cyberheater
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I'm sorry. I'm calling bullshit that MS will take £35 to transact a used game. I simply do not believe it.
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MCV: Retail sources talk used Xbox One games, £35 for used game in UK [U2: Eurogamer]
- Thread starter gofreak
- Start date
I actually don't blame Microsoft really. .
If you can get people to sign up to Gold accounts for services others give away for free, If you can get people to accept this vast array of anti-consumer measures ...
..then why not do it?
Consumers...as a whole.. get what they deserve.
intheinbetween
Member
35 quids? are they serious about that?
Joel Was Right
If you smell burning, it's probably the generators acting up. Report it anyway.
But what drives prices down in the industry?
That is what MS, EA and Activision want. They want to turn console games in to 59.99 long term rentals. By driving up the price of used games they can do this. Get the price of used games so high people just say screw it buy new at full MSRP of course. This is all about greed plain and simple. It is bad business and is short sited and will kill them off in the long run. Parents are already moving kids to tablet gaming because of 1 dollar games. This is only going to speed it up since the goal is 59.99 dollars for a game.
Yeah, I don't think I have seen a consumer base more ready to roll over than gamers. Makes me sad.
Its obvious the idea is to kill retail used game dealing without explicitly saying so. The top couple of publishers have the platform holders by the balls. Or at least Microsoft.
There are plenty of steam fans and xbots defending this to the end right now. I'm just lost. How can anyone defend this?
Ok. Analogy time.
Let's say you and 4 friends go out to dinner at Old Country Buffet. Only you pay the $12-$15 for the buffet. You eat then hand the plate over to the next guy. He eats then so on. If the restaurant makes $5 off the average diner, instead of making $20 off of you they lose $10.
yes.yes. I know you can't really do that at those types of restaurants, but imagine if you could.
This is the same thing as lending. It actually hurts the developer/publisher. The issue we all have here is a legacy one. It has been this way since the Atari 2600. We have been able to lend and borrow games forever.
So what has changed? Well, for one, it costs a lot more to develop, publish AND MARKET a game. Think back to Square/Enix recently. Their comments that Tomb Raider was a disappointment in sales when it sold the most of any installment in the first month.
Bottom line is there has to be some changes this coming generation and we now know what these changes are. I think it sucks, but I also see why it has to be this way.
I do want to maybe throw this out there. I was driving home from work yesterday and thinking about how they could actually implement a system to compromise all of this. Some of you might be too young, but VHS releases back in the day could hold the key to a different way of solving some of the problems.
Bear with me here. Back in the day a movie would release in the theaters, then around 6 months later, release at video stores at a very high price(around $100) for rental only. Then 3 months or so down the line, everyone would sell it for around $20.
Video games could do the same. Release at $60 bucks with no lending or trading in for 3 months. All the people who want to play it must pay FULL price. After 3 months you may trade it in used. After 6 more months or maybe after 1 year of release the game unlocks and it can be lent out. Though, I think each disc can only be lent out a couple of times to prevent everyone from just copying the game to everyone else's system.
Just a thought.
Let's say you and 4 friends go out to dinner at Old Country Buffet. Only you pay the $12-$15 for the buffet. You eat then hand the plate over to the next guy. He eats then so on. If the restaurant makes $5 off the average diner, instead of making $20 off of you they lose $10.
yes.yes. I know you can't really do that at those types of restaurants, but imagine if you could.
This is the same thing as lending. It actually hurts the developer/publisher. The issue we all have here is a legacy one. It has been this way since the Atari 2600. We have been able to lend and borrow games forever.
So what has changed? Well, for one, it costs a lot more to develop, publish AND MARKET a game. Think back to Square/Enix recently. Their comments that Tomb Raider was a disappointment in sales when it sold the most of any installment in the first month.
Bottom line is there has to be some changes this coming generation and we now know what these changes are. I think it sucks, but I also see why it has to be this way.
I do want to maybe throw this out there. I was driving home from work yesterday and thinking about how they could actually implement a system to compromise all of this. Some of you might be too young, but VHS releases back in the day could hold the key to a different way of solving some of the problems.
Bear with me here. Back in the day a movie would release in the theaters, then around 6 months later, release at video stores at a very high price(around $100) for rental only. Then 3 months or so down the line, everyone would sell it for around $20.
Video games could do the same. Release at $60 bucks with no lending or trading in for 3 months. All the people who want to play it must pay FULL price. After 3 months you may trade it in used. After 6 more months or maybe after 1 year of release the game unlocks and it can be lent out. Though, I think each disc can only be lent out a couple of times to prevent everyone from just copying the game to everyone else's system.
Just a thought.
Many factors. Demand, new games, used games etc.
Delusibeta
Banned
Either Microsoft is thick, thinks they're above the law and the retailers will dance to their merry tune (despite that involving the retailers getting screwed hard), or Ben Parfitt is making shit up. To be perfectly honest, I'd put my money on the latter, I don't think Microsoft would be dumb enough to blatantly break price fixing laws.
Bigmac1910
Member
I'm really curious if the xbone will bomb because of all this, once people catch on.
PC is an open box of individual competing services. those services have outside services competing with them. there is not and will not be a system on Xbox one for the individual components to compete with each other in an open market. i cannot go create my own competing Xbox One market place. it is a closed box system. they are not similar at all and your example is horrible.
Wait so it means that all the little B&M shops will simply not stock xbones.
It's impressive, considering that it makes the work of the average B&M worker harder, it means it'll have negative awareness from then from the moment they deal with it.
They really, REALLY want to hand this gen to Sony?
It's impressive, considering that it makes the work of the average B&M worker harder, it means it'll have negative awareness from then from the moment they deal with it.
They really, REALLY want to hand this gen to Sony?
Miles Quaritch
Member
I rarely buy used, but this is pretty disgusting and will destroy a lot of liquidity in the market. Short-sighted loons.
ThoughtsOfSpeaking
Banned
People also defend paying for Xbox live. Go figure.
Yeah. It is basically attacking the revenue of game shops, which will cause them to raise prices generally. Awesome.
I'm sure it will be time based like 6 months or a year, i very much doub't they will be charging 35 for 2 or 3 year old games.
ConfusedCat
Banned
shit on a stick, this is getting ridiculous (and very 1984)
This is why you can't turn the Kinect off.
"Kinect 2 will be able to employ certain DRM measures depending on what it observes in the living room.
Thats the conclusion suggested by a patent filed by Microsoft, and corroborated by sources talking to MCV in the weeks leading up to this weeks Xbox One reveal.
ExtremeTech reports that Microsoft has filed for a patent that allows Kinect to monitor the number of viewers in the room. It then cross-checks this with the maximum number of viewers permitted by the licence that a user agrees to when purchasing or renting content.
If it is deemed that too many people are present, the user will be prompted to pay an additional fee to upgrade the licence."
This is why you can't turn the Kinect off.
"Kinect 2 will be able to employ certain DRM measures depending on what it observes in the living room.
Thats the conclusion suggested by a patent filed by Microsoft, and corroborated by sources talking to MCV in the weeks leading up to this weeks Xbox One reveal.
ExtremeTech reports that Microsoft has filed for a patent that allows Kinect to monitor the number of viewers in the room. It then cross-checks this with the maximum number of viewers permitted by the licence that a user agrees to when purchasing or renting content.
If it is deemed that too many people are present, the user will be prompted to pay an additional fee to upgrade the licence."
No, that's an irrelevant distinction and the example is valid.
I'm confused. $50 is as low as any pre-owned game GS will sell or is the price you have to pay to let a friend borrow the game.
By the way, where are our fucking journalists? Shouldn't this be front of the webpage news.
-Plasma Reus-
Service guarantees member status
A lot of us might not want to admit it, but MS is simply staying on the course they've always been on. They charged for XBL all the way through the gen, and people were fine with that. There was no real BC for older XBOX games, and people were fine with that. The UI was filled with ads, and people were fine with that. They've been offering an array of games that were more or less the same for the past few years, and most of them sold well and received praise from audiences.
Their confidence and strategy is based on their experience this past gen. I understand why they would be confused and why they would think people are ''whining'' now all of a sudden.
My brother!
GoldenEye 007
Member
That's a pretty great assessment of the core situation.
I seriously and sadly doubt it. Some people here will resist and not buy it for its anti consumer tendencies, but others don't care. The general public won't bother to do any homework and will buy it in boatloads.
Who cares man, did you see you can t.v. while you skype? Oh and games.
I wonder if the people they target who don't keep up on information like us will be as happy when everything they knew about gaming changes. Really pushing on casual ignorance may be the thing that blows this whole thing apart if apathy doesn't run as rampant as it did during the red ring fiasco.
I'm starting to think that some of you are viral marketers right now.
Off the top of my head, here are some game buying/selling/playing scenarios that will likely be impossible with the new xbox:
1. I have the system for a few years. After a price drop, my sibling's family buys the system and asks if I have some games they could try. With any other system, I'd say "Sure!" and give them a stack of some old games. With xbox1, that's not happening.
2. I walk into a Goodwill and look through the video games to see if there are any gems. Oh, cool, it's that game I never bothered to try out... and it's only $5! I suppose this technically could happen on xbox1, but when I get home and put it in the system I'll discover that I have to pay $59.99 to play it.
3. I want to make some money and clear some space, so I decide to sell my xbox1 games. I want to make the most money I can, so I list them individually on ebay. I don't think anyone is going to pay me more than a few cents, considering it will cost $60 to activate the game on their end.
4. It's 2043. Microsoft has long been out of business, and some 45 year old guys are reminiscing about when they were teenagers, playing their favorite xbox1 games. They dig out the old system and decide to start up a game of Call of Duty: Grim Dog. They discover that the system won't play any games anymore because Microsoft's authentication servers have been offline for 15 years. They consider watching a blu ray movie, but ultimaely decide to play the still-working NES that's been in the family for 60 years.
1. I have the system for a few years. After a price drop, my sibling's family buys the system and asks if I have some games they could try. With any other system, I'd say "Sure!" and give them a stack of some old games. With xbox1, that's not happening.
2. I walk into a Goodwill and look through the video games to see if there are any gems. Oh, cool, it's that game I never bothered to try out... and it's only $5! I suppose this technically could happen on xbox1, but when I get home and put it in the system I'll discover that I have to pay $59.99 to play it.
3. I want to make some money and clear some space, so I decide to sell my xbox1 games. I want to make the most money I can, so I list them individually on ebay. I don't think anyone is going to pay me more than a few cents, considering it will cost $60 to activate the game on their end.
4. It's 2043. Microsoft has long been out of business, and some 45 year old guys are reminiscing about when they were teenagers, playing their favorite xbox1 games. They dig out the old system and decide to start up a game of Call of Duty: Grim Dog. They discover that the system won't play any games anymore because Microsoft's authentication servers have been offline for 15 years. They consider watching a blu ray movie, but ultimaely decide to play the still-working NES that's been in the family for 60 years.
Delusibeta
Banned
That's the minimum price GameStop will be permitted to sell used XbOne games, with GS only $5 of profit. Needless to say, this will kill trade in values which means there won't be many used games to sell in the first place. If this is true, they might as well have a complete block on used games, because it's simply unprofitable for retailers, even retailers as large as GameStop.
Zen_Arcade
Banned
Injustice is probably about $55 used at GS right now. Next gen these used games won't fall that fast in price if there is a regulation. It takes months for those games to get below $50. Anyone who bought it used that week when they could have walked into Toys R Us and got it for $15 cheaper and new is a sap.
The problem here is that the people that
wait for those games to get lower then $50 will never buy the game next gen unless they can find a deal for it new. The whole reason people buy used games now is to save a lot of money. If they take away the fact that buying used saves you a lot of money people are just going to stop buying used games and will wait until retailers have to put the
games on sale just so they can move units. Or alternatively, never buy the game at all if they can't find a deal.
Obviously there will be exceptions like CoD or Madden, but any game that isn't already in the upper teir of popularity isn't going to sell as well.
They saw no one gave a fuck about paying to play online so naturally they just moved the goal post.
Yeah, sadly this is pretty much the truth. There has been no effective pushback before, why would they expect it now. I don't.
Hopefully they will do enough to at least hurt the public acceptance of this sort of rubbish.
Maybe, but I wish it wasn't.
ConfusedCat
Banned
times like this i am reminded that its important Nintendo sticks around
because they just wouldnt fucking do this.
because they just wouldnt fucking do this.
It is a nice thought but the issue is they are screwing themselves in the long run. You know who this affects the most? Kids and teenagers you know the next generation of gamers who in their 20's will be buying games and supporting the industry. If there is no lending or used games. It becomes to expensive for them to game and never fall in love with the hobby. It is already happening with tablets and 1 dollar games. If Sony follows the same course gaming will be dead once the current 20's are done with game. There will be no one to take their place. All that will be left is crappy tablet/phone/FtP crap. As a aging gamer who this next gen is the last makes me sad. I was there near the beginning and seen the ups and downs of gaming. The crash of the 80's the death of the arcade. Games being only for nerds. Then the huge explosion of gaming and gaining acceptance by the masses. Now I will see the death of gaming.
Delusibeta
Banned
The article then goes on to say that the minimum price Microsoft will allow is £35 per used game sold, and that the percentage Microsoft takes is 90%. Read the article.
That quid price pretty much confirms what I have been saying; retailers are going to give you chump change for trading in a game, and are going to keep the actual used game price hovering around the new game price. They need to lower it enough so people will actually buy used, but high enough to get enough of a cut to sustain their business. So yeah, under this model, expect $54.99 used games for months on end.
I really hope this doesn't catch on, but all this is going to do is make people much more particular in what games they are going to pick up, used or new.
I really hope this doesn't catch on, but all this is going to do is make people much more particular in what games they are going to pick up, used or new.
Joel Was Right
If you smell burning, it's probably the generators acting up. Report it anyway.
Explaining the £35 figure
This isn't to suggest every single game would, forever, cost £35. Rather, what is driving the figure is the illustration of the point that retailers would get an estimated 10% of whatever they sell a pre-owned game for. They could, hypothetically, sell a pre-owned game for £20 and get £2 from that sale - which, of course, is an awful margin for them. So its likely they will sell it for as much as they could feasibly get away with. The difference between the £2 and £3.50 (if they sold it for £35) would then look considerably more worthwhile in their eyes.
This isn't to suggest every single game would, forever, cost £35. Rather, what is driving the figure is the illustration of the point that retailers would get an estimated 10% of whatever they sell a pre-owned game for. They could, hypothetically, sell a pre-owned game for £20 and get £2 from that sale - which, of course, is an awful margin for them. So its likely they will sell it for as much as they could feasibly get away with. The difference between the £2 and £3.50 (if they sold it for £35) would then look considerably more worthwhile in their eyes.
The real thing that worries me is that even this concept will stop now. Why lower the price at all if there's not a cheaper alternative in the used market?
The lower number of options a consumer gets, the worse it becomes for everyone involved.
Im not sure they will. If the prices on used games/trade ins change, I think most people will just take it. Id also bet that the masses dont share games as often as we do. Theyre likely not going to care too much.
Sadly, our opinion here on neogaf doesnt necessarily reflect the "real" world.