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[corduroygt]

This is just silly and yet so many ignorant people like you believe it.

How do you explain the existence of normal Muslims?regular people?

Have you actually talked to any? Do you know any?

The reason you excuse Christianity is because you know normal people. People who will say the bible is literary true, and will say you are going to hell, and say gays are the devil... and yet, they act mostly like normal nice people most of the time.

Guess what, that's most Muslims too. You are simply ignorant.

I'm an ex Muslim so all your precinceived notions are wrong. I know the religion and its people much better than you.

I know they are mostly normal people, I've said so many times. Islam is not just a personal religion like Christianity. It's a political ideology as well as a belief system. Muhammad used it to raid caravans, marry 12 women, and to conquer Mecca. The "normal" Muslims can keep it separate by denying parts of the Quran. Most do not even read it anyway. But the ideology is very dangerous today, It's as bad as Naziism or other supremacist crap. Muslim world at large thinks of non muslims same way as US police think of black people. I know this from my experiences or you can ask any atheist in a predominantly muslim society and how they have to conceal their identity.

There is nothing anyone can say that would make me look upon Islam or any other religion favorably.

 

[boiled goose]

I'm an ex Muslim so all your precinceived notions are wrong. I know the religion and its people much better than you.

I know they are mostly normal people, I've said so many times. Islam is not just a personal religion like Christianity. It's a political ideology as well as a belief system. Muhammad used it to raid caravans, marry 12 women, and to conquer Mecca. The "normal" Muslims can keep it separate by denying parts of the Quran. Most do not even read it anyway. But the ideology is very dangerous today, It's as bad as Naziism or other supremacist crap. Muslim world at large thinks of non muslims same way as US police think of black people. I know this from my experiences or you can ask any atheist in a predominantly muslim society and how they have to conceal their identity.

There is nothing anyone can say that would make me look upon Islam or any other religion favorably.

Islam is not a personal religion like Christianity, etc is a GENERALIZATION.

Ive met plenty of "personal islam Muslims"

Ive also met "political ideology" Christians. If you dont want to look at the inquisition just look at political theocrats in the usa today.

I dont view Islam or religion generally favorably AT ALL.

i think we a agree on everything, except for your tendency to generalize a religion as a single blob, which is the issue i have been compelled to bring up.

Just like the moderate Muslims ignore part of the Quran so do the moderate Christians ignore parts of the Bible. It can be done and there's plenty of evidence because we can see that these people exist.

given that they people exist, the issue are fundamentalist interpretations.

 

[corduroygt]

Islam is not a personal religion like Christianity, etc is a GENERALIZATION.

Ive met plenty of "personal islam Muslims"

Ive also met "political ideology" Christians. If you dont want to look at the inquisition just look at political theocrats in the usa today.

I dont view Islam or religion generally favorably AT ALL.

i think we a agree on everything, except for your tendency to generalize a religion as a single blob, which is the issue i have been compelled to bring up.

Just like the moderate Muslims ignore part of the Quran so do the moderate Christians ignore parts of the Bible. It can be done and there's plenty of evidence because we can see that these people exist.

given that they people exist, the issue are fundamentalist interpretations.

You are still focusing on people and interpretations. How muslims live peacefully for the most part is irrelevant, what defines islam is its teachings, not how people choose to obey it. I am only discussing the core of Islam which is the Quran and Muhammad's life through the Hadith. Compare that with the Bible and there are stark contrasts which make Islam far more toxic and dangerous.


Quran has far more rules and restrictions in daily life. You are more aware of Islam surrounding you.
Quran says it has not changed and its the literal word of god and all verses must be obeyed. Bible makes no such claim and therefore far fewer people think its the literal word of god.
Bible does not order murder or amputation. Even if it did, there are many outs (its not literal word of god, it has been altered, etc) that believers can choose to ignore and still feel they wont go to hell for ignoring it.
Jesus did not raid Caravans, wage a war of aggression, and kill entire families and have sex with their teenage daughter on the same night.
Jesus did not have sex with a 9 year old when he was 52

Islam is a far more dangerous and violent ideology due to its nature, not due to how people interpret it. That more people interpret Islam in an extremist manner is a result of its nature, not the cause.

 

[ElTorro]

The discrimination and treatment of non-believers and apostates is one field of atrocities where Islam really cannot be defended with any exercise in hermeneutic and mental gymnastics.

 

[boiled goose]

You are still focusing on people and interpretations. How muslims live peacefully for the most part is irrelevant, what defines islam is its teachings, not how people choose to obey it. I am only discussing the core of Islam which is the Quran and Muhammad's life through the Hadith. Compare that with the Bible and there are stark contrasts which make Islam far more toxic and dangerous.


Quran has far more rules and restrictions in daily life. You are more aware of Islam surrounding you.
Quran says it has not changed and its the literal word of god and all verses must be obeyed. Bible makes no such claim and therefore far fewer people think its the literal word of god.
Bible does not order murder or amputation. Even if it did, there are many outs (its not literal word of god, it has been altered, etc) that believers can choose to ignore and still feel they wont go to hell for ignoring it.
Jesus did not raid Caravans, wage a war of aggression, and kill entire families and have sex with their teenage daughter on the same night.
Jesus did not have sex with a 9 year old when he was 52

Islam is a far more dangerous and violent ideology due to its nature, not due to how people interpret it. That more people interpret Islam in an extremist manner is a result of its nature, not the cause.

Read the bible and read a history book. Very little difference.

The one thing I will concede is that the bible is more vague and long and Christians dont really know what's in it. That can and has been a double edged sword. Christians eat shellfish despite it being prohibited, dont really burn witches,dont force rapees to marry rapists, stone unruly children, etc. Yet they are against abortion which has little if non scriptural basis.

From my experience with religious people they can do whatever mental gymnastics they want to so the differences in script itself are not too important imo. We know these mental gymnastics can be done for both.

With that... i will end here.

I will let moderate Muslims explain there mental gymnastics, as i cant do them for them.
Your argument is basically no true Scotsman with you being the theogical authority. Your argument is basically moderate Muslims are not real Muslims, but then excuse other religions.

Ive had Muslims somehow explain away all these problems but I'm with you I'd rather they toss the whole book

 

[corduroygt]

Your argument is basically no true Scotsman with you being the theogical authority. Your argument is basically moderate Muslims are not real Muslims, but then excuse other religions.

Way to twist my words again, my argument is not NTS. All people who say they are Muslims are Muslims. Unlike the Bible, which is more like a history book, Quran is a book of law and conduct manual. Just like all laws there are interpretations, but they are more or less similar. It is a fact that Quran orders to kill people, cut the arms of thieves, a woman's testimony is half as worthy as man's, etc. And having such a book saying it's the true word of god is extremely dangerous. That is why you have many more Muslim extremists, from middle-class families as well, so it's not just about poverty.

Saying that Christianity is as bad as Islam, today, is like saying both Democratic and Republican parties are bad and there is no difference between them.

 

[joedan]

Another killed.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/bangladeshi-secular-activist-nazimuddin-samad-who-criticised-islamism-hacked-death-murdered-a6972246.html

 

[MonsterHunter]

http://edition.cnn.com/2016/04/30/asia/bangladesh-tailor-hacked-to-death/index.html

Hindu tailor was hacked to death in Bangladesh on Saturday.

Two LGBT activists hacked to death last Monday.

Professor hacked to death previous Saturday.

 

[cameron]

Another killed.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/bangladeshi-secular-activist-nazimuddin-samad-who-criticised-islamism-hacked-death-murdered-a6972246.html

http://edition.cnn.com/2016/04/30/asia/bangladesh-tailor-hacked-to-death/index.html

Hindu tailor was hacked to death in Bangladesh on Saturday.

Two LGBT activists hacked to death last Monday.

Professor hacked to death previous Saturday.

Might we worthy of a new thread. Since there has been an insane number of new attacks in April alone.

 

[Morrigan Stark]

Every time this thread gets bumped I fear the worst. Fuck