Support NeoGAF

[Steve Youngblood]

But I dont have to own a Wii U to point out that complaining about NiN's shittiness and using Miiverse as an example of that doesnt make sense. NiN IS pretty flawed , but not because of Miiverse.

My read on that is that the opinion is that resources were allocated badly. If you listen to Iwata, there was a concession on his part that Nintendo didn't have a chance at making a product that would be competitive to Live, and that they would have spent a lot of time and money chasing that pipe dream while still lagging behind. As such, they needed to concentrate on alternative hooks. It seems that Miiverse was one such innovation they decided to concentrate on.

Given that premise, I don't think it's entirely unfair to surmise that Miiverse has had a detrimental impact on Nintendo's online strategy if you don't personally find the appeal of that particular social networking functionality. After all, the software engineers that worked hard to get Miiverse functionality into the OS were likely the same people that could have implemented some of the traditional networking functionality one might expect on a gaming platform.

But don't mistake this as me stating that you don't have a point at all. It's not entirely clear that they would have ever done anything besides Miiverse. My argument necessitates making a leap that the team of programmers that designed and implemented Miiverse might have been capable of doing other, subjectively more desirable functionality, and this isn't entirely clear.

 

[deviljho]

yet I'm repeating the same thing over and over.

do you want a cookie or something? why should the world change for you?

 

[Dave Meltzer]

do you want a cookie or something? why should the world change for you?

No idea what point you're trying to make here.

 

[deviljho]

No idea what point you're trying to make here.

you don't own one... and you don't like the services... yet you keep "repeating the same thing over and over."

what do you hope to accomplish?

/inbefore - this is a discussion forum

 

[Dave Meltzer]

you don't own one... and you don't like the services... yet you keep "repeating the same thing over and over."

what do you hope to accomplish?

I'm repetig myself because people are telling me my opinion is wrong or they're failing to understand what I'm saying. I don't especially care if people disagree, I just don't want to be misrepresented.

I'm not posting this in the "Post your funny Miiverse Pictures OT" or anything. It's a thread bout the direction of Nintendo under Iwata. I'm under no obligation to like said direction or be a Wii U owner to comment on it.

 

[deviljho]

I'm repetig myself because people are telling me my opinion is wrong or they're failing to understand what I'm saying. I don't especially care if people disagree, I just don't want to be misrepresented.

I'm not posting this in the "Post your funny Miiverse Pictures OT" or anything. It's a thread bout the direction of Nintendo under Iwata. I'm under no obligation to like said direction or be a Wii U owner to comment on it.

believe it or not, you'll never get 100% of people to understand your perspective no matter how often you say it or how clearly. so great, there are features of the Wii U that you believe aren't up to snuff with modern day gaming, etc... Nintendo, Iwata, and Miiverse all that jazz...

 

[Darryl]

One would assume there's a limited amount of time and resources dedicated to Nintendo's online, and that Miiverse was given priority over simply trying to feature match XBL and PSN. So my objection is Iwata's priority to this service which is focusing on accessibility and novelty rather than what I consider to be the essential components of a modern online system. I don't think this is an especially controversial or complicated opinion, yet I'm repeating the same thing over and over.

here's some examples of what I think Miiverse is capable of and could possibly be coming:

• 
  automatically connecting to friends, GAFers (through the community feature coming out), friend's of friends, and similar users, and connecting to them online dynamically in X (the new monolith RPG), similar to an MMO.

• accessing the same users in Pokemon, storing their battle parties and allowing you to fight them as random encounters. integrating them into the actual world without the need for any menus. it could possibly even add them in real time like above, but i think that one is a technical stretch for the gamefreak team.

• visiting the towns of all the above users, allowing them to visit you, having them randomly visit and interact with your towns (although probably not in real time) while you play Animal Crossing.

this is cool online shit to me and the large amounts of integration the system creates opens up cool social aspects that aren't being done in the online space right now. i'd much rather them be doing this shit.

 

[MYE]

My read on that is that the opinion is that resources were allocated badly. If you listen to Iwata, there was a concession on his part that Nintendo didn't have a chance at making a product that would be competitive to Live, and that they would have spent a lot of time and money chasing that pipe dream while still lagging behind. As such, they needed to concentrate on alternative hooks. It seems that Miiverse was one such innovation they decided to concentrate on.

Given that premise, I don't think it's entirely unfair to surmise that Miiverse has had a detrimental impact on Nintendo's online strategy if you don't personally find the appeal of that particular social networking functionality. After all, the software engineers that worked hard to get Miiverse functionality into the OS were likely the same people that could have implemented some of the traditional networking functionality one might expect on a gaming platform.

But don't mistake this as me stating that you don't have a point at all. It's not entirely clear that they would have ever done anything besides Miiverse. My argument necessitates making a leap that the team of programmers that designed and implemented Miiverse might have been capable of doing other, subjectively more desirable functionality, and this isn't entirely clear.

But like you pointed out, its still guesswork. And focusing your complaints on an extra service as if its existence crippled everything else is speculation and brings nothing to the table but pointless what-if scenarios.

Things should be criticized for what they are, not for how well developed something else was (supposedly) instead.

 

[POWERSPHERE]

Iwata is cool as shit.

 

[Dave Meltzer]

here's some examples of what I think Miiverse is capable of and could possibly be coming:

• 
  automatically connecting to friends, GAFers (through the community feature coming out), friend's of friends, and similar users, and connecting to them online dynamically in X (the new monolith RPG), similar to an MMO.

• accessing the same users in Pokemon, storing their battle parties and allowing you to fight them as random encounters. integrating them into the actual world without the need for any menus. it could possibly even add them in real time like above, but i think that one is a technical stretch for the gamefreak team.

• visiting the towns of all the above users, allowing them to visit you, having them randomly visit and interact with your towns (although probably not in real time) while you play Animal Crossing.

this is cool online shit to me and the large amounts of integration the system creates opens up cool social aspects that aren't being done in the online space right now. i'd much rather them be doing this shit.

That's fine. You can disagree and that's all dandy. Personally I think if anything, that stuff should come after simple stuff like pop ups on screen for recieved messages. Things I am familiar with on Steam, PSN and XBL and find the omission of on Nintendo platforms frustrating.

 

[beef3483]

I don't think the blame can entirely land on him, I just think the fundamental idea behind the WiiU is a poor one that was never going to take off. A Wii-like runaway success is a crazy thing to expect to happen, you can't plan your business around doing that repeatedly... hmm, so maybe it is his fault.

Yup, my thoughts as well. The touch screen doesn't have the same allure to me as motion controls did.

 

[Javier]

That's fine. You can disagree and that's all dandy. Personally I think if anything, that stuff should come after simple stuff like pop ups on screen for recieved messages. Things I am familiar with on Steam, PSN and XBL and find the omission of on Nintendo platforms frustrating.

The Wii U does warn you when you get a message or a notification, just not through a pop-up.

 

[deviljho]

Don't have to repeat myself...

/thread

Spoiler

But this was hilarious:

I'm sorry but the gentleman with the anime girl avatar above this post ended this thread. The thread has been ended.

 

[Dave Meltzer]

The Wii U does warn you when you get a message or a notification, just not through a pop-up.

It's done in such a passive way it may as well not even exist. Not to mention I don't think it's an instant alert as soon as a message is sent, although I'm going from second hand info on that so I'm not sure.

 

[Darryl]

That's fine. You can disagree and that's all dandy. Personally I think if anything, that stuff should come after simple stuff like pop ups on screen for recieved messages. Things I am familiar with on Steam, PSN and XBL and find the omission of on Nintendo platforms frustrating.

i don't think you understand. the system is completely capable of doing that. it actually does that all of the time, messages pop up very frequently in NSMB:U and Nintendo Land. nintendo just took a different twist on the online system. it's like the need to explain to non-users why you don't need multitouch. it just doesn't work well. some of the miiverse posters get like 500 likes and 500 responses for one of their messages, why spam your screen with them? i'm sure they'll work out a proper solution eventually, but it's current exclusion is obvious.

 

[Blades64]

Why are people responding to Bera/Meltzer. I mean, I know Bera's funny, but still, people should know not to feed trolls by now.

Seriously, I'm honestly wondering if his account is truly a joke account? Serious question. If it is, then this would be much more understandable, but it's not, the fact that he's still around is really baffling to me...

 

[Dave Meltzer]

i don't think you understand. the system is completely capable of doing that. it actually does that all of the time, messages pop up very frequently in NSMB:U and Nintendo Land. nintendo just took a different twist on the online system. it's like the need to explain to non-users why you don't need multitouch. it just doesn't work well. some of the miiverse posters get like 500 likes and 500 responses for one of their messages, why spam your screen with them? i'm sure they'll work out a proper solution eventually, but it's current exclusion is obvious.

The system may be capable of absolutely everything, but right now its nowhere near as simple and intuitive to communicate with your friends quickly and instantly as it was on XBL in 2006.

 

[Steve Youngblood]

It's done in such a passive way it may as well not even exist. Not to mention I don't think it's an instant alert as soon as a message is sent, although I'm going from second hand info on that so I'm not sure.

Unless something has changed since I last messed with the social networking, it is very passive. All that happens is that the home button lights up. That could mean that one of your friends is online, or it could mean that you've gotten a message on Miiverse (indicated through that icon pulsating).

 

[Cheesecakebobby]

Can't wait for the inevitable shaved-head, hysterically crying youtube apology

 

[Darryl]

Why are people responding to Bera/Meltzer. I mean, I know Bera's funny, but still, people should know not to feed trolls by now.

i think i fell for it, i sort of jumped into the conversation without reading too far back and thought he was being serious.

 

[AzaK]

I don't understand. Iwata was the one that had a hand in the DS and the Wii and they resulted in massive profits the company has never seen before. Now all of a sudden he's incompetent?

It's not all of a sudden. Wii burnt out early and 3 ds started really badly ending in their first ever year loss in gaming. They should have realised these problems and should have realised Wii U was going to get the reception it did. I mean everyone here pretty much saw Wii U as an OK console and didn't expect it to be anything for special.

 

[IrishNinja]

I'm sorry but the gentleman with the anime girl avatar above this post ended this thread. The thread has been ended.

ahaha, this post got me. that's how you do it.

I am guessing Brera is taking advantage of the fact that no one's really looking at this thread

i likewise arrived at this conclusion a few weeks ago, but about ever brera thread

 

[Chaos Theory]

also:



math.



.

ok i laughed at this. :lol

 

[Javier]

Unless something has changed since I last messed with the social networking, it is very passive. All that happens is that the home button lights up. That could mean that one of your friends is online, or it could mean that you've gotten a message on Miiverse (indicated through that icon pulsating).

It's passive, but effective. When the light goes on you just press the Home button and it immediately tells if someone went online (and who did), if you've gotten a reply on Miiverse, or if you've received a notification. The game will be paused and you don't need to exit it while you go check. Haven't tried Wii U Chat yet but I believe you're notified similarly (someone chime in on this).

I certainly prefer it over a pop-up. Hate those things.

 

[Ghost_Protocol]

I'd love to see him go. Nintendo is long overdo for radical change.

 

[Steve Youngblood]

It's passive, but effective. When the light goes on you just press the Home button and it immediately tells if someone went online (and who did), if you've gotten a reply on Miiverse, or if you've received a notification. The game will be paused and you don't need to exit it while you go check. Haven't tried Wii U Chat yet but I believe you're notified similarly (someone chime in on this).

It's the same system, which isn't very effective. One time I saw a flashing light, and just assumed someone came online, or a friend sent me a stupid drawing. By the time I checked five minutes later, I had missed the call to try out Wii Chat.

Personally, I think the far better compromise would be a toggle to allow for popups when enabled, and when disabled use the current system of flashing the home screen icon to unintrusively indicate that something has happened.

 

[ASTROID2]

It's the same system, which isn't very effective. One time I saw a flashing light, and just assumed someone came online, or a friend sent me a stupid drawing. By the time I checked five minutes later, I had missed the call to try out Wii Chat.

Personally, I think the far better compromise would be a toggle to allow for popups when enabled, and when disabled use the current system of flashing the home screen icon to unintrusively indicate that something has happened.

What they need to do is bring back the light up disc slot. You don't even need to use your console or have the TV on to know you got a message. Why they got rid of it I'll never understand.

 

[Javier]

What they need to do is bring back the light up disc slot. You don't even need to use your console or have the TV on to know you got a message. Why they got rid of it I'll never understand.

Seriously. That was awesome. Can't believe they took it out.

 

[Steve Youngblood]

What they need to do is bring back the light up disc slot. You don't even need to use your console or have the TV on to know you got a message. Why they got rid of it I'll never understand.

Yes, that too would be a nice little feature to round out the networking.

 

[prwxv3]

I dont own one. I'm waiting for more personal must-have games to justify the purchase.
I'm informed of how it works through first hand experience and "research" though. Like I always am about devices I'm considering buying.



What about when his ideas result in brilliant games? Like Super Mario Galaxy for example
Defining him over one (subjective) bad call is just silly.

Super Mario Galaxy was one of his projects. I dont want him to interfere in any games that are not his projects like Paper Mario.

 

[Steve Youngblood]

Super Mario Galaxy was one of his projects. I dont want him to interfere in any games that are not his projects like Paper Mario.

As someone who just got a 3DS, I'm curious. What did he do that was so terrible to Paper Mario? I've generally enjoyed that series.

 

[qq more]

As someone who just got a 3DS, I'm curious. What did he do that was so terrible to Paper Mario? I've generally enjoyed that series.

Being too light on the story


it isn't too bad, I've completed the game last night, it isn't great but it's still pretty fun... definitely better than Super Paper Mario... ugh that was a disappointment.

 

[Silent_Ocarina]

As someone who just got a 3DS, I'm curious. What did he do that was so terrible to Paper Mario? I've generally enjoyed that series.

If I understand correctly, Paper Mario: Sticker Star could have been something similar to Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door. However, Miyamoto suggested that story remain less of a priority and that there should only be traditional Mario characters involved.

Something like that.

 

[DaBoss]

If I understand correctly, Paper Mario: Sticker Star could have been something similar to Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door. However, Miyamoto suggested that story remain less of a priority and that there should only be traditional Mario characters involved.

Something like that.

The story would have been deep like Super Paper Mario, but with Club Nintendo surveys not mentioning the story as a standout in the game and Miyamoto said it should be light on story. It wasn't going to be like TTYD in a gameplay sense.

 

[royalan]

My read on that is that the opinion is that resources were allocated badly. If you listen to Iwata, there was a concession on his part that Nintendo didn't have a chance at making a product that would be competitive to Live, and that they would have spent a lot of time and money chasing that pipe dream while still lagging behind. As such, they needed to concentrate on alternative hooks. It seems that Miiverse was one such innovation they decided to concentrate on.

Given that premise, I don't think it's entirely unfair to surmise that Miiverse has had a detrimental impact on Nintendo's online strategy if you don't personally find the appeal of that particular social networking functionality. After all, the software engineers that worked hard to get Miiverse functionality into the OS were likely the same people that could have implemented some of the traditional networking functionality one might expect on a gaming platform.

But don't mistake this as me stating that you don't have a point at all. It's not entirely clear that they would have ever done anything besides Miiverse. My argument necessitates making a leap that the team of programmers that designed and implemented Miiverse might have been capable of doing other, subjectively more desirable functionality, and this isn't entirely clear.

Yep, and the funny thing to me was that it was their own damn fault that having an online system comparable to Live is near impossible (at least at this point). There was an important opportunity years ago for them to start treating online with the respect it deserved, and Iwata was one of the key men in charge who made the choice not to, despite the overwhelming evidence showing that online would only become MORE important to gaming, not less.

Well, you can't whine and throw excuses now. You're behind in what is now a KEY feature in modern gaming and it's your own damn fault. Man, the more I read this thread the more I feel that Iwata should have been gone a long time ago.

 

[Ollie Pooch]

It's passive, but effective. When the light goes on you just press the Home button and it immediately tells if someone went online (and who did), if you've gotten a reply on Miiverse, or if you've received a notification. The game will be paused and you don't need to exit it while you go check. Haven't tried Wii U Chat yet but I believe you're notified similarly (someone chime in on this).

I certainly prefer it over a pop-up. Hate those things.

Except if you're looking at the tv you don't even see the light. Such a terrible notification method.

 

[deviljho]

Well, you can't whine and throw excuses now. You're behind in what is now a KEY feature in modern gaming and it's your own damn fault. Man, the more I read this thread the more I feel that Iwata should have been gone a long time ago.

I don't think he ever "whined" about it.

 

[AniHawk]

For some reason I always thought Pikmin 2 sold terribly, but that seems decent.

Anihawk's LTDs on f-zero/pikmin/star fox are the best thing to come from this thread since brera's weird fucking trolling.

pikmin 2 did about as well as any exclusive game on the gamecube in 2004. if pikmin 3 had been a wii u launch title, it would probably wind up closer to where pikmin 1 is. as it stands, it might get lost in the weird funk where no one wants a wii u and when the software starts hitting... if the system starts selling software.

 

[Esura]

What they need to do is bring back the light up disc slot. You don't even need to use your console or have the TV on to know you got a message. Why they got rid of it I'll never understand.

Cause it's creepy. I was playing on my PS3 one day and the damn thing lit up on me and I thought my Wii was about to die. Also scared the shit of me.

 

[Nintendude712]

What they need to do is bring back the light up disc slot. You don't even need to use your console or have the TV on to know you got a message. Why they got rid of it I'll never understand.

They also got rid of the "Always online" mode. There's no standby mode like the 3DS or the Wii that keeps downloading data over the net. It was such a neat feature.

They might be able to add this functionality through an update, but who knows if they will. And the disk slot light for notifications thing can be addressed via the HOME button.
They could add a standby mode, and have the GamePad stay in sync with the console so when you get a notification the HOME button will glow.

What about the battery? You could keep it in the stand or charging like a 3DS.

OT: I like Iwata, and I hope for the best. Iwata is such a great, honest, and wise man imo. All this Iwata hate makes me sick. :/

 

[Brera]

Their online strategy is Iwata's fault too by the sounds of it.

His Nintendo has no confidence "we can't compete with live". It's not about competing, it's about providing the basics! An account system is not complicated. Hell, their system is complicated as fuck!

I miss the Nintendo that traded blow for blow.

If Iwata wants to save his job as well as the other items i've listed earlier, he needs to:

1. Cancel Pikmin 3
2. Sack Miyamoto or at least curb his influence on shit thats none of his goddam business
3. Sack Reggie in a very humiliating way, maybe on Youtube. We need to rebalance.
4. Strong NOA that has it's own set of devs, making games that appeal to dudebro little jimmys.

 

[Freezie KO]

pikmin 2 did about as well as any exclusive game on the gamecube in 2004. if pikmin 3 had been a wii u launch title, it would probably wind up closer to where pikmin 1 is. as it stands, it might get lost in the weird funk where no one wants a wii u and when the software starts hitting... if the system starts selling software.

If Pikmin 3 is a casualty of all their poor planning and fumbling around with the Wii U, I'm going to be very sad. I'm amazed and pleased we're getting the game at all. But I don't want it to be bittersweet like Sin and Punishment 2, where we get this great title and then the franchise croaks.

 

[Terra]

I like Iwata, and I hope for the best. Iwata is such a great, honest, and wise man imo. All this Iwata hate makes me sick. :/

Iwata & Reggie is doing the best they can. There is a lot of hate and I don't think they deserve that. However, there is someone @ the big N that is not doing the homework.

 

[AniHawk]

If Pikmin 3 is a casualty of all their poor planning and fumbling around with the Wii U, I'm going to be very sad. I'm amazed and pleased we're getting the game at all. But I don't want it to be bittersweet like Sin and Punishment 2, where we get this great title and then the franchise croaks.

sin & punishment 2 should have never happened, and somehow it did. i heard somewhere that the first game did extremely well on vc in america- and why not? it was pent-up demand from over a generation of wanting to play the game, even after several n64 projects had found themselves cubeside.

and not only did it come out, but it had a commercial, voice acting, online leaderboards- the works. they didn't just slap some shit together and call it a day (the although the acting is questionable at best, but this is nintendo here). and it went on to sell about 60,000 units. maybe 100,000 worldwide.

 

[Darryl]

Cause it's creepy. I was playing on my PS3 one day and the damn thing lit up on me and I thought my Wii was about to die. Also scared the shit of me.

same, i thought it was an error message and my console was freaking out for the longest time. i'm only now finding out about that feature in this thread

 

[Brera]

Iwata & Reggie is doing the best they can. There is a lot of hate and I don't think they deserve that. However, there is someone @ the big N that is not doing the homework.

"doing the best they can" is not good enough.

These assclowns are running a 100 year old multi billion dollar company. A leader in its field. The IBM of gaming. They're leading it down a dead end alley.

They given us an answer to a question no wants answering.

 

[Glass Rebel]

sin & punishment 2 should have never happened, and somehow it did. i heard somewhere that the first game did extremely well on vc in america- and why not? it was pent-up demand from over a generation of wanting to play the game, even after several n64 projects had found themselves cubeside.

and not only did it come out, but it had a commercial, voice acting, online leaderboards- the works. they didn't just slap some shit together and call it a day (the although the acting is questionable at best, but this is nintendo here). and it went on to sell about 60,000 units. maybe 100,000 worldwide.

Well, the acting was very... special in the original as well. Probably didn't want to alienate fans

 

[Terra]

"doing the best they can" is not good enough.

These assclowns are running a 100 year old multi billion dollar company. A leader in its field. The IBM of gaming. They're leading it down a dead end alley.

They given us an answer to a question no wants answering.

I would give Wii U a year before I would count it out.

 

[mclem]

Exclusive photo of your 3DS friendly attire.

Why's he putting an ice cube tray down his trousers?

 

[mclem]

monster's excite games were pretty badass. they could probably make an f-zero that's fun to play (that concept might anger fans of the series, but having a fun racing game isn't a bad thing).

next-level seems to know their stuff too.

I wonder if Sumo would be up for it. Nintendo's got a reasonable relationship with Sega, they could put in a good word