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[Nilaul]

Ill thought Ill share this. Pretty interesting. [Copied from facebook]

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Racial profiling? Why? There were multiple for home robberies in the neighborhood in weeks leading up to this, so naturally Z was on high alert. . Z was known to be a mentor and friend to blacks. He even had a roomate and friends that were black that vouched for him.

1) George Zimmerman publicly testified against the Sanford police department in defense of a homeless black man. In other words, what we have here is more proof that the media narrative surrounding the shooting of Trayvon Martin might just end up being the most disgraced and failed media narrative

2) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4bDOF18xbb0 (skip to 0:50)

NBC shown to edit Z's conversation w/ police dispatch to make him APPEAR racist. but when you listen to the actual clip its clear it was NOT racially motivated.

3) although Zimmerman was possibly negligent, irresponsible and exercised poor judgment, it was not illegal for him to follow Martin, carry a gun when doing so or even ignore the opinion of the civilian 911 dispatcher when advised,

 

[Lysander518]

It happens everyday in other states. People in this thread don't understand that Florida has it flipped. In a lot of states you have to prove your self defense case.

No, you don't. The state has to prove that you are guilty. You do not have to prove your innocence and you never should. The only thing different about the Florida law is that you don't have to make an attempt to avoid the altercation.

 

[United]

This is not why there is still racism in the US. Now I fully understand your mindset and why you made that OJ post earlier.

No you don't know my mindset. Maybe you didn't fully read and comprehend my quote, 'To some extent'. Obviously there are more significant/historical reasons why it continues to exist.

Please don't try to paint me negatively because I have a different opinion than you do.

 

[Yoritomo]

LOL--someone? How about the unarmed person was going to get shot when this fight broke out.

Which is why you don't fight, or do anything that could even potentially lead to a fight if you carry a gun.

 

[TheGreatMightyPoo]

LOL--someone? How about the unarmed person was going to get shot when this fight broke out.

Ummm, one guy has a gun,

That doesn't mean the other guy can't get it from him in a tussle or at least grab the guy around it enough to result in someone using it.

I'm not saying that happened but the gun in play added a dangerous element for sure.

 

[T'Zariah]

Ill thought Ill share this. Pretty interesting. [Copied from facebook]

------

Racial profiling? Why? There were multiple for home robberies in the neighborhood in weeks leading up to this, so naturally Z was on high alert. . Z was known to be a mentor and friend to blacks. He even had a roomate and friends that were black that vouched for him.

1) George Zimmerman publicly testified against the Sanford police department in defense of a homeless black man. In other words, what we have here is more proof that the media narrative surrounding the shooting of Trayvon Martin might just end up being the most disgraced and failed media narrative

2) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4bDOF18xbb0 (skip to 0:50)

NBC shown to edit Z's conversation w/ police dispatch to make him APPEAR racist. but when you listen to the actual clip its clear it was NOT racially motivated.

3) although Zimmerman was possibly negligent, irresponsible and exercised poor judgment, it was not illegal for him to follow Martin, carry a gun when doing so or even ignore the opinion of the civilian 911 dispatcher when advised,

"I have black friends! Therefore I can't be racist!"

 

[Neogaffan]

not sure if is this has been posted
http://abclocal.go.com/kgo/live#

people in oakland are already protesting

 

[Mr. Patch]

No you don't know my mindset. Maybe you didn't fully read and comprehend my quote, 'To some extent'. Obviously there are more significant/historical reasons why it continues to exist.

Please don't try to paint me negatively because I have a different opinion than you do.

Victim blaming...

 

[TruckDriver]

Ill thought Ill share this. Pretty interesting. [Copied from facebook]

------

Racial profiling? Why? There were multiple for home robberies in the neighborhood in weeks leading up to this, so naturally Z was on high alert. . Z was known to be a mentor and friend to blacks. He even had a roomate and friends that were black that vouched for him.

1) George Zimmerman publicly testified against the Sanford police department in defense of a homeless black man. In other words, what we have here is more proof that the media narrative surrounding the shooting of Trayvon Martin might just end up being the most disgraced and failed media narrative

2) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4bDOF18xbb0 (skip to 0:50)

NBC shown to edit Z's conversation w/ police dispatch to make him APPEAR racist. but when you listen to the actual clip its clear it was NOT racially motivated.

3) although Zimmerman was possibly negligent, irresponsible and exercised poor judgment, it was not illegal for him to follow Martin, carry a gun when doing so or even ignore the opinion of the civilian 911 dispatcher when advised,

And that makes it okay that an unarmed kid, doing NOTHING WRONG, is dead how...?

 

[MIMIC]

Not yet.

Then no, because your head isn't being slammed against the concrete in this instance.

If we're talking about Z's story: I just don't think it adds up.

 

[royalan]

Which is why you don't fight, or do anything that could even potentially lead to a fight if you carry a gun.

Bingo

 

[Devolution]

Dude should be guilty of something. Followed an unarmed kid with a gun trying to be some sort of cowboy and ends up killing him. He gets to walk and be able to still use a firearm?

*sigh*

 

[Flo_Evans]

So...if I hate all humans equally?

Go for it.

Like I said before, if someone was doing to me what Zimmerman claimed was happening to him I would shoot/stab/whatever the fuck to get out of that situation.

I'm a peaceful person. I haven't been in a physical fight for over 20 years. I can't even conceive a scenario where I am on neighborhood watch and chasing some dude down in the rain. But I firmly believe in the right to defend yourself. Even with all the bone head maneuvers Zimmerman pulled that night does not cancel out that right.

 

[NinjaKixx]

There are a lot of factually incorrect sentences in this post. I'm on mobile right now but no witness saw the actual fight. The pathologist said it was most likely TM on top when he got shot and no assumptions about the rest of the scuffle. The damage on the head and face was relatively minor when compared to a claim of being bashed against concrete 25 times.

You are just connecting the dots in your head though. In here talking about evidence and you are making shit up.

A witness saw "Downward motions" that when coupled w/ GZ's injuries lead me to believe it was TM punching GZ while on top of him. The Pathologists testimony that TM was on top of GZ when the shot took place further prove that.

I cant argue that GZ exaggerated how many times he was hit, but I dont know his state of mind. He obviously was a terrible fighter so it may have seemed like he was hit more than he really was. All I know is that he was being hit.

 

[Soler]

do you think she's in hell?

This is horrible
Like truly terrible
Now thisis a ban worthy post

 

[Blood Diamonds]

1. TM attempted to avoid a stalker in a car by going between houses which means he had no intent to confront said stalker originally.

2. Rachel stated TM told GZ to get off of him which suggests GZ made an attempt to detain.

3. GZ's account of the story is full of lies. Jumped out of bushes? No bushes near the conflict. Head bashed 25 times against concrete, 2 small scratches doesn't support that at all. TM holding his mouth shut and grabbing for his gun, no evidence on weapon, and yet GZ was screaming the entire time according to the degense.

4. Zimmerman has a history of aggressive behavior.

5. Zimmerman had no defensive wounds, and also unholstered and discharged his weapon on his back. Doesn't prove he brandished the gun but makes it a possibility that he had his hand on his gun the entire time upto discharging his weapon which shows intent based on nothing besides profiling.

So yea, asshole was definately guilty of manslaughter. But you know, florida lol

+1
this really needs more quoting.

 

[Demon Ice]

I've heard the recordings. If you have a functioning brain, you can manage to grab those facts for yourself too, and you can also manage to put two and two together.

Your IQ has to suffer strongly in some capacity for you to make the leap that anything about this is worse than the inarguable fact that SEVENTEEN YEAR OLD TRAYVON MARTIN IS DEAD.

"You're stupid if you don't agree with me" is my favorite type of argument.

Enjoy your break.

 

[Lysander518]

I feel like people see this as a shitty situation and feel that there must be some sort of vengeance. Yes, a kid is dead and that sucks. That does not mean that we should throw a man in jail for murder when it can't be proven that he committed murder.

 

[ReiGun]

Yea...part of the reason racism is still around is because black people don't have a sense of pride...

But wait. When we try to have a sense of pride, people tell us that's racist. "Why be prideful of your race. We're all just people man."

So what do? How do I properly be black?

 

[MThanded]

No, you don't. The state has to prove that you are guilty. You do not have to prove your innocence and you never should. The only thing different about the Florida law is that you don't have to make an attempt to avoid the altercation.

A person claiming self-defense must prove at trial that the self-defense was justified in most places. Not necessary in Florida. I lifted that from a law blog. Please do your research. Maybe I am misunderstanding something. This is on multiple sites .

 

[J10]

 

[Krappadizzle]

not sure if is this has been posted
http://abclocal.go.com/kgo/live#

people in oakland are already protesting

People in Oakland look for reasons to protest. I used to live there. It happened all the time.

 

[NinjaKixx]

Dude should be guilty of something. Followed an unarmed kid with a gun trying to be some sort of cowboy and ends up killing him. He gets to walk and be able to still use a firearm?

*sigh*

This will be my 3rd time saying it in this thread. There should be a law placed on the books about following/pursuing someone while carrying a fire-arm.

 

[Camp Lo]

Finally some clarification as to what's going on.

 

[Tim the Wiz]

Everyone is ignoring the fact that Martin had pics of underage girls nude on his phone, he's a pedo.

This is about to become the new "sprinkle some crack on him" isn't it?

 

[eBay Huckster]

But wait. When we try to have a sense of pride, people tell us that's racist. "Why be prideful of your race. We're all just people man."

So what do? How do I properly be black?

Apparently, don't recognize anything whatsoever about American race relations.

 

[Nilaul]

And that makes it okay that an unarmed kid, doing NOTHING WRONG, is dead how...?

Im pretty sure this quote is about him not necesserly being racialy motivated. It doesnt say if shooting the kid was right or wrong.

I thought I would post a slightly different oppinion to the mix.

 

[TruckDriver]

Go for it.

Like I said before, if someone was doing to me what Zimmerman claimed was happening to him I would shoot/stab/whatever the fuck to get out of that situation.

I'm a peaceful person. I haven't been in a physical fight for over 20 years. I can't even conceive a scenario where I am on neighborhood watch and chasing some dude down in the rain. But I firmly believe in the right to defend yourself. Even with all the bone head maneuvers Zimmerman pulled that night does not cancel out that right.

And I'm sure you haven't been in a fight in over 20 years because you don't go looking for trouble. In my eyes, Zimmerman was looking for trouble that night. That was the biggest bone head move he pulled.

 

[royalan]

Go for it.

Like I said before, if someone was doing to me what Zimmerman claimed was happening to him I would shoot/stab/whatever the fuck to get out of that situation.

I'm a peaceful person. I haven't been in a physical fight for over 20 years. I can't even conceive a scenario where I am on neighborhood watch and chasing some dude down in the rain. But I firmly believe in the right to defend yourself. Even with all the bone head maneuvers Zimmerman pulled that night does not cancel out that right.

And in the circumstances that you just described, why doesn't TM have the right to defend himself?

To not defend yourself against a stranger following you and making an attempt to detain you goes against everything we're taught as children, and that we teach our children.

 

[Devolution]

Everyone is ignoring the fact that Martin had pics of underage girls nude on his phone, he's a pedo.

17 yr olds are pedos. K.

 

[MThanded]

A witness saw "Downward motions" that when coupled w/ GZ's injuries lead me to believe it was TM punching GZ while on top of him. The Pathologists testimony that TM was on top of GZ when the shot took place further prove that.

I cant argue that GZ exaggerated how many times he was hit, but I dont know his state of mind. He obviously was a terrible fighter so it may have seemed like he was hit more than he really was. All I know is that he was being hit.

You are extrapolating. That's not evidence. You don't understand what evidence is.

And to be fair you probably don't grasp that the defense has no burden of proof in Florida self defense cases. The burden always lies in the state. They never had proof of a scenario and try actually didn't need one. The state did.

 

[Angelus Errare]

But wait. When we try to have a sense of pride, people tell us that's racist. "Why be prideful of your race. We're all just people man."

So what do? How do I properly be black?

Spread your cheeks and lift your sack. And don't mention anything about race your president is black.

 

[childplease]

not sure if is this has been posted
http://abclocal.go.com/kgo/live#

people in oakland are already protesting

I notice people in California are usually the ones to riot or protest.

Things have been calm here in Chicago no signs of any unrest. Beautiful day to such a thing too nice weather.

CPD would crack skulls though so I am sure that keeps people from doing dumb stuff.

 

[NinjaKixx]

No, I mean you seem to be approaching this from a strictly rational perspective. Yet, you are constantly engaging with people who are or at least partially are coming at this from an emotional point of view. If you are getting enjoyment out of that...might come off as trolling to some degree. You have the right to post and express yourself, but you also have the right to not post things that will clearly fan flames. I'm not saying you're right or wrong here...I'm not one to judge in these kinds of situations...but you'd probably be able to have to conversation you want to have once things simmer a bit.

You're probably right.

 

[ezekial45]

He actually did make some sense of this.

 

[Angry Fork]

Bring back revolutionary tribunals.

 

[Lysander518]

But wait. When we try to have a sense of pride, people tell us that's racist. "Why be prideful of your race. We're all just people man."

So what do? How do I properly be black?

You don't "be black." You be a human being. People shouldn't have pride because of a coincidence of birth. I don't have pride because I'm a descendant of Irish, Germans, and/or Native Americans. I don't see why this concept is so difficult for people to grasp. IMO pride in one's race is just another stupid division like traditional racism.

 

[Baby Milo]

This is about to become the new "sprinkle some crack on him" isn't it?

that post liferebooted made makes zero sense

man wtf

 

[ReiGun]

Apparently, don't recognize anything whatsoever about American race relations.

Spread your cheeks and lift your sack. And don't mention anything about race your president is black.

I guess you guys are right. But man am I tired of getting fucked.

You don't "be black." You be a human being. People shouldn't have pride because of a coincidence of birth. I don't have pride because I'm a descendant of Irish, Germans, and/or Native Americans. I don't see why this concept is so difficult for people to grasp. IMO pride in one's race is just another stupid division like traditional racism.

It's not a difficult concept to grasp. It's just not a realistic mindset to have.

I am black. My family is black. Even if I decided I wasn't going to recognize myself as "black," the rest of the world, when they look at me is going to see a black man. I can't escape that reality, so I might as well have pride in it.

And as far as I'm concerned, ignoring the things that make us different for the sake of unity is no unity at all. If being proud of a part of my identity (not hating, or saying I hate anyone, just being proud of my race and the history behind it) makes me a racist, I'll be that.

 

[Krappadizzle]

"You're stupid if you don't agree with me" is my favorite type of argument.

Enjoy your break.

 

[Zeus Molecules]

Thanks for the correction.

As for your second point, that -is- my point. Piss poor evidence is used to convict black people of crimes. What I'm seeing in this thread is the call to prosecute Zimmerman using piss poor evidence. Does that mean people in this thread are FOR the prosecution of people using piss poor evidence? I would have expected better. Two wrongs don't make a right.

As for your last point, that wasn't my intention. I understand why people are angry, I am disappointed myself things turned out the way they did. However, you can't convict people over emotional reasons or gut reasons, those are the same reasons that are used to convict black people of so many crimes that they did not commit. There is a disgusting lack of consistency here. People are playing a dangerous "eye for an eye" game when really their efforts should be concentrated on making the law more fair, by IMPROVING IT, not by making it equally bad for everyone.

Your not understanding my point about piss poor evidence being used regularly to convict black youths or the emotions being involved. In the end the victims of these acts and zimmerman fit into the same demographic which speaks clearly where the issue liw. There is no lack of consistency either (also I see how you co-opted my use of the word disgusting.... its not appreciated)

Also f you want to talk about changing laws to fix this thwn lets talk about the elephant in the room George Zimmerman never should og been armed to begin with, and even if armed his erratic behavior before the shooting (calling cops for phantom crimes) should of had his right to carry revoked.

 

[NinjaKixx]

You are extrapolating. That's not evidence. You don't understand what evidence is.

And to be fair you probably don't grasp that the defense has no burden of proof in Florida self defense cases. The burden always lies in the state. They never had proof of a scenario and try actually didn't need one. The state did.

Sorry, Testimony.

 

[TheGreatMightyPoo]

You don't "be black." You be a human being. People shouldn't have pride because of a coincidence of birth. I don't have pride because I'm a descendant of Irish, Germans, and/or Native Americans. I don't see why this concept is so difficult for people to grasp. IMO pride in one's race is just another stupid division like traditional racism.

I'm with you.

Maybe in the minority though.

I don't take pride in anything I had no choice over.

 

[Devolution]

You don't "be black." You be a human being. People shouldn't have pride because of a coincidence of birth. I don't have pride because I'm a descendant of Irish, Germans, and/or Native Americans. I don't see why this concept is so difficult for people to grasp. IMO pride in one's race is just another stupid division like traditional racism.

A lot of marginalized groups tend to have pride in their identity because a larger group of power with more authority is consistently oppressing them.

 

[IrishNinja]

Good, he had every right to do what he did, glad the jury figured that out.

i just wanted you to know
i know things are heated & there's a lotta piss and vinegar being thrown around all over tonight
but you went & made this little post, crying for attention, and no one gave it to you...you must feel awful lonely, huh

*pats head* you don't have to say dumb things to get attention though, my friend...just be yourself and people will come around, you'll see

 

[out0v0rder]

i wish twitter would have existed when oj simpson got away with killing 2 white people.

 

[Crumpet Trumpet]

"You're stupid if you don't agree with me" is my favorite type of argument.

Enjoy your break.

Or he could be stupid because he said that us crucifying a murderer is more sickening than Trayvon being murdered. Come the fuck on.

 

[Casimir]

He wasn't a law enforcement official. He had no directives.

Sorry I was writing that from an assumption of law enforcement. My fault. Rational profiling is not the exclusive domain of official law enforcement but rather a innate/learned survival technique.

Again, as I stated before. Assuming a theoretical perspective, there is no indication (independent of Zimmerman's own testimony) that he wasn't using a acceptable type of profiling in place of a racial one.

A lynching is a murder which goes unpunished due to a prevailing sentiment among the populace that the victim deserved it and that illegally punishing them was justice, often because of their race, a perception that people like them are corrosive to society, or both.

If you don't see the common thread, running through not merely this case but through the treatment of African-American males by the official and unofficial law throughout America's history and present, I'm not sure what to tell you.

Huh, be vague and then try to recover by referencing (or making up, more likely) a new slang for a term that is historically been defined by a single particular act. I bet you feel proud of yourself.

-------------------------------

The common thread that being black is pretty much the worst ethnicity in terms of race-relations and best predictor of incarceration? I'm aware of it. I was aware and took it into account when I made my argument.

Nah, as a black man it's not really irrational to believe you're trying to ice skate uphill. A lot of documented reasons to understand this is more true than just some ideology.

No that's a completely correct assessment of one's own prospects due to race. But the knowledge that one has to 'skate uphill' does excuse lapses in rational evidence based thought that lead to race-antagonistic assumptions based simply on the outcome of a court case where a white came out 'on top' of a black.

 

[Yoritomo]

Then no, because your head isn't being slammed against the concrete in this instance.

If we're talking about Z's story: I just don't think it adds up.

Which is why I carry key chain Pepper spray.

The times you could actually use a gun are really limited, but I'm not willing to deal with a physical altercation either. I lift often enough that anyone willing to fight me is going to be able to do some major damage. So in any situation that force (but not deadly force) could be justified mace in the face and I can continue on with my life with no one dead, or even needing to visit the hospital.

 

[Krappadizzle]

Spread your cheeks and lift your sack. And don't mention anything about race your president is black.

This is your response to his question? Why not say something positive rather than perpetuate a negative "whoa is me" fucking attitude? Be the change you want to see.