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Is it racist if you aren't attracted to a particular race?

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If someone claims that they don't find an entire race attractive I would definitely be suspicious. I could quite easily post attractive women (and men) representing ever race. I understand having preferences but the statement 'I don't find black people attractive' (for example) is ignorant bordering on racist.
 
keuja said:
No it's not racist.
I wish people would stop being so incredibly dense and stop seeing racism everywhere, when in fact this is only just a matter of personal preferences.
Different strokes for different folks. Deal with it.
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I absolutely agree that with any individual person, it's difficult to differentiate between simple personal preference and subconscious racism.

But it's a lot easier to see when you blow the concept up to a larger scale. Going with the above example, if one individual guy doesn't often find black women all that attractive, that can be chalked up to individual preference. But if we scale out and see that in aggregate, across hundreds of millions of men, that black women are disproportionately less likely to be considered attractive, then something larger is going on. Just like it wouldn't be weird for me to roll a standard die and get a 6, but it would be weird if 1 million men rolled a die and 40% of us got a 6. At that point, there would be reason to conclude that something else is going on.
 
Yado said:
A lot of racism is based on ignorance. Of course people are free to date whatever race they want to date, but do some self examination and call it what it is.
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Racism? Nah. Ignorant? Possibly. Bigoted? Maybe. Racist is now a buzzword in America. Every little thing that happens between one race to another is racist.

You made a taxi driver Indian in your movie? Racist. You laughed at a fake asian pilot name on the news? Racist. Racism is the belief you are superior to someone solely for their skin color and that you treat them as if they are inferior to you. Yes you can say that anyone who blanket states I don't date colored guys is possibly racist but it's nothing to shame them for I guess. Anyone you don't deem worthy for yourself is inferior no? If someone says I don't date short people, it's probably the same no? That they are looking at a physical trait that someone has no control over and it's not suitable for them.

Anyways, I'm probably not going to argue my point here, I love women of all color, I guess I just don't like the implications that people should be forced to like someone or be shamed because they don't.

Sutton Dagger said:
If someone claims that they don't find an entire race attractive I would definitely be suspicious. I could quite easily post attractive women (and men) representing ever race. I understand having preferences but the statement 'I don't find black people attractive' (for example) is ignorant bordering on racist.
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But who are you to decide what is attractive to other people? Some people don't think Kate Upton is attractive, some people think Aishwarya Rai is ugly etc. It's all subjective and depends on the individual. Maybe it is subconscious in some form, but just because you find someone attractive doesn't mean all have to.
 
Opiate said:
I absolutely agree that with any individual person, it's difficult to differentiate between simple personal preference and subconscious racism.

But it's a lot easier to see when you blow the concept up to a larger scale. Going with the above example, if one individual guy doesn't often find black women all that attractive, that can be chalked up to individual preference. But if we scale out and see that in aggregate, across hundreds of millions of men, that black women are disproportionately less likely to be considered attractive, then something larger is going on. Just like it wouldn't be weird for me to roll a standard die and get a 6, but it would be weird if 1 million men rolled a die and 40% of us got a 6. At that point, there would be reason to conclude that something else is going on.
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This
 
On another note, I'm always intrigued that people seem to view subconscious preferences as some immutable, essential part of their being, when in most cases they're highly susceptible to influence just like anything else.

If you think your perception of attractiveness or ugliness or happiness or humor are some innate, purely genetic components of your spiritual essence, you probably haven't read a lot of neuroscience or even sociology, because that absolutely isn't the consensus opinion.

Just because you aren't consciously aware that your preferences are being influenced doesn't mean they aren't. I may hold deeply racist beliefs that never even reach the surface of my consciousness -- I may never "know" it, if by "know" we mean think about it consciously. Further, people are highly motivated to never admit these sorts of bigotries even inside their own head, so people will actively work to prevent racist thoughts from ever reaching their conscious mind.

It does not mean that everyone who doesn't like Indian women (or Asian women or Native American women etc.) is a racist, but we shouldn't simply assume "I don't notice it, therefore it doesn't exist" is a logical conclusion.
 
The problem starts when the "race" lines are blurred.

A woman with cliche caucassian facial features but a darker skin tone ?

A non cliche caucassian with cliche facial features that are the cliches to another "race" ?

The already mentioned "you are beautiful asian girl, but I don't date koreans" ....
 
Well, nobody's argued back with me for a while, so I shall take my leave for now.

If I'm still a racist for liking Asian guys, well... a proud racist I am!
 
Hmmmm ... gonna say ... yeeeah.

IMO it's one thing to simply prefer XYZ traits on people ... but for the most part you can be flexible with that, right? I mean, you can PREFER guys wit w/e kinda lips or girls with w/e kinda hips but you may not see that as a deal breaker if they don't have that exact trait.

To ME when I hear "I'm not attracted to blah blah race" it's not that they simply prefer XYZ traits, they have to dislike ABC traits that "define" the appearance of w/e race.

In other words ... there's a difference between saying "I prefer my women like I prefer my bread ... White ;] " and saying "Wheat Bread? LOL, noooope ... I don't eat wheat bread!" in my mind. It's one thing to acknowledge you have a preference but when you say " I don't date X Race" you're moving pass preference for one thing and showing dislike for the other.

Like a girl saying she doesn't date guys shorter than her compared to one who just "prefers" taller guys. One has a preference, the other finds something actually unattractive/ a turn off.

EDIT- Also what Blasty said below.
 
Racism is usually defined as views, practices and actions reflecting the belief that humanity is divided into distinct biological groups called races and that members of a certain race share certain attributes which make that group as a whole less desirable, more desirable, inferior, or superior.
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This is the Wikipedia definition of racism. I would say that not finding an entire race attractive is indeed racism. I would also agree that attraction to different race is social conditioning. Social conditioning is also why society considers white women to be the most attractive (in the U.S).
 
I feel like it's pretty racist, yeah.

It's one thing to say, well I can be attracted to anybody, but I prefer X. It's another thing entirely to say I'm attracted to pretty much everybody except X race of people.

If you're cool with all races except one, you should probably take a good long look at yourself.
 
akira28 said:
plenty of racists and bigots will have sex with the race that they look down upon.
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Take a look at the women those men in power are having sex with. Are they the attractive ones?

Or do you think these men were having sex with the ugly ones to display their power over the rest of the slaves?

Oh wait that's oxymoronic since all races consider beauty a symbol of power so defiling the most attractive woman would be the ultimate display of power over that entire race.

That is straight up racism. Honestly though, your argument doesn't prove whether attraction to a race is racist. It simply isn't. Attraction and the concept of race are independent.
 
Racism: "the belief that certain races of people are by birth and nature superior to others". That is the earliest Webster definition of racism.

Another definition is "hatred of or discrimination against a person or persons based on their race".

Is not wanting to date them discrimination? Possibly. Like I said, I'll buy ignorant, but I wouldn't say it's flat out racism.

What about folks who say I only am attracted to my own race/people who look like me? A lot of asians and indians only date and marry within their own race/culture, would it apply there?
 
Madness said:
When did I say that? I'm saying it's a generalization based on ignorance and no its not racist to say I don't want to date asian people. Lol, like what is this? You can't force someone to like something they don't. There are a lot of variations but pretty much 90% of each race has defining characteristics no? So when they say I don't want to date indians, I doubt they're thinking about the variants that have fair skin and green eyes.

It's why the concept of race is ridiculous because there is so much overlap and mixing that has gone on. If someone said they only date Italians, and yet they see let's say a Syrian that looks just like them, then what?

Is it racist? I don't know. Do you equate personal preference with superiority? Would it make them any less different if they said I don't date black people or Indian or fijian people to, I don't date people with dark skin?
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I agree it's ignorance but to discard your (hypothetical) 10% variation because of the 90% is inherently racist
 
Of course not. No more than being attracted to a certain gender makes you sexist.

I love women of all races. My wife, on the other hand, has expressed to me that she's generally only attracted to white men - I know her better than anyone in the world and can attest that she's not racist. It's simply an aesthetic preference. No more involved than preferring blondes over brunettes, or curvy figures over slim ones.
 
Madness said:
Racism? Nah. Ignorant? Possibly. Bigoted? Maybe. Racist is now a buzzword in America. Every little thing that happens between one race to another is racist.

You made a taxi driver Indian in your movie? Racist. You laughed at a fake asian pilot name on the news? Racist. Racism is the belief you are superior to someone solely for their skin color and that you treat them as if they are inferior to you. Yes you can say that anyone who blanket states I don't date colored guys is possibly racist but it's nothing to shame them for I guess. Anyone you don't deem worthy for yourself is inferior no? If someone says I don't date short people, it's probably the same no? That they are looking at a physical trait that someone has no control over and it's not suitable for them.

Anyways, I'm probably not going to argue my point here, I love women of all color, I guess I just don't like the implications that people should be forced to like someone or be shamed because they don't.



But who are you to decide what is attractive to other people? Some people don't think Kate Upton is attractive, some people think Aishwarya Rai is ugly etc. It's all subjective and depends on the individual. Maybe it is subconscious in some form, but just because you find someone attractive doesn't mean all have to.
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No one is saying that you have to find a particular race attractive, it's not something that is owed or mandatory. Writing off an entire race of people is your prerogative, but it's racist.
 
Wouldn't say it is racist, more uninformed or ignorant. Saying you wouldn't date an entire race of people is basically saying that these race of people all share the specific traits or attributes.
 
I find it bigoted and closed minded, yes.

Turning someone down or looking someone over based on "race" can't be anything else but "racist" or at least racial discrimination. Maybe not in the same way as a Klan member and if it's how you feel then it can't be helped but it's not something to be proud of either.
 
Black-Wind said:
Hmmmm ... gonna say ... yeeeah.

IMO it's one thing to simply prefer XYZ traits on people ... but for the most part you can be flexible with that, right? I mean, you can PREFER guys wit w/e kinda lips or girls with w/e kinda hips but you may not see that as a deal breaker if they don't have that exact trait.

To ME when I hear "I'm not attracted to blah blah race" it's not that they simply prefer XYZ traits, they have to dislike ABC traits that "define" the appearance of w/e race.

In other words ... there's a difference between saying "I prefer my women like I prefer my bread ... White ;] " and saying "Wheat Bread? LOL, noooope ... I don't eat wheat bread!" in my mind. It's one thing to acknowledge you have a preference but when you say " I don't date X Race" you're moving pass preference for one thing and showing dislike for the other.

Like a girl saying she doesn't date guys shorter than her compared to one who just "prefers" taller guys. One has a preference, the other finds something actually unattractive/ a turn off.

EDIT- Also what Blasty said below.
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Very interesting, I never thought of it that way. It is one thing to say "I prefer a trait" but a whole other thing to say "I dislike X trait and find anyone possessing that trait unattractive". You kind of eliminate the possibilities with the later. I don't know if I would call it racists but its pretty shallow to say the least.
 
Madness said:
Racism: "the belief that certain races of people are by birth and nature superior to others". That is the earliest Webster definition of racism.

Another definition is "hatred of or discrimination against a person or persons based on their race".

Is not wanting to date them discrimination? Possibly. Like I said, I'll buy ignorant, but I wouldn't say it's flat out racism.

What about folks who say I only am attracted to my own race/people who look like me? A lot of asians and indians only date and marry within their own race/culture, would it apply there?
Click to expand...

I definitely think it can be, but the underlying assumptions are so deeply subconscious and subtle that it's impossible to tell on an individual basis.

It's the sort of racism for which the effects are only noticeable when looking at a large population size.Let's imagine that a specific guy in the US is not particularly interested in Asian women. Alone, not a problem. But now let's imagine that this general preference is widespread, and we see that Asian women are finding it disproportionately difficult to find a husband. In that case, Asian women are clearly the victim of subconscious racism in some form or fashion, but it would be nearly impossible to pin it to specific individuals as the perpetrators.

I think most racism in America today works that way, in fact. Most people are not consciously racist -- very few people say "I hate Asians" or "I can't stand those blacks" any longer -- and I would even go so far as to say very few people even think these things inside their own head. What racism is still around is all buried deep down, contained in the assumptions we make in our subconscious, so that any individual person doesn't seem to be racist but when we look at the country as a whole we can see some large scale racial trends that can't be rationally explained.
 
NotTheGuyYouKill said:
Look, we all know hot is hot. But do you think it makes you racist if you aren't particularly attracted to a particular race?

btw, not asking about me. I love all hot women of all races. Cause they're hot and they're women and beauty isn't confined to a race. But my cousin says that he just isn't attracted to some women and that he's okay with being a racist about it.

He's kind of awful like that sometimes.
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These threads you've created lately... they're really your issues aren't they?
 
Physiognomy is the most important feature.
Certain features happen to be prominent in particular ethncities.

I'm still waiting for the flat nose that will steal my heart.
 
it's not racist, merely discrimination.
when choosing a partner, a person may discriminate not only by race but by height, weight, eye color, etc.
if a woman only wants to date taller guys, does this imply that she hates short ones? this is rather silly.
 
I don't think so. Sometimes you just can't help how you feel. There are plenty of races qand groups that I couldn't see my self dating. We pick and choose all the time on things not even based on race. That's just on of the many ways we decide on these things.

You aren't required to like everything just because.
 
Madness said:
But who are you to decide what is attractive to other people? Some people don't think Kate Upton is attractive, some people think Aishwarya Rai is ugly etc. It's all subjective and depends on the individual. Maybe it is subconscious in some form, but just because you find someone attractive doesn't mean all have to.
Click to expand...

You don't think it's suspicious when someone claims 'I don't find black people attractive'? Saying you don't find a particular person is attractive is fine, when you expand it to EVERY SINGLE PERSON in an ENTIRE RACE...Well something is up. What is it about the entire race of people that 'turns them off'? Skin tone? Where is the cutoff point in terms of skin colour that delineates attractive from unattractive etc?
 
ntropy said:
it's not racist, merely discrimination.
when choosing a partner, a person may discriminate not only by race but by height, weight, eye color, etc.
if a woman only wants to date taller guys, does this imply that she hates short ones? this is rather silly.
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Yes, yes of course. Tall women wont even look me in the eye!!! >=[

To hell with them!
 
Black-Wind said:
Yeah? Why not?
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Some people don't want to date people who don't look like them/speak their language/share their culture. If they did, we wouldn't have the racial distinctions we do today. At its very basic, kids react to what they see in the mirror, what they see in their family, what they see in their neighborhood or school. So it's not outlandish to think that's what they'll perceive as normal you know? That's why a lot of it becomes taboo then because it's something they're not accustomed to. The Korean woman who brings a black boyfriend to meet the folks, the white woman who dates an Indian man, the black man who brings a Latin woman home etc.

Sutton Dagger said:
You don't think it's suspicious when someone claims 'I don't find black people attractive'? Saying you don't find a particular person is attractive is fine, when you expand it to EVERY SINGLE PERSON in an ENTIRE RACE...Well something is up. What is it about the entire race of people that 'turns them off'? Skin tone? Where is the cutoff point in terms of skin colour that delineates attractive from unattractive etc?
Click to expand...

Suspicious of what? It's not some grand crime to not find a race or group of people attractive. What the hell do I know or care who Becky Sue finds attractive you know?

Where is the cutoff point? I don't know, depends on the individual. This is one of those things people just have to live with I guess.
 
ntropy said:
it's not racist, merely discrimination.
when choosing a partner, a person may discriminate not only by race but by height, weight, eye color, etc.
if a woman only wants to date taller guys, does this imply that she hates short ones? this is rather silly.
Click to expand...

Yes. Waiting for Short-GAF rebellion.

Edit: Too late.
 
Dark Octave said:
I find it bigoted and closed minded, yes.

Turning someone down or looking someone over based on "race" can't be anything else but "racist" or at least racial discrimination. Maybe not in the same way as a Klan member and if it's how you feel then it can't be helped but it's not something to be proud of either.
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I think this is a rather narrow-minded view. Surely you have preferences when it comes to selecting a mate. Just because you enjoy one combination of physical features over another doesn't necessarily mean you dislike or look down on the others. It's "discrimination", sure, but we could all be said to be discriminatory when it comes to selecting potential partners.
 
.GqueB. said:
I don't think so. Sometimes you just can't help how you feel. There are plenty of races qand groups that I couldn't see my self dating. We pick and choose all the time on things not even based on race. That's just on of the many ways we decide on these things.

You aren't required to like everything just because.
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Go on.
 
cutmeamango said:
Physiognomy is the most important feature.
Certain features happen to be prominent in particular ethncities.

I'm still waiting for the flat nose that will steal my heart.
Click to expand...

Hrm...wide flat noses isn't a "racial" trait though. It might be a prominent feature among some people, but not a universal one. And certainly not limited to one ethnicity.

The feature being discussed here is skin color or race. So if that's the trait one judges so negatively, one may wish to do some thinking.
 
Opiate said:
I absolutely agree that with any individual person, it's difficult to differentiate between simple personal preference and subconscious racism.

But it's a lot easier to see when you blow the concept up to a larger scale. Going with the above example, if one individual guy doesn't often find black women all that attractive, that can be chalked up to individual preference. But if we scale out and see that in aggregate, across hundreds of millions of men, that black women are disproportionately less likely to be considered attractive, then something larger is going on. Just like it wouldn't be weird for me to roll a standard die and get a 6, but it would be weird if 1 million men rolled a die and 40% of us got a 6. At that point, there would be reason to conclude that something else is going on.
Click to expand...

Or most people just have the same preferences regarding physical traits they would like to see in their partner.

At any given time, a society tends to have a common standard of beauty so it would make sense that most people would be attracted to a common type of characteristics which could be more frequently found in certain races than in others.

So you are right, it is probably partly due to subconscious external societal / family / peers influence but this is unavoidable. We are not growing up in vacuum and this is an integral part of how one’s personality and character (including such preferences about partners) are built.
 
Opiate said:
I definitely think it can be, but the underlying assumptions are so deeply subconscious and subtle that it's impossible to tell on an individual basis.

It's the sort of racism for which the effects are only noticeable when looking at a large population size.Let's imagine that a specific guy in the US is not particularly interested in Asian women. Alone, not a problem. But now let's imagine that this general preference is widespread, and we see that Asian women are finding it disproportionately difficult to find a husband. In that case, Asian women are clearly the victim of subconscious racism in some form or fashion, but it would be nearly impossible to pin it to specific individuals as the perpetrators.

I think most racism in America today works that way, in fact. Most people are not consciously racist -- very few people say "I hate Asians" or "I can't stand those blacks" any longer -- and I would even go so far as to say very few people even think these things inside their own head. What racism is still around is all buried deep down, contained in the assumptions we make in our subconscious, so that any individual person doesn't seem to be racist but when we look at the country as a whole we can see some large scale racial trends that can't be rationally explained.
Click to expand...

Exactly. When people explain that they "just aren't attracted" to black people or Asian people, you can't just say, "You're racist for not finding so-and-so attractive." It's not racist in the sense that most people use the word; it doesn't necessarily indicate conscious, individual prejudices. But you can acknowledge that any person's preferences are not simply created ex nihilo, and argue that if this is widespread, it probably implies that there is something racist about how that person's society determines what is attractive.

And personally I found that reexamining why I didn't find certain kinds people attractive, or at least was attracted to them less often - rather than simply believing that it was "just my preferences" or "just normal" or whatever - has had the effect of, I guess, broadening my tastes. I'm not really comfortable talking more specifically than that but suffice to say I don't think that this conversation is completely academic.
 
.GqueB. said:
I don't think so. Sometimes you just can't help how you feel. There are plenty of races qand groups that I couldn't see my self dating. We pick and choose all the time on things not even based on race. That's just on of the many ways we decide on these things.

You aren't required to like everything just because.
Click to expand...

Even if I were to agree with your premise, I don't think "you can't help how you feel" means that something isn't racist. Maybe people shouldn't be blamed for the racism in the traditional sense of the word "blame", but that doesn't stop it from being racist.

As an example to explain what I mean, lots of people in the 1850s were obviously racist against black people, and in many cases it's not because they were born with innate, seething hatred of blacks. They were highly influenced by the culture and attitudes around them. It doesn't suddenly make it not racist just because people didn't consciously, willfully choose to spite people.

Again, I think many people seem to have this sense that racism only presents as a consciously chosen, deliberate desire to hate others, and that subconscious feelings or thoughts can't be racist because you don't know they're there. I don't think that's logical.
 
Eidan said:
Go on.
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Lawyers
Body builders
Women with crew cuts or fades
Women with flat butts
Women with breast that are TOO big
Women that are substantially taller than me
Excons
Obese women
Women who love to travel
Women who don't shave

I could go on and on. This is something we do in our everyday lives. If we fault someone for not being attracted to a particular race then where does it stop really? Do we fault someone for not liking women with intense unibrows... add that to my list actually. Not to say Id never in a million years date someone from these groups but chances are they aren't women I'd seek out.
 
maybe if you aren't attracted to a certain physical aspect common in a certain race I guess, but there are too many exceptions to flat out not be attracted to a certain race.
 
Madness said:
Suspicious of what? It's not some grand crime to not find a race or group of people attractive. What the hell do I know or care who Becky Sue finds attractive you know?

Where is the cutoff point? I don't know, depends on the individual. This is one of those things people just have to live with I guess.
Click to expand...

Suspicious of the notion that not a single black person (example) is attractive to them? The way it is typically framed ' I don't find black people attractive' usually underlines some personal preference they have noticed among some people of a particular race, which they then ascribe to everyone. You can find every conceivable trait within every race, we aren't talking about homogeneous groups here, so when someone makes that claim, they look extremely ignorant.
 
Sutton Dagger said:
Suspicious of the notion that not a single black person (example) is attractive to them? The way it is typically framed ' I don't find black people attractive' usually underlines some personal preference they have noticed among some people of a particular race, which they then ascribe to everyone. You can find every conceivable trait within every race, we aren't talking about homogeneous groups here, so when someone makes that claim, they look extremely ignorant.
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I agree they do look ignorant and stupid. But racist in the way I define racism? No. And I meant suspicious in the sense like what of it. You can't change what they think, and I don't know if I would like to be shamed for who/what I liked you know. But we can agree it's ridiculous. There isn't a single race/culture I don't find attractive. If someone doesn't date a race of people, it's better for the rest of us who can.
 
akira28 said:
Hrm...wide flat noses isn't a "racial" trait though. It might be a prominent feature among some people, but not a universal one. And certainly not limited to one ethnicity.

The feature being discussed here is skin color or race. So if that's the trait one judges so negatively, one may wish to do some thinking.
Click to expand...

Skin complexion isn't of much importance to me (even though I have a preference for mediterranean tans :S), but it is quite understandable. It is a large part of visual stimuli. Colors.

Thing is, people love to think of extremes, and often people express themselves in broad statements.
I can find myself saying: "I don't find northerners attractive" which actually stems from a more comprehensive statement: "More often than not, I find northerners not attractive.".
But that is not the same as "There are no attractive northerners." and even less so than "I'd never date a northerner.".

But to serve internet discussion, some will "infer" the last.
 
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