They are? My brother in law has one...he's an average joe. Do you mean automatic weapon?
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NRA's solution to Sandy Hook massacre: "armed guards" in every school
- Thread starter Josh7289
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They are? My brother in law has one...he's an average joe. Do you mean automatic weapon?
But then who guards the guard guards?
teruterubozu
Member
The God in classroooms
ElectricBlue187
Member
Not like gun runners who are always honest, well meaning folk.
CharlieDigital
Banned
The police police police.
As stated before, cops at schools didn't stop Columbine.
Schools are big places, the manpower needed to provide a meaningful security presence is pretty significant.
BattleMonkey
Member
Assault rifles are supposed to be automatic, that was the whole point of the name when they were created. Now anything that looks like one and even if semi auto is considered an assault weapon.
Fuck no. I don't want a bunch of armed idiots that think they are guardians in our schools because these shitlords managed to raise enough money to put them there.
Choke on the Magic
Banned
That's what a true assault rifle is. Civilian AR15s are semi auto only.
Yeah, utterly disgusting.
CharlieDigital
Banned
terrdactycalsrock
Member
I understand that they mean well. But school is a place for learning and social activities to take place. I dont think having armed men or women helps out with that kind of atmosphere. Plus, at a certain point you dont solve the potential threat for gun violence with gun violence.
Im all full having a gun to protect yourself with, but you cant have a place guarded 24/7 just because something MIGHT happen. Also, guns shouldnt be allowed near schools at all. What if a wanna be killer gets a job as one of these men? What if a child or teen steals one of these guns?
Im all full having a gun to protect yourself with, but you cant have a place guarded 24/7 just because something MIGHT happen. Also, guns shouldnt be allowed near schools at all. What if a wanna be killer gets a job as one of these men? What if a child or teen steals one of these guns?
Dude Abides
Banned
There's no evidence that played a role in any mass shooter's decision.
Correct...isn't that the aim of these "assault weapons" bans? Semi-automatic rifles?
electricpirate
Member
So who's paying for this again? He's going to get republican's in with putting federal agents into schools?
I mean, it's better than the morons saying that if teachers were all armed we'd be fine, as at least someone with training has a shot of stopping a massacre in progress.
But even if you think you could work out the details, and make this happen, why not still support High capacity magazine/ Assault weapon bans? Wouldn't you want every advantage to go to the people fleeing, and the guard?
Then again, the NRA's goal is to increase gun sales, not to have actual policy debates.
I mean, it's better than the morons saying that if teachers were all armed we'd be fine, as at least someone with training has a shot of stopping a massacre in progress.
But even if you think you could work out the details, and make this happen, why not still support High capacity magazine/ Assault weapon bans? Wouldn't you want every advantage to go to the people fleeing, and the guard?
Then again, the NRA's goal is to increase gun sales, not to have actual policy debates.
Well, considering Adam Lanza offed himself at the first sign of police resistance it makes you wonder...
That's the sickening part. Not one mention of anything else, but go blame movies and video games and get more people with guns on the street! This is when I wish we had some rational dictator that had the power to instantly see through bullshit and shut these people down
Well I'd suggest you learn how to shoot and hunt properly because what you are doing isn't hunting you're just "killing shit."
Because the NRA and its ilk aren't suggesting that a guard here or there will be merely helpful. It's effectively the entirety of their solution.
Armed guards do more to provide an illusion of security than actual security. As CharlieDigital points out, the vast majority of these shooters are going on suicidal rampages. A guard with a gun somewhere on campus isn't going to do much to deter one of these shooters from coming to school.
Less legal guns = less illegal guns. These guns aren't being made by underground gun manufacturers or anything, you know.
All this stuff is sticking a band aid on a knife wound. The NRA isn't ever going to admit that the guns themselves are the problem, obviously. Why they're even in the discussion in the first place is baffling as they're part of the REAL problem - gun culture. We need to make steps away from that.
Posting officers at every school might help a bit, but its not where most of these sorts of shootings take place. Unless their ultimate solution is to have armed guards absolutely EVERYWHERE, which is insane, we need to fix underlying issues.
Mercury Fred
Banned
The NRA should be classified as a domestic terror organization and dealt with thusly.
As horrifying as they are, school shootings are responsible for a vanishingly small number of child deaths. But you know what does kill a lot of kids, and is in fact the second biggest killer of U.S. children? Cancer. How's that health care system coming, NRA supporters?
Oh. Right. Fuck 'em.
Oh. Right. Fuck 'em.
electricpirate
Member
And even if it does, and it means that killers are choosing the softer targets, what happens when you harden all the targets?
They still go and target the softest target, because these aren't rational people making cost benefit decisions.
I don't understand why we even play that semantic game (and it's not like any of these terms are well defined).
You don't want to call an AR-15 an assault weapon?
Fine, let's call it whatever you want.
Can we now discuss if those weapons should be readily available to pretty much everyone with very little safeguards against those weapons getting into the hands of criminals and crazy people?
p.s.
Not that it's particularly relevant, but I'd rather have a mad gunman fire in full auto then single fire.
I don't enjoy that grim math, but the death toll will most likely be lower.
TangoAlphaLima
Member
Not stopping Columbine doesn't mean there was no benefit. And you certainly can't take one isolated incident and extrapolate it to all, your sample size is too small. The Columbine officer could have been Barney Fife for all we know.
Yes, schools are big places. They will need to be on essentially complete lockdown now (a lot were already). Nobody gets in without getting buzzed in through the main doors. The cop is there in case someone slips in hiding a weapon, or if someone threatens the receptionist with a weapon to get buzzed in.
If you've got a better solution, I'd love to hear it. If that solution is to ban all guns in this country, that will never happen.
You might as well be arguing for bow hunting being the only legal form then...
that plan of armed security in all schools is quite the expansion of government...NRA abandoning its conservative ideals for its own welfare? Where is all that money coming from anyway? Probably just take it out of education, right? Not sure how this will stop the problem at malls, movie theaters, Sikh Temples, and everywhere else though. Try again
Most people that have been questioning the 2nd amendment in media that I've been watching and reading is that the founders never intended it to be about access to all these high powered rifles with seeming limitless clips. I personally don't want to see guns banned outright at all, and I'm sure obama feels the same. We really need to have tougher regulation though on those high powered type of guns and the easy access to guns in the gun industry in general. I know a change like that would be intolerable to those who love guns and are active participants in the gun industry but this is an issue that must be addressed and not to leave out mental health issues as well.
BattleMonkey
Member
And almost all high schools and college campuses already have armed police stationed at them nowadays anyways. Is it effective? Course it won't be perfect but probably better than not having a deterrent or something that can potentially help. Why not have a police offer at an elementary school? It's not like a police state and that the cop walks around with an assault rifle in view.
Private security for schools? Yea I don't like that idea seeing how bad many of those security firms can be. But most places already station police in routes near schools already, relocating an officer or two to stay on campus is something that seems worth it. Again they already do this for almost every high school, why not all schools?
But there aren't many places where a mass shooter would actually be challenged, by anything. So it shouldn't be a surprise that that is where most of these shootings occur.
Not that perceived resistance necessarily stops them. Fort Hood can attest to that.
No weapon should be available to everyone and easy to get for criminals. Now, what do you mean by 'those weapons'?
shoplifter
Member
oddly enough when I was 12 and actually did hunt infrequently, I never needed a semi auto. hit it the first shot and problem solved. if you actually need a semi automatic rifle to hunt rabbits, you are terrible and should just quit.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
The ability to kill a half dozen people in the span of less then a minute from twenty feet away is something of a problem, yeah
The joke was that they wouldn't do it if they had to pay for it. Everyone wants everything done but only as long as they're not the ones paying for it. Republicans in general are especially bad with that.
Hari Seldon
Member
Well what percentage of crime is conducted with a semi-auto "mean looking" weapon? Why don't we have some actual math and statistics instead of making law based on how mean looking the gun is?
Expanding government to benefit their pocketbooks IS a conservative ideal.
Handguns are semi-automatic...so are shotguns. Do you want to go back to muskets?
Hari Seldon
Member
Do we really need ANY realistic military shooters?
Account Attempt #4
Member
This is just about how I feel (USA here). They maybe had a chance to put somebody out there to represent the reasonable-minded gun owner base and try to make sense. Instead they lost any chance they had of offering anything constructive to the conversation and narrowed the already razor thin appeal of their position with this BS. If there is any hope of having a constructive conversation about this, you have to abandon the NRA wholesale. Silly me, I had a microscopic sliver of hope they would at least try to make sense given how fast themselves and the Rupublican party are losing ground in this country. I've never understood the NRA, this was their chance to win a slice of my heart and they derp'd big time. Maybe this is par for them, I wouldn't know.
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