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[sonycowboy]

Okay fine didn't notice that. It still means that Halo 2 is at 4.4 million in the US, while GT3 is almost 3.7 million (unless I missed another Gran turismo listing) That is after three months for one title and four years for the other. Which is the bigger title?

For this month, GT3

PS2 SYSTEM W/GT 3 878,546

GT3 Total Numbers = 4,553,368
Halo 2 Total Numbers = 4,425,798

I can't say what the deal is with GT3's Sony number vs NPD sales. Sony claims over 6M units North America, so even assuming Canada has 20% of the US (which is way over our normal assumptions) that would only be another 900k. So let's put the total at 5.5M North America. This is where we have to remember that NPD is an estimate. Same, of course, holds true for Halo 2.

Thus, the only things we can really say is:

1) Your 6.6M worlwide was way off
2) Halo 2 has generated WAYYY more revenue for Microsoft than GT3 did for Sony
3) GT3 is the most successful console title released this generation (GTA:VC 13M includes Xbox & PC Sales, same for the 12M for GTA 3)
4) The Halo series (Halo and/or Halo 2) most likely has the absolute highest attach rate of any title w/ it's system of any game, by a pretty good amount.

 

[SolidSnakex]

Okay fine didn't notice that. It still means that Halo 2 is at 4.4 million in the US, while GT3 is almost 3.7 million (unless I missed another Gran turismo listing) That is after three months for one title and four years for the other. Which is the bigger title?

GT3 till HALO 2 sales more. You can sell as many games as you want in a short amount of time but what matters is what sales the most overall. FF8 actually sold more starting up in Japan than DQ7 did, but which one sold more overall? DQ7. Are you going to say FF is bigger than DQ there because it had a faster start?

 

[android]

Okay got it.

 

[sonycowboy]

someone should post a LTD of software sales for 1st party games, add them up, and see what company has the most sales

Since NPD doesn't have a breakout by Developer, but by Publisher, here's a quick and rough number with January 2005 LTD numbers. This doesn't address Jarrod's issues of 2nd party or publishing deals.

MICROSOFT Total 20,473,997
NINTENDO OF AMERICA Total 53,614,034 (includes GCN & GBA)
SONY COMPUTER ENT. (SONY) Total 38,173,528

GBA vs GCN Breakout for Nintendo
-------------------------------------------------
GBA Total 31,268,124
GCN Total 22,345,910

 

[Shompola]

GT3 till HALO 2 sales more. You can sell as many games as you want in a short amount of time but what matters is what sales the most overall. FF8 actually sold more starting up in Japan than DQ7 did, but which one sold more overall? DQ7. Are you going to say FF is bigger than DQ there because it had a faster start?

I thought the general rule was what matters is the one wich makes most money or something like that no? Most of those Halo 2 games have been selling for more than 39USD. I don't think that is true for GT3.

 

[peedi]

GT3 till HALO 2 sales more. You can sell as many games as you want in a short amount of time but what matters is what sales the most overall. FF8 actually sold more starting up in Japan than DQ7 did, but which one sold more overall? DQ7. Are you going to say FF is bigger than DQ there because it had a faster start?

He's going to say anything that'll discount the truth.

 

[android]

He's going to say anything that'll discount the truth.

Fuck you boy. I said I now realize that GT3 sold more. Or can't you read.

 

[sonycowboy]

I thought the general rule was what matters is the one wich makes most money or something like that no? Most of those Halo 2 games have been selling for more than 39USD. I don't think that is true for GT3.

That's never been the rule before, but when it works to someone's advantage we've seen it pop up. The most basic reason is we have no idea how much revenue LTD most titles have. I think we could pretty easily get Halo 2's, but most others aren't available. Certainly, those who were for ESPN vs Madden never liked that line of thinking. Clearly, Halo 2 has taken in more revenue than GT3 domestically, however, it's not as wide a gap as you may think.

 

[kaching]

They were published by SOE, but iirc, they were developed by Snowblind.

It's fuzzy distinction...Snowblind is such a small team that, by most accounts, it seems like it's a join effort.

 

[jarrod]

Was'nt Drakan a first party title

Developed by Surreal Software.

Is Odama a 1st party GC game?

Developed by Vivarium.

You're missing Azurik... and Nightcaster (?).

Developed by Adrenium Games and VR1 respectively.

*smacks head*

then you say in house development, not 1st party development. 2 different things.

Yeah, but "in house development" can also refer to strictly internal R&D and not owned R&D teams (like Retro, Naughty Dog, Rare, etc). It's all confusing to someone really. :/

Sony's the best, they also got stuff like Mister Mosquito & Sky Gunner

Developed by Zoom and Pixel Arts respectively.

Would Zener Works, Matrix, & MediaVision be Sony 1st parties? If so, there's Okage: Shadow King, Dual Hearts, & the 3 Wild ARMs games.
Not entirely sure about Zerner Works, but Matrix Software and MediaVision are both 100% independent companies. MediaVision actually made Sneakers for Microsoft this gen. If I can get a confirmation that ZW is owned by SCE though, I'll add them.


Not quite sure how SOE counts, but since EQoA is listed, you should add EverQuest: Online Adventures: Frontiers.

Actually SOE is treated as a 3rd party publisher (as were Sony Music Entertainment and Psygnosis in the PS1 days). They could actually make Xbox or DS games if they wanted (in fact they previously announced Star Wars Galaxies for Xbox once upon a time iirc). They're off the list then.

Eternal Darkness was made after Nintendo paid 20M$ for SK. So, it is no les s a 1st party than Metroid Prime.

Actually you're right. MGS TTS counts too then and so does Courtside 2002 since Nintendo hald a controlling stake in Leftfiled when it was made. Thankfully Rare was already sold off to MS by the time SFA hit stores.

Jarrod, I though Chain Dive was made by a 3rd party for SCEJ. Don't know name of team.

Was it? Arg, I just know a ton of those SCEJ titles are wrong. :/

Add:

Ghost Hunter (SCEE Studio Cambridge)
SingStar Pop (SCEE Studio London) (coming in June)

Added, thanks.

The MS Sports team was Indie Built, sold now to Take-Two Interactive together with licenses for Amped, Top Spin en Links. Their engine assets where sold to Ubisoft.

Indie Built was only responsible for Links, Top Spin and Amped though. I thought a seperate Salt Lake team was behind Fever & Rivals, right? What were they called? Element?

 

[jarrod]

Yep seems Chain Dive was developed by Alvion. Off it goes.

edit-Ack, Alvion also made Ponie's Poin it seems. :/

 

[jarrod]

Foiled again, seems neither NaNaOn-Sha or MuuMuu are SCEJ owned. The PS2 list just gets shorter and shorter. :/

 

[jarrod]

Hey element (or anyone who knows) was there a name for the Redmond based Xbox sports team who was killed last year? Also, any name for the team working on Forza?

 

[cja]

-Destruction Derby Arenas (Studio 33)

Another to delete. Never a Sony 1st party and the founder sold out to EA in late 2003. The Liverpudlians got merged with the rest of EA Northwest (aka EA Warrington).

 

[Jesiatha]

Hey element (or anyone who knows) was there a name for the Redmond based Xbox sports team who was killed last year? Also, any name for the team working on Forza?

I would list them as MGS. Internally, they are referred to as "the Forza team" and "the Sports studio".

 

[Shiggy]

Is Odama a 1st party GC game?

No, it's from Vivarium.

Delete the Silicon Knights games, they were never a 1st party, always second party.

Wario Ware Twisted! was made by Intelligent Systems.

F-Zero Climax wasn't made by EAD, or?

Edit: F-Zero Climax was made by Dentsu, a joint-venture of Nintendo and TV Tokyo.

 

[jarrod]

Another to delete. Never a Sony 1st party and the founder sold out to EA in late 2003. The Liverpudlians got merged with the rest of EA Northwest (aka EA Warrington).

Deleted thanks.

I would list them as MGS. Internally, they are referred to as "the Forza team" and "the Sports studio".

Ah, thanks. I guess the Forza team's all that's left at MGS in Redmond after the sports cuts?

Delete the Silicon Knights games, they were never a 1st party, always second party.

They were an invested company though at the time of release, even though they weren't wholly owned. Still, I see the point...

Wario Ware Twisted! was made by Intelligent Systems.

No, that was Touched!, Twisted! was all RD1.

F-Zero Climax wasn't made by EAD, or?

Edit: F-Zero Climax was made by Dentsu, a joint-venture of Nintendo and TV Tokyo.

Thanks... I'll update.

 

[element]

I thought a seperate Salt Lake team was behind Fever & Rivals, right?

Fever and Rivals were done in redmond. They didn't have any real teams names outside of the Sports Team as Jesiatha said.

Forza has really turned into their own group recently and is known as the 'Forza Team'. Pretty lame, but that is what it is.

 

[jarrod]

Fever and Rivals were done in redmond. They didn't have any real teams names outside of the Sports Team as Jesiatha said.

Forza has really turned into their own group recently and is known as the 'Forza Team'. Pretty lame, but that is what it is.

Thanks.


Oh and DC and NGPC lists added. Let me know if anything's wrong/missing guys.

 

[Lazy8s]

kaching:

It's fuzzy distinction...Snowblind is such a small team that, by most accounts, it seems like it's a join effort.

Nothing really fuzzy. Snowblind designed and built the game and the engine; their team size is modest but not so unusually small. Sony was there to integrate the software and online set-up into their network plan.

 

[Shiggy]

Wario Ware Twisted is on Intsys.com: http://www.intsys.co.jp/game/index.html
(third game)

So it looks like their game?!


SK: But then you have to change the headline