Destructoid: PS4 controller prototype & devkit photo, [Up: New Photo/Info In OP]
- Thread starter gofreak
- Start date
Byakuya769
Member
I keep seeing shit like this, and it makes me want to move for a civil order for compelled institutionalization.
A big ass touch screen controller that makes you look away from your expensive hdtv is not the same as a generally traditional controller with a small touch pad in the middle.
It's like arguing for bias because someone went out and purchased a flat screen LCD but expressed deep disinterest in old school projector big screen televisions.
This is only step one of Sony's grand marketing plan.
Well it worked because they sold me on the d-pad.
pharmboy044
Member
Exactly. I think Sony's figured out that you can't have two screens for the user to pay attention to.
A clickable touchpad could have a lot of uses that doesn't take away from the user experience.
ibun
Member
it depends on how you develop or rather how you intend devs to use it. if its a gimmick you dont have to rely on, there is nothing speaking against it, well if the size is as small as the the touchpad (like the pic posted earlier). a big wiiu style pad is too much, especially if it shows exactly the same as on your tv set, then its distracting
Refreshment.01
Member
No sir i did not. But back to my original point, can you or any of the gentleman here give an example of what im asking?
But my sweet sugar biscuit don't get mad, did you saw to what i was replying to? That sh!t flies perfectly with you yet my claim in jest offends you. Seems its an issue with the poster not what is posted.
Let me explain, these guys (to who the reply was intended) wanted a touch screen in the Dual Shock, not a touch pad. As soon as you put a screen in there the focus of attention is divided, the Wii U got a lot of sh!t for it. Do you understand now? Nothing wrong with a touchpad in there, as a matter of fact im disputing chances are that's what will get since the surface click makes more sense that way. Plus they still have the Vita to leverage any useful dual screen gaming that Somy might come up with/or want to copy.
That's what move was for
pharmboy044
Member
Yeah, hopefully it's not relegated to gimmick applications.
Boss Man
Member
I'd love it if that GT post was true and the pad doubles as a low-tech screen to display UI elements and the like, but trying my best not to expect it.
For the record, I don't have anything against Nintendo exploring with "new ways to play" and I don't think the GamePad was a bad idea. I'm not particularly fond of how big the controller becomes as a result, but that's totally a personal opinion.
You're just being defensive though. It should be obvious to anyone that these are two completely different scenarios, and to perceive it like "Well, this one has a touch screen and that one has a touch screen so they're the same!" is being purposefully simple to make things fit the view you want to have of the situation.
The Sixaxis technology was rather finicky in my experience. It just didn't work well enough, and turned out to be more of a struggle than it was worth for games that tried to implement it. The idea of it wasn't bad though, for instance in Warhawk it made perfect sense. You gain an extra axis for control, which has huge gameplay implications. I'm sure there are a ton of other ways it could be implemented, like peeking around corners in Killzone. I don't think its applications were explored very much because Sixaxis just wasn't precise enough. That's where the position tracking could come in. It's basically a one-to-one, perfectly functioning version of Sixaxis as far as I'm seeing it. That could actually provide some useful capabilities. I like the thought of that, but not so much the thought of that ugly light being at the top of the controller. I'm playing wait-and-see on this.
No, because the shit that was directed at the Wii U's GamePad would not apply to a small novelty screen that is only there to display small UI elements and does not interfere with the controller's design or the entire scheme of the games on the console.
For the record, I don't have anything against Nintendo exploring with "new ways to play" and I don't think the GamePad was a bad idea. I'm not particularly fond of how big the controller becomes as a result, but that's totally a personal opinion.
You're just being defensive though. It should be obvious to anyone that these are two completely different scenarios, and to perceive it like "Well, this one has a touch screen and that one has a touch screen so they're the same!" is being purposefully simple to make things fit the view you want to have of the situation.
Again, you're playing Texas sharpshooter here. These companies are all working within the same industry and trying to capitalize on the same technology and trends. Would you say that Nintendo copied Sony and Microsoft by making an HD console?
Byakuya769
Member
Same deal. The pic ThisWreckage showed had a tiny screen and quick xmb access. That's not the same as "-prompt - 'look at mario on your control pad now! ! ! !'" And the controller is still a small traditional controller with the focus on the main screen, not silly asynchronous play options.
Graphics Horse
Member
A first person brawler with ducking and dodging. Or a game like Tumble where you're manipulating objects in 3D space. Identifying where each player is sitting in a camera based party game. I don't think it's going to do anything better than what Move could do, or be more suitable, but it's just another option which is cheap to implement assuming they were bundling a camera in there already.
I just like how many possibilities open up with this controller. There's traditional means, touch, and motion, but none have to be separated from the other. This is why it's so good. If it were just a touch pad, or just a movie want, or just a controller, then people whine and cry that it's too cumbersome to use two different devices in conjunction, but when they're physically combined it opens up many new doors.
Refreshment.01
Member
No, a small screen like that is just castrating the potential of the concept. Or you go big like Nintendo did or don't bother. Even with all the features the Upad has, Nintendo in more than 2 years hasn't been able to show one single groundbraking use for the screen already. Having an even less functional and smaller screen in the Dual Shock would do sh!t, except for the novelty of it.
Let's see what logic you come up with to sustain your claims after i have given you a real life example to back up my pov.
TimeEffect
Member
I love the idea of a touchscreen acting as the OS UI. So much more sexier to have your friends list, messaging, notifications, etc. on your controller Just a cheap, simple screen with single touch capabilities.
But Im not complaining either way. It sounds like a great feature solely because it is extra, needed input. I am most interested in extra buttons and precision capabilities. Really hope Sony makes the best of it
Also, what is the rumour about the back? Sure hope we get a scroll button and Move triggers. Those were close to Gamecube style
But Im not complaining either way. It sounds like a great feature solely because it is extra, needed input. I am most interested in extra buttons and precision capabilities. Really hope Sony makes the best of it
Also, what is the rumour about the back? Sure hope we get a scroll button and Move triggers. Those were close to Gamecube style
PlayStation Camera tracks your controller & your head gets the exact 3D position from the real world & the PS4 use that data in the game so if it's something coming from behind you in the game they can make it sound like it's coming from behind you in the real world & if it's on your left or right they can make it sound like it's coming from your left or right.
TimeEffect
Member
I dont see the point of Move sensors on this unless the controller can somehow split apart.
Would love to have a Move nav controller bundled, how expensive is that?
Edit: Ohh lkkkng these 3D sound capabilities. Sound immersiveness is underrated
Would love to have a Move nav controller bundled, how expensive is that?
Edit: Ohh lkkkng these 3D sound capabilities. Sound immersiveness is underrated
Boss Man
Member
What real life example did you provide for what argument exactly? The only real statement you made is:
Which has absolutely no basis in anything. Why can't you have a small touch screen that functions for navigation conveniences and nothing else? I like that idea a lot, because I don't necessarily want my games to be focused on using a touch screen, but for menu navigation and UI uses there's no harm in it whatsoever.
Which is fine by me. Again, I don't want a touch screen whose purpose is to be used for gameplay mechanics. That doesn't mean that I wouldn't like a small, completely inconsequential method for more conveniently navigating UIs. Saying that this screen shouldn't be expected to provide anything more groundbreaking than what the Wii U GamePad has is fine, but I don't think anyone is even considering that and you still haven't said why "...you go big like Nintendo or don't bother."
Regardless, the reality of the situation is that this is probably just a touch pad and will be used for gameplay gimmicks. At the very least, I hope this pad (be it a screen or not) is used mostly for UI purposes and not forced into gameplay mechanics. The former (with a screen or not) sounds very cool and useful, while the latter would be aggravating for either case.
ibun
Member
why would one need it to navigate the ui. i am still a big fan of the xmb and hope it stays and gets rid of those bloatware (dead icons, tv stuff, vidzone,), but its still easy and fast (well not so fast if you have 2000mp3s on and several hundred pictures). ok i came to realize by writing, it would be faster to flick through those pictures. if you have a reasonable amount of media, just clicking is also fine.
Boss Man
Member
Yeah, you're essentially gaining a track pad like a laptop has which would be pretty damn liberating. Not to mention the keyboard issue with traditional controllers would be greatly remedied. Outside of the practical uses there, I think there could be some really cool novelty features involved with it too - especially if it is indeed a screen of some sort.
Adding move compatibility is worth the price and 'gimmick' labels just if we get a Tumble 2. That was godly in 3D
And we shouldn't compare with sixaxis. If you're familiar with wiiU or Vita motion controls, that is way more responsive and accurate.
I think they'll still sell move wands and nav controllers for things like sports champions etc.
Refreshment.01
Member
Thanks for taking the time gentlemen (^o^)
The only way i would see the absolute postioning working for a dual handed controller for something like pointing or manipulating objects in 3d space, is if Sony designed the controller with a similar design concept as the N64 one. With that controller one hand could easily sustain the controller with an even distribution of weight. That would've also benefit the use of the trackpad since one hand steadily held the controler while the other manipulates the surface.
The rest of 3D sound has been more or less ubiquitous in todays games for years as long as the user has the proper set up.
In case i did not understand you correctly, would you please give it another shot? Im really interested in this thing.
Ok, of your examples the one really practical was the one about tracking several players postion in fornt of the camera. As for manipulating objects in a 3D enviroment a one handed set up is the optimal way to do it, not the implementation as it is with the DS4.
The only way i would see the absolute postioning working for a dual handed controller for something like pointing or manipulating objects in 3d space, is if Sony designed the controller with a similar design concept as the N64 one. With that controller one hand could easily sustain the controller with an even distribution of weight. That would've also benefit the use of the trackpad since one hand steadily held the controler while the other manipulates the surface.
I dont quite understand you here. Are you sugesting sounds coming from the build in speaker? In that case there's no need for absolute postioning since the controller in most cases is always in front of the player. Also using the build in speaker fits better when the controller is phycally asociated with an object in the game world, for example the sounds a gun makes when reloading or the ring of a smart phone. That's how basically the pseudo 3D sound positioning worked in the Wii Remote.
The rest of 3D sound has been more or less ubiquitous in todays games for years as long as the user has the proper set up.
In case i did not understand you correctly, would you please give it another shot? Im really interested in this thing.
I doubt it will split apart. I really dont get how the Move functionality will work (if thats what it is). It certainly doesn't look like you can hold the DS4 like the Move or Wii-mote for motion-gaming. Itll be very interesting to see exactly how that is going to work or if it is even what we think it is.
Iacobellis
Junior Member
I also had a dream a week or two ago of the PlayStation Meeting.
Kaz walks on stage, starts talking about the PS4, and then pulls the new DualShock out from his inside coat pocket. It looked like a DS3 but had a small (3 inch?) OLED screen where the usual Select and Start buttons are.
Hi i'm Caleb
Member
Yes I do want this.
Boss Man
Member
I'm assuming that it will work as an actually functioning version of Sixaxis, which as I said earlier isn't a bad idea but personally I wouldn't choose the reward for that ugly ass light. I guess I'm being a little superficial there though.
The idea of tracking the player in 3D space could also prove useful. What the other poster said about sound would be really cool. Sound is a sorely overlooked aspect of immersion and a trick like that could be a pretty great little ninja feature. I'm also really liking that speaker (is it a speaker or a mic?) on the controller if it will be used like I'm imagining. Again, clever use of sound can go a whole lot further than what most people realize.
In any case, I'm sure we won't really understand the whole picture until Wednesday.
TimeEffect
Member
yup sound is huge
It's still useful to have better tracking of a two handed controller...but you could use it as a one-handed point and shoot thing if you wanted. A one-hand overhand grip by the middle would be comfortable, keep the LED in view of the camera, and give you access to the touchpad and click in the middle. Having Move embedded will also allow the controller to serve as a standard, interactive, AR marker.
Will be interesting to see how they demo it initially, but those are a couple of ideas.
I think they will be keeping Move around though, either as a required prop for certain games, or as a more intuitive alternative to the regular pad.
edit - and yeah, the sound thing too could be interesting - knowing where the speaker on the controller is in 3D space, and relative to your head, could let them do some neat things.
RadarScope1
Member
Goofy Kaz image aside, I like this mock-up. I like everything we're seeing so far. I hope the final design is a little more unified and elegant (like this image).Okay...
Nothing fancy
FOUR more days.
No need to port it, Civ is perfectly suited for Gaikai. Could even run more smoothly in the end game.
Play it via PS4, PS3, Vita, Browser or inspect your cities with your mobile phone.
But don't charge per hour then!
Its good but I'm not a huge fan of all that flat glass surface.
Giant Panda
Member
They absolutely need to add a 2nd analog to an updated Move though.
That's what makes the D-pad better for even some 3D titles, though. It's exactly where you want to go rather than a little bit off to the side, and 100% immediately rather than losing 3 or 6 frames in the tenth of a second it takes you to travel through the deadzone and lower ranges.
There's a reason why KB/M rather than stick/mouse is the standard for PC titles.
anonymous_abc
Member
That mockup makes it look like that third party controller that's an SNES controller inside of a 360 style pad or whatever.
Because people are afraid of change and stick/mouse would require a rather cumbersome setup.
Because people are afraid of change and stick/mouse would require a rather cumbersome setup.
No I'm saying they will use the location of the controller to place you in the 3D world so that they will know how to deliver the sound to your sound system or headset to make you feel like the sounds are really in the room with you & coming from the same place in the game.
Also the controller might be used to track your head using ultrasound to track your headset.
From the Patent:
"SOUND LOCALIZATION FOR USER IN MOTION
Abstract Methods, apparatus, and computer programs for simulating the source of sound are provided. One method includes operations for determining a location in space of the head of a user utilizing face recognition of images of the user. Further, the method includes an operation for determining a sound for two speakers, and an operation for determining an emanating location in space for the sound, each speaker being associated with one ear of the user. The acoustic signals for each speaker are established based on the location in space of the head, the sound, the emanating location in space, and the auditory characteristics of the user. In addition, the acoustic signals are transmitted to the two speakers. When the acoustic signals are played by the two speakers, the acoustic signals simulate that the sound originated at the emanating location in space. "
This is interesting. So it's not just about the line of sight on the TV that dictates the surround audio - the audio is now placed in relation to X, Y and Z axis of where the player is sitting. Interesting.
Whiskeymatt
Member
I hope that those analogue sticks are on the final model, they look so much better than the ones on the DS3.
Along with the extra shoulder buttons.
Red Chocobo
Banned
And yet another winner.
Ha! Wouldn't that be some shit?