how much does it afflict you that next-gen (3DS/VITA/WIIU) is struggling so much?

darkside31337 said:
The Wii was an innovative piece of technology with a huge draw to consumers.

The Wii U doesn't have that.
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So now that the goal posts have moved let's counter what you're currently saying. The Wii U is an innovative piece of technology. It hasn't found its software that shows people why they need it. Will it? I don't know. Could it? Yes it could.

If people think that the Xbox 3 and PS4 are going to just do well because there is all of this "pent up demand" for "REAL consoles" are fooling themselves. I think we're going to see a smaller market all the way around.
 
It surprises me that those 3 are considered "next-gen". Assuming that the majority (not everyone) of consumers judge by the leap in graphics and gameplay possibilities.
 
73V3N said:
And those will struggle even worse.
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3DS and Vita are more direct competitors with the mobile market. That market affecting them makes some sense. The Wii U is a marketing disaster coupled with lack of support, hype, or quality titles.

PS4/Xbox will not be in direct competition with the mobile market. Will it affect them to some degree? Sure. But not like the handhelds. Both will likely be plenty successful so long as they stay the course.
 
Yup the PS4 and 720 are not gonna sell any more then the WiiU in its first few months plus they will be going directly against each other its gonna be very hard to move units. 3DS, Vita and WiiU came out with out going up against another new system at the same time and they had a hard time.
 
73V3N said:
Explain the Wii please.
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At the time, the Wii offered a new, novel experience that was simple, obvious to grasp and fun for a large number of people. It has nothing to do with consumers being stupid.

The Wii U does not do this.
 
Gannd said:
So now that the goal posts have moved let's counter what you're currently saying. The Wii U is an innovative piece of technology. It hasn't found its software that shows people why they need it. Will it? I don't know. Could it? Yes it could.

If people think that the Xbox 3 and PS4 are going to just do well because there is all of this "pent up demand" for "REAL consoles" are fooling themselves. I think we're going to see a smaller market all the way around.
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Sorry but its not. Sales indicate that. People got the Wii when it came out. The hook of the Wii U is not even in the same stratosphere as what the Wii was. If the hook isn't there at launch then when is it coming?

I think the overall market will shrink this generation but that doesn't necessarily mean that the PS4 or the 720 are going to less systems than their predecessors.
 
netBuff said:
I'm sorry to tell you this, but the 3DS isn't doing all that great - as is evidenced by the continuing sales decline in most markets as well as the lack of meaningful support by major publishers.
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The 3DS, at this point, has sold 30m in all territories in two years. How the fuck is that not all that great? And, with the kinds of sales numbers that Nintendo puts up, I'd be willing to be that they don't give a shit about meaningful support by major publishers.
 
I had a thread locked for suggesting that the 360 had struggled outside the US (suspect thats what the juniouring was from too).

Am not sure how the 3DS is struggling when its shown consistent strength since mid 2012 in mainland Europe and had a fantastic holiday whilst in Japan its pretty much dominating the gaming landscape; yet the 360 is fine in being irrelevant in one of the biggest gaming markets in the world and has struggled to fight a very weak Sony mostly it seems because of branding and Live - two highly important elements going into next gen.

Anyway; Vita isn't struggling, its a bad product aimed at a market that doesn't exist outside a very niche form. WiiU is struggling. 3DS is not struggling and will likely start dealing with the issues it does have this year; there are no signs to suggest that software won't have a big effect on sales so suggesting its struggling is rather short-sighted.

Just my thoughts.
 
jmizzal said:
Yup the PS4 and 720 are not gonna sell any more then the WiiU in its first few months plus they will be going directly against each other its gonna be very hard to move units. 3DS, Vita and WiiU came out with out going up against another new system at the same time and they had a hard time.
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Wii U has had a very poor first few months. PS4 and 720 should easily out-perform it if priced well.
 
Xpliskin said:
It surprises me that those 3 are considered "next-gen". Assuming that the majority (not everyone) of consumers judge by the leap in graphics and gameplay possibilities.
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Please don't put this "next-gen" argument on the table once again. It is not the issue here.

And no, the reason why WiiU seems to fail is not its power. And no, PS4 won't blow everything else out of the water because it is so powerful.
 
Phoenician_Viking said:
Let him dream. It´s his wishful thinking that the PS4 and Durango struggle so he can blame the economy for shitty WiiU sales or he can always say that console sales are shrinking.
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This user always scares me, i don't know if he really is this way or if he is one of those "funny" characters.
 
Xpliskin said:
It surprises me that those 3 are considered "next-gen". Assuming that the majority (not everyone) of consumers judge by the leap in graphics and gameplay possibilities.
Click to expand...

How can you have both of those things come out of your fingers and not realize that you are saying two conflicting things. I am going to have to bail out of this thread before the stupidity gets me banned.

Leap in graphics and gameplay possibilities. How the hell can you say that the Wii U, 3DS and Vita do not offer both of those things? Because the Xbox 3 and PS4 will be more powerful? That didn't work out in prior generations. Both the Xbox and GameCube were more powerful than the PS2. The Xbox 360 and PS3 are much more powerful than the Wii and they didn't sell 100 million units.

Gameplay possibilities? Well, the Wii U has that in spades.

my%20head%20hurts.jpg
 
73V3N said:
Explain the Wii please.
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Non-traditional gamers enjoyed Wii Bowling with friends. That doesn't make them stupid.

The success of the Transformers movies makes a much better case for mass idiocy than the Wii does. Nothing wrong with the Wii from those people's perspectives. It gave them exactly what they wanted: a Wii Sports machine. That they enjoyed a Wii Sports machine with friends and family doesn't make them stupid.
 
If 3DS is struggling, all the other consoles will do. I can't see PS4 or Xbox selling 30M consoles in the first two years. So many people should rethink what they mean by "struggling".
 
Kyoufu said:
Wii U has had a very poor first few months. PS4 and 720 should easily out-perform it if priced well.
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I could see supply constraints limiting both consoles as they try to get enough ready for the holidays.

And I mean actual ones, not like Nintendo lying about the Wii U selling out.
 
Gannd said:
"meaningful support by major publishers alone" I guess you mean western support? Western publishers have never really "meaningfully supported" handhelds. They haven't for years. The support has come from Japan. I don't understand how people have such a skewed view of the world that really doesn't lineup with reality.
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Sheroking said:
I mean, really, what "meaningful support" from Western publishers did the DS, Gameboy Advance or even the Gameboy Color have?
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Gannd said:
None. Even the GameBoy back in the day didn't have "meaningful support" from western developers.
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The DS clearly had much more publisher backing, something the 3DS barely enjoys. Even compared to the levels of "western" support on the DS, Nintendo's current handheld is doing badly.

Gannd said:
So now that the goal posts have moved let's counter what you're currently saying. The Wii U is an innovative piece of technology. It hasn't found its software that shows people why they need it. Will it? I don't know. Could it? Yes it could.

If people think that the Xbox 3 and PS4 are going to just do well because there is all of this "pent up demand" for "REAL consoles" are fooling themselves. I think we're going to see a smaller market all the way around.
Click to expand...

Innovation as an end in itself is pointless and doesn't help anyone. I don't see much "innovation" in the Wii U anyway, seems more like a novelty that hasn't captured the imagination of the public.
 
So from what I got from this thread is...

Wii U is a failure, it's not innovation and it's Nintendo screwed up.

3DS is apparently struggling

Vita is doomed

PS4/720 will do much better than Wii U, even though nobody has proof of anything, and who knows by the end of the year, WiiU/Vita will pick up sales as well as PS4/720.
 
Almost all systems struggle out of the gate. The success of the Wii has seemed to create a false reality among many people here. If you're an early adopter, you ride it out like you've always had to do with new hardware.
 
I should have put "compared to last gen" in the opening post.

that's my whole premise: this generation is struggling a lot compared to last (the one ending) generation, not only in the sales department, in many areas.

nobody is calling the 3DS a failure, nobody is saying it will die, but it has had its share of big difficulties and like I've said several times already, compared to DS, it just doesn't live up to it.*

EDIT: *not yet.
 
3DS is going to handidly sell more hardware then either ps4 and durango, so if 3DS level sales is stumbling, then those two will be comatose in comparison.
 
To me, the industry as a whole is probably more popular than it was when the Wii/360/PS3 gen started. There are more people playing games now than ever before.

What happened, however, is a massive fragmentation of the market. The onset of the iPhone and iPad, the FTP and $0.99 games, basically changed the landscape of video games. You don't have to buy a $200+ handheld to enjoy games in your hand. You have a phone? Here's Angry Birds. Have fun.

Likewise, you have a PC? You have Facebook? Here's Castleville. Have fun.

Now, obviously, for most of us on GAF we're more "hardcore" gamers, and even that term has changed in this gen.

Bottom line: games are part of the mainstream culture now. People wear Angry Bird t-shirts ffs. It doesn't mean those same people are going to shell out $500+ for a PS4 and the next high def FPS.
 
73V3N said:
Explain the Wii please.
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What about it? It had an instant system seller in Wii Sports. The new control scheme was fresh and grabbed consumers that may have never been interested in gaming before. Then you have its pricing sweet spot. And it had a brilliant advertising strategy. The Wii U doesn't have any of that going for it.
 
LCfiner said:
At the time, the Wii offered a new, novel experience that was simple, obvious to grasp and fun for a large number of people. It has nothing to do with consumers being stupid.

The Wii U does not do this.
Click to expand...

Exactly right. On top of that, the Wii also released in 2006, before the iPhone/iPad. Post mobile market explosion, large sections of the casual market that flocked to the Wii is satisfied elsewhere.

The end result is that Nintendo released a less compelling machine and are forced to sell to a smaller audience at the same time.
 
ffdgh said:
Hmm I don't think 3ds belongs with the other 2....anymore anyway.
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Why? It's still struggling in western territories, it's just not doing Wii U and Vita numbers. Those two systems are bombing so hard that they're making everything else look great.
 
I like how the OP sneaked the WiiU to next gen PS4 and Durango.

Mpl90 said:
Despite 3DS is still actually having some difficulties especially in US (but it has a big lineup saleswise incoming, so...), it seems quite exaggerated to put it in the same category of Vita and Wii U right now, just saying.
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Except for the 3DS is selling much less than Nintendo´s expectation on both software and hardware. The 3DS has been under-performing since its inception. But please continue to say the opposite what Nintendo is expecting the 3DS to sell.
 
73V3N said:
I was talking about the "7 years late to current gen" thing.
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Yeah, there isnt just one market for Wii U.

Wii U doesn't connect with a lot of gamers because it is a new $350 console behind the tech curb.

It fails with the Wii Sports crowd because it seemingly isn't even trying to cater to them at all.
 
LCfiner said:
At the time, the Wii offered a new, novel experience that was simple, obvious to grasp and fun for a large number of people. It has nothing to do with consumers being stupid.

The Wii U does not do this.
Click to expand...

Well...You could say the same thing about PS4/720 if you wanted...
 
3DS already sold around 30milion units and will have two of the biggest handheld franchises released (Pokemon and MH4) this year among other popular software like the western release of Animal Crossing. It´s doing quite well.

While PSV barely sold 4m units so far and already close to beeing surpassed by the 3 months old WiiU. So it actually makes little sense to lump them together.
 
SolidSnakex said:
What about it? It had an instant system seller in Wii Sports. The new control scheme was fresh and grabbed consumers that may have never been interested in gaming before. And it had a brilliant advertising strategy. Then you have its pricing sweet spot. The Wii U doesn't have any of that going for it.
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And that's exactly my point, it's "late to the PS2/GC/Xbox gen" (if we go by technology like the post i quoted) and it didn't fail.
 
Phoenician_Viking said:
I like how the OP sneaked the WiiU to next gen PS4 and Durango.



Except for the 3DS is selling much less than Nintendo´s expectation on both software and hardware. The 3DS has been under-performing since its inception. But please continue to say the opposite what Nintendo is expecting the 3DS to sell.
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Yeah, if Nintendo is aiming for 150M, selling 130M means 3DS is bombing.
Lol, video game industry is dead with that kind of thinking.
 
netBuff said:
The DS clearly had much more publisher backing, something the 3DS barely enjoys. Even compared to the levels of "western" support on the DS, Nintendo's current handheld is doing badly.
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The big difference between the DS and the 3DS in publisher support is that a lot of the junkware has been moved into the mobile space. A lot of the "bite sized games" have moved into the mobile space. But, if you want fantastic traditional handheld games the 3DS has that in spades.
Innovation as an end in itself is pointless and doesn't help anyone. I don't see much "innovation" in the Wii U anyway, seems more like a novelty that hasn't captured the imagination of the public.
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If you don't see any innovation with the Wii U there is nothing more to say. There is more innovation in the Wii U than the PS4. What we are going to get from the PS4 is even better looking and even more cinematic "interactive experiences" and even better looking and even more cinematic games that we have had this generation.

You cannot like the Wii U and that's perfectly fine. No one will argue with that opinion. But, saying the Wii U isn't innovative is silly. It is innovative. Innovation doesn't equal success.
 
Sadly, I don't consider Wii U next gen. I think the court of public opinion agrees. It does not afflict me that 3DS, Vita, and Wii U are struggling.. I'd like it if they were doing better, but I question the direction of all of them and so it doesn't afflict me.

I also don't consider their relative failures to be any mark against the PS4 or X-Box, or upcoming Steamboxes, or anything else. I think they're failures on their own right.
 
73V3N said:
But
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Don't try to have them be logically consistent. They cannot do it. There is a visceral hate, distrust, loathing, malaise or whatever we want to call it when it comes to Nintendo and movement gamers. They will never be logical.
 
I see the ps4 and next xbox struggling after the launch phase due to price and competition with each other and existing consoles. What happens after that I don't know. I personally believe all three (Wii U, ps4, xbox) will be 'fine' in time.
 
73V3N said:
And that's exactly my point, it's "late to the PS2/GC/Xbox gen" (if we go by technology like the post i quoted) and it didn't fail.
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Because Nintendo figured out a new strategy. They disconnected themselves from the core gamer mindset that they had with the Gamecube and targeted a new audience. The result was them grabbing lots of new consumers. They haven't been able to grab those same consumers with the Wii U. Nintendo Land is nowhere near as appealing as Wii Sports. You didn't need to explain Wii Sports to people. Just hand them a Wiimote and they basically knew what to do.

Then you have their core gamer issue. They've failed to really grab their attention with the titles current available. Stuff coming up like the WW Remake, 3D Mario, Mario Kart, SSB and X will certainly grab their attention, but Sony and MS will likely have their consoles on the market by that time. And that of course opens up another problem for Nintendo.
 
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