Super Smash Bros Wii U and 3DS: Info Collection - Dojo, Mega Man and Trailer! 2014!

Guys look at ALL DAT SUCK. Olimar and Ice Climbers? Pfft what ridiculous characters.

Ice Climbers ARE ridiculous. What other character can chain grab you indefinitely from 0%? You got grabbed? Too bad. The only thing that makes up for it is their high skill cap. Even then, it only takes a while to learn how to grab spike.
 
- Wii Fit Trainer: Proof that GAF has superior taste when it comes to game design choices: The character was near-universally praised here,


Not really. I'm sure there is just as many people who think she was a terrible character to add instead of fan favorites. But whats done is done no point to keep arguing with Wii fit fans.
 
After brawl it was like who could they add besides bringing back characters they removed from Melee or a 3rd party that's like an obvious inclusion? Only one I can think of is Little Mac, everyone else is obscure to me.
Toad
Dixie Kong
King K. Rool
Ridley
Little Mac

I think those characters are well-known enough to be considered major newcomers. I certainly wouldn't call them "obscure" to anyone who even remotely cares about Nintendo games.
 
Tier lists make me sad because my main Lucas is shit. :(

And it makes me even sadder because I bet Sakurai is gonna remove him for something dumb like Monita or something.
 
Toad
Dixie Kong
King K. Rool
Ridley
Little Mac

I think those characters are well-known enough to be considered major newcomers. I certainly wouldn't call them "obscure" to anyone who even remotely cares about Nintendo games.

Not to mention new characters. See: The Fire Emblem discussion (Chrom, Avatar/Robin, Lucina). Also Shulk has gotten a lot of mention but I'm not sure Xenoblade was a big enough thing for Sakurai to consider a playable rep from that game. Maybe a stage or assist trophy.
 
Not really. I'm sure there is just as many people who think she was a terrible character to add instead of fan favorites. But whats done is done no point to keep arguing with Wii fit fans.
8da.jpg
 
Guys look at ALL DAT SUCK. Olimar and Ice Climbers? Pfft what ridiculous characters.

My main is last on that list. I don't now how all this is decided but I don't see how Ganon is considered worse in Brawl than he is in Melee. With the exception of being slowed down a bit I thought he was much better in Brawl.
 
And with a ZSS winning apex, I think she deserves to go higher. Though I think that may just being Salem being insane.

If you haven't seen this video, it's incredible. Especially the end. Absolutely insane. (metaknight vs zero suit grand finals)

Characters don't move up just based on a single tournament winning. ZSS also has to have a lot of favorable MUs against the top half of the cast on top of... well, being an overall good character; which I'd argue she isn't too great of a character overall compared to someone like Falco.

I think Salem is just an exceptional player; so much so that if he played someone better he'd have probably taken GFs even easier.
 
Toad
Dixie Kong
King K. Rool
Ridley
Little Mac

I think those characters are well-known enough to be considered major newcomers. I certainly wouldn't call them "obscure" to anyone who even remotely cares about Nintendo games.

I worded my post wrong. I'm sure there are a few they can add, like the protag to their more recent series like a Villager and such. After you get those out of the way you're scraping the bottom of the barrel of characters of, yeah people are aware of them, but the amount that'd want to play as them is small. I'm aware of Waluigi's existence but I do not want to play as him. Dixie or Toad would be way worse than any "waaaaaah clone" character.

The series pretty much has the characters that matter already. Everyone else is like who cares?
 
I don't think we Wii Fit Trainer supporters are really Wii Fit fans.

Never touched wii fit, never will. Ever. It's everything I dislike in videogames and nintendo.

But holy crap her reveal trailer was fantastic and she looks hilarious. Sakurai forever.

Characters don't move up just based on a single tournament winning. ZSS also has to have a lot of favorable MUs against the top half of the cast on top of... well, being an overall good character; which I'd argue she isn't too great of a character overall compared to someone like Falco.

I think Salem is just an exceptional player; so much so that if he played someone better he'd have probably taken GFs even easier.

Yeah, I know. And it's true. I think I'm just salty by still getting hit by the chain grabs still after all this time. -__-

And based on how he played through this years Apex, yeah, salem is just brilliant to watch. Esam's pika is always my favorite though.
 
My main is last on that list. I don't now how all this is decided but I don't see how Ganon is considered worse in Brawl than he is in Melee. With the exception of being slowed down a bit I thought he was much better in Brawl.

he's too slow to hit anything most of the time lol.
 
My main is last on that list. I don't now how all this is decided but I don't see how Ganon is considered worse in Brawl than he is in Melee. With the exception of being slowed down a bit I thought he was much better in Brawl.

Pretty much Ganondorf is nothing like Melee 'Dorf. His options are hugely limited in high level play, he's much too slow of a character to actually pose a threat. High power doesn't mean much when he can't even get the hits in in the first place. Characters like Falco, Marth, MK, Snake, Wario, etc. roll all over him with their superior mobility options OR superior range.

The majority of his match-ups he is disadvantaged in and thus, he isn't viable to win any tournaments (nor has he won any major ones whatsoever). Tier lists are built with a character's MUs in mind, their tournament placings (whether they are consistently in a certain spot or is never seen in tournament play at all), and... something else. But yeah, once all those are figured out it's left up to a vote to determine the exact placements of the characters in their respective tiers.

Tier lists won't matter to you if you don't play competitively, though in some cases it can find its way into casual play... especially in the case for Meta Knight.
 
Not really. I'm sure there is just as many people who think she was a terrible character to add instead of fan favorites. But whats done is done no point to keep arguing with Wii fit fans.

You assume people who like Trainer like Wii Fit.

See, that's not how it works and is a pretty shallow/narrow assumption on why people like characters.
 
I used to think Melee Ganondorf was shit, then I actually tried using him and he is a beast if you can start landing shit. His aerials are insane. He's just kind of bad against faster characters, who happen to be the best in the game, so.
 
- Wii Fit Trainer: Proof that GAF has superior taste when it comes to game design choices: The character was near-universally praised here,

I laughed when I saw her reveal. I thought it was a joke, seriously. I didn't get it at all... I hated her, thought she was a pure waste of a slot. Really wanted to see someone else more noteworthy get a slot.

but then I saw her gameplay footage...

And I said yup. She fits right into Smash. They designed her really well as a character, Almost to the point where Im thinking about maining her. Her dimensions make her pretty agile, Looks like shes great for footsies and quick kills.

Lesson learned : Can't judge anything still you see the footage
 
In Melee if you got touched by Ganondorf you were eating a lot of damage.

In brawl if you get touched by Ganondorf it tickles.

Yeah, pretty much Melee's advanced techs and overall mechanics allowed Ganondorf to get in. Without all of that, he has nothing... other than the amazing forward air. :lol (Which was hugely nerfed in Brawl).
 
I hope with the new changes Sakurai is doing the balances are better, I hope some moves get slightly nerfed. Like Falco's A move, if you ever play online on Brawl with a friend that's all they did till you racked into the high percentages =/
 
Not really. I'm sure there is just as many people who think she was a terrible character to add instead of fan favorites. But whats done is done no point to keep arguing with Wii fit fans.
Wii Fit fans? I don't play Wii Fit, so I don't consider myself a fan. I am, however, a fan of creative character design and of thinking outside the box. Wii Fit Trainer ticks both of those boxes with a giant charcoal pencil.

At a time when guessing the next newcomer felt like scrapping the bottom of the barrel (Brawl having covered so many obvious picks), Wii Fit Trainer is so refreshing. She reaffirms the fact that no matter how clever we all think we are, no matter how thorough we are in poring over all of the possibilities and dissecting them to atoms, Sakurai is still the master and will still surprise and delight us.

Wii Fit Trainer was a highlight of the show, IMO. And this was a damn good show, a show with sequels to my favorite platformers ever (3D World and Tropical Freeze), the wildest-looking Mario Kart yet, a double dose of Platinum Games, the seemingly boundless X, a return to form in portable Zelda, astounding new installments in Final Fantasy and Metal Gear Solid, etc. I'm 110% pleased!
 
Pretty much Ganondorf is nothing like Melee 'Dorf. His options are hugely limited in high level play, he's much too slow of a character to actually pose a threat. High power doesn't mean much when he can't even get the hits in in the first place. Characters like Falco, Marth, MK, Snake, Wario, etc. roll all over him with their superior mobility options OR superior range.

The majority of his match-ups he is disadvantaged in and thus, he isn't viable to win any tournaments (nor has he won any major ones whatsoever). Tier lists are built with a character's MUs in mind, their tournament placings (whether they are consistently in a certain spot or is never seen in tournament play at all), and... something else. But yeah, once all those are figured out it's left up to a vote to determine the exact placements of the characters in their respective tiers.

Tier lists won't matter to you if you don't play competitively, though in some cases it can find its way into casual play... especially in the case for Meta Knight.

Yeah I don't really play competitively. I don't really play one on one matches either. It's always just four player brawls for me and when I play as Ganon I pretty much always win. In my experience it's extremely easy to get kills with Ganon.
 
I loved down throwing then using his f-air or side smash in melee for gnondorf. Oh and star koing people with down-a never got old.
 
Exactly.

After brawl it was like who could they add besides bringing back characters they removed from Melee or a 3rd party that's like an obvious inclusion? Only one I can think of is Little Mac, everyone else is obscure to me.

And you can join him in the corner. All because they're obscure to you doesn't lessen their significance to the people who know them.

Little Mac has to be in though.

My point from the very beginning of this conversation has been that Kid Icarus does not deserve more than two characters. Nothing's changed.

No franchise that isn't Wii Fit/Wii Sports/Wii whatever deserves more reps going into this game if we go by any metric that isn't total time on duty as a gaming franchise.

Guys look at ALL DAT SUCK. Olimar and Ice Climbers? Pfft what ridiculous characters.

Olimar was fucking retarded good from Day 1. I'm a Marth main and it's as if he's specifically designed to fuck me over especially:

- So much visual information on screen because Pikmin running everywhere
- Whistle blowing is a Focus Attack/Parry (There is nothing more infuriating that hitting an Olimar with a tipper then getting smacked in the face with a Purple Pikmin while you're in recovery)
- Spacing game gets nullified because Pikmin run in the way of tippers and spare Olimar

Tier lists make me sad because my main Lucas is shit. :(

And it makes me even sadder because I bet Sakurai is gonna remove him for something dumb like Monita or something.

Holy shit, you're a Lucas bro too? My man.

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Edit: Literally the only two good things about Brawl Dorf vs. Melee Dorf are his Flame Choke side B and that he got a reversible Warlock Punch. When you consider the idea that he shouldn't even have the punch in the first place, that just makes this all sad as fuck.
 
You're pretty much alone in that view man. Half the excitement of a new Smash is the new fighters.

I think his point is more that Brawl cleaned up the last few stray characters we'd been expecting since Smash 64. Diddy, Wario, Olimar, Dedede, Metaknight, even Red were characters that honestly long overdue. Dedede had been cut from 2 Smash bros previously, Diddy and Wario were looonng overdue. Olimar was the big new IP from the GCN era and was a shoe in. They were obvious and without them Brawl would have seemed like it had holes in the roster.

I think he was saying the "Big" obvious characters are already in, which is completely true. Now that Villager and Megaman are announced, they just need to announce Mewtwo and they'd have filled all the holes I felt Brawl had in the roster. Others might not have even cared about those three.

So to me it's hard to think of characters that would be added. I think Mii and Little Mac are "obvious" this time around, but who even knows. It's not really the same as Brawl, there's no glaring holes left in the roster of Nintendo staples.
 
I hope with the new changes Sakurai is doing the balances are better, I hope some moves get slightly nerfed. Like Falco's A move, if you ever play online on Brawl with a friend that's all they did till you racked into the high percentages =/

...His jab...? Just mash the stick away from Falco and you get out asap. Regardless of lag or delay, you'd get out and only take like 5%.
 
My main is last on that list. I don't now how all this is decided but I don't see how Ganon is considered worse in Brawl than he is in Melee. With the exception of being slowed down a bit I thought he was much better in Brawl.

wat

ganon had arthritis in brawl

I worded my post wrong. I'm sure there are a few they can add, like the protag to their more recent series like a Villager and such. After you get those out of the way you're scraping the bottom of the barrel of characters of, yeah people are aware of them, but the amount that'd want to play as them is small. I'm aware of Waluigi's existence but I do not want to play as him. Dixie or Toad would be way worse than any "waaaaaah clone" character.

The series pretty much has the characters that matter already. Everyone else is like who cares?

Basically. It's so bottom of the fucking barrel at this point. Animal Crossing Villager and Wii Fit Trainer. Really?

As I've said before, Brawl's lineup + Mewtwo and Megaman is enough for me. Simon Belmont too ;)

I don't think they'll ever put K Rool or Ridley in Smash if they haven't by now. I bet Ridley will show up as a boss again. K Rool seems to have been forgotten entirely.
 
I hope with the new changes Sakurai is doing the balances are better, I hope some moves get slightly nerfed. Like Falco's A move, if you ever play online on Brawl with a friend that's all they did till you racked into the high percentages =/

My issue with falco is his blaster. It's too good to have hardly any flaws.
 
I laughed when I saw her reveal. I thought it was a joke, seriously. I didn't get it at all... I hated her, thought she was a pure waste of a slot. Really wanted to see someone else more noteworthy get a slot.

but then I saw her gameplay footage...

And I said yup. She fits right into Smash. They designed her really well as a character, Almost to the point where Im thinking about maining her. Her dimensions make her pretty agile, Looks like shes great for footsies and quick kills.

Lesson learned : Can't judge anything still you see the footage

Seriously, when I saw the Joytiq article before the trailer came out and it was just a picture someone took on the show floor, I thought "wait, wut", I was sold once I watched her gameplay trailer.
 
Seriously Toad would be the lamest inclusion.

He's probably the last iconic Mario character to the general public, and given his recent return to Mario platformers (NSMB Wii, NSMB U, SM3DW) they have more than enough abilities to pull from the different games to give him a good moveset while paying homage to recent Mario games.
 
In my head Wii Fit Trainer has the personality of Android 18, with an extra dash of fitness obsession.
 
I'd downright main Toad as much as you hate the little guy, people. He's my favorite Mario character.

He's my man in Mario Kart and I'll always play as him in 3D World. Go mushroom man.
 
My issue with falco is his blaster. It's too good to have hardly any flaws.

It's always been the one thing that makes Falco dominant in both games. It controls space and the pace of the match itself; Falco controls the tempo and can change it in any way he wants. And a lot of it is because you can't clank the laser out like other projectiles in the game. Another part of it is the distance it covers.
 
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