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[Brian_FETO]

Nah being adapted for western audience to me is a lame excuse.

Big budget blockbusters generally have leads they feel can sell the film and justify the cost

There's obviously diversity issues in Hollywood, but they follow what the public pays for. It's easy to assume the sole culprit is "evil white guys in Hollywood" but they're in it for the money first. (This is, of course, not to say that there aren't a lot of evil white guys on top in Hollywood). They'll do what is safe and is proven to make money with the western audience.

They're taking a story that's been successful in another culture/medium and doing it their way to make money, for better or worse.

Spoiler

Guaranteed worse

At a surface level Ghost In The Shell is about AI. Obviously there are certain nuances and themes rooted in Japanese culture but including them doesn't mean the foreign audience will resonate with them (or understand them). It'd be great if everyone saw films to be exposed to foreign cultures and ways of life, but they don't.

 

[Cabbagehead]

Am I the only one that thinks Edge of Tomorrow was mediocre

You could be. I thought it was a fairly great movie and one of the better adaptation/original takes in a while.

It ain't no Mad max though.

 

[Loudninja]

Big budget blockbusters generally have leads they feel can sell the film and justify the cost

There's obviously diversity issues in Hollywood, but they follow what the public pays for. It's easy to assume the sole culprit is "evil white guys in Hollywood" but they're in it for the money first. (This is, of course, not to say that there aren't a lot of evil white guys on top in Hollywood). They'll do what is safe and is proven to make money with the western audience.

They're taking a story that's been successful in another culture/medium and doing it their way to make money, for better or worse.

Spoiler

Guaranteed worse

At a surface level Ghost In The Shell is about AI. Obviously there are certain nuances and themes rooted in Japanese culture but including them doesn't mean the foreign audience will resonate with them (or understand them). It'd be great if everyone saw films to be exposed to foreign cultures and ways of life, but they don't.

Its the same excuses everytime though stuff will never change.

 

[zelas]

Look, I've already cooled down and come to terms with the ScarJo casting and at this point I'll just judge it as its quality solely as a film, but this is just a bs argument through and through.

Yeah I've gone through the same train of thought. The political intrigue between different countries is part of the appeal of GitS. His excuse sounds like there will be none of that or there will be drastic changes to what Section 9 is.

 

[Azerth]

Am i the only one that doesnt care. I would have see the movie no matter the color of the actress

 

[Two Words]

Oh, so their white-washing it even more....

 

[KahooTs]

He should have just said that in a world with commercial realities, if you can get the second biggest female actor in the world to play your lead then that's what happens, unless you can get the biggest.

 

[Dongs Macabre]

Am i the only one that doesnt care. I would have see the movie no matter the color of the actress

Unfortunately, you're likely in the majority.

 

[diamount]

Unfortunately, you're likely in the majority.

The majority wouldn't even be aware of the property before this movie.

 

[Cabbagehead]

Yeah I've gone through the same train of thought. The political intrigue between different countries is part of the appeal of GitS. His excuse sounds like there will be none of that or there will be drastic changes to what Section 9 is.

Exactly Section 9 and Ghost of shell world/setting is not a full on melting pot. Its still very much japanese and maybe even more secluded then even now, given how that world works.

The strict international policies most have to deal and the slight nationalism is ever so present. An its usually about outside factors causing trouble, or local internal struggles, radical groups or power plays. It is not about jo smith and tom and the neo japan/japanese background.

 

[harSon]

Is there a reason we consider Scarlett Johansson to be a legitimate box office draw? She's been in a lot of films that were successful at the box office, but outside of Lucy, it's difficult to come to the conclusion that said films were successful because of her.

This film will give a good idea if she is or not considering that this is the type of film that typically under performs at the box office.

 

[RangerBAD]

Is there a reason we consider Scarlett Johansson to be a legitimate box office draw? She's been in a lot of films that were successful at the box office, but outside of Lucy, it's difficult to come to the conclusion that said films were successful because of her.

This film will give a good idea if she is or not considering that this is the type of film that typically under performs at the box office.

I figure it won't be a horrible flop, but a flop nonetheless. She's no Tom Cruise.

 

[Cabbagehead]

I figure it won't be a horrible flop, but a flop nonetheless. She's no Tom Cruise.

I think they're overestimating her reach a little here. Though if the movies bad then it won't matter either way. Especially since her solo output is not exactly Oscar worthy or award worthy period.

 

[Riposte]

So I assume when a Japanese director wanted to make an adaptation of King Lear he should have used Brits.

I hope this is a Ran joke. More people should talk about Ran.

EDIT: The comparison isn't really the same, because Ran is a full reimagining, while is simply an adaptation with slight changes.

Personally, I have no problem with the Major, even with the last name Kusanagi, being played by a white woman, if they don't ignore it. Someone who was once an asian girl now living in a white woman body fits the setting fine and could be used for thematic significance. It may make finding the right body type easier, if you wanted to go tall and athletic for the lead actress, along with other factors like ability to act well in english. However tiny, mediocre-actress Johanson is kind of a terrible pick in that respect and they are recasting the race of a bunch of non-full cybernetic people, so it's a moot point.

 

[lightskintwin]

Is there a reason we consider Scarlett Johansson to be a legitimate box office draw? She's been in a lot of films that were successful at the box office, but outside of Lucy, it's difficult to come to the conclusion that said films were successful because of her.

This film will give a good idea if she is or not considering that this is the type of film that typically under performs at the box office.

Lucy is actually a very good indicator of Scarlett Johansson's box office prowess specifically as a badass in a Sci Fi film. Lucy was a modestly budgeted, completely original film that required her star power to carry most of the load and it grossed over 450 million worldwide. That's fucking impressive. I expect Ghost in the Shell to be as successful, if not more. It was honestly a good career choice after her success with Lucy.

 

[Yamauchi]

Unfortunately, you're likely in the majority.

I don't care about the race of the characters. I am a bit worried, since he talks about it being international, that it will somehow end up being generic, mediocre scifi. But I'm still interested in the film, and that's coming from someone who has been a GitS fan since the 90s.

 

[Cabbagehead]

I don't care about the race of the characters. I am a bit worried, since he talks about it being international, that it will somehow end up being generic, mediocre scifi. But I'm still interested in the film, and that's coming from someone who has been a GitS fan since the 90s.

That's the thing GITS is most likely the furthest from international as you may get as a series even in the cyberpunk genre.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_of_Ghost_in_the_Shell

 

[Azerth]

Unfortunately, you're likely in the majority.

The only time i care about the race is if its about a true person

 

[harSon]

Lucy is actually a very good indicator of Scarlett Johansson's box office prowess specifically as a badass in a Sci Fi film. Lucy was a modestly budgeted, completely original film that required her star power to carry most of the load and it grossed over 450 million worldwide. That's fucking impressive. I expect Ghost in the Shell to be as successful, if not more. It was honestly a good career choice after her success with Lucy.

She could very well be Box Office gold. Or Lucy's success could be an outlier. My point is that her filmography thus far is not really a good indicator of affirming either notion. Yes, she's in a lot of successful films, but considering what those films are - it's difficult to say whether she's directly responsible for their success. Sometimes movies come in at the right time and resonate with movie goers for reasons unbeknownst to most analysts. For example, why the fuck did Now You See Me gross $351,723,989 worldwide?

 

[Cabbagehead]

She could very well be Box Office gold. Or Lucy's success could be an outlier. My point is that her filmography thus far is not really a good indicator of affirming either notion. Yes, she's in a lot of successful films, but considering what those films are - it's difficult to say whether she's directly responsible for their success. Sometimes movies come in at the right time and resonate with movie goers for reasons unbeknownst to most analysts. For example, why the fuck did Now You See Me gross $351,723,989 worldwide?

That international audience? the domestic won't do while for this movie very much.

 

[lightskintwin]

She could very well be Box Office gold. Or Lucy's success could be an outlier. My point is that her filmography thus far is not really a good indicator of affirming either notion. Yes, she's in a lot of successful films, but considering what those films are - it's difficult to say whether she's directly responsible for their success. Sometimes movies come in at the right time and resonate with movie goers for reasons unbeknownst to most analysts. For example, why the fuck did Now You See Me gross $351,723,989 worldwide?

That's a bad example, that movie didn't require a leading actor to carry it but had an ensemble cast with Morgan Freeman being the most famous. I think Now You See Me is a good example of what you're saying though. LOL

 

[Shaanyboi]

Yeah, no.

Non whites are good enough to support the white leads and that's all that is usually comes from Hollywood "diversity". Fuck that nonsense.

Yup. "Look at how diverse we are, right fellow asian best friend?"

"I mean... sure, but I don't really get much of a character to work with, and could really use more than like three lines for the whole mov--"

"Haha that's great, fellow asian best friend! I'm so glad you're always here to back me up, but also know to never get too mouthy while we important characters are talking!"

 

[Razgriz-Specter]

Is there a reason we consider Scarlett Johansson to be a legitimate box office draw? She's been in a lot of films that were successful at the box office, but outside of Lucy, it's difficult to come to the conclusion that said films were successful because of her.

This film will give a good idea if she is or not considering that this is the type of film that typically under performs at the box office.

She is a huge name regardless of being an actual draw,

Honestly there aren't many huge female draws especially in action, however they think her big name plus her other roles in the genre(Lucy, Black Widow) can turn it into a safe bet for audiences
More "oh Johansson is in this? She is cool, it can't be THAT bad" vs "oh Johansson is in this, need to see it asap."

 

[CaviarMeths]

They probably should have done it like Edge of Tomorrow or The Departed -- just a total adaptation with a different name.

At this point they've probably already burned all chances of using the original name to draw in some fans. They obviously care more about attracting people who wouldn't normally watch Ghost in the Shell as-is.

Ghost in the Shell is my favorite anime movie. Stand Alone Complex is in my top 3 favorite series. More of that in live action would be cool, but something different could be cool too. I'm honestly not too worried about how close of an adaption it is. I just want a good movie.

Of course with the talent attached, it's not likely to be as good as Edge of Tomorrow. But I'm still going to keep an open mind for now.

I figure it won't be a horrible flop, but a flop nonetheless. She's no Tom Cruise.

You say that, but Tom hasn't had many big hits outside of Mission Impossible in the last decade either. Lucy outgrossed Edge of Tomorrow while being a significantly worse movie.

 

[UnemployedVillain]

Big budget blockbusters generally have leads they feel can sell the film and justify the cost

Just say white people because that's what you mean, unless you're trying to say Sam Worthington (Terminator Salvation, Avatar) and Taylor Kitsch (Jon Carter) sell films. Hint, they don't. They're just white so Hollywood is willing to take a change on them despite being unknown shitty actors

 

[Razgriz-Specter]

Thread is reminding me I need an Edge of Tomorrow poster, to bad they don't have that "To Victory" mural as a poster.

 

[harSon]

I'm 100% positive that this movie is going to under perform. Box Office has not been kind to non-YA large budget science fiction films. Oblivion, Edge of Tomorrow, John Carter, After Earth, Tomorrow Land, Elysium, Jupiter Ascending, Ender's Game, Chappie, Transcendence, Dredd, etc.

I don't think today's audiences give a shit about Ghost in the Shell type science fiction. I feel like it'll do Total Recall type numbers.

 

[Brian_FETO]

Just say white people because that's what you mean, unless you're trying to say Sam Worthington (Terminator Salvation, Avatar) and Taylor Kitsch (Jon Carter) sell films. Hint, they don't. They're just white so Hollywood is willing to take a change on them despite being unknown shitty actors

I didn't specify white because the same sort of thing would apply towards any region trying to appeal to their biggest native audience in the safest way

For the US, yes white. Obviously Hollywood is Hollywood but errbody's trying to make a buck. They get those shitty actors because they look at them and say "yes, I can SELL this!"

 

[lupinko]

They should have done the full adaptation like what happened with Edge of Tomorrow or Oldboy (Korean original).

This is just a lame excuse to white wash.

And why bring up Shirow? He hasn't had anything to do with GITS in almost two decades now. All he cares about probably is getting paid and illustrating porn.

 

[UnemployedVillain]

I didn't specify white because the same sort of thing would apply towards any region trying to appeal to their biggest native audience in the safest way

For the US, yes white. Obviously Hollywood is Hollywood but errbody's trying to make a buck

Most regions are FAR more homogeneous than the US so it really wouldn't be usually be applicable. Anytime anyone brings up Asian cinema mostly employing Asian actors I shake my head at how laughable a comparison it is

 

[RedSwirl]

Yeah I've gone through the same train of thought. The political intrigue between different countries is part of the appeal of GitS. His excuse sounds like there will be none of that or there will be drastic changes to what Section 9 is.

This is my biggest fear about this movie, that it's just gonna be a regular sci-fi action flick. Even that aspect could just be written into a new setting based on the ideas and framework of GitS.

 

[Shy]

 

[Ravek]

Am I the only one that thinks Edge of Tomorrow was mediocre

No. Maybe you're just one in a not so big crowd.

 

[NipplesAndToes23]

Disregarding the state of America in the GITS world kinda ruins some of the uniqueness of it.

Whatever. I'll never understand why American audiences can't watch a movie where America isn't the center of it.

Yeah, I don't get it either.

 

[Jotaka]

We know this is pure garbage bullshit after they tried the yellowwashing CG.

 

[Razgriz-Specter]

Disregarding the state of America in the GITS world kinda ruins some of the uniqueness of it.

Whatever. I'll never understand why American audiences can't watch a movie where America isn't the center of it.

The general audience isn't going to give a damn about a fictional city in future Japan and all its government conspiracies.
They'd hardly care if it was actually based on current Japan and true stories.

Hell unless its LOTOR, HP or James Bond it isn't going to be a huge blockbuster in the US.

 

[Mr. Pointy]

Rupert Sanders though....

 

[geomon]

“I think everybody is going to end up being really happy with it,” he said. “They’re going to be very, very happy with it when they see what we’ve actually done with it, and I don’t think anybody’s going to be disappointed.”

Yeah, we'll see.

 

[Cabbagehead]

The general audience isn't going to give a damn about a fictional city in future Japan and all its government conspiracies.
They'd hardly care if it was actually based on current Japan and true stories.

Hell unless its LOTOR, HP or James Bond it isn't going to be a blockbuster in the US.

Then why make it....

 

[Shandy]

Dude, just make your bloody movie. You're lucky in that hardly anyone expects anything of you anyway. The bar to avoid being the shittiest thing to happen to Ghost in the Shell is just not that high. You will not receive nor even deserve a medal for clearing it. So just make your movie.

 

[A Link to the Past]

Why isn't she black, or Asian, or Hispanic

"The movie isn't about nations!" is a non-answer to "why is she the billionth instance of a non-white character being whitewashed." It's an excuse invented, where the actual reason for the whitewashing was business. What a dishonest person to offer that answer.

Kaneda went from Asian to white. Light turned from Asian to white. Motoko went from Asian to white. This is a pattern, and it has nothing to do with "different region" or "international locations."

 

[Razgriz-Specter]

Then why make it....

Because its a pretty big name everything considered and Hollywood sees something easily transplantable.
Same reason they make American Godzilla

On the other side you have something like Dragon Ball, which was so incredibly big in America at one time Hollywood had to get on it(Very late though)
But honestly that could never seriously work no matter how much you mess around with it.

 

[spiderman123]

Come on. Just adding a few minority supporting characters to hide that fact that you are whitewashing a film is bs imo.

 

[Opto]

I can see the trailer: Task Force 9 is assigned to uncover the secret robot trade that threatens american interests. Major ScarJo sums up the difficulty of the case. Generic helicopter b team footage of future city. Car chase with slightly futuristic cars on highway, major scarjo fighting a bunch of generic jobbers in a japanese themed area, 1 second long shots of the rest of the case looking tense, some scary robot things, maybe a shot of the tank from the 1st GitS movie. Voiceover from Beat Takeshi that brings up whatever theme they're going to try and tackle, ScarJo makes a response, final shot is a technically impressive long take of a prosthetic body going into battle mode and being scary

 

[RangerBAD]

Because its a pretty big name everything considered and Hollywood sees something easily transplantable.
Same reason they make American Godzilla

I wouldn't say GitS is at all as household as Godzilla.

How good is Beat's English anyhow? He's in the role of a fairly articulate character. Oh, who am I kidding? The script won't even be good.

 

[Opto]

Because its a pretty big name everything considered and Hollywood sees something easily transplantable.
Same reason they make American Godzilla

Ghost in the Shell is nowhere near the realm of Godzilla in terms of popularity, c'mon. even if we go by the most recent GitS thing America has been exposed to, Adult swim viewership barely breaches a million views

 

[A Link to the Past]

Ghost in the Shell is nowhere near the realm of Godzilla in terms of popularity, c'mon. even if we go by the most recent GitS thing America has been exposed to, Adult swim viewership barely breaches a million views

Seriously. They're trying to chase after the possibility of GitS being a landmark franchise, only to likely fail and create something that the fanbase doesn't care about.

 

[spiderman123]

Seriously. They're trying to chase after the possibility of GitS being a landmark franchise, only to likely fail and create something that the fanbase doesn't care about.

Just like how they failed with Avatar. I WOULD HAVE BEEN FINE WITH A ANIMATED MOVIE.

 

[RangerBAD]

We get to go through this all again if the Alita movie ever happens.

 

[Not]

While the original Ghost in the Shell takes place in the fictional Japanese city of Niihama, Niihama Prefecture, Paul referred to the setting of Ghost in the Shell as “an international world.” “There [are] all sorts of people and nationalities in the world in Ghost in the Shell,” he said of the cast, which also includes Pilou Asbaek, Michael Pitt, Takeshi Kitano, Juliette Binoche, Kaori Momoi, and Chin Han. “We’re utilizing people from all over the world. … There’s Japanese in it. There’s Chinese in it. There’s English in it. There’s Americans in it.”

This is even fucking worse because you still couldn't make the main character Asian even though she could be "any race," and you only said she could be "any race" in the first place JUST SO YOU COULD MAKE HER WHITE

Jesus.

I'll say it again. If she was black in the cartoon, they wouldn't have cast a white person.