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Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. S4 |OT| Ghost Riders in the Skye - Tuesdays 10/9c
- Thread starter TheOddOne
- Start date
CopperPuppy
Member
Whew...
Thank goodness ya'll in here to make sure HYDRA doesn't get unfairly labeled.
Fighting the good fight.
Thank goodness ya'll in here to make sure HYDRA doesn't get unfairly labeled.
Fighting the good fight.
Tathanen
Get Inside Her!
Yeah they kinda just glommed on the Nazis to get their own shit done. Red Skull happily ditched Hitler in The First Avenger when he was no longer useful for him.
In the MCU at least, dunno how much of that is comic-accurate.
616/Prime Hydra has deeper roots, as seen in the current Steve Rogers comic.
Rumblebones
Banned
Hydra used the Nazis as a means to the end. That doesn't really make them true believers or anything more than nominal members.
They are way more worse than that.
As for Ward, the guy was a piece of shit, but I doubt he believed in the ideology. Being Hydra was all pretty much knew since he was recruited as a teenager. It'd almost be sad if he wasn't such a scumbag.
They are way more worse than that.
As for Ward, the guy was a piece of shit, but I doubt he believed in the ideology. Being Hydra was all pretty much knew since he was recruited as a teenager. It'd almost be sad if he wasn't such a scumbag.
HP_Wuvcraft
Banned
Some new event. I would guess its where the inhuman become known to humanity in Hydraverse.
Tetsujin_MK
Member
Saying that Hydra aren't Nazis isn't "defending" them or whatever people here seem to think, it's being aware that national socialism is a very real and specific type of fascism and Hydra in the MCU has become less defined cartoony generic fascism with fucking laser guns and aliens thrown on top.
HP_Wuvcraft
Banned
Hydra is fictional.
They are literally supposed to represent nazis, but they are also fictional. There's no reason to try to "defend" Hydra against being called nazis, because they are fictional. There's nothing to defend.
They are literally supposed to represent nazis, but they are also fictional. There's no reason to try to "defend" Hydra against being called nazis, because they are fictional. There's nothing to defend.
Rumblebones
Banned
I haven't seen anyone "defend" Hydra in this thread.
Yessssss
Madame Hydra to appear on Agents of Shield
Even before clicking I thought "Aida's actress would be so good for her" and low and behold. Lol
Madame Hydra to appear on Agents of Shield
Even before clicking I thought "Aida's actress would be so good for her" and low and behold. Lol
BrokenFiction
Member
Aww, it's not the real Madame Hydra. That'd be aces. Get Katrina Law to play her.
The Whitney Frost Madam Masque was on Agent Carter.
BrokenFiction
Member
New clip. Man, this gonna be crazy.
https://twitter.com/AgentsofSHIELD/status/848952590859739142
Agents of SHIELD @AgentsofSHIELD 4 minutes ago
https://twitter.com/AgentsofSHIELD/status/848952590859739142
Agents of SHIELD @AgentsofSHIELD 4 minutes ago
fallengorn
Bitches love smiley faces
This should open the episode with Jemma doing this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mk5fAvpwtKU
Father_Brain
Banned
I'm curious how/whether they'll explain where the Avengers are in this timeline, heh.
Pai Pai Master
Banned
Hoping that will be a thing - they were probably all executed by Hydra. Project Insight worked out in the Framework I'm guessing.
Without Coulson, they never coalesced. Thor might be powerless/locked up (depending on what effects Son of Coul had in New Mexico), Iron Man might have died to Iron Monger, without Phil there to save Pepper, who then didn't save Tony, Hawkeye and Widow are just agents of Hydra away on mission (or killed when they didn't comply) and Cap...well, still frozen?
Pai Pai Master
Banned
That makes more sense, if Coulson never joined SHIELD in the first place. But then who stopped Loki?
Kai Dracon
Writing a dinosaur space opera symphony
Maybe Hydra stepped up to stop Loki and the invaders because they didn't want someone else to conquer the Earth. Even without Loki's staff Von Strucker looked like his group had improved on the WWII Hydra weapons. They could have fought the Chitauri.
Hydra saves the world, goes public, becomes heroes.
StarCreator
Member
Why would Loki be on Earth if Thor hadn't been there to stop his endgame?
Of course, Thanos would have still made an attempt to acquire the Tesseract from Earth somehow, but of course the Tesseract's circumstances would have been very different without SHIELD. (It's also a moot point considering no one on Earth knows about Thanos, therefore he can't possibly be taken into account in the simulation...)
Pai Pai Master
Banned
Haha we're going down a rabbit hole here. Wonder how the show will reconcile all these differences.
oh...they won't...
NinjaTehFish
Banned
If Red Skull won, Cap would be dead and If Stark wasn't killed Immediately (but still died at roughly the same age) Tony would've grown up a totally different person etc. etc. etc.
Conversely Winter Soldier could play out differently but this means other continuity changes beforehand need to take place (eg:What coulson has been doing since "dying" * ) and assume they pull off whatever plan they must've had for the other avengers. Which I dont like as much because I think getting as much result as you can with one change only affecting future events as being a much simpler method.
* If they went this route maybe the teacher gig is cover and Fury set him up to manage the "Patriot Program" or resistance/whatever In the event of shield or the Avengers falling.
and that is my quarterly random post in these threads.
Conversely Winter Soldier could play out differently but this means other continuity changes beforehand need to take place (eg:What coulson has been doing since "dying" * ) and assume they pull off whatever plan they must've had for the other avengers. Which I dont like as much because I think getting as much result as you can with one change only affecting future events as being a much simpler method.
* If they went this route maybe the teacher gig is cover and Fury set him up to manage the "Patriot Program" or resistance/whatever In the event of shield or the Avengers falling.
and that is my quarterly random post in these threads.
I think you guys are being a little too strict with your interpretation of the Framework as a quasi-divergent timeline. I know the show is inviting those theories due to the creative premise, but at its core it is still a collective virtual simulation. That effectively gives the writers carte blanche to pick and choose what elements make up the history of the world without having to heavily reconcile the alternate history with the established MCU canon.
What's the point if they're not going to play with the scale of it?
The Elite
BOSS
They can and should. But the details aren't super important - like, sure, Stark probably dies if Coulson isn't an agent. But if the Framework wants Iron Man alive to fight the Chitauri or whatever, the Framework can just tweak things so that he survives.
I do hope they go big, but they have the latitude to be loose with it.
Yeah, I don't think the program would even strive for everything to fit perfectly in a timeline. The narrative appeal of the Framework isn't historical accuracy, but the need to fulfill exactly what the connected people crave.
They hinted at that with the tests using May. Her nature craves for danger, so any perfectly peaceful scenario would eventually get her to disconnect. It will be interesting to see what it means for the other characters, especially Fitz and Simmons.
They hinted at that with the tests using May. Her nature craves for danger, so any perfectly peaceful scenario would eventually get her to disconnect. It will be interesting to see what it means for the other characters, especially Fitz and Simmons.
The Elite
BOSS
It bugs me. It screams cheap TV knockoff of major motion picture. I hate it when TV shows do that. The concept of a virtual world is not original to the Matrix so I don't need them emulating it.
The Elite
BOSS
Agents of Shield is a spin off of a major motion picture franchise. There is a difference and it works well for what it is. The concept of a virtual world doesn't have to be a cheap knockoff of anything since it's an idea that isn't exclusive to a single source. They don't need to emulate the Matrix just because they are doing a virtual world.
The Elite
BOSS
Why do they have to think about another virtual worlds. Why does the framework need to reference anything? Virtual worlds are a popular fictional trope. The Framework can stand on its own without needing to look like the Matrix. The only other reason to use a green tint is as a virtual marker to separate the real world from the virtual world and there are other ways you can achieve that.
BrokenFiction
Member
SHIELD IS BACK.
The Elite
BOSS
A virtual world isn't a callback or reference to anything without the green tint. It doesn't have to have anything to do with the Matrix.
Do a search for the word "Matrix" inside this thread. I'm not the first one to bring it up here.
Do a search for "Agents of SHIELD + Matrix" on Google.
People everywhere were already making that comparison. The show is just leaning into it because (I assume) they realize the comparison is obvious.
The Elite
BOSS
You can draw comparisons all you like I am just saying that a virtual world doesn't have to be a reference to the Matrix simply because it was popular. Adding the green tint seems silly to me. Smallville did cheap TV knock off episodes of movies all the time. They always bugged me. That's why this bugs me.
The Elite
BOSS
I do love that.
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