Disgusting Trayvon Martin halloween costume... what is wrong with people?

Status
Not open for further replies.
marrec said:
That said, I do believe in redemption based on actions. If these idiots learn the error of their ways and use this experience to help promote equality then I think we should be willing to forgive their past transgressions.

The problem is that the internet is what it is. A snapshot of their lives is now the first thing that Google pops up with you type in their names. They can do a bunch of little, local things to seek redemption and forgiveness that will never be as memetic as this one awful stupid then they did and never live it down.

Of course, that's only a problem if they learn anything from this experience.

Which, presumably, is what we'd want.
Click to expand...

While I agree, I've seen people like this all over where I live and they usually never change, even after backlash from other people. Now this could be a bit different since it is all over the internet, but people like this are usually insensitive regardless of how you try to convince them of their wrong ways. If anything, they can move to a small town full of racists in the south, mainly a place like I live, and they should be fine.
 
General Patton said:
You misinterpret me, I'm more concerned with the tactics and the aim of ruining their lives. I would totally support re-education attempts in a myriad of ways, but I don't see the satisfaction in these vigilante social media campaigns. What does it achieve? A whole bunch of pissed off people who need vengeance, humiliated victims and perpetrators, then everyone fucks off until we do it all again, leaving fractured families, people jobless, worsened race relations, and a increasingly tense society. America's outlawed murder for hundreds if years and you still gun each other down like it's a national sport. Seems to me that this vigilante thing doesn't ever achieve anything.
Click to expand...

Presumably it drives casual racism like this off the internet eventually. So we're not actually changing any opinions, just showing people the consequences for getting caught with your opinion.
 
marrec said:
That said, I do believe in redemption based on actions. If these idiots learn the error of their ways and use this experience to help promote equality then I think we should be willing to forgive their past transgressions.

The problem is that the internet is what it is. A snapshot of their lives is now the first thing that Google pops up with you type in their names. They can do a bunch of little, local things to seek redemption and forgiveness that will never be as memetic as this one awful stupid then they did and never live it down.

Of course, that's only a problem if they learn anything from this experience.

Which, presumably, is what we'd want.
Click to expand...

I agree that ideally we would like them to learn from their mistakes, but the public uproar need not be for their direct benefit. It's a warning to others about what kind of behavior is inappropriate. And while the extinction of publicly racist behavior through social approbation does not necessarily directly extinguish racist thoughts and private racist behavior, it does help slow the spread and propagation of racist thoughts and acts and does reduce their occurrence over time, i.e., a less racist future society emerges.

I don't think most people change in their lifetimes. That's why focusing on social approbation is key. It gets to children and helps shape them before some shitty racist does.
 
Nibel said:
Haha, this is great
Click to expand...

It really isn't.

Also it took me a while to get the costumes, I had to google the hashtags and everything, a little clarification would have been nice, not all of us live in the US :P

I really don't see the issue with blackface, ok I do but I feel it's exaggerated, these costumes however go way beyond that though.
 
To the people saying she shouldn't have been fired (if she did), the following example is why companies do fire people situations like this.

Imagine if a black person had walked into the store she worked at, and she said to a co-worker, you help him\her, I'm not helping his\her black ass (or some other racist term).

The customer hears her say that, now the store this girl works for has a potential discrimination lawsuit on their hands.

Any place that you work for, you represent that place, when you're on and off the clock. I'm in the Air Force and I represent the Air Force and the US government no matter where I am in the world. If I do or say something stupid off-base, it doesn't just come back on me, it comes back on the Air Force as well, and there's repercussions for that. People need to learn to be responsible for their actions, it's something a person should be taught as a child, looks like her parents failed her in more ways than one.

If she did get fired, her employer is well within their rights to fire her as it reflects badly on them.
 
General Patton said:
Well if you're going to character assassinate someone (deserved or not) at least get the facts straight.
Click to expand...

Indeed.
https://twitter.com/LydiasLyfe/status/394352988711440384/photo/1
G90aTBu.png
 
Mael said:
There's really nothing to assassinate that they didn't do themselves.
That's the beauty of social media, they provide the rope to hang themselve.
Click to expand...

Or people misinterpret shit, get facts wrong and vilify and assassinate the innocent. Obviously not the case here but it's important to be accurate.

If anything, the ape photo is the most depressing. Publicly humiliating someone who is already down and out. Ugh.
 
JDSN said:
Indeed.
https://twitter.com/LydiasLyfe/status/394352988711440384/photo/1
G90aTBu.png
Click to expand...

You could have circled the "tacos" comment too...
Needless to say, there's really no character assassination going on.

General Patton said:
Or people misinterpret shit, get facts wrong and vilify and assassinate the innocent. Obviously not the case here but it's important to be accurate.
Click to expand...

In general I'd agree with you.
In this current case? Nah, they're racists PoS who brought it on themselves.

General Patton said:
If anything, the ape photo is the most depressing. Publicly humiliating someone who is already down and out. Ugh.
Click to expand...

That's so vile and coming from someone on the low ladders of society to boot.
 
JDSN said:
Indeed.
https://twitter.com/LydiasLyfe/status/394352988711440384/photo/1
G90aTBu.png
Click to expand...

I don't want to snowball this discussion away from the main, but isn't she using that in the colloquial sense? Like how Australians call their mates 'cunts' and European people 'wogs'? I'm not American and I know it's different over there, but it seems there was no malicious intent behind calling her friend 'niggs'.

EDIT: I've never seen the word tacos used as a slur? What's that about?
 
General Patton said:
I don't want to snowball this discussion away from the main, but isn't she using that in the colloquial sense? Like how Australians call their mates 'cunts' and European people 'wogs'? I'm not American and I know it's different over there, but it seems there was no malicious intent behind calling her friend 'niggs'.
EDIT: I've never seen the word tacos used as a slur? What's that about?
Click to expand...
No, not even remotely. Black people don't call each other "niggs" and white most certainly shouldn't be saying it.

EDIT: It's a derogatory term for Mexicans.
 
enzom21 said:
No, not even remotely. Black people don't call each other "niggs" and white most certainly shouldn't be saying it.

EDIT: It's a derogatory term for Mexicans.
Click to expand...

Black people don't call each other 'nigger' in the US? Really? I thought they had stripped away the maliciousness of that word for some time and attempted to turn it around...
 
General Patton said:
I don't want to snowball this discussion away from the main, but isn't she using that in the colloquial sense? Like how Australians call their mates 'cunts' and European people 'wogs'? I'm not American and I know it's different over there, but it seems there was no malicious intent behind calling her friend 'niggs'.

EDIT: I've never seen the word tacos used as a slur? What's that about?
Click to expand...

She's using "taco" here to refer to Mexican people, which is a racial slur.

The problem is that cunts (and wogs? I've never seen that one before) aren't racial based. We have no problem calling our friends dicks (or at least i don't, i call my best friend a dick a lot), but it's a racial slur, so it's not okay.
 
I don't see anything wrong with this. If a black man dress up as some dead white man, people don't throw a fit. When a white man does it, oh lord call the presses!!!!
 
BigDaddyFatSack said:
I don't see anything wrong with this. If a black man dress up as some dead white man, people don't throw a fit. When a white man does it, oh lord call the presses!!!!
Click to expand...

There's a difference between black people playing Georges Washington or Abraham Lincoln in a play and this.

General Patton said:
Black people don't call each other 'nigger' in the US? Really? I thought they had stripped away the maliciousness of that word for some time and attempted to turn it around...
Click to expand...

I wouldn't take everything you see on South park as some kind of reflexion of what happens in the US....:p
 
General Patton said:
Black people don't call each other 'nigger' in the US? Really? I thought they had stripped away the maliciousness of that word for some time and attempted to turn it around...
Click to expand...
No we don't call each other "niggs." There are some black people who call each other "nigga" but it is still considered a racial slur and white definitely shouldn't be saying it.

BigDaddyFatSack said:
I don't see anything wrong with this. If a black man dress up as some dead white man, people don't throw a fit. When a white man does it, oh lord call the presses!!!!
Click to expand...
Is there a history of black people dressing up in white face to demean white people in this country?

Do you also think it's unfair that black people can use nigger free of consequence and white people can't?
 
Featheredkitten said:
She's using "taco" here to refer to Mexican people, which is a racial slur.

The problem is that cunts (and wogs? I've never seen that one before) aren't racial based. We have no problem calling our friends dicks (or at least i don't, i call my best friend a dick a lot), but it's a racial slur, so it's not okay.
Click to expand...

Wogs is used to describe European and Middle Eastern people, in Australia it typically refers to Greek, Italian, Lebanese, etc. When European immigration explode here after the war, it was used as a racial slur, but over time the sting was taken out of the word and it became a colloquial, even fond way to describe someone. Now many European and Middle Eastern people have taken ownership of the word and it's no longer seen as a racial slur. There was even a comedian known as The Wog Boy who was quite popular, for a time.

I think it's still considered offensive in parts of Europe though.
 
Ruining their lives?
With what their own public posts?

The punishment they receive will be based on how future employees feel about them after they Google their name and see their reputation...just like any of us.
 
empty vessel said:
I agree that ideally we would like them to learn from their mistakes, but the public uproar need not be for their direct benefit. It's a warning to others about what kind of behavior is inappropriate. And while the extinction of publicly racist behavior through social approbation does not necessarily directly extinguish racist thoughts and private racist behavior, it does help slow the spread and propagation of racist thoughts and acts and does reduce their occurrence over time, i.e., a less racist future society emerges.

I don't think most people change in their lifetimes. That's why focusing on social approbation is key. It gets to children and helps shape them before some shitty racist does.
Click to expand...

Obviously we don't owe these people anything. It would be a lot of work and empathy to direct public outrage to be more constructive rather than destructive and as humans our empathy graph drops off sharply when we deal in large crowds against someone who's wronged us.

I just honestly don't know what the best approach is. Do we systematically ostracized every confirmed racist in hopes that this method will eventually lead to a racially agnostic society? If we do this, aren't we just further isolating an already insular and ignorant group of people, confirming their narrow world view in their minds? I'm afraid if that's our tactic then we'll always have to deal with a small but vicious group of racists that propagate based on perceived injustice as well as ignorance.

I'm not so far removed from this as I once was in New Mexico. Western Pennsylvania seems to be quite a stronghold of ignorant fucks so unfortunately public shaming doesn't do shit because it's... expected. Oh, he doesn't like black people... but he's great at plumbing and besides, he's from West Virginia. That doesn't have much to do with this specific case though...
 
General Patton said:
I don't want to snowball this discussion away from the main, but isn't she using that in the colloquial sense? Like how Australians call their mates 'cunts' and European people 'wogs'? I'm not American and I know it's different over there, but it seems there was no malicious intent behind calling her friend 'niggs'.

EDIT: I've never seen the word tacos used as a slur? What's that about?
Click to expand...


Nah man, she is not using it in the colloquial sense because no one does that, she is not Louis C.K in a routine, she is racist. Im also from Colombia, which means the outrage at this is not about americans acting up.
 
This is quickly going from a weekly thing to a daily thing.... there's that one story that someone would post that would just make me silently angry.

How do you not realize this is evil [people in the photo]? How can you not realize this is wrong?
 
hipbabboom said:
This is quickly going from a weekly thing to a daily thing.... there's that one story that someone would post that would just make me silently angry.

How do you not realize this is evil [people in the photo]? How can you not realize this is wrong?
Click to expand...

They know it's wrong, but they're surrounded by people who support them and even applaud them.
 
hipbabboom said:
This is quickly going from a weekly thing to a daily thing.... there's that one story that someone would post that would just make me silently angry.

How do you not realize this is evil [people in the photo]? How can you not realize this is wrong?
Click to expand...

Based on everything I have seen in this thread it is because they are hateful racist assholes. Like many they don't have a problem with being dicks. And the guy who did it even has a criminal history, he does not seem the kind of person who is most mindful of his actions.

marrec said:
They know it's wrong, but they're surrounded by people who support them and even applaud them.
Click to expand...

They know others consider it wrong but I doubt themselves think it is wrong. Which is not really a defense for their actions. The fucked up things you do are no less fucked up if you think they are right.
 
General Patton said:
Wogs is used to describe European and Middle Eastern people, in Australia it typically refers to Greek, Italian, Lebanese, etc. When European immigration explode here after the war, it was used as a racial slur, but over time the sting was taken out of the word and it became a colloquial, even fond way to describe someone. Now many European and Middle Eastern people have taken ownership of the word and it's no longer seen as a racial slur. There was even a comedian known as The Wog Boy who was quite popular, for a time.

I think it's still considered offensive in parts of Europe though.
Click to expand...

Ah, I see, I didn't know. No those slurs she used in her facebook post are quite offensive, really, really offensive, actually.
 
enzom21 said:
No, not even remotely. Black people don't call each other "niggs" and white most certainly shouldn't be saying it.

EDIT: It's a derogatory term for Mexicans.
Click to expand...

I used to work with a bunch of black dudes (and Hispanics) who said and used niggs repeatedly.
 
marrec said:
They know it's wrong, but they're surrounded by people who support them and even applaud them.
Click to expand...

Assuming there is any net negative fall out for them--e.g., lost job opportunities or embarrassment--those other people will ideally learn to suppress their own racist thoughts and actions for fear of the same happening to them. That means that other people will in turn have less opportunities to learn racism from them. Suppressing overt behavior in a population today can lead to changes in values held by a population later. Will it ever be stamped out entirely? Who knows, but it seems to me we should try.
 
empty vessel said:
Assuming there is any net negative fall out for them--e.g., lost job opportunities or embarrassment--those other people will ideally learn to suppress their own racist thoughts and actions for fear of the same happening to them. That means that other people will in turn have less opportunities to learn racism from them. Suppressing overt behavior in a population today can lead to changes in values held by a population later. Will it ever be stamped out entirely? Who knows, but it seems to me we should try.
Click to expand...

Well until we can come up with a better way, I agree.
 
Kerub said:
Eh, do you honestly think that? Or is it a way to show yourself "edgy"?
Click to expand...

Yes, yes I do. Admittedly, the costume could be considered to be in 'bad taste' by some, and thats understandable. However, I find it hilarious that a simple Halloween costume can spark such controversy and get people so riled up. The racism card is so overplayed these days, and I think its fabulous that this costume has gotten people so upset.

The majority of protestors in this thread are framing themselves to be some kind
of self appointed racial freedom fighters who cry tears of injustice because of a Halloween costume that was done in poor taste. It's my opinion, that senseless debates such as this one do absolutely nothing to help advance the ideal of racial equality and only serve to highlight the pettiness of society.
 
sgi02 said:
Yes, yes I do. Admittedly, the costume could be considered to be in 'bad taste' by some, and thats understandable. However, I find it hilarious that a simple Halloween costume can spark such controversy and get people so riled up. The racism card is so overplayed these days, and I think its fabulous that this costume has gotten people so upset.

The majority of protestors in this thread are framing themselves to be some kind
of self appointed racial freedom fighters who cry tears of injustice because of a Halloween costume that was done in poor taste. It's my opinion, that senseless debates such as this one do absolutely nothing to help advance the ideal of racial equality and only serve to highlight the pettiness of society.
Click to expand...
So these people aren't racist?
 
sgi02 said:
Yes, yes I do. Admittedly, the costume could be considered to be in 'bad taste' by some, and thats understandable. However, I find it hilarious that a simple Halloween costume can spark such controversy and get people so riled up. The racism card is so overplayed these days, and I think its fabulous that this costume has gotten people so upset.

The majority of protestors in this thread are framing themselves to be some kind
of self appointed racial freedom fighters who cry tears of injustice because of a Halloween costume that was done in poor taste. It's my opinion, that senseless debates such as this one do absolutely nothing to help advance the ideal of racial equality and only serve to highlight the pettiness of society.
Click to expand...

I have a hard time believing you give a shit about the ideal of racial equality.
 
A non-racist approach to costumizing this incident would be to go as the Zimmer Man. Still would have the potential to offend, but at least the POV is not completely fucked up.
 
General Patton said:
Or people misinterpret shit, get facts wrong and vilify and assassinate the innocent. Obviously not the case here but it's important to be accurate.

If anything, the ape photo is the most depressing. Publicly humiliating someone who is already down and out. Ugh.
Click to expand...

Then why bring it up here? Just gets people riled up...
 
marrec said:
Probably the later, it's important these days to look as edgy and unshakeable as possible on the internet because offense is taken as weakness these days.
Click to expand...

while I do agree
Actually on the web it tends to be the opposite.Why that is is, a long conversation that involves reactionary cultures, and being "grown up". But its very long and not thread reliant. The short version is

People try to make themselves look anti egdy, but then by doing so make themselves look edgy.


On topic though, I'm kind of interested in what kind of work you can find after this.
 
There seems to be an unchallenged bit of narrative going on here from those who are advocating for the rights of the racists in the picture:

How is "losing a job" equivalent to "ruining a life?"

It's a job. Many people have lost jobs for a variety of reasons and not had their life effectively damaged beyond repair. If that one guy's multiple arrests haven't "ruined his life," I doubt getting fired is going to be the match that sets his soul aflame.

If the consequence to the action of belittling the murder of an unarmed teenager is that they no longer have employment, that isn't automatically "a life ruined" at all.

They're just unemployed. Unless you wanna argue that the millions of Americans currently jobless are also living with ruined lives.

There's more to life than working.
 
BigDaddyFatSack said:
I don't see anything wrong with this. If a black man dress up as some dead white man, people don't throw a fit. When a white man does it, oh lord call the presses!!!!
Click to expand...

False equivalency out the ass yo. At what point in US history were black people dressing up as white people and caricaturing the entire ethnic group by exaggerating facial features and acting like savages and monkeys or utter idiots incapable of understanding or appreciating the "vast superiority" of other ethnic groups in movies; all for the sole intent to dehumanize them and paint them as less than human?

Take your time, I'm off work today so I'll definitely wait.
 
Angelus Errare said:
False equivalency out the ass yo. At what point in US history were black people dressing up as white people and caricaturing the entire ethnic group by exaggerating facial features and acting like savages and monkeys or utter idiots incapable of understanding or appreciating the "vast superiority" of other ethnic groups in movies; all for the sole intent to dehumanize them and paint them as less than human?

Take your time, I'm off work today so I'll definitely wait.
Click to expand...

Ever see the smash hit White Chicks? Cried myself to sleep many a night after that was released.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

Where did it Go Wrong with KFC?
Opinion  2 3
115
5K
Woggleman replied
Happy Martin Luther King Jr Day!
12
787
LegendOfKage replied
So halloween is basically just cosplay day.
Social 
22
2K
StueyDuck replied
If you think the joker is "cool" he's not and there's something likely wrong with you.
2 3
114
5K
Soodanim replied
Ever deal with these sort of people at work?
41
2K
CokeDiet replied
Top Bottom