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[MIMIC]

9/11 panel sees no link between Iraq, al-Qaida
Commission opens final hearing before release of report

WASHINGTON - The commission investigating the Sept. 11 attacks reported Wednesday that Osama bin Laden met with a top Iraqi official in 1994 but found “no credible evidence” of a link between Iraq and al-Qaida in attacks against the United States.

[...]

The report said that bin Laden explored possible cooperation with Saddam at the urging of allies in Sudan eager to protect their own ties to Iraq, even though the al-Qaida leader had previously provided support for “anti-Saddam Islamists in Iraqi Kurdistan.”

Bin Laden ceased that support in the early 1990s, opening the way for a meeting between the al-Qaida leader and a senior Iraqi intelligence officer in 1994 in Sudan, the report said. At the meeting, bin Laden is said to have requested space to establish training camps in Iraq as well as Iraqi assistance in procuring weapons, but Iraq apparently never responded, the staff report said.

No ‘collaborative relationship’ seen
It said that reports of subsequent contacts between Iraq and al-Qaida after bin Laden had returned to Afghanistan “do not appear to have resulted in a collaborative relationship,” and added that two unidentified senior bin Laden associates "have adamantly denied that any ties existed between al-Qaida and Iraq."

The report, the 15th released by the commission staff, concluded, “We have no credible evidence that Iraq and al-Qaida cooperated on attacks against the United States.”

MSNBC

Can we please call an emergency press conference and have the President react to this report????

 

[RiZ III]

 

[MrAngryFace]

I GIVE UP!

 

[dskillzhtown]

Uh oh. Democrats might have wished this had come out a bit later, like during the debates.

 

[Fusebox]

This doesn't mean that there wasn't a link, simpy that they couldn't find evidence of one.

 

[Ripclawe]

There was never a link between Iraq/Al qaeda that they conspired together for any attacks on US interests, but there is evidence of ties between them. big difference between cooperation and connections.

As on page 10 of the staff report that says no government "officially" helped Al qaeda but they got money from different islamic charities, plus I have problems with the report including the denial of Al qaeda is not into drug business to get funding.

 

[MIMIC]

Uh oh. Democrats might have wished this had come out a bit later, like during the debates.

As far as the Bush dart board goes, this is just the tip of the iceberg. He'll continue to get hammered from now until November.

 

[MIMIC]

There was never a link between Iraq/Al qaeda that they conspired together for any attacks on US interests, but there is evidence of ties between them. big difference between cooperation and connections.

The panel has concluded that they did not establish a "collaborative relationship" for ANY reason.

 

[All Hail C-Webb]

Ok the panel found no link between al-qaeda and Iraq.
Big fucking deal.
Maybe the President should hold a press conference about how I found there is no link between the quality of Shrek 2, and it's Box Office gross?

 

[Outlaw Pro Mod]

Back in 1997, "Osama Bin Laden's group" was reportedly in Iraq training to hijack planes. Maybe Saddam / Iraq didn't know they were there.

 

[Ripclawe]

The panel has concluded that they did not establish a "collaborative relationship" for ANY reason.

I have a copy of the staff report from the commission, what page do you see that.

There are parts of this report that sounds like a rehashing of stuff that was already known and stuff made up.

http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/06/16/911.commission/index.html

The panel also dismissed reports that Atta met with an Iraqi intelligence officer in the Czech Republic on April 9, 2000. "We do not believe that such a meeting occurred."

The report said that Atta was in Virginia on April 4 -- evidenced by video that shows him withdrawing $8,000 from an ATM -- and he was in Florida by April 11 if not before.

I thought the disputed meetings took place in April of 2001 and what bank has an ATM that allows 8000 dollar withdrawls?

Here is the Slate article that says the FBI made shit up to the papers and have no clue where Atta was .
http://slate.msn.com/id/2091354

 

[evil solrac v3.0]

Back in 1997, "Osama Bin Laden's group" was reportedly in Iraq training to hijack planes. Maybe Saddam / Iraq didn't know they were there.

and in the 80's there were supposedly terrorists training to hijack planes in iran.

 

[shoplifter]

This doesn't mean that there wasn't a link, simpy that they couldn't find evidence of one.

Funny how Cheney is so sure of it though..

 

[Ripclawe]

speaking of which one of the people who wrote the staff reports emailed Instapundit to say that AP and others picked up on one sentence that is carefully worded on purpose and ran with it.

http://www.instapundit.com/archives/016035.php

 

[fart]

This doesn't mean that there wasn't a link, simpy that they couldn't find evidence of one.

this is the funniest thing i've ever read. you win dude

 

[Desperado]

Am I missing something? Since when did people start believing Iraq had something to do with 9/11?

 

[sprsk]

Am I missing something? Since when did people start believing Iraq had something to do with 9/11?

http://aolsvc.news.aol.com/news/article.adp?id=20040616112109990008

 

[dskillzhtown]

Ok the panel found no link between al-qaeda and Iraq.
Big fucking deal.
Maybe the President should hold a press conference about how I found there is no link between the quality of Shrek 2, and it's Box Office gross?

ummm...what?

 

[cvxfreak]

Am I missing something? Since when did people start believing Iraq had something to do with 9/11?

Since never.

 

[Desperado]

http://aolsvc.news.aol.com/news/article.adp?id=20040616112109990008

WTF? I can't see it cuz I don't have an AOL account.

 

[Leon]

.

 

[Incognito]

This doesn't mean that there wasn't a link, simpy that they couldn't find evidence of one.

LLOOOOOLLLL!!!

So, since the terrorists were in our country masterminding the whole , tragic events, does that mean we were in connection and harbored them?

Ripclawe? FuseBox?

I'm confused.

 

[sprsk]

WTF? I can't see it cuz I don't have an AOL account.

its some internet poll that states 55% of people think there is a connection. Mind you this poll is no where near accurate, but it shows some people out there actually do believe there is a link.

 

[shoplifter]

its some internet poll that states 55% of people think there is a connection. Mind you this poll is no where near accurate, but it shows some people out there actually do believe there is a link.

yeah, there was a poll done in the last few months (if I find it i'll edit appropriately) that asked what primary news outlets people used and then asked stuff like:

is there a link between al qaida and iraq?
did iraq use chemical weapons on our troops?
did the US find WMD in Iraq?

and the like. A staggering number believed all three were true. The group with the highest percentage of misconceptions were Fox News viewers, the lowest being newspaper readers and NPR listeners IIRC.

 

[xsarien]

Since never.

Actually, at one point, before it all came to a head and people needed to start correcting other people before it got out of hand, the Washington Post pegged the number at 70%. You can thank Cheney for it getting so bad.

 

[MIMIC]

The truth is a double-edged sword: either Americans are fucking idiots, or they are extremely gullible. Either way, it's an painful revelation.

 

[Ripclawe]

Since never.

hee, there are people actually blaming Bush/Cheney for letting that "impression" go on. So even when people come out and say there was no link between Iraq/Al qaeda for the 9/11 attacks. Thats still not good enough.

 

[shoplifter]

hee, there are people actually blaming Bush/Cheney for letting that "impression" go on.

http://www.reuters.com/newsArticle....FFA?type=topNews&storyID=5438743&pageNumber=1

President Bush and Vice President Dick Cheney this week reiterated pre-war arguments that an Iraqi connection to al Qaeda, which is blamed for the Sept. 11 attacks, represented an unacceptable threat to the United States.

The report stood in contrast to comments this week by Vice President Dick Cheney, who said that ousted Iraqi leader Saddam had "long-established ties" to al Qaeda.

Bush, asked on Tuesday about Cheney's comments, cited the presence in Iraq of Islamist militant Abu Musab al-Zarqawi as "the best evidence of (a) connection to al Qaeda affiliates and al Qaeda."

 

[Dead]

Since never.

youd be surprised

 

[Ripclawe]

Thats the Deborah Charles reuters piece where she gives off the impression of Cheney lying by taking bits from page 10 of #15 staff report and mixes it with the part that is worded specifically about Iraq non- involvement in attacks on America. Big difference between what Cheney is saying and what debbie there is trying to imply.

Thats like someone saying officially Saudi Government officials and members of the royal family never gave money to them, but you know they were looking the other way for years and giving money support thru other means.

 

[xsarien]

Thats the Deborah Charles reuters piece where she gives off the impression of Cheney lying by taking bits from page 10 of #15 staff report and mixes it with the part that is worded specifically about Iraq non- involvement in attacks on America. Big difference between what Cheney is saying and what debbie there is trying to imply.

Thats like someone saying officially Saudi Government officials and members of the royal family never gave money to them, but you know they were looking the other way for years and giving money support thru other means.

Does everyone have an agenda/ulterior motive with you?

 

[ShadowRed]

This doesn't mean that there wasn't a link, simpy that they couldn't find evidence of one.

You gotta be freaking kidding me. I really hope you are retarded because I'd hate to think that there is someone out there with your serious lack of mental facalties unsupervised. You could really do some damage to yourself.

 

[Belfast]

This doesn't mean that there wasn't a link, simpy that they couldn't find evidence of one.

This doesn't mean unicorns don't exist, simply that they couldn't find evidence of one!

 

[bobafett]

Is there anyone in America that still believes in this government?

 

[Dead]

Is there anyone in America that still believes in this government?

Enough of them to vote Bush back in office this coming November

 

[bobafett]

Enough of them to vote Bush back in office this coming November

This would be amazing. President Evil and The Patriots are manipulating America. The world is doomed.

 

[Hitokage]

http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/South/06/14/cheney.terrorism.ap/

http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/meast/06/15/bush.alqaeda/index.html

 

[Mandark]

Ooooh, Edward Jay Epstein says the FBI is making stuff up. Really impressive.

I wonder if Lee Harvey Oswald was in Prague too, representing the KGB.

A lot of people think that Saddam was knee-deep in 9/11 planning. There really are millions and millions of registered voters who don't bother making the distinction among the Taliban, Al Qaeda, the Baath party, the Sadrists, etc.

I don't expect people to read Juan Cole's site daily, but in an endeavor as expensive, serious, and deadly as war, we really need to be a bit more careful as a nation.

 

[Banjo Tango]

hee, there are people actually blaming Bush/Cheney for letting that "impression" go on. So even when people come out and say there was no link between Iraq/Al qaeda for the 9/11 attacks. Thats still not good enough.

http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/South/06/14/cheney.terrorism.ap/

http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/meast/06/15/bush.alqaeda/index.html

Bless this board, and the people who post on it.

 

[gofreak]

hee, there are people actually blaming Bush/Cheney for letting that "impression" go on. So even when people come out and say there was no link between Iraq/Al qaeda for the 9/11 attacks. Thats still not good enough.

Huh? Cheney's ramblings definitely would leave some less informed with the impression that Hussein had some sort of roll in 9/11. And unfortunately there seem to be a lot of people who are less informed. The easiest way to get people to accept and support the war on Iraq was to play the 9/11 violin, and they did that, either implicitly or explicitly.

Also, I find it funny to hear the Bush admin talk about ties between Al Qaeda and Saddam. When do we get around to talking about the ties between people in his administration and Saddam? While he was gassing the Kurds? I wonder if the less well informed of America would thus be so eager to draw links between certain Bush-ites and those crimes against humanity, as they are to draw links between Saddam and 9/11.

 

[gofreak]

Bah, it's early morning, my bad..(double post)

 

[sc0la]

I love how Hito indescriminately dishes out the ownage. Always quality.

 

[shoplifter]

Bush still quelling the Iraq/Al Qaida connection rumors!!

"This administration never said that the 9-11 attacks were orchestrated between Saddam and al-Qaida," he said.

"We did say there were numerous contacts between Saddam Hussein and al-Qaida, for example, Iraqi intelligence agents met with (Osama) bin Laden, the head of al-Qaida in the Sudan."

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=514&e=1&u=/ap/20040617/ap_on_go_pr_wh/sept_11_bush_7

 

[Pimpwerx]

What about the ties between Saddam and our Secretary of Defense. Unlike the Al-Qaeda link, we have photographic evidence for this one. Americans are the enemy. American taxpayers paid to make Saddam dangerous. PEACE.

 

[iapetus]

Does everyone have an agenda/ulterior motive with you?

Only those people who say bad things about Dubya. It's a joyous coincidence...

 

[Willco]

Americans are the enemy.[/QUOTE]

Pfft. Talk like that will get you reported to the FBI, TERRORIST.

 

[Ripclawe]

http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/South/06/14/cheney.terrorism.ap/

http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/meast/06/15/bush.alqaeda/index.html

You know the press has blown it when members of the commission has to come out and correct them.


http://www.sanluisobispo.com/mld/sanluisobispo/news/politics/8949175.htm

The vice chairman of the bi-partisan, 10-member commission, however, suggested the flap was overblown.

Both the White House and the commission agree there were some "connections" between Iraq and al-Qaida, said Lee Hamilton, the former Democratic congressman from Indiana who is director of the Woodrow Wilson International Center for Scholars.

"What we have said is ... we don't have any evidence of a cooperative, or a corroborative, relationship between Saddam Hussein's government and these al-Qaida operatives with regard to the attacks on the United States," Hamilton said.

The "sharp differences that the press has drawn" on the issue, he said, "are not that apparent to me."

 

[Hitokage]

http://www.9-11commission.gov/hearings/hearing12/staff_statement_15.pdf

Bin Ladin also explored possible cooperation with Iraq during his time in Sudan, despite his opposition to Hussein's secular regime. Bin Ladin had in fact at one time sponsored anti-Saddam Islamists in Iraqi Kurdistan. The Sudanese, to protect their own ties with Iraq, reportedly persuaded Bin Ladin to cease this support and arranged for contacts between Iraq and al Qaeda.

A senior Iraqi intelligence officer reportedly made three visits to Sudan, finally meeting Bin Ladin in 1994. Bin Ladin is said to have requested space to establish training camps, as well as assistance in procuring weapons, but Iraq apparently never responded.

There have been reports that contacts between Iraq and al Qaeda also occurred after Bin Ladin had returned to Afghanistan, but they do not appear to have resulted in a collaborative relationship.

Two senior Bin Ladin associates have adamantly denied that any ties existed between al Qaeda and Iraq. We have no credible evidence that Iraq and al Qaeda cooperated on attacks against the United States.

A clear case of when the details are far more important than their summary.

 

[Ripclawe]

I read the report, it doesn't dispute what Bush/Cheney has been saying, the press blew it.


http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tm.../ts_nm/iraq_intelligence_dc&cid=564&ncid=1480

Iraqi Officer Tied to Al Qaeda - 9/11 Commissioner




By Peter Kaplan

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The commission investigating the Sept. 11 attacks has been told "a very prominent member" of al Qaeda served as an officer in Saddam Hussein (news - web sites)'s militia, a panel member said on Sunday.

 

[TAJ]

>>>I thought the disputed meetings took place in April of 2001 and what bank has an ATM that allows 8000 dollar withdrawls?<<<

Good question. I can only get $700 at an ATM, and I think even that is more than most people can get.