ShadowSwordmaster
Banned
This is true. I have seen it a couple times now and it needs some work.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
August Wrasslin' |OT| I'M NOT FINISHED WITH YOU-LY
- Thread starter Hasney
- Start date
serenewarfare
Banned
What's funny is that when all those stories came out about Enzo, so many were quick to ridicule the source and claim they were BS. This dude has always had a bad rep.
Do his coworkers know he thinks this?
ShadowSwordmaster
Banned
I bet some of them do.
Probably they do now. Just like Owens is going to find out a pin like this exists:
https://twitter.com/makeitloud/status/891413697096298496
serenewarfare
Banned
Also isn't Enzo dating Liv Morgan? He better hope this story is BS. lol
avengers23
Banned
Night 6 was the first time that I felt like I was in the doldrums of the G1.
Night 7 started pretty well with Tama Tonga vs. Juice Robinson, at least, and they played off of Suzuki targeting Robinson's knees from Night 5.
Also, I hate SANADA's new mask with the horns. Go back to the cool skull mask.
Night 7 started pretty well with Tama Tonga vs. Juice Robinson, at least, and they played off of Suzuki targeting Robinson's knees from Night 5.
Also, I hate SANADA's new mask with the horns. Go back to the cool skull mask.
sf2fanatic
Member
#teamolds got this.
slightconfuse
Banned
I much prefer it to the old mask. Dunno why. I like his whole new getup. The SANADA face push is really on.
Okada was on something today. Acting like an absolute weird, cocaine fuelled asshole in his tag match, grandstanding like a motherfucker, being a total cunt to Juice and this all comes after the Kojima match. He had the young boys keep the dirty masses away from him as well, far more than usual on his entrance and exit.
Compare that to Naito who was being all cute with an awesome little dude all decked out in LIJ gear and generally being a man of the people. It's great storytelling.
I don't think so.
There is not one hair of him on her social media, twitter or instagram anywhere. not even a retweet
DELETE
DELETE
DELETE
EXTERMINATE
EXTERMINATE
EXTERMINATE
The feud practically writes itself!
How dare you, Naito!
serenewarfare
Banned
I'm in
DELETE
DELETE
DELETE
EXTERMINATE
EXTERMINATE
EXTERMINATE
The feud practically writes itself!
avengers23
Banned
In case you aren't reading the G1 thread, I'll put the link to the rest of that interview with Naito here:
https://www.njpw1972.com/12518
Full of quotables, character stuff and LIJ developments
https://www.njpw1972.com/12518
Full of quotables, character stuff and LIJ developments
SallyIsNow
Banned
Dr.Who is for jabronies only
avengers23
Banned
I'm watching Kojima vs. Okada now, and he's a complete asshole to Kojima from the start. Encouraging the crowd to chant for him only to jump him at the bell.
Edit: WHAT THE FUCK, going after Tenzan too?
What in the world is that?
TimeEffect
Member
That enzo stripper story.
That dude is Worse than ryback
Between him and cass, Im okay with them both getting released
That dude is Worse than ryback
Between him and cass, Im okay with them both getting released
Sweeney Tom
Banned
I just automatically assumed it was widely known
Usually in WWE, if you end up in a position where you're playing an asshole, acting like an asshole, and (post team breakup, for example) cut a promo sadly admitting that you know you're an asshole, you either 1) are an asshole and/or 2) are at least considered one by people backstage to the point they're ribbing you about it
And obviously it can go beyond "asshole" that they're acknowledging or making fun of. Very rarely are gimmicks that un-subtle. See also Ric being a womanizer, Steiner being unstable, and on the more childish/petty side Natalya having a farting problem and talent regularly making fun of Mickie's weight on-air
RecRoulette
Member
lmao, this is almost as good when Okada was roasting him, calling Goto the "embodiment of disappointment"
RecRoulette
Member
They will job in stairs matches at every TLC.
So Regal just signed CM Punk to NXT?
Edit: Double posted, anything is possible when you
Yeah that was really surprising. He went maximum heel for that match. He was talking mad shit about Kojima in interviews before as well, about how an old guy like him didn't deserve to be in the G1 at all and Okada didn't even think it as a real match.
Being Goto is suffering.
Im sure many of you have read my posts over the last few months about #5years and have some questions. What exactly does #5years mean? Are you serious or just trolling? While I do play up the angle at times to create heat, increase the gate and draw, there is absolutely truth behind this little premonition of mine. Allow me to SHOOT:
Short and soft: WWE will be dead in 5 years.
Long and hard: WWE will be a complete shell of itself in 5 years, barring a miracle (The second coming of Steve Austin in 1998) or a major change in creative direction (departure of Vince McMahon and Kevin Dunn, sale of the company).
Introduction and Background
The #5years prophecy has been a long time coming, but it officially began the night after Wrestlemania 33 on April 3, 2017. Coming off another part-timer filled supershow (and 3 month build on TV) that focused the likes of Goldberg, Brock Lesnar, Triple H and Undertaker none of the 4 stars appeared at Raw on the following night, and the regular full timer roster never felt less important. The product never felt quite as directionless and bland, and as the show came to an end, I had a realization: If they actually continue down this road, with this same presentation, this same storytelling, this same philosophy behind booking big shows and following big shows, the same utter inability to get full time stars over and constant use of older, part time stars to pop a rating or create hype for a big show theyre going to be completely fucked eventually.
The thing is it doesnt matter what I think. Im just a fat nerd on a video game forum. Just some asshole who thinks he knows everything, right? Hows my territory doing? However, what made all of this so real was the TV rating for the Raw after Mania, traditionally the highest rated show of the year.
It was pitiful. It was down 11% from the 2016 Raw After Mania show, and 2016s show was down 20% from the 2015 show!
The average Raw ratings over each calendar year paint a similar picture: drops have been dramatic since 2015, and yet, there doesnt seem to be any sense of urgency over at WWE. In fact, the show itself feels more stale than ever, despite having arguably the most talented roster of performers of all time. If the company was truly worried, they would have done something about it in 2015 or 2016 when steep drop began. If they were truly worried, we would have seen a change in philosophy like we saw in 1997, the last time ratings were this soft. Back then, a hungry Vince McMahon was trying anything and everything to get the company back on track, pushing new stars and a completely different booking philosophy. Today, he shrugs these slumping ratings off, pointing to increases in social media numbers (essentially useless information) and the fact that TV ratings are down across the board (while true, ratings across the board are dropping at nowhere near the rate of WWE programming since 2015).
Theres a pretty logical solution to this problem: Change your programming style. Get with the times. Understand that there may need to be a short term loss for long term gain, rather than the short term bandaid that is pushing old men like Goldberg and Undertaker, at the expense of the long term success of the company. However, the man in charge isnt just any man. This is Vincent Kennedy McMahon, one of the most flat out insane mother fuckers on the planet. I can write an entirely separate 5000 word essay on the psyche of Vince MaMchon and all the crazy shit hes said or done over the years. But lets keep it short and sweet: This is a guy who does what he wants. Anyone who knows anything about the behind the scenes working of the company would tell you that. Hell, just watch his interview with Steve Austin. This is the man who allegedly claimed that hed rather a stadium be half full cheering for who he wants than a full stadium of fans cheering for who they want. And if you look at how the program is booked, how could you say thats not true? Roman Reigns is basically the living embodiment of that statement: as the TV ratings plummet and live show attendance dwindles, Reigns push only gets stronger and stronger.
This infamous night after Wrestlemania Raw that gave birth officially to the #5years movement also contained one of the craziest segments in Raw history to start off the show. The hardest of hardcore WWE fans, who paid thousands of dollars to attend Wrestlemania and the many other shows that weekend, made their feelings on the golden boy of WWE very clear. It was like something out of an ECW show from the late 90s, as chants like FUCK YOU ROMAN and SHUT THE FUCK UP prevented Roman from uttering even a single word for at least 5 minutes.
On the surface, even I would consider this segment to be one of the most heat filled of the modern era. Truly one of the most genuine and rowdy crowd responses to a WWE performer in a long, long time. Many felt the same, and I recall a number of wrestling experts claiming that this was the full heel turn of Roman Reigns, and that the crowd response was exactly what WWE wanted and expected.
However, there are a number of factors at play here that you MISS if you just look at it on the surface, and it was my realization of this that ultimately gave birth to the #5years hashtag.
The vociferous crowd reaction to Roman Reigns was not directed at Joe Anoai, or the character he plays on TV. It was not an outcry of the crowds displeasure with Joes character defeating The Undertaker in a fake wrestling match. It was not a fiery, invested crowd representative of a red hot wrestling product. In that ring did not stand an all time great heel character who would go on to draw millions of dollars and captivate fans as they would tune in to the show every week to seek his defeat inside the squared circle.
Indeed, this response, like many of the anti-Roman chants, is directed at Vince McMahon, the direction of the company as a whole, the booking and the writing. The anti-Roman chants come from a generation of fans who grew up with the Attitude Era, a generation of fans who remember what it was like to idolize certain performers, what is was like to see the bad guys get their ultimate comeuppance, and most importantly, have a no nonsense mother fucker that would NEVER pander to a crowd holding the entire ship together.
Roman Reigns does not have heel heat. He never did, and unless WWE chooses to actually turn him heel, he never will. People are not paying to see Roman be defeated in pretend combat. In fact, people are tuning out of the product more than ever, which is the sign of an unsuccessful main character if Ive ever seen one.
But the truth of the matter is this: with the person in charge right now, nothing will change. Vince will double down on the Roman Reigns character because he wants to. He will double down on his booking style because thats what he wants to do. And if the fans leave, so be it. Theyve been bleeding viewers for years and the booking philosophy has always been the same.
Well, its that stubborn attitude that has brought them to this point, in my opinion. 5 more years of this and theyre done. You cant keep insulting your audience like this, in this day and age, and get away with it.
Now that we have some background on the subject and how Ive come to this conclusion, let's answer the question Ive been asked constantly since April:
WWE is a billion dollar massive company. What makes you think it's even remotely possible that the company will be dead in 5 years?
Answer:
A domino effect, as the result of these three key factors:
- Stupidity (Vince thinks his ideas are great but theyre terrible)
- Stubbornness (Vince could easily do a number of things to stop the bleeding but refuses to because he has his weird, nonsensical reasons)
- Market Realities (Just look at how other products that insult the audience have been performing lately).
Stupidity
To me, the main reason why the ship is sinking is obvious: WWE has not been putting out a compelling product, and thus people are leaving in droves. WWE is poorly written, poorly paced and is simply boring to watch. The poor writing and 50/50 booking result in a supremely talented roster coming off as artificial, scripted, robotic geeks week after week. This is why WWE is unable to create new stars that have people coming back and craving more. So instead, they are tuning out! In 2017, theres better shit to do than watch a bad wrestling show for 3 hours every Monday. Theres better things to spend $10 a month on than a subscription based pro wrestling video library. The creative, use of talent and storylines in 2017 are worse than they have ever been. From all indications of backstage activity, Vince himself thinks his ideas are great, but by every possible metric, theyre not. The company makes money in spite of him, not because of him. Simply put, it's bad television.
Id like to rewind to the mid 90s, when WWE was facing a similar struggle with relevancy. Running off the fumes of the golden era of wrestling, ratings were down, live attendance was soft, and despite having some of the most talented performers in the history of pro wrestling on the roster, they just couldnt seem to connect with audiences. It was at this point, in 1996 and 1997, that the company began to plant the seeds for a complete turnaround in 1998 but the most groundbreaking events of the era took place no thanks to Vince McMahon and the WWF itself.
Instead, a series of happy accidents, or miracles, took place that were in no way planned by McMahon. Most of the WWF stars of the 80s had found greener pastures in WCW, so McMahon was forced to push younger talent, such as Hunter Hearst Helmsley, the planned winner of the 1996 King of the Ring and future number one contender for the WWF title. Instead, the infamous Curtain Call would take place and as fate would have it, HHH lost his spot and it was given to another young midcarder, Steve Austin.
Enter Survivor Series 1997 and the Montreal Screwjob. A complete cluster fuck of a finish that would send one of their biggest stars to WCW and paint Vince McMahon, who was mostly known to audiences on air as an announcer, as the evil boss character. Royal Rumble 1998, Taker drops Shawn Michaels on the casket and ends his career.
This series of miracles, none of which were by design, was basically God opening the red sea for Vince McMahon, Steve Austin and the WWF as a whole, and leading them to the promised land: the hottest period in pro wrestling history and ultimately turning the fortunes of the company around.
But what if this didnt happen? What if Bret stuck around and the Montreal Screwjob never happened? What if HHH won the KOTR and Steve Austin continued forward as a mid carder? What if Shawn didnt get injured and refused to drop the title to a new up and comer, hanging the threat of leaving to WCW as leverage over McMahons head? Does the Austin/McMahon feud that saved the company even happen? Is WWF even alive today?
Heres my point: in 2017, the WWE finds itself in a very similar spot as it did in 1995. Its running off the fumes of a bygone era of great popularity, but things are slow right now, and the future looks bleak. 20 years have passed and Vince is even more out of touch with what audiences want than he was in 1995. His WWE product is scripted down to the letter. Commentators and talent alike have a list of banned words that they can not say without getting chewed out by the boss.
Events like the Curtain Call or the Screwjob just wouldnt happen today. Everything is too meticulous, too planned out, and not open to change. A suspended or injured Roman Reigns will return and they'll continue like he never left. Furthermore, I personally dont believe a Stone Cold Steve Austin, a Rock or a John Cena will show up out of nowhere and turn the companys fortunes around this time. In #5years, I see a WWE where they DONT figure it out like they did in 1997, where they DONT turn it around, and the product just gets worse, the product just gets more stale, and indeed, they lose a ton of money as a result.
So with that, weve established that the quality of the WWE product wont be improving. In 2017, I believe people are smarter and more informed than ever when it comes to consuming media. There was a time when bad movies, bad tv, bad music and even bad video games would sell because it went after the mainstream. It went after the lowest common denominator. The movie was terrible, but they hired the right actors! It had the marketing machine behind it! Today, everyone is so connected via social media, text messaging and forums like Reddit that word gets out quicker than ever when something is shit, or when something is great and they should check it out.
I detail these examples later, but just look at the box office performance for Transformers 4 to 5, a drop no one saw coming. You see how quickly the floor can fall out underneath you when the audience collectively says Fuck this garbage, Im done. Think about how quickly the negative word of mouth set in for a huge blockbuster like Batman v Superman thanks to its low Rotten Tomatoes score. Conversely, look at Wonder Womans amazing run thanks to positive word of mouth.
The bottom line is this: people these days are smart enough to reject bad content. There's SO much content out there to consume... what is the incentive to watch 5 hours of bad wrestling every week when not only stuff like Netflix and YouTube exist, PUMPING great content out on a daily basis... but indeed great WRESTLING is available at anyone's fingertips via New Japan World, YouTube, Dailymotion and even the WWE Network itself!
In 2017 and beyond, a nonsensical, poorly written tv show has no place in this world, no matter the branding behind it, no matter the marketing behind it, no matter the past successes. It will not survive if the product is bad and viewers are given no reason to believe it will get any better in the future. The #1 reason why my words are more than just the rambling thoughts of a hardcore wrestling fan is the steep year over year decline in ratings that WWE TV is experiencing right now. I have no reason to believe this ratings pattern will turn around due to the stubbornness of people in control of the company.
Dave Meltzer said:
Continued in Part 2
serenewarfare
Banned
He's taking his meme to new heights.
Stubbornness
In 2017, a senile Vince wont realize the errors of his ways and make changes for the better. If Meltzer is to be believed, there is an excuse behind every drop in the ratings, rather than any internal push for change or improvement. They seem to believe everything is just fine as it is, despite almost every metric telling them otherwise. McMahon has his ways of doing business and his ways of producing TV, and refuses to change them despite dipping ratings and fan outcry. He just doesnt give a fuck.
To briefly paint a picture of the current situation, and just spell out how stunningly poor the decisions are on a weekly basis
I believe it is appropriate at this time to talk about some of the non-booking related issues going on with WWE as well. There is an old school carny attitude that is still alive and well in WWE that has no place in any company ever, let alone a billion dollar company in 2017. Its no secret that the WWE is a poor working environment, with higher ups constantly berating talent for nonsensical reasons, lies upon lies upon lies (We have a big push planned for you, just lose to this guy and Ill owe you one.), horror stories as it pertains to bullying, said bully still on the payroll calling TV every week (fuck you JBL you fucking cowardly cunt), racism, discrimination, assault and nonsensical booking hurting your value as a brand (undeserved pushes based on arbitrary factors like height and body type, blatant killing of a hot character because they dont meet Vince McMahons ridiculous, illogical criteria).
Worst of all is the fact that McMahon is so stubborn at this point that even with ratings and live event attendance drastically down all of these things Ive listed above will not be changing any time soon. Many believe McMahon has waged a war on the fans, and looking at the nonsensical push of Roman Reigns, Id tend to agree. His breathless pursuit to put CM Punks red hot run in Summer 2011 on ice by pairing him with Del Rio, Triple H and Kevin Nash also comes to mind. One of McMahons workers had to kill his wife, his kid and himself before Vince finally enforced a drug policy for the WWE (a policy that part timers and a handful of full timers are still able to get around for unknown reasons). Is there any reason to believe that Vince will be changing his ways any time soon? Is there any reason to believe that the 50/50 booking will go anywhere if thats how Vince likes it, or if hell stop bullying if it makes him laugh?
I could go on all day pointing out how stubborn the higher ups in this company are, but the point is this: with more options available than ever for talent, what is the incentive to stay and work with this shit hole, Trump supporting company? Why would anyone want to put themselves through that kind of torture?
At one time, the answer was simple: $$$. But in recent times, many have proven that WWE is no longer the be all end all for making money in pro wrestling.
Market Realities
This section will boil down to numbers. How does WWE make its money? Why, through stupidity and stubbornness, will WWE lose a good chunk of that money over the next 5 years? And what are some comparables that we can look at to paint a picture of the situation?
First off, let's take this opportunity to get into the nitty gritty of WWE financials. Im an economics major so Ill do my best to simplify all of this stuff.
WWE is a travelling carnival, and their carny nature is not only expressed through their low brow programming, but also to their shareholders.
In 2014, McMahon infamously promised to investors that his company would triple its 2012 operating income by 2015. This was going to be the result of a new TV contract, and the expectation that McMahon would get a fat TV deal similar to other live sports like Major League Soccer or Nascar. Funny how Wrestling is suddenly a sport and not entertainment when the situation needs it to be a sport! Nonetheless, theres only one problem: Wrestling is fucking fake entertainment bullshit that no one takes seriously besides hillbillies with $20 to their name, you moron. In the end, WWE scammed NBC Universal in a deal that would pay them 50% above their prior contract, but nowhere near the 300% increase that shareholders promised.
Why is the TV deal so important here? Because the truth is, WWE will live and die on their TV deal. Losing TV killed WCW, and I believe the same will happen to WWE. Of course WWE has multiple different revenue streams, but it begins and ends with the product millions see on TV every week. If that product is bad, and people begin to turn out, they will not buy the network, they will not go to live events they simply will not give WWE their money.
Lets do some math, Ill be basing this on the latest WWE Financial Report, for the Six Months Ended June 30.
101.4 / 403 = 25% WWE Network (Formerly PPV Business)
130.2 / 403 = 32% Television Deal
84.9 / 403 = 21% Live Events
86.5 / 403 = 22% Other (WWE Shop, Venue Merchandise, Digital Media like Youtube, etc)
So as we can see, the ship is held together by the money they make from their TV deal. Without TV, no one goes to live events. Without TV, there is no weekly push for people to join the WWE Network. And without TV, all that other stuff pretty much doesnt exist.
Like any good publicly traded company, WWE will brag about record numbers to stockholders, and fans will read headlines like WWE Reports Record Revenue and Q2 2017 Results and assume all is fine and dandy in the make believe world of WWE.
In reality, the important numbers are hidden away in the financial report and paint a far more grim picture. While revenue is up year over year, WWE fails to mention that they are putting on more shows than they were last year before the brand split. Furthermore, revenue is important, but not if youre spending more than youre making. And thats precisely the case with WWE at the moment.
Despite a revenue of $403 million over the first 6 months of 2017, total expenses for the company are at $397 million, resulting in a measly $6 million profit for the company over 6 months. This is down big from the first six months of 2016, which boasted a fairly terrible $14.7 million in profit for the company. Let it be known that these are atrocious profit margins.
I believe WWE runs into a big problem in 2019 when it comes time to negotiate a new TV deal. Lets quickly look at the previous two TV deals. Before 2015, NBC Universal was paying around $90 million annually for WWE Programming. In 2015, the price was raised to $150 million, well short of McMahons promise of $270 million a year.
One of McMahons primary sales pitches during the 2014 deal negotiations was that their program was not DVRable. In other words, ratings would not drop like other entertainment programming because you have to experience Raw live. 3 years later, we can see just how untrue that was.
The May 12 2014 Raw, which was the show before WWE announced its new deal in 2014, did 4,006,000 overnight viewers. Compare that to the second Raw of May 2017, which did 2,696,000 viewers. That is a 33% drop, and we still have two years to go until the next negotiations. The average rating for Raw in 2014 was 2.95. Since then, it has dropped to 2.64 in 2015, then 2.26 in 2016. It stands at 2.11 halfway through 2017, before football season. It will assuredly be below 2.0 come contract negotiations in 2019. Im sure NBC Universal is THRILLED at that nosedive right when they signed a new TV deal in 2014!
My point is this: If McMahon wasnt able to get the deal he wanted when his ratings were relatively solid year over year, how in the name of holy fuck does he expect to do so if the ratings are down 50% from 2014 to 2019?
Barring a miracle, WWE will have to accept a lower TV deal. Meaning their main source of income will take a giant hit. The result of this could be catastrophic: programs being cancelled, NXT losing its funding, talent being let go, and an all around lower budget feel and presentation. Sponsors may begin to pull away from the dying WWE brand. Network subscribers dwindle away, and live event attendance continues to go down.
My friends, this is how the WWE fades away. Taking its audience for granted. Treating the viewer like an idiot. Stubbornly refusing to make changes when every indication is telling them to make some god damn changes.
While the ever changing TV landscape and its effect on the WWEs ratings and future TV deal is by far the most important factor at play here, I believe it is also important to look at the wrestling industry in 2017, which has undergone massive changes from just one year ago.
Increasingly lucrative opportunities have become available for pro wrestlers outside of the WWE. The Young Bucks and Kenny Omega have become increasingly popular and have yet to step foot into a WWE ring. According to Dave Meltzer, The Elite and Bullet Club merchandise in the US sells more than all but the top tier of WWE guys right now. This was before the watershed announcement that Bullet Club and Young Bucks merchandise would be sold in Hot Topic stores across the world.
Cody Rhodes, a former mid card WWE act, has come out confirmed that he is making more money working the indy circuit and New Japan Pro Wrestling than he did working in the WWE. So while it may be difficult to justify a top player like Seth Rollins leaving WWE to look for greener pastures on the indy circuit, now more than even can forgotten mid card talent like Antonio Cesaro or Luke Harper successfully transition to the indie circuit without going broke.
Finally, Id like to mention Juice Robinson, a talented young worker who amounted to basically nothing in the WWE developmental system. He decided to leave NXT in 2015 and pursue New Japan, where he is now a fixture on New Japan cards and a solid performer. If someone like Robinson, who was almost invisible in the WWE system, could find such success outside of WWE, who knows how many underutilized WWE talent could be finding greener pastures elsewhere?
Now I want to reiterate that I dont think other wrestling promotions will suddenly rise up and kill WWE. WWEs problem is competition in the TV space and utter incompetence as a company. However, I think it is still very much worth noting that for the first time since 1999, talent could pretty much tell Vince and the WWE to fuck off, go to another wrestling promotion and still make a great living, if not an even better living than in WWE. Weve just seen it again with Austin Aries, and I fully expect it to happen again and again as we head into the big 2019 TV negotiations.
If anything, WWE is in the WCW position right now. Let's rewind to 1999. Wrestling is the hottest it has ever been. On January 4th 1999, Raw did a 5.76 rating and Nitro did a 4.96. Wrestling ruled the fucking world. Youd sound like a crazy person if you went out there and claimed Um, yeah WCW is going to be dead in 2 years.
And yet what happened? Even with Hogan and Goldberg selling out the Georgia Dome and drawing nearly 10 million viewers on TV on one of the greatest nights in the history of our sport, Dave Meltzer would tell you that the writing was on the wall as early as 1998. To me, the very same writing is on the wall for WWE. Once you start bleeding money, its hard to make it stop, and 2019 will be the severe laceration via elbow through a non-gimmicked limo window.
I also want to bring up a couple of examples of similar downfalls in other forms of media, specifically the movie business. The Transformers franchise was revived by Michael Bay in 2007. While the film received middling reviews from critics, it was beloved by audiences and was a massive success at the box office. Transformers was huge again, and we got a sequel in 2009.
The sequel was a complete turd, full of McMahon-esque racist humor and poop jokes, but it seemed like the franchise was too big to fail, as it made more money than the first film. Surely audiences wouldnt be fooled again?
Wrong. Transformers 3 was released in 2011 and was the first to crack $1 billion at the box office. Another offensively bad film, but it was clear at this point that the Transformers franchise was too big to fail. Every new film was an event. Sexy women, handsome men, awesome explosions, sick cars these films had it all. Besides a coherent plot, likeable characters and sensical writing.
Transformers 4 was the drizzling shits, but it made $1 billion at the box office again in 2014. Its clear at this point that you dont need to make a good Transformers movie to make money, right? As long as the eye candy is there and the Transformers brand is present, its going to make a boat load of money. Theyll just keep going and going and the audiences will just keep coming back for more. Right?
Transformers 5 came out this year and it was a FUCKING BOMB. It made a pitiful $551 million at the box office, worse than the first Transformers and about HALF of what the last film did. What happened? Well, its pretty obvious. They tried going back to the well one too many times, and the floor fell out from underneath them. They tried to feed the audience shit, and they took it in droves the first four times, but collectively said FUCK THAT SHIT the fifth time. With all of the quality, big budget Summer action movies being released these days like Wonder Woman, Spider-Man Homecoming, Fast and Furious, Guardians of the Galaxy 2 who is going to waste their time and money on a god awful pile of shit like Transformers 5? Theres enough great action movies out there that deserve my time.
With #5years, I predict the same exact thing to happen to WWE. 2019 will be WWEs Transformers 5 moment. Everything looks great! They keep putting out a shitty product, but who cares! The suckers keep buying into it! We keep making money! Theres no reason to make any changes to how we do business, look at how much money were making.
Then the ground falls out from under them. The audience collectively says FUCK THIS and leaves. Instead of other action movies stealing Transformers lunch, it is this Golden Age of TV that we currently live in that will steal the WWEs. Between all of the original content from Netflix, HBO and all the other massively popular TV shows on the air right now, where exactly does 3 hours of Raw fit into the average persons schedule? They have a new episode of Game of Thrones to watch and a season of Punisher to marathon on Netflix. Eventually, a bad wrestling show just isnt required watching. The bleeding has already started when it comes to TV ratings for WWE, and it isnt going to stop.
Summary and Conclusion
To sum these posts up, Ive created this handy dandy graphic that summarizes the rough #5years timeline.
My conclusion is that you can't be so utterly stupid and stubborn in presenting an entertainment product in this day and age. There is way too much entertainment competing for peoples time in this day and age. People have other shit to do. There was a time where "they'll just watch anyways" was a philosophy that worked. It's no longer the case, and the declining ratings only prove my point. As was the case with Transformers, people will eventually smarten up and move on to better alternatives for their entertainment needs.
Poorly written and unfulfilling TV is doomed. If they haven't already, I can't see any scenario where WWE "smartens up" and stops the bleeding.
This is 1997 with no Stone Cold to come and save them.
Team #5years in that fucking ass. We out.
In 2017, a senile Vince wont realize the errors of his ways and make changes for the better. If Meltzer is to be believed, there is an excuse behind every drop in the ratings, rather than any internal push for change or improvement. They seem to believe everything is just fine as it is, despite almost every metric telling them otherwise. McMahon has his ways of doing business and his ways of producing TV, and refuses to change them despite dipping ratings and fan outcry. He just doesnt give a fuck.
To briefly paint a picture of the current situation, and just spell out how stunningly poor the decisions are on a weekly basis
- The 50/50 booking philosophy
- The part timers
- The WWE style, too much programming and staleness
- The scripting
I believe it is appropriate at this time to talk about some of the non-booking related issues going on with WWE as well. There is an old school carny attitude that is still alive and well in WWE that has no place in any company ever, let alone a billion dollar company in 2017. Its no secret that the WWE is a poor working environment, with higher ups constantly berating talent for nonsensical reasons, lies upon lies upon lies (We have a big push planned for you, just lose to this guy and Ill owe you one.), horror stories as it pertains to bullying, said bully still on the payroll calling TV every week (fuck you JBL you fucking cowardly cunt), racism, discrimination, assault and nonsensical booking hurting your value as a brand (undeserved pushes based on arbitrary factors like height and body type, blatant killing of a hot character because they dont meet Vince McMahons ridiculous, illogical criteria).
Worst of all is the fact that McMahon is so stubborn at this point that even with ratings and live event attendance drastically down all of these things Ive listed above will not be changing any time soon. Many believe McMahon has waged a war on the fans, and looking at the nonsensical push of Roman Reigns, Id tend to agree. His breathless pursuit to put CM Punks red hot run in Summer 2011 on ice by pairing him with Del Rio, Triple H and Kevin Nash also comes to mind. One of McMahons workers had to kill his wife, his kid and himself before Vince finally enforced a drug policy for the WWE (a policy that part timers and a handful of full timers are still able to get around for unknown reasons). Is there any reason to believe that Vince will be changing his ways any time soon? Is there any reason to believe that the 50/50 booking will go anywhere if thats how Vince likes it, or if hell stop bullying if it makes him laugh?
I could go on all day pointing out how stubborn the higher ups in this company are, but the point is this: with more options available than ever for talent, what is the incentive to stay and work with this shit hole, Trump supporting company? Why would anyone want to put themselves through that kind of torture?
At one time, the answer was simple: $$$. But in recent times, many have proven that WWE is no longer the be all end all for making money in pro wrestling.
Market Realities
This section will boil down to numbers. How does WWE make its money? Why, through stupidity and stubbornness, will WWE lose a good chunk of that money over the next 5 years? And what are some comparables that we can look at to paint a picture of the situation?
First off, let's take this opportunity to get into the nitty gritty of WWE financials. Im an economics major so Ill do my best to simplify all of this stuff.
WWE is a travelling carnival, and their carny nature is not only expressed through their low brow programming, but also to their shareholders.
In 2014, McMahon infamously promised to investors that his company would triple its 2012 operating income by 2015. This was going to be the result of a new TV contract, and the expectation that McMahon would get a fat TV deal similar to other live sports like Major League Soccer or Nascar. Funny how Wrestling is suddenly a sport and not entertainment when the situation needs it to be a sport! Nonetheless, theres only one problem: Wrestling is fucking fake entertainment bullshit that no one takes seriously besides hillbillies with $20 to their name, you moron. In the end, WWE scammed NBC Universal in a deal that would pay them 50% above their prior contract, but nowhere near the 300% increase that shareholders promised.
Why is the TV deal so important here? Because the truth is, WWE will live and die on their TV deal. Losing TV killed WCW, and I believe the same will happen to WWE. Of course WWE has multiple different revenue streams, but it begins and ends with the product millions see on TV every week. If that product is bad, and people begin to turn out, they will not buy the network, they will not go to live events they simply will not give WWE their money.
Lets do some math, Ill be basing this on the latest WWE Financial Report, for the Six Months Ended June 30.
101.4 / 403 = 25% WWE Network (Formerly PPV Business)
130.2 / 403 = 32% Television Deal
84.9 / 403 = 21% Live Events
86.5 / 403 = 22% Other (WWE Shop, Venue Merchandise, Digital Media like Youtube, etc)
So as we can see, the ship is held together by the money they make from their TV deal. Without TV, no one goes to live events. Without TV, there is no weekly push for people to join the WWE Network. And without TV, all that other stuff pretty much doesnt exist.
Like any good publicly traded company, WWE will brag about record numbers to stockholders, and fans will read headlines like WWE Reports Record Revenue and Q2 2017 Results and assume all is fine and dandy in the make believe world of WWE.
In reality, the important numbers are hidden away in the financial report and paint a far more grim picture. While revenue is up year over year, WWE fails to mention that they are putting on more shows than they were last year before the brand split. Furthermore, revenue is important, but not if youre spending more than youre making. And thats precisely the case with WWE at the moment.
Despite a revenue of $403 million over the first 6 months of 2017, total expenses for the company are at $397 million, resulting in a measly $6 million profit for the company over 6 months. This is down big from the first six months of 2016, which boasted a fairly terrible $14.7 million in profit for the company. Let it be known that these are atrocious profit margins.
I believe WWE runs into a big problem in 2019 when it comes time to negotiate a new TV deal. Lets quickly look at the previous two TV deals. Before 2015, NBC Universal was paying around $90 million annually for WWE Programming. In 2015, the price was raised to $150 million, well short of McMahons promise of $270 million a year.
One of McMahons primary sales pitches during the 2014 deal negotiations was that their program was not DVRable. In other words, ratings would not drop like other entertainment programming because you have to experience Raw live. 3 years later, we can see just how untrue that was.
The May 12 2014 Raw, which was the show before WWE announced its new deal in 2014, did 4,006,000 overnight viewers. Compare that to the second Raw of May 2017, which did 2,696,000 viewers. That is a 33% drop, and we still have two years to go until the next negotiations. The average rating for Raw in 2014 was 2.95. Since then, it has dropped to 2.64 in 2015, then 2.26 in 2016. It stands at 2.11 halfway through 2017, before football season. It will assuredly be below 2.0 come contract negotiations in 2019. Im sure NBC Universal is THRILLED at that nosedive right when they signed a new TV deal in 2014!
My point is this: If McMahon wasnt able to get the deal he wanted when his ratings were relatively solid year over year, how in the name of holy fuck does he expect to do so if the ratings are down 50% from 2014 to 2019?
Barring a miracle, WWE will have to accept a lower TV deal. Meaning their main source of income will take a giant hit. The result of this could be catastrophic: programs being cancelled, NXT losing its funding, talent being let go, and an all around lower budget feel and presentation. Sponsors may begin to pull away from the dying WWE brand. Network subscribers dwindle away, and live event attendance continues to go down.
My friends, this is how the WWE fades away. Taking its audience for granted. Treating the viewer like an idiot. Stubbornly refusing to make changes when every indication is telling them to make some god damn changes.
While the ever changing TV landscape and its effect on the WWEs ratings and future TV deal is by far the most important factor at play here, I believe it is also important to look at the wrestling industry in 2017, which has undergone massive changes from just one year ago.
Increasingly lucrative opportunities have become available for pro wrestlers outside of the WWE. The Young Bucks and Kenny Omega have become increasingly popular and have yet to step foot into a WWE ring. According to Dave Meltzer, The Elite and Bullet Club merchandise in the US sells more than all but the top tier of WWE guys right now. This was before the watershed announcement that Bullet Club and Young Bucks merchandise would be sold in Hot Topic stores across the world.
Cody Rhodes, a former mid card WWE act, has come out confirmed that he is making more money working the indy circuit and New Japan Pro Wrestling than he did working in the WWE. So while it may be difficult to justify a top player like Seth Rollins leaving WWE to look for greener pastures on the indy circuit, now more than even can forgotten mid card talent like Antonio Cesaro or Luke Harper successfully transition to the indie circuit without going broke.
Finally, Id like to mention Juice Robinson, a talented young worker who amounted to basically nothing in the WWE developmental system. He decided to leave NXT in 2015 and pursue New Japan, where he is now a fixture on New Japan cards and a solid performer. If someone like Robinson, who was almost invisible in the WWE system, could find such success outside of WWE, who knows how many underutilized WWE talent could be finding greener pastures elsewhere?
Now I want to reiterate that I dont think other wrestling promotions will suddenly rise up and kill WWE. WWEs problem is competition in the TV space and utter incompetence as a company. However, I think it is still very much worth noting that for the first time since 1999, talent could pretty much tell Vince and the WWE to fuck off, go to another wrestling promotion and still make a great living, if not an even better living than in WWE. Weve just seen it again with Austin Aries, and I fully expect it to happen again and again as we head into the big 2019 TV negotiations.
If anything, WWE is in the WCW position right now. Let's rewind to 1999. Wrestling is the hottest it has ever been. On January 4th 1999, Raw did a 5.76 rating and Nitro did a 4.96. Wrestling ruled the fucking world. Youd sound like a crazy person if you went out there and claimed Um, yeah WCW is going to be dead in 2 years.
And yet what happened? Even with Hogan and Goldberg selling out the Georgia Dome and drawing nearly 10 million viewers on TV on one of the greatest nights in the history of our sport, Dave Meltzer would tell you that the writing was on the wall as early as 1998. To me, the very same writing is on the wall for WWE. Once you start bleeding money, its hard to make it stop, and 2019 will be the severe laceration via elbow through a non-gimmicked limo window.
I also want to bring up a couple of examples of similar downfalls in other forms of media, specifically the movie business. The Transformers franchise was revived by Michael Bay in 2007. While the film received middling reviews from critics, it was beloved by audiences and was a massive success at the box office. Transformers was huge again, and we got a sequel in 2009.
The sequel was a complete turd, full of McMahon-esque racist humor and poop jokes, but it seemed like the franchise was too big to fail, as it made more money than the first film. Surely audiences wouldnt be fooled again?
Wrong. Transformers 3 was released in 2011 and was the first to crack $1 billion at the box office. Another offensively bad film, but it was clear at this point that the Transformers franchise was too big to fail. Every new film was an event. Sexy women, handsome men, awesome explosions, sick cars these films had it all. Besides a coherent plot, likeable characters and sensical writing.
Transformers 4 was the drizzling shits, but it made $1 billion at the box office again in 2014. Its clear at this point that you dont need to make a good Transformers movie to make money, right? As long as the eye candy is there and the Transformers brand is present, its going to make a boat load of money. Theyll just keep going and going and the audiences will just keep coming back for more. Right?
Transformers 5 came out this year and it was a FUCKING BOMB. It made a pitiful $551 million at the box office, worse than the first Transformers and about HALF of what the last film did. What happened? Well, its pretty obvious. They tried going back to the well one too many times, and the floor fell out from underneath them. They tried to feed the audience shit, and they took it in droves the first four times, but collectively said FUCK THAT SHIT the fifth time. With all of the quality, big budget Summer action movies being released these days like Wonder Woman, Spider-Man Homecoming, Fast and Furious, Guardians of the Galaxy 2 who is going to waste their time and money on a god awful pile of shit like Transformers 5? Theres enough great action movies out there that deserve my time.
With #5years, I predict the same exact thing to happen to WWE. 2019 will be WWEs Transformers 5 moment. Everything looks great! They keep putting out a shitty product, but who cares! The suckers keep buying into it! We keep making money! Theres no reason to make any changes to how we do business, look at how much money were making.
Then the ground falls out from under them. The audience collectively says FUCK THIS and leaves. Instead of other action movies stealing Transformers lunch, it is this Golden Age of TV that we currently live in that will steal the WWEs. Between all of the original content from Netflix, HBO and all the other massively popular TV shows on the air right now, where exactly does 3 hours of Raw fit into the average persons schedule? They have a new episode of Game of Thrones to watch and a season of Punisher to marathon on Netflix. Eventually, a bad wrestling show just isnt required watching. The bleeding has already started when it comes to TV ratings for WWE, and it isnt going to stop.
Dutch Mantel said:
Summary and Conclusion
To sum these posts up, Ive created this handy dandy graphic that summarizes the rough #5years timeline.
My conclusion is that you can't be so utterly stupid and stubborn in presenting an entertainment product in this day and age. There is way too much entertainment competing for peoples time in this day and age. People have other shit to do. There was a time where "they'll just watch anyways" was a philosophy that worked. It's no longer the case, and the declining ratings only prove my point. As was the case with Transformers, people will eventually smarten up and move on to better alternatives for their entertainment needs.
Poorly written and unfulfilling TV is doomed. If they haven't already, I can't see any scenario where WWE "smartens up" and stops the bleeding.
This is 1997 with no Stone Cold to come and save them.
Team #5years in that fucking ass. We out.
RecRoulette
Member
Put that in OT.
SallyIsNow
Banned
Army of Darkness alt ending > original
Sweeney Tom
Banned
God, that was incredible seeing the Transformers 5 review thread where even its fans were like "yeah it sucks but it'll still get a billion easily :smug"
Not even gonna get $600 mil by the end. Notice none of those people made another comment regarding it since
Not even gonna get $600 mil by the end. Notice none of those people made another comment regarding it since
ShadowSwordmaster
Banned
You spend way too much time on this 5 years stuff, Anthony.
It's only fun in the wrasle thread. trolls would ruin it if I post in OT.
I hope you guys enjoy the read, even if you don't believe. Doing all that research was fun.
Nocturnowl
Member
I read it all, it was a fun read to be fair.
SallyIsNow
Banned
It is I! It is I! Sweeney Tom! I talk about threads and don't link them.
Sweeney Tom
Banned
Said thread http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1394841
Featuring Anth0ny saying not only would it not make a billion, but China wouldn't save it. Both completely true in the end. Nobody else called both happening like he did.
Sweeney Tom
Banned
Nobody else called both happening like he did.
No. Body. Else.
I believed in him then
I believe in him now
I believe in him forever
#TeamAnth0ny
No. Body. Else.
I believed in him then
I believe in him now
I believe in him forever
#TeamAnth0ny
ShadowSwordmaster
Banned
I really want Toma Tonga to take over Bullet Club now.