• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

"Be excellent to each other" AKA I like the idea of the "jesusist"

Status
Not open for further replies.

Monk

Banned
I've long thought that the terms "Christian" and "Christianity" have been so thoroughly hijacked by worshippers of Supply Side Jesus that we need a new word for those good people who actually participate in what Jesus taught. You know:

# Don't hate people;
# Don't judge people;
# Don't combine money and religion, or religion and politics;
# Peace is better than war;
# Love is better than hate;
# Take care of the poor and the weak;
# Whatever you do to the least of my brothers, you do unto me;
# Do unto others as you would have them do unto you;
# Be excellent to each other;
# We're all in this together.

Locally in America, in individual churches all across the country, Christians still stand for these values -- which is right and good and as it should be. But on the national stage, the only people who get to call themselves "Christians" are those who hate: hate women, hate scientists, hate gays, hate doctors, hate the non-religious openly and hate non-Christans on the down-low. These self-proclaimed "Christians" are the only representatives of Christianity we ever see on TV.

And that's wrong. Those people don't represent my once and future roommate, Dr. Brent, M.D.; they don't represent his brilliant wife, Lisa, who was absolutely right about the war in retrospect (and I was absolutely wrong); they don't represent poet and mimic extraordinaire Toy O'F., or the Quakers over at Guilford College, or the people who meet each week at St. Mary's Episcopal Church, where the MFA program does our readings.

There's a hell of a lot of people out there that the Christian Coalition doesn't speak for.

The bad Christians just shout louder than the good ones.

George Bush once said that Jesus Christ was his favorite political philosopher. At the time, yes, I snorted. But it would actually be a fairly decent answer, if the teachings of Jesus Christ had any discernable relationship whatsoever to George Bush's politics. There's not a huge gap between Jesus and Gandhi, or Jesus and Martin Luther King, or Jesus and the Buddha, or Jesus and John Rawls. All these people are all working off the same basic page. But there is a huge gap beween Jesus and Pat Robertson or between Jesus and George Bush.

What Bush does has nothing to do with "God's love," and nothing to do with Christ.

The new word I've proposed for my liberal Christian friends is Jesusist, which sadly doesn't exactly roll of the tongue. I'm sure they can come up with a better one.

Since I'm neither a Christian nor a Jesusist, I can't really participate -- but I'm assured that Brent, Lisa, Toy, and others have the situation well in hand. They'd better.

There are a lot of things good people need to take back. Christianity is one of them.


http://threeguys.blogspot.com/2004/11/verily-i-say-unto-you-be-excellent-to.html


This guy makes a good point. And I like to subscribe to his newsletter. :p I strongly believe in Jesus's teaching but I hate the doctrine that has come with it. I am thinking of calling myself a jesusist.
 
Yes, a lot of those points are common sense. But that's something most people don't follow anyway.

And why do you need to label yourself and follow someone to practice these basic points?
 

RiZ III

Member
It is impossible not to hate. It is impossible not to mix religion and politics if the politicians are not athiests. Religion can't control human nature even though it tries. Religion consists of a name people like to attach themselves to without following its codes. In a perfect world, true Religion would be possible.
 

Monk

Banned
Because I believe in Jesus but not in the things that many christians are doing, which I find unchristian. I like to set myself apart from them but I don't want to give up my belief that Jesus is my saviour.
 

maharg

idspispopd
Indeed. It's so sad when you see people, for example, on this forum who say "I'm Christian and I don't know why [gay marriage is a big deal|we had to invade iraq]." I don't think they need to schism their way to a new religion, though. They just need to actually get together and start talking about what they believe on a political stage. There seems to be no equivelent to all the right wing christian think tanks and organizations on the left wing.

I can understand that, often believing in seperation of church and state, they feel they should not actively politic or form political organizations. But they need to realize that that is itself a political concept and needs to be defended.
 

Monk

Banned
RiZ III said:
It is impossible not to hate. It is impossible not to mix religion and politics if the politicians are not athiests. Religion can't control human nature even though it tries. Religion consists of a name people like to attach themselves to without following its codes. In a perfect world, true Religion would be possible.

I don't hate anyone at all. So you are wrong.
 

Dice

Pokémon Parentage Conspiracy Theorist
I agree with the criticisms of christianity these days, but you can't oversimplify his teachings like that. Actually read through the gospels, not just the sermon on the mount, preferably with a bible or guide that will refer you to the old testament passages that he quotes. Heck, even within the sermon on the mount he said:

Matthew 5
17"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. 18I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. 19Anyone who breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. 20For I tell you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the Pharisees and the teachers of the law, you will certainly not enter the kingdom of heaven.

And that really complicates things. You need a good hermeneutic method to determine which laws he has already fulfilled and how (i.e. He is the ultimate sacrifice, so no need for animal sacrifices. Many ceremonial laws are fulfilled in him, read Hebrews.) and then there is a huge debate when it comes to politics and how we embrace principles God set out for Israel while understanding we are not Israel as it was. Also, Jesus never said not to mix your faith and politics like this guy seems to say.

Jesus wasn't some vague hippie character; he taught doctrine, and a lot of it. He was a hebrew through and through, fully embracing the heritage of all that he came to fulfill and calls us to be a part of. And sorry but this makes him very different from Gandhi and Buddha and the like. Everyone will have the same focus on love and peace, and ones vision of what this looks like will be similar, but they will differ on how it is to be brought about and established.

Are we to hate? No. Are we to speak out about what God says? Yes.
Are we to judge? No. Are we to warn about the judgement of God? Yes.

And so on and so forth... it's a tough balance, and many times christians fall to one side and it's not good. But there are also many times they keep balance and are misunderstood and mislabled, assumed to have the same intentions as those misguided christians.

The thing is that when you group people into "good christians" and "bad christians" you're already breaking even these vague hippie teachings. You need to understand that their hostility comes from weakness, misguidance, ignorance, etc. You need to show them mercy then give them grace, don't argue but find out why they think as they do and help show them the way out of their thinking box.

Matthew 5
38"You have heard that it was said, 'Eye for eye, and tooth for tooth.' 39But I tell you, Do not resist an evil person. If someone strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also. 40And if someone wants to sue you and take your tunic, let him have your cloak as well. 41If someone forces you to go one mile, go with him two miles. 42Give to the one who asks you, and do not turn away from the one who wants to borrow from you.
43"You have heard that it was said, 'Love your neighbor and hate your enemy.' 44But I tell you: Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, 45that you may be sons of your Father in heaven. He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous. 46If you love those who love you, what reward will you get? Are not even the tax collectors doing that? 47And if you greet only your brothers, what are you doing more than others? Do not even pagans do that? 48Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect.

Sometimes this applies to christians who don't get it. Yes the "good ones" aren't as loud, but that's because being loud doesn't reach to the heart, and doesn't make a good and lasting change in a person. Before you lead a person in your worldview you have to lead them in your manner, and sometimes that takes time, personal investment, even a willing friendship.
 

Monk

Banned
But from my perception of the Gospel, is not to dictate how people live. Like things like making gay marriage illegal or forcing Iraq to be democratic. What I am saying is that you can live by your religious ideals, you can tell others to do the same, but you shouldn't force others to behave the way you want, that is something against God's will from even from Genesis where Adam and Eve had the choice of eating from the fruit of Knowledge or not.

Taking away free will is not God's way.
 

maharg

idspispopd
"Sometimes this applies to christians who don't get it. Yes the "good ones" aren't as loud, but that's because being loud doesn't reach to the heart, and doesn't make a good and lasting change in a person. Before you lead a person in your worldview you have to lead them in your manner, and sometimes that takes time, personal investment, even a willing friendship."

This isn't good enough anymore. The loud ones are all people, even christians, hear. The televangelists are all preaching fire and brimstone for the unbelievers, and the politicians who make a point of showing their religious colours are their best friends. The reason it's hard to reach the heart is because they hear so little of that and so much of the hate.
 

ronito

Member
Monk said:
But from my perception of the Gospel, is not to dictate how people live. Like things like making gay marriage illegal or forcing Iraq to be democratic. What I am saying is that you can live by your religious ideals, you can tell others to do the same, but you shouldn't force others to behave the way you want, that is something against God's will from even from Genesis where Adam and Eve had the choice of eating from the fruit of Knowledge or not.

Taking away free will is not God's way.


Huzzah! Great post old chap!

pat.jpg
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top Bottom