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[Four_Chamber]

Won't affect me at all. It's better for publishers and I'm all for anything that will buck the trend of publishers closing left and right. I don't participate in this second hand market at all.

 

[2+2=5]

Sounds good imo.

 

[chickdigger802]

Who actually trades in games at retail? You get barely a fraction of the price you can get just merching it off normally.

Hmmmm...

I'm just glad I don't sell my games anyways...

 

[famousmortimer]

Retailers win

Publishers win

We trade in the way we used to.

Except for those of us who are actually smart enough to sell our games ourselves over craigslist, eBay or amazon. We can get fucked as far as MS is concerned.

Publishers win.

Microsoft wins.

Certain retail places kinda win.

Customers can go fuck themselves.

 

[AHA-Lambda]

serious question here.. what is different with the PC then the stuff they mention here..? can you even resell a PC game..?

No but Steam isn't this draconian plus it's way cheaper.

 

[toddhunter]

This sounds okay actually. Steam should have a system like this..

All it does is prevent loaning games to a freind and I havent done that in a while.

No, it also prevents people selling games themselves for a decent price.

$80+ preowned games? That is what you can get in Australia if you go to EB. It'll be even worse now due to zero competition. Fuck, that.

This is not ok.

 

[michaelius]

i've never understood why they tout that as something good for publishers, am i missing something? here's a super simple example:

lets say you buy a title for 50

you trade it in for 40 a week later

you buy a new title for 50, using the 40 you earned from the trade

you spent a total of $60 and "consumed" 2 games. in a used-game free world you would have spent 100 to consume those two games.

the money from used game sales going towards new games is not really putting any new money into the system, know what i mean?

but i feel like i may not be grasping something here.

Yes you are not grasping something very simple
Money isn't unlimited resource.

 

[doniewhalberg]

i've never understood why they tout that as something good for publishers, am i missing something? here's a super simple example:

lets say you buy a title for 50

you trade it in for 40 a week later

you buy a new title for 50, using the 40 you earned from the trade

you spent a total of $60 and "consumed" 2 games. in a used-game free world you would have spent 100 to consume those two games.

the money from used game sales going towards new games is not really putting any new money into the system, know what i mean?

but i feel like i may not be grasping something here.

Because maybe you only had $60, and not $100? So maybe you just bought one game, or none because you think they're too expensive a hobby to upkeep.

 

[metalslimer]

I'm now thinking the reason they're not getting it is because they're not playing ball with what the publishers want.

I doubt. Ubisoft was one of the kings of DRM last generation and are developing multiple games. Activision is also supposedly putting Ghosts on it. If Activision and Ubisoft don't care, then what makes people think Sony will "cave" to the pressure. And we know mot Japanese publishers don't care since they would bankrupt themselves trying this.

 

[BrokenEchelon]

Sounds good imo.

2+2=5
Member
(Today, 06:03 AM)

 

[farisr]

Yeah, Basically no more selling your games yourself. No more borrowing games from your friend letting your friends borrow from you. No more letting your family member borrow it who has their own xbox and account who may even be in the same household as you.

 

[Satchel]

How is this reasonable?

If Sony adopts this they are dead to me too

You're talking to someone who never buys used games.

I don't sell many either.

While its obviously not a perfect system, it beats paying the full retail price twice like we thought might happen.

 

[jorma]

I hate this and i hope Sony will not implement anything like this.

I've never sold a copy of a game i bought (and own, since i live in the EU!) ever, but i do frequently give them away and/or lend them to friends.

 

[Toki767]

Won't affect me at all. It's better for publishers and I'm all for anything that will buck the trend of publishers closing left and right. I don't participate in this second hand market at all.

This is not going to prevent studios from closing. Not by a long shot.

 

[farisr]

You're talking to someone who never buys used games.

I don't sell many either.

While its obviously not a perfect system, it beats paying the full retail price twice like we thought might happen.

Yeah, paying $55 the second time instead of $60. What a big difference.

 

[DecoyOctopus]

2+2=5
Member
(Today, 06:03 AM)

Perfect!

 

[BrokenEchelon]

You're talking to someone who never buys used games.

I don't sell many either.

While its obviously not a perfect system, it beats paying the full retail price twice like we thought might happen.

Instead of being fucking terrible, it's only terrible. Thank god!

 

[Router]

That actually seems pretty fair. I'm assuming there would have to be some similar system in place for renting then?

 

[AHA-Lambda]

Plausible Outcomes

- Second hand sales diminish significantly
- People buy fewer games, but spend more on major franchises + DLC
- Games retail is dealt a deathblow in several places, reducing the places to buy games
- Publishers get more and more wary of selling titles at retail
- Retail becomes for the biggest AAA titles only - everything else goes to digital. And we see a mass contraction in the games industry.

Fixed that for you.

 

[Satchel]

Yeah, paying $55 the second time instead of $60. What a big difference.

Huh?

I'm saying that under the system BEFORE everything was "cleared up", we thought you'd buy the second hand game, then pay almost full retail to unlock it.

This isn't better than that?

 

[Impeccable]

Won't affect me at all. It's better for publishers and I'm all for anything that will buck the trend of publishers closing left and right. I don't participate in this second hand market at all.

Me either but this is fucking stupid and has huge consequences, not positive.

 

[Monty Mole]

So, basically eBay is screwed. Also the prices you'll get for trade-ins will be even more measly, given the shop will have an even smaller margin.

 

[Empty]

while this is better than some things suggested in the last week i see no reason to give up a system that works nicely for me so microsoft can pocket from it.

 

[Spike]

Heh, and they call us gamers 'entitled'...

 

[Smiles and Cries]

So no private sale or borrowing.

Sounds good, but will places like gamespot just increase the price of used games to cover what they will lose and pass the cost on to us? Also, how will renting work?

you guys are ruining the it makes sense feeling I was having after reading the OP

it does sound good but then you can't craiglist ebay yardsale your classic Xbone games

collector's editions lulz

 

[GraveRobberX]

serious question here.. what is different with the PC then the stuff they mention here..? can you even resell a PC game..?

PC removes the price burden

You just wait for sales, the competition between the different providers is ridiculous

A Steam Seasonal sale + $100 can earn you almost a year worth of content
None of the bullshit haha u buy flash gamez/indies, I'm talking legit titles

Hitman Absolution released what in November 2012, it was like $5 on amazon last week, the Digital CE $8 - Steam key to boot
$20 for the 360/PS3 (was $29.99 not too long ago), the CE is now $40
(PS+ EU got it for free)

Steam and other DD service remove the fixed price wars of retail MSRP
Shit have you seen the absurd offering now offered just to get you to buy a Day 1 DD title for PC
Bioshock Infinite gave you 2 extra games + other goodies, most subsidized by selling those and making the BI price be in the mid teens to twenties in price Day 1

PC isn't about resell, most know going in
It's really about content released at a fervor pace with so many different offerings, it's crazy not to get in on it

Humble Bundles alone, I have yet to start one game for the PC from it, but have bought almost everyone, including Android, even though I have no android device...
I buy it for future promise, I'll get something that will allow me to use that content, not hurt my wallet in the process
Also I have bought so many gift keys for GAF and gave so many keys to Free to a good home thread, it really feels like PC is ahead of consoles not in only in performance but social community aspect too

 

[ThoughtsOfSpeaking]

Wait till they annouce that you cant sell your console either without the buyer paying them a fee.

 

[neojubei]

That actually seems pretty fair. I'm assuming there would have to be some similar system in place for renting then?

What if you want to give the game away ton a friend or family member. Do they have to pay Microsoft to play the game? How fair is that?

 

[toastyToast]

While its obviously not a perfect system, it beats paying the full retail price twice like we thought might happen.

This system might as well not exist

By funnelling used game sales to specific outlets it creates a monopoly/oligopoly where they'll probably sell the things for a $5 discount at best.

Just say there won't be any second hand games.

 

[toddhunter]

Huh?

I'm saying that under the system BEFORE everything was "cleared up", we thought you'd buy the second hand game, then pay almost full retail to unlock it.

This isn't better than that?

You'll still be paying almost full retail mate. Gamestops and the like now have a monopoly on selling used games. No more ebay, no more private sales.

They'll give you $1 trade in and sell the game again for $1 below retail. Don't like it? Want to sell your game elsewhere? Well tough luck because you can't.

 

[hodgy100]

New game prices regularly drop below £35 in the uk. is this also a way to keep new game prices at £40?

 

[Arjen]

Wait till they annouce that you cant sell your console either without the buyer paying them a fee.

People here will think that's reasonable ass well.
Nothing suprises me anymore, apparantly people love being fucked over.

 

[OmegaTreeFish]

Won't affect me at all. It's better for publishers and I'm all for anything that will buck the trend of publishers closing left and right. I don't participate in this second hand market at all.

Or less people buy games overall because they cant justify the costs via decent trade ins.

Take away the ability to trade in doesn't mean people will automatically by the game at full price. They will wait for it to bomb and then drop in price.

Over all they spent the same amount of money but over a longer period of time.

Publisher still closes.

Its a broken logic they are using.

Only works in the PC world because prices are way way better.

 

[Facism]

That actually seems pretty fair. I'm assuming there would have to be some similar system in place for renting then?

what would be fair is that publishers and MS have no fucking hand in whatever is done with a game after it's been sold once. I don't need them profiting even more by restricting how and where i can sell off my games, who takes a cut and how that negatively effects the money i receive from those resales.

With all this cloud nonsense, always online crap your games have a lifespan.

 

[UberTag]

This is not going to prevent studios from closing. Not by a long shot.

Of course not. Can't wait to see what publishers scapegoat next once used games, rentals, game trading and piracy are a distant memory.

Or perhaps then and only then once all other avenues to screw us over have been exhausted they'll just say, "Fuck it! All games are now $99 at release instead of $69."

Actually, what they should do as an extortionary measure is that every game starts at $99 and then gets marked down to $69 after a month. So we can justify it saying, "Oh, I'm not going to pay any extra for my games at all. But the fiends who must have a game at Day 1 will gladly open up their wallets for the 4-week head start."

And after that they'll come up with some more ways to fuck us in the ass. And the developers will still get screwed and close down after their one big title only sold 3 million copies instead of the necessary 5 million.

Wait till they annouce that you cant sell your console either without the buyer paying them a fee.

Ooooh... that's a good one. I like that. Yeah, used consoles are robbing Microsoft of new sales revenue that should be rightfully theirs.

 

[BibiMaghoo]

I will never support this. Whatever the benefits for publishers, MS is pocketing money they should have no part of, at the expense of the customer. Forcing their own policies onto second hand retailers is a disgrace.

 

[Captain Tuttle]

This still fits Sony's "We don't block Used Games" / "PS4 plays used games" comments.

The X1 doesn't block and still plays used games too.

I don't think Sony has a cloud system to match MS though....ugh, why can't either company just give a 100% detailed answer already.

Because the answers suck for us and they know it.

 

[Impeccable]

I think I'll go on record and say that if Sony implements this on a wide scale then I'll go full PC as well. That way I can have fantastic games and only pay a couple of dollars.

It'll end up being financially better for me too.

 

[jordan0386]

Doesnt this make every used game a fixed price?

Who competes with Gamestop in the used sales race?

 

[Doug Heffernan]

Still better than all digital. I like getting something back when I finish a game.

 

[Korezo]

serious question here.. what is different with the PC then the stuff they mention here..? can you even resell a PC game..?

Difference is pc games are super cheap.

 

[Starwolf_UK]

They'll give you $1 trade in and sell the game again for $1 below retail. Don't like it? Want to sell your game elsewhere? Well tough luck because you can't.

I don't know about you but I'd rather smash up the disc on youtube then take $1 trade-in (also, I'd knock over the magazine rack...). I can imagine many people to feel the same. In this situation it might as well be no pre-owned.

Bit the silver lining is Microsoft don't really know either. Or if they do they've not officially announced it as they would prefer rumours to prevail over fact.

 

[specialguy]

Yes you are not grasping something very simple
Money isn't unlimited resource.

I think I realized what I missed that's simple (and none of you guys got it), gamestop is putting new money into the system in this case (when they pay you for trade in)

They get your 50, but they give 40 of it back in the example. They are the ones "hurt", except they are keeping a cut of each transaction so they are not.

So I guess it's worse than the ideal for pubs, gamestop is pocketing some money they otherwise would not out of the system, but much of the blow can be softened by repeatedly using trade in money on new games?

economics is really complicated. i'm still confused.

 

[scakko84]

Oh shit! I didn't think of that! If you have no way (refuse to sign up to MS's cloud and buy their access machines) to check the licence state then you can't offer refunds or returns.

Also, as i stated in a previous comments, if you don't buy used games from "Authorized" retailers you can't be 100% sure the game has not been used yet.

Assume you paid a used game 30$ from a guy or store on ebay, when it ships you go home and put it in your console only to find out the previous owner has not unregistered it from his account.

You have to pay full price to play a game you have already paid for...

 

[TheDarkKnight774]

I still think if they wanted to do this just force the used game store resellers (the large ones like GameStop) to give the pubs a kickback of used games sold and leave everything else alone. No 24 hour check, no restriction on lending, eBay private sellers, etc.

 

[Knux-Future]

hate to say it but...if Gamefly isn't effected (I think there might be a workaround for them...I think?), then..this doesn't bother me as much.

It still sucks but in terms of personally effecting me?

not so much.

Suck for the rest of the world for sure tho

 

[DESTROYA]

I rarely buy used games but I do trade/borrow with friends just to see if I like a game before buying it new, this won't work for me so it's been nice MS but I guess all good things must come to an end. MS is digging there own grave with all these anti-consumer features.

 

[MarkusRJR]

So basically this still means I can't lend my games to my friends like I usually do? Still backwards as fuck. They should just let users play games off the discs without installing it. Having games installed (without a need for a disc) is basically their only reasoning for blocking lending/gifting games, and it's stupid.

 

[strata8]

Also, as i stated in a previous comments, if you don't buy used games from "Authorized" retailers you can't be 100% sure the game has not been used yet.

Assume you paid a used game 30$ from a guy or store on ebay, when it ships you go home and put it in your console only to find out the previous owner has not unregistered it from his account.

You have to pay full price to play a game you have already paid for...

In that case you'd get your money back from the seller. No different than if you'd bought any other item and received a faulty copy.

Besides, we don't even know whether you can reactivate the disc yourself.

So basically this still means I can't lend my games to my friends like I usually do? Still backwards as fuck. They should just let users play games off the discs without installing it. Having games installed (without a need for a disc) is basically their only reasoning for blocking lending/gifting games, and it's stupid.

Ideally:

- Playing installed without a disc = requires activation/serial code
- Playing installed, with a disc = doesn't require code as long as disc in inserted each time you play (ie, what we do now)

That's how I would do it. But it's a bit complicated. That way you could have the game activated on your console and play without a disc. If you lent it to a friend, they could still play the game but they'd need to have the disc inserted. Effectively restricts it to two people at a time.

 

[Ramocalypse]

Has MS said anything about being able to sell your license online through their digital store? I feel like that would ease at least some of this transition.