When they were just barely looking out of the water... oh my
Game of Thrones *NO BOOK SPOILERS* |OT| Season 3 - Sundays on HBO [Read the OP]
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Funky Papa
FUNK-Y-PPA-4
My guess is that she only has a tiny amount of them. She still has a Dothraki personal guard protecting her tent, but most of the horde left after Drogo died. Also, the Second Sons wouldn't even acknowledge them when they counted her troops. I'm guessing that most able warriors left out or perished in the desert/Qarth, leaving her with mostly servants. I have to wonder if she still plans to recruit a gigantic Dothraki horde or if she's content with her new Unsullied army.
ThoseDeafMutes
Member
My guess is that she only has a tiny amount of them. She still has a Dothraki personal guard protecting her tent, but most of the horde left after Drogo died. Also, the Second Sons wouldn't even acknowledge them when they counted her troops. I'm guessing that most able warriors left out or perished in the desert/Qarth, leaving her with mostly servants. I have to wonder if she still plans to recruit a gigantic Dothraki horde or if she's content with her new Unsullied army.
My guess is she'll wander around the outskirts collecting the dragon balls until the plot is ready to receive her on the mainland.
Funky Papa
FUNK-Y-PPA-4
Spoilers, DAMN IT.
Phenomenal.
Have you seen Avatar?
I'd like her to replicate the scene before the big battle where they travel across Pandora and recruit the Na'vi tribes to aid them in battle, except Dothraki in this case.
Do the Dothraki respect the name Khal Drogo or would they laugh in Dany's face?
If she let them know that Khal Drogo intended to take the Dothraki across the Narrow Sea and claim Westeros for her, she might be able to persuade them.
I loved learning about Dothraki culture and I'm sad that she seems to have forgotten where she came from now that she has a legitimate army.
Brofist
Member
Count me in. That fucking finger scene gave me nightmares.
A khal that does not ride is no khal. The Dothraki respect only strength.
Woody Invincible
Banned
She used to look very attractive. Thanks Obama!
The One Who Knocks
Member
Absolutely. The most likely thing for her that I can see is that her story this season is going to be repeated with variations so that she can 'learn' different elements of an invasion; freeing various cities along the way until finally she can invade in the final season where she'll arrive just in time to stop the White Walker threat (or alternatively either in the second/third last season and then she has to face the White Walkers having already suffered large casualties or after the White Walkers have already started invading). I hope I'm wrong and she invades far sooner than that as if this is what happens her story is going to become increasingly tedius but with how things are developing currently (and at the current pace) I definitely see her as an 'end game' piece as opposed to somebody with any immediate impact on the plot. After all, she still has a relatively small army (of skilled warriors admittedly), no siege weapons (as was mentioned in the last episode), no boats, a lack of political skill (the only power she really has is "I have dragons; submit or die" and I doubt that that's going to work very well in Westeros with the large amount of political backstabbing), is on an entirely different continent and has no spies/contacts in Westeros to provide any news. The handmaiden (I can't remember her name) she received from Astapor mentiond that she speaks nineteen languages; that certainly gives them a lot of cities to visit/plunder/liberate. There's also the very obvious point that her dragons are far too small at the moment so they need to have her occupied in something while they grow to have any real impact.
EDIT: Actually there's an even larger hinderence now that I think of it. Even if she had enough boats to invade I highly doubt she has the supplies (I'm not sure what supplies she actually has though; is it just what she plundered from Astapor? What does she feed everybody with?) to avoid a mass starvation on the voyage to Westeros. They're pretty nomadic at the moment, her army not striking me as particularly self-sufficient so they'll need to get supplies too. Your comparison seems pretty spot-on. Her story is like a checklist and when it's complete she's able to start having relevance but until then I can't see a way to tie it in very well.
I may have to stop posting in this thread after this. I really like chatting and speculating with everyone here and posting funny GoT gifs and pics with you guys, but a gaffer just spoiled the climax of this season for me and I'm really bummed out about it. And I think they may have done it out of spite.
I think I'll have to go read the books, even though I didn't want to. So I guess that means the spoiler-hinting guys, well, you win.
ThoseDeafMutes
Member
You've only got like, two eps to go before you see it?
Don't read the books. Don't be that guy.
It's quite possible they lied to you about what was going to happen. If you come from the angle that people like this aren't to be trusted then you really can't be spoiled on anything.
You're right, Tyrion, I can still win this battle!
Could be, but it doesn't seem so in this case since he was quoting me in the spoiler thread and complaining...about me complaining in this thread. A vicious cycle.
Ah well, so it goes. Hopefully the spoiler happens in the next episode so I am virgin fresh like a Greyjoy prostitute.
Funky Papa
FUNK-Y-PPA-4
Everybody is dead, Westeros is the purgatory.
Joe Shlabotnik
Banned
Same here, I'm honestly curious. And I won't comment either way on the accuracy to you.
Edit: nm, I think I can deduce what happened.
Edit: nm, I think I can deduce what happened.
Nowadays it would be a twist if this wasn't the case.
Theon isn't a POV character so you wouldn't see scenes of him without another POV character being present. But those injuries are mentioned, as far as I know. You couldn't just skip on the character in the TV show as you could in the books.
It'd be great if you guys would just stfu about the books and what's in them and what's not.
To be fair Robb's been fighting for 2 and a half seasons and not much has changed, so she can arrive fairly soon as long as the plot figures out ways to undermine her every victory.
I haven't even read the books. It' not like I'm telling you that Robb is really a whizz kid and ends up discovering gunpowder from obsidian glass which is really the only way to kill both the Dragons and the White Walkers. It's just an explanation of why you couldn't just say cut of Theon's finger and be done with it. I don't even know if anything is else is gonna be cut or not.
I may have to stop posting in this thread after this. I really like chatting and speculating with everyone here and posting funny GoT gifs and pics with you guys, but a gaffer just spoiled the climax of this season for me and I'm really bummed out about it. And I think they may have done it out of spite.
I think I'll have to go read the books, even though I didn't want to. So I guess that means the spoiler-hinting guys, well, you win.
I think he was just joking about the dragonballs dude.
HyruleGuardian
Member
I don't know if the torture scenes were really redundant.
On the one hand you might say "I get it, he's being tortured again, I've already seen this".
But there's a difference between being tortured once and being tortured over and over and over again...
If the show had only shown Theon being tortured once, we'd all be like "okay, so they tortured Theon, he deserved it anyway".
But by showing Theon being horrible tortured 3 times, we're like "Damn it, this is horrible, just make it stop already, I just feel bad for Theon already" (at least that was my reaction).
If Theon ends up changing as a character, I think if we had only seen him being tortured once we might have questioned it and called it unrealistic. But now, I don't think I would question it.
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Just a comment, I've also heard that Theon's scenes this season weren't in the book, but were said to have happened anyway.
I don't know what that means for Theon's plot line, but all I can say is that book and television have different ways in which they convey change, and what works in books doesn't always work on TV and vise versa, so I'm still confident there's a good reason that we got the 3 Theon torture scenes this year.
HyruleGuardian
Member
I really hope our last season is not simply "Dany rides her dragons to Westoros, burns the while walkers, takes the Iron Throne, the end". And frankly, that seems like way too predictable and happy of an ending for this story, so I just don't see it.
Although it does seem as if it will be some time before Dany comes to Westoros. It seems like she's sort of developing her own story line somewhat separate from Westeros in which she is become the "breaker of chains" in Essos. I could see this plot thread lasting for a while before she finally turns for Westoros.
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One question - Is Dany's army really as big and strong as people make it out to be?
Her army basically consists of 8000 Unsullied, 2 Knights, 3 small dragons, and a very small band of Dothraki.
I don't remember exact numbers but I'm pretty sure that Renly / Stannis' force vastly outnumbered Dany's current force, and they couldn't take King's Landing.
Even Robb Stark has something like 20,000 men on foot, and I'm pretty sure his army is outnumbered greatly by the southern armies.
So yeah, unless she is able to make alliances in Westoros, it doesn't seem like she's strong enough to conquer Westoros yet.
This is correct. And the way it is done on the TV show makes sense based on the book.
Funky Papa
FUNK-Y-PPA-4
Dany's army is small, but is a professional one that mirrors the Spartan system, which essentially created some of the finest soldiers of their era. They are bred to kill. Westero's armies are mostly made up by a small number of well trained knights leading vast numbers of mobilised farmers and tradesmen. I don't think Dany is strong enough right now to take the seven kingdoms, but she could easily wreck a couple of houses with some decent strategy.
Why are you even reading stuff in the spoiler thread if you don't want to be spoiled?
He wasn't. The new "who quoted me" function was at fault.
Correct. She's lacking cavalry and siege weapons, but dragons are living siege weapons.. well grown up ones anyway.
It only shows the thread title though, you'd have to click through to see the post. Sucks either way, but if I didn't want to be spoiled I wouldn't have checked what someone had said in that thread in response to one of my posts.
HyruleGuardian
Member
Yeah I get that.
Also, remember in Season 1 when Robert was having a conversation with Cersei, and he asked her what was a large number, 5 or 1?
Then he showed 5 spread out fingers, and then 5 fingers closed together to make 1 fist.
His point was all the lords of Westoros are not truly united, so an invader with a truly strong and united army could wreck havoc.
All of that said, I still feel like Dany would need to grow her army and make alliances if she was ever to actually conquer Westoros.
HyruleGuardian
Member
But Dany's dragons are still babies - I assume they're still fairly prone to being killed.
Heck, at some point or another, someone must have killed FULLY GROWN dragons, so it seems like baby dragons are certainly vulnerable.
The thread titles are too similar, it's an easy mistake to make. The spoiler policy should be the first part of the title imo.
Yeah, they're still babies. I'm unsure if someone has killed a dragon after The Doom of Valyria, since the Targs ran over most of Westeros with just three grown dragons.
Funky Papa
FUNK-Y-PPA-4
Three babie dragons could still be inmesely demoralising. Imagine those fuckers flying around and spitting fire over an army lined up to stand a defensive/attack line. There is no way those soldiers would stand their ground.
Also, for those wondering about the effectivity of light infantry troops, I'd suggest you to read about the Almogavars. Those guys ran a goddamned train all over the Mediterranean basin, bullying entire kingdoms and sometimes turning against their employers with rather frightening results if they wouldn't meet their terms. And they did all of that without proper cavalry.
HyruleGuardian
Member
If memory serves me correct from the DVD extras Aegon and his sisters conquered Westoros after the 'Doom of Valyria'.
So unless the dragons died from old age (CAN dragons even die of old age? Somehow I doubt it) someone / something must have killed 3 big ass dragons within the last couple of hundred years.
So I would say based on that 3 baby dragons are not at all invincible.
Sure they're a great weapon to have, but at the same time what if they're killed? Then the mother of dead dragons is doomed.
So yeah, even more incentive for her to wait a little as her dragons continue to grow.
So unless the dragons died from old age (CAN dragons even die of old age? Somehow I doubt it) someone / something must have killed 3 big ass dragons within the last couple of hundred years.
So I would say based on that 3 baby dragons are not at all invincible.
Sure they're a great weapon to have, but at the same time what if they're killed? Then the mother of dead dragons is doomed.
So yeah, even more incentive for her to wait a little as her dragons continue to grow.
DrForester
Kills Photobucket
Olenna mentioned a few episodes ago that Highdardgen alone commands 15,000 troops. Even just figuring each of the seven Kingdoms has a similar size, that's a tough order for Danny to take on even one of them. And that's before taking into account alliances. Not to mention the Westeros armies have home field advantage. Danny's army is used to fighting in a desert.
HyruleGuardian
Member
Yeah, home field advantage is *huge* when you're talking about being on the right side of a castle wall.
All of that is to say, I don't think Dany could just sail to Westoros and conquer now like some people seem to think she should be able to do.
All of that is to say, I don't think Dany could just sail to Westoros and conquer now like some people seem to think she should be able to do.
Stones don't stand up to dragonfire. Remember Harrenhall? It was the biggest, baddest castle in Westeros when it was finished. Too bad the Targs showed up shortly after that and melted down the walls and burned everything inside.
True enough, but they never had to fight against heavy cavalry, like knights in full plate, since those were fielded a couple centuries after they were operating.
HyruleGuardian
Member
Agreed, but those were fully grown dragons!
I'm pretty sure there's a big difference between a dragon that's a hundred years old and a dragon that's 1 year old.
...and again, we know that those big dragons must have been killed somehow.
I'm really tempted to ask book readers if we know how Aegon and his sister's dragons were killed.
Don't answer that question if it's something that's revealed further down the story from where we are now in the show.
Dragons are great and all, but if she loses them she's fucked. And if she did arrive Robb, Tywin, Stannis, and every single other person on the continent would make it their number one priority to kill those dragons, or just kill her.
I think either some Lord of Light magic or just a shit load of arrows could kill a dragon, they can't be invincible. And if one of Melisandres shadow queefs took out Dany what's left of her army would have little luck controlling them.
She's going to need a bigger army.
I think either some Lord of Light magic or just a shit load of arrows could kill a dragon, they can't be invincible. And if one of Melisandres shadow queefs took out Dany what's left of her army would have little luck controlling them.
She's going to need a bigger army.
Orbis Tabula
Member
I know this discussion goes on every page, but it really is frustrating to see book mentions here, even when they're totally minor. The rule should just be that we're all basically pretending the books don't exist. Because any mention, no matter how small, can carry implications you might not realize. I'm actually having the same problem in real life because I'm watching the show with my girlfriend, but she's impatient and read spoilers and stuff. She basically knows the entire story and not matter how many times I tell her not to say anything, she's still spoiled plenty of shit for me. It's usually small stuff, but I hate it. If the threads were instead "GAME OF THRONES || Talk about books and be banned" and "GAME OF THRONES || Go crazy" maybe it would help. I'm just nervous because this is the first piece of literature/tv that I've really, really enjoyed in a long time and I'd hate to have it ruined. I've basically resorted to reading the books myself so that I don't get spoiled by someone else. Which sucks, because I love reading, but I want to watch the show. I'm only in the second book, but I make sure not to mention book stuff, and the moment I pass what's going on in the show, I plan to never return to this thread again.
ANYWAY, just found out that there won't be an episode tomorrow and I'm pretty pissed. This seasons has been moving slow enough as it is! Ah, well, Arrested Development should help me last.
I think this season just seems slow because I only started watching the show a few months back, so I was able to marathon the first two seasons. Which especially helped with how boring Dany's scenes were last season. I guess this time the same thing seems to be happening to Jon Snow, because I hate his story, even though I think it should be the most interesting. The two I care about the most are Jaime and Arya, and I don't think either of them were even in last episode. Tyrion is my favorite, of course, but I don't think anyone could complain about not getting enough of him. Plus I'm in the "Shae is super annoying" camp, so it hurts his scenes when she shows up to whine. Seeing him threaten Joffrey was amazing, though.
ANYWAY, just found out that there won't be an episode tomorrow and I'm pretty pissed. This seasons has been moving slow enough as it is! Ah, well, Arrested Development should help me last.
I think this season just seems slow because I only started watching the show a few months back, so I was able to marathon the first two seasons. Which especially helped with how boring Dany's scenes were last season. I guess this time the same thing seems to be happening to Jon Snow, because I hate his story, even though I think it should be the most interesting. The two I care about the most are Jaime and Arya, and I don't think either of them were even in last episode. Tyrion is my favorite, of course, but I don't think anyone could complain about not getting enough of him. Plus I'm in the "Shae is super annoying" camp, so it hurts his scenes when she shows up to whine. Seeing him threaten Joffrey was amazing, though.
Funky Papa
FUNK-Y-PPA-4
They defeated very easily knights with plated mail (not unlike Stannis armour). Knights had a hard time recovering from a fall, so they'd just lance the horses and bash the skulls of their enemies in or put a short sword through their faces. Full plate armour was very good against slashing attacks from below and conventional arrows, but knights were also very vulnerable once on the ground. If their horses are not well protected... they are SOL.
It's never really elaborated on how exactly they died, nor is the exact age of the dragons used by Aegon to conquer Westeros given. All we know that they could be ridden and that they (later?) grew extremely large.
There is one event that killed off a bunch of dragons some 170 years before the shows time, but it might be brought in the show so I don't want to post it here. Also there's some speculation amongst the readers what caused the rest of the dragons to die off and weaken over time like mentioned in the show, but it's a bit tinfoily and uses material from later down the line.
HyruleGuardian
Member
Before anyone get mad about this brief mention of the books...
I can tell you that nothing was posted that wasn't basically mentioned in the DVD extras...
except for the fact that even fans of the books don't actually know what killed the dragons, which puts them in the same position as us.
So yeah.
I can tell you that nothing was posted that wasn't basically mentioned in the DVD extras...
except for the fact that even fans of the books don't actually know what killed the dragons, which puts them in the same position as us.
So yeah.
I personally think that at some point Dany is going to lose everything and have to start over.
Everything's going too right for her at the moment and she is getting arrogant.
She'll be left with nothing but her dragons, and she'll fly to Westeros on one of their backs and build up her army over there.
I just can't see her ferrying over an enormous army.
Edit: Also, on an unrelated note, anyone want to talk about their favourite characters? It's something I've never (or rarely) see in here, so I'd love to see who you're excited to see every week, who you're rooting for, etc.
Everything's going too right for her at the moment and she is getting arrogant.
She'll be left with nothing but her dragons, and she'll fly to Westeros on one of their backs and build up her army over there.
I just can't see her ferrying over an enormous army.
Edit: Also, on an unrelated note, anyone want to talk about their favourite characters? It's something I've never (or rarely) see in here, so I'd love to see who you're excited to see every week, who you're rooting for, etc.
Forceatowulf
G***n S**n*bi
Shit, I forgot how Big those fuckers can potentially be...It's never really elaborated on how exactly they died, nor is the exact age of the dragons used by Aegon to conquer Westeros given. All we know that they could be ridden and that they (later?) grew extremely large.
There is one event that killed off a bunch of dragons some 170 years before the shows time, but it might be brought in the show so I don't want to post it here. Also there's some speculation amongst the readers what caused the rest of the dragons to die off and weaken over time like mentioned in the show, but it's a bit tinfoily and uses material from later down the line.
Dany with a legit freed slave army and three grown ass dragons would be a nightmare to deal with. fuck
"God's Beard!"
Member
Syrio Forel is my favorite character. :-(
Funky Papa
FUNK-Y-PPA-4
I'm still trying to figure out the logistics of feeding three flying beasts of that size.
Victory Red
Member
A couple cows and horses each a day should do it.
Funky Papa
FUNK-Y-PPA-4
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