guns? Yeah control that somehow. Don't sell another gun from tomorrow and the country still has more guns per capita than anywhere else.

 

[EvilMario]

I listen to a very small amount of American talk radio, but the few podcast I do turn into have been using the phrase 'video game culture' over and over. Likewise, when some violence issues occurred in the NFL this season, there were bone heads blaming it on video games some how.

Remember, guns don't kill people, video games kill people.

 

[Oppo]

When we know for a fact that the shooters didn't play these games, why are we doing this? Why waste money for something that has no connection to reality?

It's an easy political target, and seems an attractive scapegoat to the puritanical folks.

 

[Penguins&PolarBears]

I've learned to stop caring about this stuff (at least in a defensive capacity). None of my family or peers or acquaintances or workers or anybody I know that matters really believes it. Also, nothing will ever come of it anyway because it's clearly not true. There is no link. It's completely irrelevant.

What does upset me is that time and money is spent on this nonsense that could be going towards the real issues.

Well with Joe Biden in charge of the task force I'm sure no time or money will be wasted. :-/

You should care about this because according to Gallup 78% of the country believes that censoring violent TV, movies, videogames would help to prevent incidences like this. 47% believe it would be very effective to start censoring media like video games. 31% believe it would somewhat effective to censor violent media like games. And only 20% believe it would have no effect.

That's more than think gun control would help (42%).

In either case I see many Americans wanting to violate the 1st or 2nd Amendments and without a healthy respect for the US Constitution.

 

[GillianSeed79]

from Politico:

http://www.politico.com/story/2012/...shooter-games-and-violence-studied-85298.html

Rockefeller said he will call on the FTC and FCC to expand their work on video game regulation. “The FTC has reviewed the effectiveness of the video game ratings system. The FCC has looked at the impact of violent programming on children. Changes in technology now allow kids to access violent content on-line with less parental involvement,” he said. “It is time for these two agencies to take a fresh look at these issues.”

The lawmaker also pointed out that responsibility rests with the entertainment industry. “Major corporations, including the video game industry, make billions on marketing and selling violent content to children. They have a responsibility to protect our children,” he said. “If they do not, you can count on the Congress to take a more aggressive role.”

I thought the Supreme Court ruled you can't regulate the content of video games?

 

[kliklik]

Can I ask Americans here... is there not a law in place to stop the sale of guns to people who live with mentally ill people – those who wouldn't be qualified to buy a gun themselves – to ensure that the gun isn't stored near them? And is there not a law against buying guns and lending them to people who wouldn't qualify to buy them? And if those laws aren't in place, wouldn't it be a good idea to put them in place, or would that contradict your 2nd amendment?

 

[Josh7289]

I don't mind this. Let them study it, and take action, or not, based on the results. That's the way things should be done.

 

[Eric C]

I thought the Supreme Court ruled you can't regulate the content of video games?

Sounds like Rockefeller doesn't care, and is trying to find some way to regulate them anyway.

"Recent court decisions demonstrate that some people still do not get it," added Rockefeller. "They believe that violent video games are no more dangerous to young minds than classic literature or Saturday morning cartoons. Parents, pediatricians, and psychologists know better. These court decisions show we need to do more and explore ways Congress can lay additional groundwork on this issue.

 

[Duane Cunningham]

Well with Joe Biden in charge of the task force I'm sure no time or money will be wasted. :-/

You should care about this because according to Gallup 78% of the country believes that censoring violent TV, movies, videogames would help to prevent incidences like this. 47% believe it would be very effective to start censoring media like video games. 31% believe it would somewhat effective to censor violent media like games. And only 20% believe it would have no effect.

That's more than think gun control would help (42%).

In either case I see many Americans wanting to violate the 1st or 2nd Amendments and without a healthy respect for the US Constitution.

Upholding the Second Amendment will protect us from fake, non-existent, hypothetical bullshit.

These shooting are REAL. Trying to prevent them has to happen. Doing that at the expense of a bunch of asshole gun enthusiast "rights" isn't actually an expense at all.

Also, this mentality that any strengthening of gun control is an assault on our holy constitution is an offensive and dangerous line of thought. God damn. If we restrict the sale of guns to the mentally ill, or reinstate the ban on assault weapons, it's not a repeal of your beloved vague, anachronistic, murder-assisting mistake.

 

[mavs]

You know, just because Morgan Freeman didn't say it doesn't mean it rings any less true. This quote needs to be spread around...........................

It's bullshit. Anderson Cooper refused to say the killer's name more than once during his report that day. The media is interviewing every parent who is willing to speak, and they constantly show pictures of the victims and talk about their lives.

Yeah, they talk about the killer. It's not like he's totally irrelevant or that ignoring him will make these killings stop.

 

[Corky]

Yeah, they talk about the killer. It's not like he's totally irrelevant or that ignoring him will make these killings stop.

Not talking about them makes it more difficult to be a "copy cat killer", how are people going to idolize and emulate something they know literally nothing about? Instead, like mentioned over and over again, we're spoon fed everything about them, painting them as vile demons and evil antagonists straight out of a story. And then people wonder why it happens over and over again.

 

[Penguins&PolarBears]

Upholding the Second Amendment will protect us from fake, non-existent, hypothetical bullshit.

These shooting are REAL. Trying to prevent them has to happen. Doing that at the expense of a bunch of asshole gun enthusiast "rights" isn't actually an expense at all.

Also, this mentality that any strengthening of gun control is an assault on our holy constitution is an offensive and dangerous line of thought. God damn. If we restrict the sale of guns to the mentally ill, or reinstate the ban on assault weapons, it's not a repeal of your beloved vague, anachronistic, murder-assisting mistake.

Playing the game of picking and choosing the Amendments of the Constitution that you personally like devalues all of them in my opinion. Also we can't force the Supreme Court to interpret the Constitution in a different way than they have. I've never owned a gun, but I can't say I'd be okay to just start shredding some of the most important parts of the Constitution. That being said from the Gallup polling it seems like Americans are more willing to violate the 1st Amendment than the 2nd Amendment. Neither is good.

The ban on assault weapons accomplished nothing, incidences went up while the ban was in place for 10 years, (nor would it have applied to the rifle used in this incident). It's just feel good legislation that accomplishes nothing good in the end. Same thing would happen if we banned all violent movies and games, the frequency of incidences like this may very well increase or stay the same.

The big trend based on all stats is that crime and violence in America has decreased drastically over the past few decades (as guns and violent games become more prevalent). The majority of these mass shootings are now only carried out by the mentally ill and I think the silver lining of these past few tragedies in AZ, CO, CT is that Americans are finally starting to become aware for the first time that we have a serious mental health issue to address. Something which has been taboo to talk about and address is finally becoming a part of the national conversation and that's really the only positive thing I can see happening in light of this horrific tragedy.

 

[News Bot]

In regards to the Morgan Freeman "quote": http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PezlFNTGWv4

 

[RagnarokX]

I think congress has something far more sinister to investigate: ice cream.

 

[jambo]

I think congress has something far more sinister to investigate: ice cream.

My god...

 

[bumpkin]

I think congress has something far more sinister to investigate: ice cream.

A cold stone... err stone cold killer.

 

[dc89]

The absolute best line from that film... still relevant today.

Just watched this clip for the first time ever on YouTube. Wow, damn, he nailed it.

 

[Rebel Leader]

from Politico:

http://www.politico.com/story/2012/...shooter-games-and-violence-studied-85298.html




I thought the Supreme Court ruled you can't regulate the content of video games?

and isn't the ESRB labled a gold standered in rating systems?

Yes it is

In a December 2009, the U.S. Federal Trade Commission (FTC) credited the computer and video game industry for “outpacing” other entertainment industries in curtailing the marketing of mature-rated products to children, clearly and prominently displaying rating information, and restricting children’s access to mature-rated products at retail locations across the U.S.

The ESRB has been described as the gold standard for rating systems by family advocates, elected officials and government agencies. “If we are looking for an industry model, I would point to the video game rating system,” said Sen. Joseph Lieberman (I-CT) in 2001. “I believe it is the best media rating system in existence.”

 

[StayDead]

I'm sorry and I don't want to get into trouble for this or start a pointless debate, but this has nothing to do with video games. This comes down to a man who was clearly clinically depressed getting no help from society and deciding to take his own life as well as others as either he was too scared to kill himself and wanted someone to kill him, or live out some kind of sick fantasy before he died.

The media in America use this as a way to turn the eyes of joe public away from the real problem which is that somehow these clinically depressed/psychopathic killers find it so easy to get hold of and use guns to hurt other people. Also why they're blaming video games I have no idea when America in movies has been gloryfying war for the past 60 odd years.

 

[jcm]

Well with Joe Biden in charge of the task force I'm sure no time or money will be wasted. :-/

You should care about this because according to Gallup 78% of the country believes that censoring violent TV, movies, videogames would help to prevent incidences like this. 47% believe it would be very effective to start censoring media like video games. 31% believe it would somewhat effective to censor violent media like games. And only 20% believe it would have no effect.

That's more than think gun control would help (42%).

In either case I see many Americans wanting to violate the 1st or 2nd Amendments and without a healthy respect for the US Constitution.

Then we should probably study it. Otherwise it could well wind up happening. When 3/4s of the population thinks it's a problem, it would be nice to have some proof they're wrong.

 

[test_account]

The more studies proving they don't cause violent behavior, the better. I'm for this bill at face value. Please read the OP before knee-jerking.

I agree with this. I see no problem with doing this research. Doesnt mean that i necessarily will agree with whatever result they conclude from the research, but if they want to do it, i dont see any big problems with it.

 

[KojiKnight]

At this point I WELCOME a government sponsored study. Let them get it out of their system... when the study doesn't come back as conclusive it'll put an end to that right then and there (not that they won't continue to try, but it will greatly derail things).

And if it DOES show a long term negative effect on children it STILL won't change anything because there is already a rating system in place... It's parents that have to buy M rated games for kids, and thus it's the parents that need teaching not the other way around.