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[Forsaken82]

In regards to that GTAV gif...

is it my computer screen (or the GIF compression) or is sweat collecting on his back? If so... THAT is a nice detail. (yes i guess this is off topic, but since everyone else is focusing so much on it!)

 

[phosphor112]

I took it to mean that on paper it looks to be just a bit more capable than the PS360 but that it performs above what you might expect from it. That's why I feel that by the end of the gen,(If the resources are allocated) we may see games on the Wii U that look comparatively better than launch Xbox1 and PS4 games. Hell, there were games on the Wii that I think look better than many launch PS360 games, albeit at a lower resolution. That gap was much, much larger than this one in terms of power.
Mario Galaxy 2 being one of them.

That could very well be possible. We have a lot of cross gen stuff. I could see it happening.

In regards to that GTAV gif...

is it my computer screen (or the GIF compression) or is sweat collecting on his back? If so... THAT is a nice detail. (yes i guess this is off topic, but since everyone else is focusing so much on it!)

It is darker there, but it might be just compression artifact. I doubt it's sweat though.

 

[krizzx]

Wii U is just a step above the previous gen. X, though superior to any 360 game, is only a tad more so than the bottom game (though I am not invalidating arguments that the bottom gif is actually superior, that game does have an obscene budget).

That is impossible to conclude from those shots. What you are seeing from GTAV is an actual gameplay screen made to show off people in a single area specifically. What you are seeing in X is just a scene to showcase the main character walking down the side walk.

Areas in Xenoblade had more characters gathered in a single spot then either of those gifs are showing, and doubt Monoliths project has less characters on screen than the Wii game its based on does.

Also, that is clearly just a shadow though making it appear to be sweat would require nothing more than the darkening on of the palette on the back of his shirt. That wouldn't be much of an effect at all even if he actually had sweat dripping off of him. Tech like that has existed since the sixth gen.

 

[foxuzamaki]

The PC will get ports of PS4/XB1 games for the next 5-8 years, while the WiiU won't. That's a big deal. The difference between WiiU and it's next-gen competition is by no means made smaller because PCs will keep getting more powerful..

The WiiU is a fine piece of hardware for what it is, but I'm afraid third parties will leave it behind..

nobody is in here to discuss this

 

[phosphor112]

That is impossible to conclude from those shots. What you are seeing from GTAV is an actual gameplay screen made to show off people in a single area specifically. What you are seeing in X is just a scene to showcase the main character walking down the side walk.

Areas in Xenoblade had more characters gathered in a single spot then either of those gifs are showing, and doubt Monoliths project has less characters on screen than the Wii game its based on does.

Also, that is clearly just a shadow though making it appear to be sweat would require nothing more than the darkening on of the palette on the back of his shirt. That wouldn't be much of an effect at all if he actually had sweat dripping off of him. Tech like that has existed since the sixth gen.

What make believe place is that? One of the most populated places in the game is Colony 6. And even that barely had people. More people walk around in Oblivion than they do in Xenoblade.

 

[Nostremitus]

I dunno, the colony 9 market has quite a few people at the right time of day... Or really anywhere in colony 9 at the right time of day. And almost every character in the game has their own schedules and lives they live. Thats why its so damned hard to find the NPC for a quest sometimes. but other than, I'd have to agree.

and with that I'm backing away, don't want to turn this into a Xenoblade thread... even if it has become an X cross GTAV thread as of late.

 

[krizzx]

This is just a small thing that a lot of people seem to forget regarding the differences between the consoles strengths vs generation, but "most" of the games on the 360 and PS3 ran at sub HD resolutions upscaled to 720p and only ran at 30 FPS in most cases. All of the non-ported games on the Wii U run at no less than 720p 60 or 1080p 30 fps+ on top of having higher res textures and better shading.

There have been a substantial number of 1080p games released on and announced for the Wii U. The console isn't even a year old yet. That is more than "slightly" better if you ask me.

 

[Interceptor]

So why are we compairing PC gifs of gta v with x again? and why is this giving us any indication about how the wii u performs against a 360? and why are we doing this in this thread?

 

[Riki]

So why are we compairing PC gifs of gta v with x again? and why is this giving us any indication about how the wii u performs against a 360? and why are we doing this in this thread?

GDDR5

 

[OminoMichelin]

So why are we compairing PC gifs of gta v with x again? and why is this giving us any indication about how the wii u performs against a 360? and why are we doing this in this thread?

I've been wondering for the past few hours as well. The last couple pages look incredibly silly to me.

 

[krizzx]

So why are we compairing PC gifs of gta v with x again? and why is this giving us any indication about how the wii u performs against a 360? and why are we doing this in this thread?

Because there are a lot of people who who seem to have an emotional investment in Sony/Microsoft products because superior to Nintendo's in every and want this console to be viewed as negatively as possible for some reason.

The entire point of comparison, from the normal posters, is to analyze the "potential" capabilities of the GPU through contrasts with similar games, but you will always have people who come in here for no other reason than to dismiss any gains promoted, promote the older hardware they prefer over it and try their hardest to see to it that the lowest end assumptions are always accepted at the absolute limit of capability for Nintendo hardware..

Mentions of Monoliths X seem to be a hotbed for this. I've seen it compared to Killzone, God of War and now game that hasn't even released yet.

 

[StevieP]

Because there are a lot of people who who seem to have an emotional investment in Sony/Microsoft products because superior to Nintendo's in every and want this console to be viewed as negatively as possible for some reason.

To be fair, the emotional investment clearly goes both ways. As is the case with most of the threads on this forum in general.

 

[NBtoaster]

So why are we compairing PC gifs of gta v with x again? and why is this giving us any indication about how the wii u performs against a 360? and why are we doing this in this thread?

No reason to think its PC footage.

 

[joesiv]

Or you could choose not to take one thing out of context.

This is the original quote from Eurogamer.

I realize that this quote is vague and people draw their own conclusions, but he said the same thing twice. Once was compared to it's power envelope, the other compared to its capabilities compared to PS360. Specifically, the quote was about the CPU. I understood his statement to mean exactly what I posted before. The CPU is weaker in some areas because it wasn't designed to carry the GPU but stronger in the areas it was designed to be.

Well, re-reading your quotes (thanks for re-posting that), it still is vague. The first quote is comparing to the how many watts it consumes, which means not much considering the Wii U consumes much less than any other console. The next two quotes are just general quotes about how it's stronger but weaker in some areas, and how it shouldn't be looked at just by it's specs.

Nothing conclusive IMO.

 

[krizzx]

To be fair, the emotional investment clearly goes both ways. As is the case with most of the threads on this forum in general.

No it doesn't. I don't by into obligatory blaming. There are few people in this thread who I would call Nintendo supporters or say have an emotional investment in the hardware.


Its mostly just people who view it neutrally and people who disparage the hardware at every given opportunity.

Even during the rare occurrence that a big Nintendo fan does show up, they are usually more rational and open minded than the ones who come in here trying to nitpick at screen shots in favor of the PS3/360 and and outright dismiss anything said in favor of the Wii U GPU with no logical analysis or facts provided whatsoever.

 

[tkscz]

Damn look at all that fog in X.

lighting effects are fog now?

 

[QaaQer]

No it doesn't. I don't by into obligatory blaming. There are few people in this thread who I would call Nintendo supporters or say have an emotional investment in the hardware.


Its mostly just people who view it neutrally and people who disparage the hardware at every given opportunity.

Even during the rare occurrence that a big Nintendo fan does show up, they are usually more rational and open minded than the ones who come in here trying to nitpick at screen shots in favor of the PS3/360 and and outright dismiss anything said in favor of the Wii U GPU with no logical analysis or facts provided whatsoever.

90% of this thread is NDF vs the anti-NDF. Neutral posters have given their opinions on the Wii U's gpu (which turned out to be 'worst case scenario' unfortunately) and don't post hardly at all in this thread. To think there is no Ninty bias here is just wrong, because whenever the tech types posted anything that was less than complementary, the knives would come out.

At the end of the day the console just isn't that interesting; not to consumers, not to modders, and not to non-nintendo developers. And so, whatever the potential of the console is, nobody is going to spend the money to max it out, not even Nintendo.

 

[Apophis2036]

I doubt you were intending to be, but that's how he took it. It was a bit condescending, to be honest.

Fair enough. When I used to read/post in the WUST's there were quite a few people who admitted they were 'Nintendo only gamers'.

If all you had played for the past gen was Wii then a lot of the games that look good on PS360 would also look really impressive to them on WiiU (including the ports).

It wasn't meant to be smart or put anyone down, it was a genuine question to try and understand why people find a lot of the WiiU games so amazing looking.

 

[phosphor112]

So why are we compairing PC gifs of gta v with x again? and why is this giving us any indication about how the wii u performs against a 360? and why are we doing this in this thread?

GDDR5

Because there are a lot of people who who seem to have an emotional investment in Sony/Microsoft products because superior to Nintendo's in every and want this console to be viewed as negatively as possible for some reason.

The entire point of comparison, from the normal posters, is to analyze the "potential" capabilities of the GPU through contrasts with similar games, but you will always have people who come in here for no other reason than to dismiss any gains promoted, promote the older hardware they prefer over it and try their hardest to see to it that the lowest end assumptions are always accepted at the absolute limit of capability for Nintendo hardware..

Mentions of Monoliths X seem to be a hotbed for this. I've seen it compared to Killzone, God of War and now game that hasn't even released yet.

Just want to clarify... that's not the "PC version" of GTA5.

http://www.rockstargames.com/newswi...auto-v-official-gameplay-video.html/#comments

Here is a comment directly from an employee.

 

[Apophis2036]

Uhh, yeah, check this out: http://i.imgur.com/BSE7yyA.jpg The low-res buildings hurt my eyes. Oh wait, it's a work in progress, like any other game for Wii U we mentioned above. Well, except Infamous should release pretty early next year.

Troll much ?, great a terrible screen grab taken from Youtube, here is how actual gameplay really looks -

Gameplay video (watch in 1080p) -

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sPXz-DAPjsY

 

[OG_Original Gamer]

Wii U is just a step above the previous gen. X, though superior to any 360 game, is only a tad more so than the bottom game (though I am not invalidating arguments that the bottom gif is actually superior, that game does have an obscene budget).

The problem with this comparison, GTA is a end gen game and we all know what that means. X is at a different level when it comes to the amount of detail on mechs and humans. That's without pointing out draw distance or the level detail on monsters.

 

[diaspora]

Troll much ?, great a terrible screen grab taken from Youtube, here is how actual gameplay really looks -

Gameplay video (watch in 1080p) -

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sPXz-DAPjsY

Yow. How do I texture filtering.

 

[tkscz]

Troll much ?, great a terrible screen grab taken from Youtube, here is how actual gameplay really looks -

Gameplay video (watch in 1080p) -

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sPXz-DAPjsY

This doesn't look much better.

 

[Starfish Hero]

Troll much ?, great a terrible screen grab taken from Youtube, here is how actual gameplay really looks -

Gameplay video (watch in 1080p) -

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sPXz-DAPjsY

As others have said, the problem with this and the last picture are the low-res textures on the buildings in the background. The only thing your picture improves upon is having less buildings in the background.

 

[OG_Original Gamer]

This doesn't look much better.

What's obvious is polygons, texture resolution, and render resolution. Only thing at least from this static image that doesn't stand out is lighting. I'm not talking about bloom.

 

[StevieP]

No it doesn't. I don't by into obligatory blaming. There are few people in this thread who I would call Nintendo supporters or say have an emotional investment in the hardware.


Its mostly just people who view it neutrally and people who disparage the hardware at every given opportunity.

Even during the rare occurrence that a big Nintendo fan does show up, they are usually more rational and open minded than the ones who come in here trying to nitpick at screen shots in favor of the PS3/360 and and outright dismiss anything said in favor of the Wii U GPU with no logical analysis or facts provided whatsoever.

Some are more open minded and rational, and others are emotional just as any other "fan" of a company. It happens pretty much in every thread of this forum.

This doesn't look much better.

No (the extremely low res texture work is still in play), but it does feature a mystically high level of AA on certain edges (outside of the post processing I mean). And by that I mean it's still a bullshot.

I think the current discussion has trailed off from the intend of this thread. Now it has turned into a pic comparison showdown.

This thread has been comically off topic for pages now. It's unfortunate.

 

[OryoN]

I think the current discussion has trailed off from the intend of this thread. Now it has turned into a pic comparison showdown.

 

[DrWong]

I think the current discussion has trailed off from the intend of this thread. Now it has turned into a pdic comparison showdown.

.

 

[Apophis2036]

It's not going to compete with PC, but neither are PS4 or Xbox1. However, if you ask me, I expect Wii U is much closer to those consoles than either of them will be to High end PCs or mid tier PC's an a couple of years. That's why I don't see what the big deal is. In the end, it's no where near as large a divide as there was last gen between consoles, and none of the new consoles are bleeding edge in any way, Unless you want to count PS4's memory, but then a large portion of that will be used for processes that aren't going to get the proper use out of it's higher bandwidth anyway.

At least, that's my impression so far.

I don't agree at all, even ignoring gameplay videos of the likes of Killzone Shadow Fall, Infamous Second Son, Driveclub, Dead Rising 3 and Ryse it's still a massive difference in CPU / GPU speed / cores / shaders and memory bandwidth on paper -


CPU -

PS4 - 8 Core @ 1.6 GHz.
XBO - 8 Core @ 1.6 GHz.
WiiU - 3 Core @1.2GHz.


GPU -

PS4 - 1.8 TFLOPs / DirectX 11 equivalent feature set.
XBO - 1.3 TFLOPs / DirectX 11.1 equivalent feature set.
WiiU - 176 GFLOPs / DirectX 10.1 equivalent feature set.


RAM (Dedicated to games only) -

PS4 - 5GB @ 176GB/s.
XBO - 5GB @ 60GB/s + 32MB of sRAM @ 102 GB/s.
WiiU - 1GB @ 12.8GB/s + 32MB of eDRAM @ 70GB/s.

All PS4 and XBO games can also be installed to their HDD's.

 

[OG_Original Gamer]

I don't agree at all, even ignoring gameplay videos of the likes of Killzone Shadow Fall, Infamous Second Son, Driveclub, Dead Rising 3 and Ryse it's still a massive difference in CPU / GPU speed / cores / shaders and memory bandwidth on paper -


CPU -

PS4 - 8 Core @ 1.6 GHz.
XBO - 8 Core @ 1.6 GHz.
WiiU - 3 Core @1.2GHz.


GPU -

PS4 - 1.8 TFLOPs / DirectX 11 equivalent feature set.
XBO - 1.3 TFLOPs / DirectX 11.1 equivalent feature set.
WiiU - 176 GFLOPs / DirectX 10.1 equivalent feature set.


RAM (Dedicated to games only) -

PS4 - 5GB @ 176GB/s.
XBO - 5GB @ 60GB/s + 32MB of sRAM @ 102 GB/s.
WiiU - 1GB @ 12.8GB/s + 32MB of eDRAM @ 70GB/s.

All PS4 and XBO games can also be installed to their HDD's.

Your eDRAM bandwidth is far from fact, unless a licensed dev member.

 

[Interceptor]

Troll much ?, great a terrible screen grab taken from Youtube, here is how actual gameplay really looks -

Gameplay video (watch in 1080p) -

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sPXz-DAPjsY

I would love to explain in detail how unimpressed and even bored i am by this video but i don´t want to derail this thread even further.

 

[Apophis2036]

Your eDRAM bandwidth is far from fact, unless a licensed dev member.

I thought 70GB/s was the generally accepted speed for the eDRAM (much like the 176GFLOPs for the GPU).

 

[Nostremitus]

I don't agree at all, even ignoring gameplay videos of the likes of Killzone Shadow Fall, Infamous Second Son, Driveclub, Dead Rising 3 and Ryse it's still a massive difference in CPU / GPU speed / cores / shaders and memory bandwidth on paper -


CPU -

PS4 - 8 Core @ 1.6 GHz.
XBO - 8 Core @ 1.6 GHz.
WiiU - 3 Core @1.2GHz.


GPU -

PS4 - 1.8 TFLOPs / DirectX 11 equivalent feature set.
XBO - 1.3 TFLOPs / DirectX 11.1 equivalent feature set.
WiiU - 176 GFLOPs / DirectX 10.1 equivalent feature set.


RAM (Dedicated to games only) -

PS4 - 5GB @ 176GB/s.
XBO - 5GB @ 60GB/s + 32MB of sRAM @ 102 GB/s.
WiiU - 1GB @ 12.8GB/s + 32MB of eDRAM @ 70GB/s.

All PS4 and XBO games can also be installed to their HDD's.

http://www.custompcreview.com/compu...l-gaming-pc-build-under-1500-june-2013/18040/

Click that link, realize that it's nowhere near ultra high end, and compare it against the numbers you just posted and tell me if your post in any way invalidated my previous statement.

Then click this one
http://www.custompcreview.com/compu...rkstation-build-under-2500-august-2013/18444/

 

[Apophis2036]

http://www.custompcreview.com/compu...l-gaming-pc-build-under-1500-june-2013/18040/

Click that link, realize that it's nowhere near ultra high end, and compare it against the numbers you just posted and tell me if your post in any way invalidated my previous statement.

I literally have no idea why you just linked me to a $1500 state of the art gaming PC ?...

My point was that WiiU is much, much closer to eight year old consoles than it is to the two new consoles being released in three months.

I guess you want to bring in high end gaming PC's to make PS4/XBO look just as weak as WiiU does to PS4/XBO ?.

 

[Nostremitus]

I literally have no idea why you just linked me to a $1500 state of the art gaming PC ?...

My point was that WiiU is much, much closer to eight year old consoles than it is to the two new consoles being released in three months.

I guess you want to bring in high end gaming PC's to make PS4/XBO look just as weak as WiiU does to PS4/XBO ?.

My statement was that the Wii U is closer to Xbox1 and PS4 than they are to high end PCs. You said that you completely disagreed. So I linked you to a mid-tier gaming rig that blows the xbox1 and PS4 out of the water and shows that they are closer to Wii U compared to PCs than you'd apparently like to admit.
and again, you should probably read the posts you are responding to before replying. You were talking about high end gaming rigs already if you were replying to me. If not, then I have no idea why you randomly posted that wall of specs in response to my post.

Nevermind, I'm done. You can't have a conversation with someone who isn't even reading the posts and is instead responding to what thay assume may have been said.

 

[megabytecr]

At this point we are kind of stuck as far as HW analysis goes, so IMO we only have the games we have seen to discuss and the rare quotes by dev, but it always results in either PS4 XB1 screens or some other current gen game like TLOU and GTA V.

I am pretty comfortable with the Wii U 2.5-3x more powerful than that of X360. Also the advantage in RAM and the memory subsystem built for efficiency plus the DX10.1 feature set of the GPU will propel the Wii U games fairly above the PS360.

 

[Apophis2036]

My statement was that the Wii U is closer to Xbox1 and PS4 than they are to high end PCs. You said that you completely disagreed. So I linked you to a mid-tier gaming rig that blows the xbox1 and PS4 out of the water and shows that they are closer to Wii U compared to PCs than you'd apparently like to admit.
and again, you should probably read the posts you are responding to before replying. You were talking about high end gaming rigs already if you were replying to me. If not, then I have no idea why you randomly posted that wall of specs in response to my post.

Nevermind, I'm done. You can't have a conversation with someone who isn't even reading the posts and is instead responding to what thay assume may have been said.

I had no idea why you were talking about PC's to begin with tbh, it's a silly comparison because as you have just shown by linking a PC which costs as much as PS4, XBO and WiiU combined with change left over for 5 brand new games.

This thread is about the WiiU GPU, since we don't have official specs for it we can only gauge it's power by comparing it to PS360 and PS4/XBO games in finding out where it sits in between them. That is the only reason I have linked pics of those games, for comparison to try and narrow down the WiiU GPU's potential power.

I think my posts have been more productive than the same people linking the same three X gifs over and over and over again...

Anyway I don't want to cause any bad feeling, so I'm out of here.

 

[TAS]

This, combined with the fact that the Wii U CPU only uses one core unless you specifically program it to use the other two (Something a lot of devs didn't seem to know until recently), means that it had a lot more overhead when running code for the older systems.

You learn something new everyday. Thanks.

 

[airmangataosenai]

The problem with this comparison, GTA is a end gen game and we all know what that means. X is at a different level when it comes to the amount of detail on mechs and humans. That's without pointing out draw distance or the level detail on monsters.

The humans in X look worse than some PS2 games. There's a reason why the trailers all avoid showing their faces except that brief moment in the original trailer.

 

[BLACK AMERICAN PSYCHO]

The humans in X look worse than some PS2 games. There's a reason why the trailers all avoid showing their faces except that brief moment in the original trailer.

Hahahaha GOD DAMN

 

[Jrs3000]

You learn something new everyday. Thanks.

Yeah. To think launch ports that ran good on a double threaded, high clock Xenon are running on 1 Wii U core is impressive.

 

[Mithos]

This, combined with the fact that the Wii U CPU only uses one core unless you specifically program it to use the other two (Something a lot of devs didn't seem to know until recently), means that it had a lot more overhead when running code for the older systems.

You sure this is still the case, I know Ideaman spoke about this way before Wii U were released, and later after release confirmed that this was the thing he had been talking about before release, that some developers had been not running on all cores.

But still? Shouldn't everyone have fixed this issue by now?

 

[OG_Original Gamer]

I thought 70GB/s was the generally accepted speed for the eDRAM (much like the 176GFLOPs for the GPU).

Even the FLOPs numbers are far from fact, just because some moderately internet educated guys using third hand knowledge give their opinion and a few agree doesn't make them facts. They may be theoretically close.

Alphas, shaders, transparencies eat up way to much bandwidth. X, Bayonetta 2 would not be able to sustain the suggested or advertised frame rates mentioned with a paltry bandwidth performance of 70GB/s. Especially considering the fact that MEM1 only has 12.8 to work with, which would be eaten up with texture resolutions higher than current gen hardware. MEM1 more than likely houses the frame buffer ad well.

What's worse is that bandwidth numbers are theoretically peak. So you won't even reach that in real world performance.

 

[guek]

I find all the infamous 2nd son praise a bit funny since I think it looks a lot like current gen game, current gen geometry, but at 1080p with AA.

And yes, just managing that requires a substantial leap above current gen (and wii u). At this point, I think a lot of what constitutes as impressive will come down to the eye of the beholder. Remember the PS4 reveal? Remember the widespread reaction of "that's it? this is next gen?" by journalists that were at that event?

Lots of gaffers wet their pants too, and that's perfectly fine, but I do think we're getting awfully close to the point where stuff just looks good and everything else is just gravy. Some people will exclaim "you're blind!" and whatnot but that's just how I feel. Comparing X and GTA for example is pretty silly imo. Both are great looking games and I think that's all that matters.

I just hope GTAV has a steady framerate and avoids screen tearing. Sadly, I'm pretty pessimistic about that.

 

[Nostremitus]

You sure this is still the case, I know Ideaman spoke about this way before Wii U were released, and later after release confirmed that this was the thing he had been talking about before release, that some developers had been not running on all cores.

But still? Shouldn't everyone have fixed this issue by now?

It's not the case anymore, but we were talking about launch games.
IIRC, Ideaman said the increase wouldn't be seen on the launch games because they were too far in development when it was realized, hence my statement.

 

[TAS]

How can the Wii U GPU only be 176 GFlops when the XB360 is 240? I don't think you need to be a tech guru to know something is wrong here.

 

[roddur]

@Apophis2036, buddy, fucking sale your wii u. the machine is not for you and selling it will save you a lot of energy. why i'm saying this you ask? i think you derailed the thread very much and you are not stopping.

sorry for the jerk reaction, but...

 

[USC-fan]

How can the Wii U GPU only be 176 GFlops when the XB360 is 240? I don't think you need to be a tech guru to know something is wrong here.

To be fair im pretty sure that 240 Glfop number is wrong and x360 GPU is like 215 Gflops. It been so long since i have look at the number but i know 240gflop is quoted all over the place but i dont think that is correct.

 

[lwilliams3]

You sure this is still the case, I know Ideaman spoke about this way before Wii U were released, and later after release confirmed that this was the thing he had been talking about before release, that some developers had been not running on all cores.

But still? Shouldn't everyone have fixed this issue by now?

Yea, we are not sure on how widespread the problem was, but Ideaman stated that those devs somehow missed utilizing an entire core up until a few weeks before launch. The issue is probably resolved now, though it may still take some time for devs to optimize their games to take more significant use of Wii U's hardware.

To be fair im pretty sure that 240 Glfop number is wrong and x360 GPU is like 215 Gflops. It been so long since i have look at the number but i know 240gflop is quoted all over the place but i dont think that is correct.

Hmm, I'm interested if we can find a source for that 215GFLOPS number.

 

[foxuzamaki]

The humans in X look worse than some PS2 games. There's a reason why the trailers all avoid showing their faces except that brief moment in the original trailer.

one thing to note this is the model they showed off in the jan direct, before the game was even truly ready to be shown