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[Kabouter]

(Reuters) - At least 14 youths have been stoned to death in Baghdad in the past three weeks in what appears to be a campaign by Shi'ite militants against youths wearing Western-style "emo" clothes and haircuts, security and hospital sources say.

Militants in Shi'ite neighborhoods where the stonings have taken place circulated lists on Saturday naming more youths targeted to be killed if they do not change the way they dress.

The killings have taken place since Iraq's interior ministry drew attention to the "emo" subculture last month, labeling it "Satanism" and ordering a community police force to stamp it out.

"Emo" is a form of punk music developed in the United States. Fans are known for their distinctive dress, often including tight jeans, T-shirts with logos and distinctive long or spiky haircuts.

At least 14 bodies of youths have been brought to three hospitals in eastern Baghdad bearing signs of having been beaten to death with rocks or bricks, security and hospital sources told Reuters under condition they not be identified because they were not authorized to speak to the media.

Nine bodies were brought to hospitals in Sadr City, a vast, poor Shi'ite neighborhood, three were brought to East Baghdad's main al-Kindi hospital and two were brought to the central morgue, medical sources said.

Six other young people, including two girls, were wounded in beatings intended as warnings, the security sources said.

"Last week I signed the death certificates of three of those young people, and the reason for death I wrote in my own hand was severe skull fractures," a doctor at al-Kindi hospital told Reuters. "A very powerful blow to the head caused these fractures which totally smashed the skull of the victim."

A leaflet distributed in the Shi'ite Bayaa district of east Baghdad seen by Reuters on Saturday had 24 names of youths targeted for killing.

"We strongly warn you, to all the obscene males and females, if you will not leave this filthy work within four days the punishment of God will descend upon you at the hand of the Mujahideen," the leaflet said.

Another leaflet in Sadr City bore 20 names. "We are the Brigades of Anger. We warn you, if you do not get back to sanity and the right path, you will be killed," it said.

In a statement last month the interior ministry said it was monitoring "the 'emo' phenomenon, or Satanism" which it said was spreading through schools, particularly among teenage girls.

"They wear tight clothes that bear paintings of skulls, they use school implements with skulls and wear rings in their noses and tongues as well as other weird appearances," it said.

After reports of the stonings circulated on Iraqi media, the interior ministry said this week that no murders on its files could be blamed on the reaction to "emo".

"Many media have reported fabricated news reports about the so-called 'emo' phenomenon - stories about tens of young people killed in various ways, including stoning," the ministry said in a statement on Thursday.

"No murder case has been recorded with the interior ministry on so-called 'emo' grounds. All cases of murder recorded were for revenge, social and common criminal reasons."

CLERICS DENOUNCE KILLINGS

Iraq's leading Shi'ite clerics have condemned the stonings.

Abdul-Raheem al-Rikabi, Baghdad representative for Iraq's most influential Shi'ite cleric, Ali al-Sistani, called the killings "terrorist attacks".

"Such a phenonomenon which has spread among young people should be tackled through dialogue and peaceful means and not through physical liquidation," Rikabi told Reuters.

In a response to questions on his website on Saturday, Moqtada al-Sadr, a Shi'ite cleric whose followers dominate Sadr City, described "emo" youths as "crazy and fools", but said they should be dealt with only through the law.

"They are a plague on Muslim society, and those responsible should eliminate them through legal means," he said.

Abu Ali al-Rubaie, a leading Sadr aide in Sadr City, said the cleric's followers had nothing to do with the killings.

"In this issue and in all such problems we always use peaceful and educational methods to correct any wrongdoings. We are not connected in any way to those groups allegedly responsibility for killing those young people."

In the years after the fall of Saddam Hussein, most of Baghdad's neighborhoods were under the firm grip of Sunni and Shi'ite religious militias which enforced strict dress codes.

Today, the militias have largely disappeared, Baghdad is far more peaceful and many youths experiment with Western styles, although much of Iraqi society remains conservative.

On the streets of Baghdad, people said they had heard of the killings through the media. Many expressed disapproval of the "emo" style, but said murder was no way to respond.

"I saw them a couple weeks ago ... a bunch of girls, high-school aged, walking together, dressed in black. They had long black eye makeup and bracelets with skulls and chains on their handbags with skulls," said Abdullah, 31.

"If they are close friends who have something in common, that's all right. If other things we hear about them are true, like sucking each other's blood or worshipping the devil, that is not accepted in our society. But I think this is just a trend to imitate the West."

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/03/10/us-iraq-emo-killings-idUSBRE8290CY20120310

 

[Ivan A Nguyen]

Isn't it Goth at that point?

 

[Joel Was Right]

"If they are close friends who have something in common, that's all right. If other things we hear about them are true, like sucking each other's blood or worshipping the devil, that is not accepted in our society. But I think this is just a trend to imitate the West."

This reminds me of that video of the African pastor talking about homosexuality after seeing videos of 'fisting' and faeces, and all kinds of stuff he apparently believed to have been part of the norm. When something different and new is introduced into a culture, a lot of preconceived notions come with me - like this for example. It's not the first time I've seen people mistake goths for devil worshippers, ironically

 

[dejay]

Martyrs to the cause of freedom of expression.

Another leaflet in Sadr City bore 20 names. "We are the Brigades of Anger. We warn you, if you do not get back to sanity and the right path, you will be killed," it said.

Mad men talking about sanity.

 

[ElectricBlue187]

"If they are close friends who have something in common, that's all right. If other things we hear about them are true, like sucking each other's blood or worshipping the devil, that is not accepted in our society. But I think this is just a trend to imitate the West."

MMMmmm I'm thirsty for some blood

 

[Large Professor]

This doesn't fit very well in the freedom and democracy narrative.

 

[Violet_0]

Iraq is a lost cause

 

[Guerrillas in the Mist]

All the nutters in Iraq should drive out to the desert, kill each other, and leave everyone be.

 

[Snaku]

The entire region is a lost cause

Fixed.

If they didn't control the majority of the worlds oil supply, nobody would have ever cared for or bothered with the dirt they call holy.

 

[GavinGT]

If there's any place where acting like the world is dark and dismal is appropriate, it's Iraq.

 

[Black-Box]

Iraq is a lost cause

sad but true, they just don't seem like they want to change

 

[Conciliator]

Christ that is fucked. Those are some seriously brave kids to dress like that in a region as conservative as Iraq.

Note, I think one of the distinct things about 'emo' dress versus what's commonly referred to as 'goth' dress as that males often carry deliberately feminine elements(makeup, girlish figures, etc.). It's what made 'normal' America so threatened by it here, but then you have to multiply that ten-fold in Iraq. Of course, we don't know exactly how they dressed without pics.

 

[SoulPlaya]

Those fucking leaflets need to stop.

I had a relative in Mosul get a leaflet at their house that unless they move out of the city within a week, they would be punished (they're Christians living in a Muslim city).

 

[Staccat0]

People make me fucking sick. Death is so stupid, and some people are way too fucking casual about it.

This reminds me of that video of the African pastor talking about homosexuality after seeing videos of 'fisting' and faeces, and all kinds of stuff he apparently believed to have been part of the norm. When something different and new is introduced into a culture, a lot of preconceived notions come with me - like this for example. It's not the first time I've seen people mistake goths for devil worshippers, ironically

I only somewhat recently learned here on GAF that there is basically no such thing as devil worshipers, which sorta' blew my mind because popular culture and religious figures had me pretty convinced someone did it despite the fact that it would make no sense whatsoever.

 

[SquiddyCracker]

I hope things will turn for the better in Iraq, but I have a feeling it will turn even more fundamentalist and horrible before the light at the end of the tunnel is in sight

 

[pje122]

Bronson...?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gEyP4Q8igQY

 

[Kinyou]

Why? Why the fuck are they doing this?

 

[Staccat0]

Christ that is fucked. Those are some seriously brave kids to dress like that in a region as conservative as Iraq.

Note, I think one of the distinct things about 'emo' dress versus what's commonly referred to as 'goth' dress as that males often carry deliberately feminine elements(makeup, girlish figures, etc.). It's what made 'normal' America so threatened by it here, but then you have to multiply that ten-fold in Iraq. Of course, we don't know exactly how they dressed without pics.

Naw, male goths have traditionally been pretty effeminate. Its a pretty nerdy form of teenage rebellion and usually scoffs at macho bullshit. Doesn't really attract dudes with qualms about having long bangs or wearing white and black make-up.

I think the real distinction is a waste of time though. Emo used to describe a type of indie/punk or even hardcore music that was pretty good and completely unrelated to what we call emo today. As time went bands influenced by emo took the moniker in different directions. At this point, it doesn't mean anything musically. Fashion-wise it's basically synonymous with goth, but with less maybe "gothic" flair. So we're talking skinny jeans, tight band tee-shirt, chuck taylor shoes, white belt and asymmetrical hair...
But honestly, you woulda' just called most of that that goth or punk 10 years ago.

Point is, it's just shorthand for "effeminate and moody looking teen" at this point which always comes across about a inch away from being homophobic to my ears whenever I hear it.

 

[dejay]

sad but true, they just don't seem like they want to change

Change is often only affected by generational succession. This is what's happening, although the old guard is trying its best to stop it. Strict adherence to dogma doesn't work in the long run in a rapidly changing world though, especially with communication technology becoming more ubiquitous, even in more deprived countries.

 

[SoulPlaya]

Change is often only affected by generational succession. This is what's happening, although the old guard is trying its best to stop it. Strict adherence to dogma doesn't work in the long run in a rapidly changing world though, especially with communication technology becoming more ubiquitous, even in more deprived countries.

You'd be surprised. From what I've heard, the acceptance of "western" imagery by some of the youth has caused the rest to become even more extreme as an answer.

 

[Loofy]

At least they werent guidos.

 

[Snaku]

You'd be surprised. From what I've heard, the acceptance of "western" imagery by some of the youth has caused the rest to become even more extreme as an answer.

Yeah, there can't be "generational succession" if you murder the next generation.

 

[echoshifting]

Fixed.

If they didn't control the majority of the worlds oil supply, nobody would have ever cared for or bothered with the dirt they call holy.

^^^ This is how I expect pretty much all of the "arab spring" fledgling democracies to turn out. Radicalized religion is just too powerful in the region, and it doesn't mesh well with the staples of democracy at all.

Very sad story.

 

[dejay]

Yeah, there can't be "generational succession" if you murder the next generation.

Yeah, but for every overt goth over there you have 10, 20 or 100 people who don't dress rebelliously but inside they're just playing along with the minority of extremists who are trying to repress them and maintain the status quo.

Eventually these attitudes may become more overt if enough people have them. We just see the extremists in the media, when in reality there may be something simmering below the surface.

 

[speculawyer]

The killings have taken place since Iraq's interior ministry drew attention to the "emo" subculture last month, labeling it "Satanism" and ordering a community police force to stamp it out.

WTF? How is that the government's business at all?

Ugh . . . religion poisons everything.

"We strongly warn you, to all the obscene males and females, if you will not leave this filthy work within four days the punishment of God will descend upon you at the hand of the Mujahideen," the leaflet said.

Anyone that claims to speak for god is a fucking liar and an asshole.

 

[SoulPlaya]

Yeah, but for every overt goth over there you have 10, 20 or 100 people who don't dress rebelliously but inside they're just playing along with the minority of extremists who are trying to repress them and maintain the status quo.

Eventually these attitudes may become more overt if enough people have them. We just see the extremists in the media, when in reality there may be something simmering below the surface.

Unfortunately, I think you may be exaggerating what's simmering below. You're asking the youth to go against Islam, or at least, how they've been taught to interpret it. That's fucking huge. The majority of the youth are extreme, and are likely more extreme than the previous generation. These countries were actually pretty liberal (relative to now) back in the 70's, but this youth has been raised in extremism. Yes, some are changing, but that's a small minority.

 

[Stinkles]

Iraq is a lost cause

we did that.

 

[Kurtofan]

We warn you, if you do not get back to sanity and the right path, you will be killed

I know someone already pointed it out, but damn!

If other things we hear about them are true, like sucking each other's blood or worshipping the devil, that is not accepted in our society

Talk about blood libel.

 

[Utako]

I remember the same thing happening in Mexico a little while ago.

Fucking bastards.

 

[TAJ]

we did that.

Yep.
We removed a secular regime, and now we're surprised that religious extremists have more power?

 

[Violet_0]

we did that.

I guess you could say that democracy comes at a price, and for the Middle East, that's religious fundamentalism

 

[dejay]

Unfortunately, I think you may be exaggerating what's simmering below. You're asking the youth to go against Islam, or at least, how they've been taught to interpret it. That's fucking huge. The majority of the youth are extreme, and are likely more extreme than the previous generation. These countries were actually pretty liberal (relative to now) back in the 70's, but this youth has been raised in extremism. Yes, some are changing, but that's a small minority.

Perhaps, I'm hoping it's a blip in history. Every place in history has had it's dark ages. The next fifty years will be interesting.

 

[s7evn]

Oh religion...

It's a shame the people going through with this think that murder is the only/best solution to their personal problems. It's even worse that the government thinks its job to point out that there is a "problem" anyway.

 

[Amalthea]

Sucking blood and worhipping the devil is wrong but killing young people is god's will.

Yeah right.

 

[kylej]

lol what time do we live in? Stoning people to death? Jesus christ. It's one thing to read the word "stoning" in a news story but can you imagine how immensely violent and savage that type of act would be in person? To be able to throw rocks at another human being as they slowly wither away and die is mindblowing to me.

What's next Iraq, quartering people?

 

[Zebra]

lol what time do we live in? Stoning people to death? Jesus christ. It's one thing to read the word "stoning" in a news story but can you imagine how immensely violent and savage that type of act would be in person? To be able to throw rocks at another human being as they slowly wither away and die is mindblowing to me.

And all for something as harmless as how they dress...

 

[lexi]

We all did a great job liberating this country.

 

[Mush]

I can only imagine what will happen once they discover dubstep/rave culture.

 

[sp3000]

lol what time do we live in? Stoning people to death? Jesus christ. It's one thing to read the word "stoning" in a news story but can you imagine how immensely violent and savage that type of act would be in person? To be able to throw rocks at another human being as they slowly wither away and die is mindblowing to me.

What's next Iraq, quartering people?

Welcome to the Islamic Middle East

 

[Youta Mottenai]

And all for something as harmless as how they dress...

Don't worry, if the international disgust gets too high the government/clerics will issue a statement declaring they were also gay and/or apostates and/or adulterers so the punishment was A-ok.

 

[Ether_Snake]

At least they werent guidos.

I don't understand. When those guys watch themselves in the mirror, don't they realize they look fucking ridiculous?

 

[ChiTownBuffalo]

At least 14 murders in the last 3 weeks.

Baghdad (CNN) -- A recent rash of killings of people perceived to be gay or emo in Iraq has stoked fear within those communities, which worry the government might be unwilling or unable to protect them.

At least 14 such victims were killed in Baghdad in the past three weeks, according to a senior Interior Ministry official, who was not authorized to talk to the media.

Rights activists claim the number is actually much higher, with some suggesting dozens or more than 100 have been killed since February.

The killings appear to target people perceived to be gay, or emo -- shorthand in Iraq for an in-your-face style of Western dress that favors tight clothes, long hair and the color black.

Most of the killings have taken place in Shiite neighborhoods like Sadr City, Shulaa, Ameen and Tariq, activists said.

"Ten days ago, I received a letter from militiamen threatening me that if they found me then they will not kill me like other 'perverts,' but they will cut my body into pieces," a gay activist told CNN on Sunday.

The activist, who spoke on the condition of anonymity because of safety concerns, showed CNN a copy of a letter he said was distributed in Sadr City, identifying 33 potential "gay and emo" targets.

"We strongly warn every male and female debauchee, if you do not stop this dirty act within four days, then the punishment of God will fall on you at the hands of Mujahideen," it read.

CNN could not confirm the authenticity of the letter.

The anonymous threats and murders come less than a month after the Interior Ministry released a statement on the so-called emo phenomenon, blasting it as Satanic.

It said the movement, which it described as young people wearing "strange and tight clothes with graphics such as skulls," is being monitored by authorities with the goal of eliminating it.

To that end, community or "moral police" will be allowed to enter schools in the capital, the statement read.

The campaign and violence have had an immediate chilling effect among youth communities in Baghdad.

Teenager Kamel Saad told CNN he cut his hair so as not to become a potential target.

"I'm not the only one. All my friends in the school decided to change their hair style and change their clothes, too, even though we're not emo or gay," he said.

Saad said a group of men, who identified themselves as community police, entered his classroom two weeks ago and asked students to tell them about other students' suspicious behavior.

"I thought it was about terrorism, but later, when the police explained more, we realized that they were talking about emo," he said.

 

[Izick]

Dark Ages shit.

 

[SmokyDave]

"We strongly warn every male and female debauchee, if you do not stop this dirty act within four days, then the punishment of God will fall on you at the hands of Mujahideen,"

Yeah, heaven forbid the big bully has to sort this shit out himself.

 

[Elginer]

I can't believe in these modern times shit like this happens. WTF?!

 

[Stumpokapow]

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?p=35909139

(dupe)

 

[TheContact]

wow Iraq has emos?

 

[Kabouter]

wow Iraq has emos?

Times have changed since 2005.

-Emo kids

I have no idea what's wrong with these people. Your parents broke up, you hate your school, and no one likes you: this is what caused you to get that raggy haircut and paint your nails black? Whatever. They're just a bunch of whiners who need to be discriminated against more; in fact, why should two emo people be allowed to marry anyway? There shouldn't be any emo people in a country as rich as ours. You never hear about emo people in countries that have it hard, like Africa or Iraq. No. That's because real people who are suffering don't make MySpaces about it or create retard music: they don't even have the resources to do that crap. Nelson Mandela didn't have a LiveJournal, and neither should any stupid American.

 

[SmokyDave]

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?p=35909139

(dupe)

That mergin' sure looked like sorcery to me.

 

[SuicidalSteve]

What a load of Shi'ite