Gabe Newell: Big companies won't stay relevant.

EagleBurnn said:
He said that the Windows Store was a "catastrophe" because it would make the whole OS closed source. Lots of journalists (real ones) said that it was a radical statement to only make his new competition look bad, which makes more sense than Microsoft ditching their decades of tradition and closing their OS over a new store competing with Valve.
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More sense than microsoft wanting to take a cut of every piece of software sold for windows?

I don't have the answer, but if it were me, and I was the billionaire MS CEO, I take the gamble because the upside would be E-N-O-R-M-O-U-S


PS they have no problem doing it on the xbox platform, so I'm not sure of what 'tradition' you are speaking of.
 
EagleBurnn said:
He said that the Windows Store was a "catastrophe" because it would make the whole OS closed source. Lots of journalists (real ones) said that it was a radical statement to only make his new competition look bad, which makes more sense than Microsoft ditching their decades of tradition and closing their OS over a new store competing with Valve.
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He didn't specifically refer to the Windows Store itself, though it would be tempting to assume that he was referring to that. Then there's people from Blizzard and Notch himself having similar concerns over Microsoft's new direction.
 
epmode said:
Do you see something wrong with someone trying to disparage their competition in an interview?
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What you're saying isn't exactly objective if your only goal is to make your competition look bad. There isn't anything wrong with it, but such words shouldn't be taken as gospel either.
 
Valnen said:
Nope. Something has to be good to be epic.
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Agreed.

Orayn said:
Ideally, yeah. My point was that the industry is still trying to make "proper epic" games, but the end result is often just overwrought and disappointing.
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Exactly. Companies are trying to convince consumers that they are epic and consumers are throwing it right back in their face like, "NOPE". RE6 is also a great example of this.
 
epmode said:
Do you see something wrong with someone trying to disparage their competition in an interview?
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That's exactly what I'm talking about. That's all he's doing (wishful thinking). You claimed he's never been wrong when he really has. He's saying what he wants to happen so it can be encouraged, not because it's realistic. Common business practice, but I wouldn't go as far as saying he's never been wrong.

Untalkative_Bunny said:
PS they have no problem doing it on the xbox platform, so I'm not sure of what 'tradition' you are speaking of.
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An open source console wasn't even an idea back when the Xbox and 360 were made. It's just now becoming a possibility. If that's a hint MS is going to close their OS, then people who would have said that 10+ years ago when the closed source Xbox was announced would look silly right now and I predict the same will happen to Gaben 10 years from now when Windows is still open.

epmode said:
That would be a stupid thing to say. Valve does dumb stuff from time to time, obviously.
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You're right, you didn't say that (misread). I'm just trying to show that Gaben is talking much more because he's facing the strongest competition he's ever seen, and his right/wrong ration is going to dwindle because of that.
 
I'm not going to say these websites are wrong for making stories out of certain quotes, but you don't get the full meaning unless you listen to the Nerdist podcast. Gabe goes into more detail in the podcast.

He specifically mentions GM in the podcast and how they have lost 350 billion dollars since starting up business in the 1970s. His thought process on these things are a lot deeper than the selective quoting for only a few examples in an article. In fact, after listening to both Nerdist podcasts, I'm pretty amazed at all the things Gabe pays attention too outside of gaming.
 
Mrbob said:
I'm not going to say these websites are wrong for making stories out of certain quotes, but you don't get the full meaning unless you listen to the Nerdist podcast. Gabe goes into more detail in the podcast.

He specifically mentions GM in the podcast and how they have lost 350 billion dollars since starting up business in the 1970s. His thought process on these things are a lot deeper than the selective quoting for only a few examples in an article.
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It's a good listen, the one about Valve as a company anyway. The one about Valve games is terrible. Too many people trying waaay to hard to be funny, talking over Gabe and not letting him finish sentences.


You are right: context is important.
 
PhoReal said:
Exactly. Companies are trying to convince consumers that they are epic and consumers are throwing it right back in their face like, "NOPE". RE6 is also a great example of this.
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The process of making and marketing these games is like trying to blow up a balloon so big that you lose control and helplessly watch it go flying around the room making fart noises. There will be more Medal of Honor: Warfighter, more Hitman: Absolution, more games that fail because they're being designed by committee to check as many boxes as possible and sell themselves on pure hype to a "core" audience that doesn't care.
 
Shining Sunshine said:
Same responsibility to stop the release of a product, but even worse for Valve as Steam is their platform.
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I wasn't talking about responsibility.

And worse for Valve?
1. There is no universe in which EA has a better reputation than Valve.
2. EA spent time and resources developing and bringing the game to market.
 
Orayn said:
The process of making and marketing these games is like trying to blow up a balloon so big that you lose control and helplessly watch it go flying around the room making fart noises. There will be more Medal of Honor: Warfighter, more Hitman: Absolution, more games that fail because they're being designed by committee to check as many boxes as possible and sell themselves on pure hype to a "core" audience that doesn't care.
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I can't help but wonder if Hitman: Absolution and Resident Evil 6 would have been more successful if they were more like their predecessors, and updated to modern standards in less drastic ways. Much like X-COM.

They're checking too many boxes, shoving in stuff in that absolutely doesn't belong and the games ultimately suffer for it. As do sales.
 
fritolay said:
I have been tired of Gabe's talk. So he launched Steam and made some games, has a good track record. The next half life is becoming a joke like Duke Nukem was.

I didn't think someone could top the confusion of the Wii U but here comes a or some random steam boxes for your living room. TV or Big Mode for steam, well how is that different that a PC ported to a console that you can use a keyboard and mouse? If you use a controller, then how is it different still? Does he have a redesigned phantom controller up his sleeve since he says motions controls also suck. He just seems to be talking smack about everything but doesn't have the answers lately.
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It took 6 years for HL2 to come out. And I dont think you know DNF's horrible dev history if you think HL3's is remotely comparable.
 
you see evidence of this everywhere. indie and lower-budget games are becoming more and more popular at such a rapid rate that it makes the big publisher model seem absolutely ridiculous. we're reaching a tipping point where the 60 dollar buy-it-and-trade-it model is obviously antiquated. they'll either adapt (quickly), or they'll crash and burn. it's just not sustainable, what they're doing.
 
blame space said:
you see evidence of this everywhere. indie and lower-budget games are becoming more and more popular at such a rapid rate that it makes the big publisher model seem absolutely ridiculous. we're reaching a tipping point where the 60 dollar buy-it-and-trade-it model is ridiculously antiquated. they'll either adapt (quickly), or they'll crash and burn. it's just not sustainable, what they're doing.
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What about PC games and shareware? Then there was the internet and how anyone could download a demo or a game and play without the publishers, etc.

Atari games, weren't they 50 dollars in the 80's?

I think the industry is just bigger, and there are more options than ever. The biggest thing changing right now is people want to play games on their phones, and they want quick short games while on the crapper or waiting for an appointment. The games that are picked up for this are less than 10 dollars.

If mobile phone games replace consoles, then Gabe is in a bad spot as I previously said. Steam on a PC is not cutting edge and if he has a plan that all the other big players don't have I don't see it at all.

However people still want to play games on big TV screens and surround sound at home instead of their phone, just like they would rather watch NFL with the same setup vs their phone. TV's and surround sound are so much cheaper now and people want media to enjoy them.
 
yeah and Youtube is going to make movies and tv irrelevant. in this grand future, everyone in the country will just watch Pewdiepie and Fred all day instead of Breaking Bad.
 
fritolay said:
What about PC games and shareware? Then there was the internet and how anyone could download a demo or a game and play without the publishers, etc.

Atari games, weren't they 50 dollars in the 80's?

I think the industry is just bigger, and there are more options than ever. The biggest thing changing right now is people want to play games on their phones, and they want quick short games while on the crapper or waiting for an appointment. The games that are picked up for this are less than 10 dollars.

If mobile phone games replace consoles, then Gabe is in a bad spot as I previously said. Steam on a PC is not cutting edge and if he has a plan that all the other big players don't have I don't see it at all.

However people still want to play games on big TV screens and surround sound at home instead of their phone, just like they would rather watch NFL with the same setup vs their phone. TV's and surround sound are so much cheaper now and people want media to enjoy them.
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there's a lot of analogies in this post that are all over the place.
 
i guess, but this industry is unlike any other that's ever existed. you can't compare what's going on currently to atari; and you certainly can't compare it to mobile games priced at a dollar, which is kind of the point.

certain people are still going to want games on their TVs as opposed to their phones, that's obvious. but the money behind these games is going to change drastically.
 
I wonder why Indie games didn't take off more on XBOX Live when this type of discussion comes up.

Then also I think about the middle ground, the games more than 10 dollars but not 60, some of the XBOX Live Arcade games. It really seems like MS tried to cater to each crowd. Yes there is costs for updates and profit sharing, but when before could someone make a game and publish it on a console from their own computer (and test it).
 
listen i don't know if you make some weird distinction like microsoft does between "indie" indie games and shit like minecraft, but minecraft is pretty much the crux of my argument.
 
fritolay said:
I wonder why Indie games didn't take off more on XBOX Live when this type of discussion comes up.

Then also I think about the middle ground, the games more than 10 dollars but not 60, some of the XBOX Live Arcade games. It really seems like MS tried to cater to each crowd. Yes there is costs for updates and profit sharing, but when before could someone make a game and publish it on a console from their own computer (and test it).
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MS made a lot of terrible decisions when it came to indie dev treatment.
 
well let's hope Newell doesn't know what he's talking about because these big companies publish, fund and develop most of a gen's best games.
 
I think there will always be a few large publishers/developers. I mean, look at games like Blops 2 or AC3 and how much they've sold. They'll easily survive the next generation of gaming as long as they have quality IP. People, despite wanting time wasters on their phones, still have a desire for large scale AAA titles.
 
specialguy said:
Sucks for Valve then...

Also, I dont see large companies going out of style in the regular world, so dont see why they would in the games world either.
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Valve remains flexible, and despite their growth of business they haven't invested heavily on needless overhead and expansion to push short term profits and success.

We may see the ebb and wane, but they have that luxury. They can fall out of favor and still be successful. Big companies would just fall flat on a broken business model.
 
I just don't see kick starter supporting triple A games that cost in excess of $50 million. We need the next block buster summer flick as much as we need the quirky indies to have a good balance in gaming.
 
mr2xxx said:
I just don't see kick starter supporting triple A games that cost in excess of $50 million. We need the next block buster summer flick as much as we need the quirky indies to have a good balance in gaming.
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What about everything in between?
 
Just to summarize the thread:

"Ahahahah, that's CRAZY! He's crazy! It can't happen!"

Meanwhile: most of these companies are already losing money year after year.
 
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