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Alien Swarm |OT| - Free Co-op Multiplayer from Valve
- Thread starter gregor7777
- Start date
Sorry if this has been discussed, but I dont want to read all he thread for this.
Did anyone hear someone whistling a song in the middle of the game..?
Is it the song called "Amigo"(Friend) by Roberto Carlos..?(Not the football player)
Being this "gift" given so close to friend's day...
Did anyone hear someone whistling a song in the middle of the game..?
Is it the song called "Amigo"(Friend) by Roberto Carlos..?(Not the football player)
Being this "gift" given so close to friend's day...
Stallion Free
Cock Encumbered
"A large tile could be used for that. Tilebased doesn't necessarily mean that it's just a bunch of small square chunks put together, they just need to fit on the grid properly. In fact, if you look at some of the example tiles in the Tilegen, there are quite a few really large somewhat irregular shaped pieces there."
If you are going to make a tile for something as large as that segment there, then my point still stands, you can make a level too. In fact, if that is a tile (which it isn't available for use and there is no reason it shouldn't be if it is a tile) then it would be incredibly obvious if it was reused and it would. I mean that tunnel makes up a third of that level. Who wants to play a level that has more or less copy-pasted a third of another level?
If you are going to make a tile for something as large as that segment there, then my point still stands, you can make a level too. In fact, if that is a tile (which it isn't available for use and there is no reason it shouldn't be if it is a tile) then it would be incredibly obvious if it was reused and it would. I mean that tunnel makes up a third of that level. Who wants to play a level that has more or less copy-pasted a third of another level?
Clearly you're right and the fact that the game has super easy to use editing tools means that absolutely nothing new will ever be released for it ever. No one will ever release any new levels for this, no one will ever make more tiles for other people to use, and there will never ever be anything in the game other than what there is right now.
Also, it's really pathetic for Valve to release a game in this state and you should totally ask for your money back.
Also, it's really pathetic for Valve to release a game in this state and you should totally ask for your money back.
Technosteve
Banned
Durp Durp Derp Derp. On neogaf people can find shit to complain about even when no one gives a shit.
Stallion Free
Cock Encumbered
I think you are missing the point of the discussion here. I'm explaining why people need to keep their expectations in check and that quality unique maps won't be products of the tile-gen.Htown said:
Teknopathetic
Member
"If you are going to make a tile for something as large as that segment there, then my point still stands, you can make a level too. In fact, if that is a tile (which it isn't available for use and there is no reason it shouldn't be if it is a tile) then it would be incredibly obvious if it was reused and it would. I mean that tunnel makes up a third of that level. Who wants to play a level that has more or less copy-pasted a third of another level?"
You're completely not getting it. Of course you can "make a level," it's significantly *faster* to do it in a tilebased manner and reuse tiles where applicable. That doesn't mean that you ONLY reuse things and that you don't make anything unique within that. If you look at the rest of that level instead of focusing on one single part, you'd see a lot of same-y rooms and corridors.
"I think you are missing the point of the discussion here. I'm explaining why people need to keep their expectations in check and that quality unique maps won't be products of the tile-gen."
And I'm explaining how there's no comparison between Alien Swarm and L4D because there are tools available to Alien Swarm that aren't available for L4D. Furthermore, Alien Swarm maps are already much simpler to design due to the fact that there's virtually no verticality to them. I'm not even sure why you think the tilegen is "crude and simple," anyway. What is your logic behind that?
You're completely not getting it. Of course you can "make a level," it's significantly *faster* to do it in a tilebased manner and reuse tiles where applicable. That doesn't mean that you ONLY reuse things and that you don't make anything unique within that. If you look at the rest of that level instead of focusing on one single part, you'd see a lot of same-y rooms and corridors.
"I think you are missing the point of the discussion here. I'm explaining why people need to keep their expectations in check and that quality unique maps won't be products of the tile-gen."
And I'm explaining how there's no comparison between Alien Swarm and L4D because there are tools available to Alien Swarm that aren't available for L4D. Furthermore, Alien Swarm maps are already much simpler to design due to the fact that there's virtually no verticality to them. I'm not even sure why you think the tilegen is "crude and simple," anyway. What is your logic behind that?
Stallion Free
Cock Encumbered
"You're completely not getting it. Of course you can "make a level," it's significantly *faster* to do it in a tilebased manner and reuse tiles where applicable. That doesn't mean that you ONLY reuse things and that you don't make anything unique within that. If you look at the rest of that level instead of focusing on one single part, you'd see a lot of same-y rooms and corridors."
Hallways are about the only place where you can reuse tiles and actually get away with it, so you will still have to make a new tile for pretty much everything else. And that would be using the actual SDK quite a bit then. If you are making a ton of new tiles with the SDK, you might as well make sure they flow together well in the actual SDK instead of throwing them all into tile-gen and connecting them there. Have you played a map made with the tile-gen?
"And I'm explaining how there's no comparison between Alien Swarm and L4D because there are tools available to Alien Swarm that aren't available for L4D. Furthermore, Alien Swarm maps are already much simpler to design due to the fact that there's virtually no verticality to them. I'm not even sure why you think the tilegen is "crude and simple," anyway. What is your logic behind that?"
Tile-gen is crude and simple because you are limited to pre-fab tiles. To make anything actual new with it that isn't a boring corridor that looks the same as everyone else's corridor, you have to go use the actual SDK.
Hallways are about the only place where you can reuse tiles and actually get away with it, so you will still have to make a new tile for pretty much everything else. And that would be using the actual SDK quite a bit then. If you are making a ton of new tiles with the SDK, you might as well make sure they flow together well in the actual SDK instead of throwing them all into tile-gen and connecting them there. Have you played a map made with the tile-gen?
"And I'm explaining how there's no comparison between Alien Swarm and L4D because there are tools available to Alien Swarm that aren't available for L4D. Furthermore, Alien Swarm maps are already much simpler to design due to the fact that there's virtually no verticality to them. I'm not even sure why you think the tilegen is "crude and simple," anyway. What is your logic behind that?"
Tile-gen is crude and simple because you are limited to pre-fab tiles. To make anything actual new with it that isn't a boring corridor that looks the same as everyone else's corridor, you have to go use the actual SDK.
Teknopathetic
Member
"Hallways are about the only place where you can reuse tiles and actually get away with it, so you will still have to make a new tile for pretty much everything else. And that would be using the actual SDK quite a bit then. If you are making a ton of new tiles with the SDK, you might as well make sure they flow together well in the actual SDK instead of throwing them all into tile-gen and connecting them there. Have you played a map made with the tile-gen?"
Have you actually played this game? There isn't much "unique" per level.
"Tile-gen is crude and simple because you are limited to pre-fab tiles. To make anything actual new with it that isn't a boring corridor that looks the same as everyone else's corridor, you have to go use the actual SDK."
Now, I'm convinced that you just don't get it, either through willful ignorance or just shortsightedness. To make something quality and unique, you're definitely going to have to go into Hammer. The difference is, making a set of tiles and designing levels from that is much faster than repeating the process for every single room in your level(s). Especially if you feel a need to change the layout for whatever reason while making it.
Have you actually played this game? There isn't much "unique" per level.
"Tile-gen is crude and simple because you are limited to pre-fab tiles. To make anything actual new with it that isn't a boring corridor that looks the same as everyone else's corridor, you have to go use the actual SDK."
Now, I'm convinced that you just don't get it, either through willful ignorance or just shortsightedness. To make something quality and unique, you're definitely going to have to go into Hammer. The difference is, making a set of tiles and designing levels from that is much faster than repeating the process for every single room in your level(s). Especially if you feel a need to change the layout for whatever reason while making it.
gregor7777
Banned
Stallion, have a look at Forza my man. Then talk to me about creativity with simple tools.
For truly unique content, sure, some talented people will be needed to create unique assets. And the tools do so can be complex.
But when has that ever stopped the moding community? Particularly with a straightforward game like this? You keep bringing up L4D, which is actually a fairly complex game to create content for. Have a look at simpler games and the amount of unique content created for them. Examples: Killing Floor, UT2004 (where this game originated).
I'm not sure why you feel the need to temper expectations here. Are you laying claim to an epic "I Told You So."?
For truly unique content, sure, some talented people will be needed to create unique assets. And the tools do so can be complex.
But when has that ever stopped the moding community? Particularly with a straightforward game like this? You keep bringing up L4D, which is actually a fairly complex game to create content for. Have a look at simpler games and the amount of unique content created for them. Examples: Killing Floor, UT2004 (where this game originated).
I'm not sure why you feel the need to temper expectations here. Are you laying claim to an epic "I Told You So."?
Stallion Free
Cock Encumbered
"Have you actually played this game? There isn't much "unique" per level."
Now, I'm convinced that you just don't get it, either through willful ignorance or just shortsightedness. To make something quality and unique, you're definitely going to have to go into Hammer. The difference is, making a set of tiles and designing levels from that is much faster than repeating the process for every single room in your level(s). Especially if you feel a need to change the layout for whatever reason while making it."
Any differences from room to room (desks, debris, etc.) has to be changes in Hammer. While it's not blatantly unique, it requires loading up said tile and making all the necessary changes. I realize that what you are saying people should do is a much faster process, however faster =/= quality. I want quality maps for this game as does everyone else and the tile-gen editor doesn't guarantee that. In fact, it's going to mean we are going to have a lot more shit to wade through to get to good stuff. And that was my whole point to begin with.
If you are making cool unique rooms, there is a good chance it will be easier tweaking your maps in Hammer than it is in the tile-gen due to the limitations of how you can manipulate rooms in there.
Now, I'm convinced that you just don't get it, either through willful ignorance or just shortsightedness. To make something quality and unique, you're definitely going to have to go into Hammer. The difference is, making a set of tiles and designing levels from that is much faster than repeating the process for every single room in your level(s). Especially if you feel a need to change the layout for whatever reason while making it."
Any differences from room to room (desks, debris, etc.) has to be changes in Hammer. While it's not blatantly unique, it requires loading up said tile and making all the necessary changes. I realize that what you are saying people should do is a much faster process, however faster =/= quality. I want quality maps for this game as does everyone else and the tile-gen editor doesn't guarantee that. In fact, it's going to mean we are going to have a lot more shit to wade through to get to good stuff. And that was my whole point to begin with.
If you are making cool unique rooms, there is a good chance it will be easier tweaking your maps in Hammer than it is in the tile-gen due to the limitations of how you can manipulate rooms in there.
fallengorn
Bitches love smiley faces
This is going to build up into a "Prove Stallion Free is Wrong: Alien Swarm map contest."gregor7777 said:
Teknopathetic
Member
"Any differences from room to room (desks, debris, etc.) has to be changes in Hammer."
Uh, yes. But placing things like that doesn't suck up near as much time as designing the entire layout of the level. Nowhere near.
"While it's not blatantly unique, it requires loading up said tile and making all the necessary changes. I realize that what you are saying people should do is a much faster process, however faster =/= quality. I want quality maps for this game as does everyone else and the tile-gen editor doesn't guarantee that. In fact, it's going to mean we are going to have a lot more shit to wade through to get to good stuff. And that was my whole point to begin with."
There is always going to be lesser quality stuff out there. For a lot of modders out there now, making something truly standout and compare to levels in these multi-year development cycle, multi-million dollar budget titles takes an absurd amount of time. I would argue that's the main reason you don't see many "Valve-quality" L4D custom maps. The time it takes to make something of that level by yourself or even with a team of 2 or 3 in your spare time is immense.
Uh, yes. But placing things like that doesn't suck up near as much time as designing the entire layout of the level. Nowhere near.
"While it's not blatantly unique, it requires loading up said tile and making all the necessary changes. I realize that what you are saying people should do is a much faster process, however faster =/= quality. I want quality maps for this game as does everyone else and the tile-gen editor doesn't guarantee that. In fact, it's going to mean we are going to have a lot more shit to wade through to get to good stuff. And that was my whole point to begin with."
There is always going to be lesser quality stuff out there. For a lot of modders out there now, making something truly standout and compare to levels in these multi-year development cycle, multi-million dollar budget titles takes an absurd amount of time. I would argue that's the main reason you don't see many "Valve-quality" L4D custom maps. The time it takes to make something of that level by yourself or even with a team of 2 or 3 in your spare time is immense.
Stallion Free
Cock Encumbered
Great, just make sure you use those tiles and your tile-gen editor to prove me wrong.fallengorn said:
Stallion Free
Cock Encumbered
"There is always going to be lesser quality stuff out there. For a lot of modders out there now, making something truly standout and compare to levels in these multi-year development cycle, multi-million dollar budget titles takes an absurd amount of time. I would argue that's the main reason you don't see many "Valve-quality" L4D custom maps. The time it takes to make something of that level by yourself or even with a team of 2 or 3 in your spare time is immense."
And that's why I said people need to keep expectations in check and that you aren't going to get Valve quality with just a tile-gen and some prefabs. To make something that is actual quality, I want unique scenarios similar to the final level, not just a clear out the eggs bullshit. I want little physics puzzles, I want finales similar to the elevator in level 2 where you have all the bugs climbing up the walls, I want more than what can be done with tile-gen. And 90% of a modders time will be working on getting those types of things working, so how much time does tile-gen actually save someone making a good map?
I want to be proven wrong by the community. But I do not expect anything that was mostly worked on in tile-gen to knock my socks off.
And that's why I said people need to keep expectations in check and that you aren't going to get Valve quality with just a tile-gen and some prefabs. To make something that is actual quality, I want unique scenarios similar to the final level, not just a clear out the eggs bullshit. I want little physics puzzles, I want finales similar to the elevator in level 2 where you have all the bugs climbing up the walls, I want more than what can be done with tile-gen. And 90% of a modders time will be working on getting those types of things working, so how much time does tile-gen actually save someone making a good map?
I want to be proven wrong by the community. But I do not expect anything that was mostly worked on in tile-gen to knock my socks off.
Teknopathetic
Member
"And that's why I said people need to keep expectations in check and that you aren't going to get Valve quality with just a tile-gen and some prefabs. To make something that is actual quality, I want unique scenarios similar to the final level, not just a clear out the eggs bullshit. I want little physics puzzles, I want finales similar to the elevator in level 2 where you have all the bugs climbing up the walls, I want more than what can be done with tile-gen."
Most of those things you want revolve around scripting and not really the layout of the level itself.
Most of those things you want revolve around scripting and not really the layout of the level itself.
Technosteve
Banned
I would pay for dlc to unlock hats.Javaman said:
Stallion Free
Cock Encumbered
"Most of those things you want revolve around scripting and not really the layout of the level itself."
Just making a good level layout/environment isn't enough.
Just making a good level layout/environment isn't enough.
Stallion Free
Cock Encumbered
That tile-gen doesn't magically mean that we will get quality maps that people are expecting to see.Lyphen said:
gregor7777
Banned
Stallion Free said:
OP updated. Thanks
Prophet Steve
Member
I believe both have a different opinion on what the point is, so there is no point.Lyphen said:
gregor7777
Banned
Prophet Steve said:
I disagree.
This video is why we will see custom AS maps, and soon.
(boss spoilers I guess, if they ever add this in an official map)
(boss spoilers I guess, if they ever add this in an official map)
Alright, GAF, I'm going to need more Alien Swarm friends (I really wish they would feed group members to make it easier).
http://steamcommunity.com/id/lyphen Eastern US (mostly evening playtime).
http://steamcommunity.com/id/lyphen Eastern US (mostly evening playtime).
Has anyone here had their CPU and GPU temps climb to dangerous levels while playing Alien Swarm?
http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1370923
Enabling V-Sync and disabling multicore rendering might help if this problem has affected your PC.
http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1370923
Enabling V-Sync and disabling multicore rendering might help if this problem has affected your PC.
Prophet Steve
Member
Meh, can't get it to work.Sciz said:
