Support NeoGAF

[Mahadev]

End of the day dont like it dont put your app on there or buy there product. Simple as that, epic could of easily of done that

Yeah, just let huge corporations use their oligopolies to bully everyone into paying a 30% tax to them just just for putting their games on their products, what could possibly go wrong? If you don't want to pay the monopoly tax just lose millions in revenue and sales, that simple.

 

[mckmas8808]

Apple won't get sued, since Epic violated their developer agreement Apple is fully within their rights to refund every IAP made on Fortnite. Epic is then on the hook to pay that bill. It really doesn't seem like Epic thought about the full ramifications about going up against Apple......

I'm plenty sure they did and is willing to take this all the way to the Supreme Court to prove their point.

 

[TriSuit666]

Based Epic, and y'all are bums thinking this isn't part of the plan.

$300 Mil in free money might be chump change for Apple, but they'll lose more in cache, it might drive other devs away from the platform.

 

[mckmas8808]

What next? Ban the Unreal Engine on iOS/macOS/iPadOS? That would be Epic

They sorta did that already starting this past weekend, I believe.

 

[INC]

at the end of the day

Fuck apple

 

[Mahadev]

It should be noted that EU has already opened an antitrust investigation against Apple for this exact bullshit. I'm sure Apple's incredible arrogance won't bite them up the ass or that EU won't use this crap they pulled to fucking destroy them with multi-billion dollar fines. I'm actually glad they did this, fuck Apple indeed.

 

[mckmas8808]

It should be noted that EU has already opened an antitrust investigation against Apple for this exact bullshit. I'm sure Apple's incredible arrogance won't bite them up the ass or that EU won't use this crap they pulled to fucking destroy them with multi-billion dollar fines. I'm actually glad they did this, fuck Apple indeed.

I didn't know this. Interesting....

 

[Chiggs]

You sir are an idiot of biblical proportions

I have 2 iPhones, an iPad Pro, an iMac and an Apple Watch! I thought it was because I enjoyed those products, but as it turns out it was really just because of my low testosterone levels!

 

[SlicedBread3]

Do the people that are siding with Epic not realize that they are simply trying to act innocent, and like the good guys because they simply want MORE of your money? Or is this simply because people think it's cool to hate on Apple?

It's neither. It's the usual situation of people being offered a product that isn't exactly to their liking, so they spin it to try and argue their consumer rights are being abused somehow in order to get what they want.

 

[Mr Moose]

Terrible post. Apple make great products. What's not to like?

$999 for a stand.

 

[quickwhips]

you dont see a security issue with anyone able to take your creditcard info and process it wherever? come on think.

It happens every day on pc.

 

[MrS]

$999 for a stand.

$600 for wheels is more egregious, but we can't pretend things like iPad, iPod and iPhone weren't revolutionary. Like, there's an obvious reason why people enjoy their products. They look great and they're extremely easy to use. Even my technophobe dad can use an iPad.

 

[Entroyp]

I do wonder, from reading a lot of the comments here, what do people think Apple should do?

1. Reduce the cut Apple takes (let's say.. 15%)
2. Take no cut (lol)
3. Let another company have unrestricted access to the storefront Apple created and currently maintains? Including access to the millions and millions of its customers, all for free? Because, why? "Anti-Consumer" cries from the internet?

Shit, not even google rolled with that shit.

 

[Skifi28]

Tenc...I mean Epic, always fighting the good fight.

 

[JLB]

lol. Deal with it Epic.

 

[alabtrosMyster]

Apple is shitty... I mean, way worse than I ever imagined.

 

[TimFL]

They breached their contract with Apple, then filed a lawsuit against Apple and launched an anti-Apple marketing campaign. Apple has every reason to cease doing business with them.

They have a valid point in their lawsuit regarding in-app payment methods. Apple forces apps to use their in-app payment solution for digital goods that can be consumed in-app (movies, music, game stuff etc), yet amazon is the odd one out with special treatment allowing them to for one get only 15% taken off and also use their own payment processing with rentals and purchases in the Prime app.

The whole "everyone gets treated fairly" is hyperbolic as fuck coming from Apple.

Just look up the origin of their "Reader app" clause, it's a gigantic special treatment factory so apps like Netflix and co. didn't just kill their apps day 1, leaving Apple TV and co. dead in the water.

Apple bends their own rulesets where they see fit, it's not a fair ecosystem at all yet everyone goes at Epic for being the odd one out there, actually trying to fight for fair treatment between all apps.

Disclaimer: I hate Epic for their Epic Store exclusivity practice, but I agree with them that Apple is borderline retarded when it comes to developer relations and treatment. Xcloud being another mind boggling and ancient way of thinking just to cover their backs (e.g. streaming killing native apps one day, rendering the App Store obsolete).

 

[nemiroff]

Shitbag CEO Tim Cock and shitbag CEO Tim Swiney providing some great entertainment. Thank you for that at least.

 

[Mahadev]

I have 2 iPhones, an iPad Pro, an iMac and an Apple Watch! I thought it was because I enjoyed those products, but as it turns out it was really just because of my low testosterone levels!

Enjoying Apple has less to do with testosterone levels and more to do with poor decision making. We're talking about a company that not only uses monopolistic practices and has a disgustingly locked down "ecosystem" but also constantly rips off its customers even when they try to repair their overpriced products. It should be noted that Apple is also fighting and trying to close down independent Apple repair shops so that is can freely do shit like this to its customers. I can point to hundreds of Luis Rossman videos alone of Apple blatantly ripping off customers or selling them faulty products they will later force them to pay hundreds of dollars to repair.


Apple is pretty much a scam company now that carpet bombs customers with marketing to brainwash them into buying its shitty products as a fashion statement or status symbol. Fuck. Apple.

 

[The Cartographer]

Sweeney right now:

 

[Chiggs]

Enjoying Apple has less to do with testosterone levels and more to do with poor decision making. We're talking about a company that not only uses monopolistic practices and has a disgustingly locked down "ecosystem" but also constantly rips off its customers even when they try to repair their overpriced products. It should be noted that Apple is also fighting and trying to close down independent Apple repair shops so that is can freely do shit like this to its customers. I can point to hundreds of Luis Rossman videos alone of Apple blatantly ripping off customers or selling them faulty products they will later force them to pay hundreds of dollars to repair.


Apple is pretty much a scam company now that carpet bombs customers with marketing to brainwash them into buying its shitty products as a fashion statement or status symbol. Fuck. Apple.

Yeah, it's the ecosystem. Once they've got you....

 

[oagboghi2]

That's the thing. Apple should be able to have its own store and have their own rules. It's fine if they don't want third party payment processors on the app store. Totally within their rights.

But, Apple should not be able to lock down iOS to prevent me from installing any software I want, either.

Apple is basically my favorite computer company and it's not even close. But I think they are completely wrong with how they approach iOS and even MacOS to some degree (pushes towards notarization). The whole thing is depressing and feels like the company is run by bean counters and lawyers and not product people anymore, or people who actually care about computing.

Is that what they are doing? Or are they blocking you from using their services, which is what the app store store is.

 

[reptilex]

That Apple prevents Epic from having their own store/transaction channel I can understand, but that they're banning or discontinuing their account...I hope anti-trust laws will fall hard on their asses

 

[fran.fernandez]

Epic feels like China trying to find loop holes everywhere

 

[Endless Fluff]

Yeah, it's the ecosystem. Once they've got you....

To be fair, their ecosystem works extremely well... I have yet to see multiple different devices from others/Android working together this well. This starts by mirroring screens between iPads, iPhones, AppleTVs and Mac to simply transferring files between devices. I don't even want to live without handshake anymore. You always need workarounds on Android/Windows or you need to use unreliable apps (edit: at least Google is working on an Air Drop alternative).

This functionality makes it hard to leave the ecosystem once you've fully embraced it.

 

[Mahadev]

Terrible post. Apple make great products. What's not to like?

Apple makes great products.

Apple makes great products!

APPLE MAKES GREAT PRODUCTS

 

[Redlancet]

As much i dont care about epic, Apple defense force fascinates me, not only in forums or websites, its like religión

 

[TriSuit666]

I do wonder, from reading a lot of the comments here, what do people think Apple should do?

1. Reduce the cut Apple takes (let's say.. 15%)
2. Take no cut (lol)
3. Let another company have unrestricted access to the storefront Apple created and currently maintains? Including access to the millions and millions of its customers, all for free? Because, why? "Anti-Consumer" cries from the internet?

Shit, not even google rolled with that shit.

If it works for Microsoft and EA, then yeah, fuck it, why not.

Also, by all accounts Google gets fucking peanuts compared to the big old bag of blow Apple gets from Fortnite transactions.

 

[phil_t98]

Yeah, just let huge corporations use their oligopolies to bully everyone into paying a 30% tax to them just just for putting their games on their products, what could possibly go wrong? If you don't want to pay the monopoly tax just lose millions in revenue and sales, that simple.

Your still making millions reguardless. If you don't put it on there then your not loosing anything, if you put it on there you are making millions reguardless of apples or Google's 30%

 

[Ashraf’s Lioness]

Yay let's dethrone the king! Apple is evil!

Absolute state of this forum. Corps are not your friends and they'll never be. NONE OF THEM.

Is EG innocent here? They know Fortnite isn't going to be relevant as much as it is today in the future so they are going all in. Do you really think they're doing this out of the kindness of their heart?

Monopoly you say? Every Mega company has it. Epic Games is nowhere near these giants but if they were they would 100% have a monopoly. Why do u think they made the shitty EpicStore? What's next we gonna nag about 45% of YT?

They are both asshole companies I don't like either of them but EG has destroyed PC gaming and Fortnite is garbage so good job Apple! fuck Epic Games anally.

Btw imagine thinking Apple will loose. LMAO. Apple is the US goverment in a sense and China is behind EG and guess who is running the office? Yea the dude who is anti China
Loosing 100s of millions is nothing for Apple. Litrally nothing. EG thought they can bully Apple with Fortnite lol

 

[phil_t98]

As much i dont care about epic, Apple defense force fascinates me, not only in forums or websites, its like religión

Bit like Sony defence force?

 

[Mahadev]

I do wonder, from reading a lot of the comments here, what do people think Apple should do?

1. Reduce the cut Apple takes (let's say.. 15%)
2. Take no cut (lol)
3. Let another company have unrestricted access to the storefront Apple created and currently maintains? Including access to the millions and millions of its customers, all for free? Because, why? "Anti-Consumer" cries from the internet?

Shit, not even google rolled with that shit.

Let people install apps in its products without its explicit approval and allow independent storefronts in its products would be a good start.

Your still making millions reguardless. If you don't put it on there then your not loosing anything, if you put it on there you are making millions reguardless of apples or Google's 30%

Some companies don't make millions, not to mention that just because you're making millions it doesn't mean you should allow monopolistic corporations to bully you.

 

[Njocky]

"Apple has for years used its complete monopoly over the distribution of apps to the billion users of iOS, the Apple operating system ("OS") running on all iPhones and iPads, to coerce app developers into using Apple's payment platform, In-App Purchase ("IAP") for all inapp purchases of digital content used in their apps. By tying IAP to app distribution, Apple eliminates all competition in the market for in-app payment processing, allowing it to impose an exorbitant 30% "app tax" on all in-app purchases of in-app content. "

Can't argue with that. But if I'm Epic may be I sue first to try to get the terms and conditions changed before putting my app on Apple's store. To violate the T&Cs first and then sue basically means "Your rules apply to all devs but us and if you hold to the contract that we signed, then we'll sue you". Apple didn't change the rules after starting to host Fortnite.

 

[TriSuit666]

Loosing 100s of millions is nothing for Apple. Litrally nothing. EG thought they can bully Apple with Fortnite lol

Bookmark this one, it'll come back to bite you on the arse...

 

[phil_t98]

Let people install apps in its products without its explicit approval and allow independent storefronts in its products would be a good start.





Some companies don't make millions, not to mention that just because you're making millions it doesn't mean you should allow monopolistic corporations to bully you.

Well epic shouldn't of agreed to the terms and conditions in the first place. Epic broke the terms so they got kicked off both store fronts. All this is about epic making more money that's it at the end of the day

 

[Iced Arcade]

Those faces as Epic after that 1984 commercial remake vs now would be a priceless tiktok

 

[Redlancet]

Bit like Sony defence force?

Your doctor its two Doors at the left, Thanks, dont come back

 

[phil_t98]

Your doctor its two Doors at the left, Thanks, dont come back

Same could be said of any brand but when it's said towards something you like personally you respond that way. I could of said Xbox defence force as well. Just because somebody disagrees with what your saying doesn't make it that they blindly defending something now does it

 

[Entroyp]

Let people install apps in its products without its explicit approval and allow independent storefronts in its products would be a good start.





Some companies don't make millions, not to mention that just because you're making millions it doesn't mean you should allow monopolistic corporations to bully you.

Well, that what Android is for no? Apple can have a walled garden as long as there are other options. While I agree that approach is convenient for some users others value some sort of quality control and security.

I do agree that 30% is way too much though.

 

[Ashraf’s Lioness]

Bookmark this one, it'll come back to bite you on the arse...

Bet

 

[-Minsc-]

I'm sitting here having no idea what's going on while eating some sort of peanut, other nut, chocolate things and dried banana mix.

 

[Mahadev]

"Apple has for years used its complete monopoly over the distribution of apps to the billion users of iOS, the Apple operating system ("OS") running on all iPhones and iPads, to coerce app developers into using Apple's payment platform, In-App Purchase ("IAP") for all inapp purchases of digital content used in their apps. By tying IAP to app distribution, Apple eliminates all competition in the market for in-app payment processing, allowing it to impose an exorbitant 30% "app tax" on all in-app purchases of in-app content. "

Can't argue with that. But if I'm Epic may be I sue first to try to get the terms and conditions changed before putting my app on Apple's store. To violate the T&Cs first and then sue basically means "Your rules apply to all devs but us and if you hold to the contract that we signed, then we'll sue you". Apple didn't change the rules after starting to host Fortnite.

I think they're deliberately forcing Apple's hand so that they can have a better case. By doing this Apple pretty much proves that developers have zero other options if they want to sell something on Apple's products. Like I said, EU is gonna have a field day with this one.

 

[phil_t98]

Well, that what Android is for no? Apple can have a walled garden as long as there are other options. While I agree that approach is convenient for some users others value some sort of quality control and security.

I do agree that 30% is way too much though.

the thing is the price to purchase the skin or the V-bucks with Apple was 9.99 and the price on epics direct store was 7.99 so it's not like epic was thinking of the consumer it was about them squeezing more money for themselves without looking like theyupped their prices. If epic would of priced their own store prices at 7.00 this could be different

 

[Warnen]

Wonder what epic would do if there was a game on epics store that did the same shady shit. Prob nothing since they are in desperate need of customers on it


here take theses free games! do you like us yet? Here are some more! Dont worry kids stealing there parents CC for vbucks is what's funding all of this! What you want the basic features that steam has? NO, take some more games!

 

[MDSLKTR]

Bit like Sony defence force?

I don't think there will be virtual candle vigils held for Cerny's funeral for one.

 

[BeardGawd]

Well epic shouldn't of agreed to the terms and conditions in the first place. Epic broke the terms so they got kicked off both store fronts. All this is about epic making more money that's it at the end of the day

I don'tunderstand why this keeps getting parroted around? Epic is passing the savings onto consumers. They are not getting any more money from this. If anything they are losing money.

They did the same thing on PC. Only charging 12% when all other stores charge 30%.

Hell the UE license is crazy cheap to use at only 5% or something like that? They don't want Apple (or Google) controlling what we can install on our phones. That is the paramount issue.

 

[Poop!]

They still agreed to the TOS that they broke...

 

[phil_t98]

I don'tunderstand why this keeps getting parroted around? Epic is passing the savings onto consumers. They are not getting any more money from this. If anything they are losing money.

They did the same thing on PC. Only charging 12% when all other stores charge 30%.

Hell the UE license is crazy cheap to use at only 5% or something like that? They don't want Apple (or Google) controlling what we can install on our phones. That is the paramount issue.

So the price of v-bucks or skins on Apple/google was 9.99

so saving 30% is 7.00

on epics direct payment it was 7.99

epic making more money than befor, not about consumers saving it's about epic getting more money

 

[Enjay]

Good. Fuck epic.

 

[BeardGawd]

So the price of v-bucks or skins on Apple/google was 9.99

so saving 30% is 7.00

on epics direct payment it was 7.99

epic making more money than befor, not about consumers saving it's about epic getting more money

That 10% is the transaction processing fee from using a cheaper payment processor (than Apple). Transactions are not processed for free they have to pay someone. They would rather pay cheaper prices to someone else instead of being forced to use Apple. Plus this is more about us having control over our devices. Apple shouldn't be the sole entity to decide what apps we can install. Game Pass is just the most recent example.