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[Messofanego]

Don't get why some are STILL going on about the most optimal delivery method for a protest when it's already happened. Reasonable people are now informed about certain injustices. Guess some people REALLY need to get their point across that they don't like some kinds of protests. When a quieter and less disruptive protest comes about, will obnoxiously go "see that's how you do it!".

 

[FyreWulff]

Why would it be a crime? There might be a trespassing or jaywalking crime in the second gif but that's it.

Using a car against anyone it usually considered assault with a deadly weapon

 

[Blue Lou]

Channel 4 had someone from the campaign in the studio.

https://www.facebook.com/channel4newsidentity/videos/1144431848962906/

Unfortunately, there's no Youtube link, just Facebook.

 

[timetokill]

When a quieter and less disruptive protest comes about, will obnoxiously go "see that's how you do it!".

No they won't, because they won't even hear about it

Which is ultimately what they want

 

[Maztorre]

Seems like a number of people still don't understand that causing inconvenience for privileged groups is the core of how civil disobedience works. It takes a special kind of ignorance to bemoan a minority group protesting in the weeks following a 500-600% increase in hate crimes against anyone deemed "foreign".

 

[Jezbollah]

Seems like a number of people still don't understand that causing inconvenience for privileged groups is the core of how civil disobedience works. It takes a special kind of ignorance to bemoan a minority group protesting in the weeks following a 500-600% increase in hate crimes against anyone deemed "foreign".

That really depends on your definition of "privileged groups".

 

[Polari]

Clear them out. Morons. The UK isn't perfect, but the situation is very far removed from in the US.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

Clear them out. Morons. The UK isn't perfect, but the situation is very far removed from in the US.

Did you read their Twitter and watch their video?

http://twitter.com/ukblm

So many of you complainers have such vague handwave explanations that seem to show you haven't done literally one second of research.

 

[commedieu]

Seems like a number of people still don't understand that causing inconvenience for privileged groups is the core of how civil disobedience works. It takes a special kind of ignorance to bemoan a minority group protesting in the weeks following a 500-600% increase in hate crimes against anyone deemed "foreign".

Where did u get that % I saw it while ago but couldn't find the source.

 

[gerg]

Where did u get that % I saw it while ago but couldn't find the source.

Here's but one source for the figure: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...increase-race-hate-crimes-since-brexit-result

 

[Polari]

Did you read their Twitter and watch their video?

http://twitter.com/ukblm

So many of you complainers have such vague handwave explanations that seem to show you haven't done literally one second of research.

There's pretty much no reliable stats in it (sources?), and then somehow they manage to toss illegal immigrants, Syria, unemployment and school stand-downs into the cause as well.

1,562 deaths in police custody? For starters, where? What causes of death? If it's Black Lives Matter, what ethnicities? Then to say "0 convictions" is pretty much lying with stats 101. Pathetic.

What solutions are they proposing?

 

[PopeReal]

They're confusing the message. There's a difference between a protest of a very specific symbol of oppression and just protesting wherever you'll make some noise.

Poor BLM desperately needs their own MLK. The leadership is just questionable. A lot of the protests seem poorly thought out.

They gotta stick with stuff like the million man march and the bus boycotts of old, clear symbols against clear oppression.
Blocking airport roads and gay pride parades confuses the message. Makes it more about the noise, not the message they're trying to say.

Do they? Or do you?

I am thinking it is you. If you need some once in a lifetime type of person to convince you that black lives matter.... then that is no one else's problem but your own.

 

[jem0208]

There's pretty much no reliable stats in it (sources?), and then somehow they manage to toss illegal immigrants, Syria, unemployment and school stand-downs into the cause as well.

1,562 deaths in police custody? For starters, where? What causes of death? If it's Black Lives Matter, what ethnicities? Then to say "0 convictions" is pretty much lying with stats 101. Pathetic.

What solutions are they proposing?

http://www.inquest.org.uk/statistics/deaths-in-police-custody

Just to note, that is ALL deaths in custody, not just black and minorities.

The stats on black and minority deaths show 156 deaths: http://www.inquest.org.uk/statistics/bame-deaths-in-police-custody

However, this doesn't include pursuit or RTI deaths.

 

[Polari]

http://www.inquest.org.uk/statistics/deaths-in-police-custody

Just to note, that is ALL deaths in custody, not just black and minorities.

The stats on black and minority deaths show 156 deaths: http://www.inquest.org.uk/statistics/bame-deaths-in-police-custody

However, this doesn't include pursuit or RTI deaths.

Thanks - this is why they way the video is framed is completely disingenuous.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

Thanks - this is why they way the video is framed is completely disingenuous.

How?

 

[jem0208]

How?

In the video there is no indication that the stat (1563 deaths) is actually all people and not only black/minorities.

 

[The Hamburglar]

Channel 4 had someone from the campaign in the studio.

https://www.facebook.com/channel4newsidentity/videos/1144431848962906/

Unfortunately, there's no Youtube link, just Facebook.

Why are they doubling down on criminals? Didn't the police find a gun on or near mark? And those others they mentioned tried to free a criminal from a police van? Honestly does Britian have an issue with police killing minorities when 2 of the 3 this year killed were trying to bust a prisoner out...

 

[Polari]

How?

Isn't it obvious? It's the only ethnically neutral stat in the video, and it's presented without any qualifiers leading people to assume (particularly since it's - y'know - a Black Lives Matter video) that it refers to black/minority deaths, when the reality is 1/10th of that.

Just trumpeting a big number doesn't make it remotely relevant.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

Isn't it obvious? It's the only ethnically neutral stat in the video, and it's presented without any qualifiers leading people to assume (particularly since it's - y'know - a Black Lives Matter video) that it refers to black/minority deaths, when the reality is 1/10th of that.

Also how many were suicides? How many were attacks by others held in police custody? How many resulted from natural causes? Just trumpeting a big number doesn't make it remotely relevant.

Fair enough, but I was thinking the key was the convictions stat.

 

[GoldenCrow]

That's true, although as a Pakistani I sometimes wonder how different my life would have been if not for colonization- probably living as a farmer in my home village or something, so as someone on the receiving end of that colonization, I have to admit a part of me acknowledges the spread of higher modes of thinking and secular thought that came out of colonization. I am surprised to hear that the UK does not dwell on its colonization (and associated atrocities) as much though, here in Canad we go through middle school constantly reminded of the plight of the Native Americans as a result of our British forefathers, and likewise in Germany a lot of emphasis is placed on educating the populace on the evils of its past.

Most people are pretty much blissfully ignorant of it. I looked into it when I was a teen as I thought it odd that it wasn't a subject covered in depth in history seeing how large the empire was and how much it shaped the world today. There was a time in the 60's and 70's apparently when it was a national discussion and it pretty much helped kill off nationalism along with the right wing nutters at the time which has only really just recently started to appear again. In England it has been white washed, if you want to find out it is easy but it isn't talked about.

 

[Polari]

Fair enough, but I was thinking the key was the convictions stat.

True, but they don't say how much more likely to be convicted. With the convictions stat, it would be interesting to see it controlling for socio-economic disadvantage as that's likely a very influential variable on those rates.

The stop and searches seem worse to me. On that one though you probably do need to compare with the proportions of stop and searches that actually yield something. If there's a significant discrepancy between ethnicities here then that's obviously a bad thing and a sign of institutional racism. If there's not it's probably just good policing.

For the record, I think there's institutional racism in Britain, and it manifests itself most in socio-economic disadvantage, which seems like the most important thing to address. It seems like they are wanting to address that, but along with a bunch of other things that might be better left to other causes rather than trying to do everything at once.

 

[Sunster]

If they didn't do things like this there'd hardly be a discussion.

 

[Breakage]

The relationship between police and black people is no where near as bad as it is in the US. It's simply not comparable.
I was listening to the radio today and ppl phoning in to support this were advocating a "day of rage" and didn't care about the disruption caused.
I heard one guy unambiguously say that he was anti-police.

I just got the impression that they were trying to stir things up to kick off a "London riots 2016" under the disguise of black lives matter. It's the 5th anniversary of the riots and there were callers speaking of Mark Duggan and his "unlawful assassination"(as one caller put it).

I think a young black male is (in London at least) more likely to die at the hands of another black male than a police officer.

 

[dyergram]

Why are they doubling down on criminals? Didn't the police find a gun on or near mark?

Yea he had a gun in his hand some argue he was about to throw it out the window. I was thinking this protest is incredibly poorly timed since the most recent high profile armed police incident is a example of them showing incredible restraint with the knife attack in London where they tazered and arrested the assailant.

 

[jem0208]

I was curious so I did some research on some of the comments in that Twitter video.

The 1563 deaths in police custody actually includes all ethnicities. 156 black or minority people are reported to have died in police custody however this does not include pursuit or RTI deaths.


Sarah Reed was attacked by a police officer in 2012, the officer was then charged with common assault and removed from the force. She was found dead in prison in January.

Jermaine Baker was apparently part of an attempt to break someone out of a custody van when he was shot. The officer who shot him was arrested.

Mzee Mohammed was apparently having a "medical episode" and died in hospital after being taken there by the police.


On the up to 37 times more likely to be stopped and searched statistic, this article says that last year Dorset was the worst offender where black people were 17 times more likely to be stopped and searched..


They didn't have any other exact statistics other than the refugee comment which I thought was fairly irrelevant to issues in the UK. Although I think the comment that Britain is responsible for those conflicts is a little dubious...


With regards to more convictions and more arrests, in 2013/14 Black people were almost 3 times more likely to be arrested other ethnic groups, however, white people consistently had higher conviction rates from 2009 to 2014.

 

[Bleepey]

I was curious so I did some research on some of the comments in that Twitter video.

The 1563 deaths in police custody actually includes all ethnicities. 156 black or minority people are reported to have died in police custody however this does not include pursuit or RTI deaths.


Sarah Reed was attacked by a police officer in 2012, the officer was then charged with common assault and removed from the force. She was found dead in prison in January.

Jermaine Baker was apparently part of an attempt to break someone out of a custody van when he was shot. The officer who shot him was arrested.

Mzee Mohammed was apparently having a "medical episode" and died in hospital after being taken there by the police.


On the up to 37 times more likely to be stopped and searched statistic, this article says that last year Dorset was the worst offender where black people were 17 times more likely to be stopped and searched..


They didn't have any other exact statistics other than the refugee comment which I thought was fairly irrelevant to issues in the UK. Although I think the comment that Britain is responsible for those conflicts is a little dubious...


With regards to more convictions and more arrests, in 2013/14 Black people were almost 3 times more likely to be arrested other ethnic groups, however, white people consistently had higher conviction rates from 2009 to 2014.

Pretty much. Some of their numbers are very cherry picked. I think it dilutes the BLM movement and need to be looked at in context.

 

[yanipheonu]

Do they? Or do you?

I am thinking it is you. If you need some once in a lifetime type of person to convince you that black lives matter.... then that is no one else's problem but your own.

Good Ad hominem argument. Really furthering the cause.

Their protests have confused messaging and could use better leadership.
That in no way means I don't understand the plight of BLM or black people in general.
This is perfectly valid criticism meant to point out that BLM could do a better job spreading their message.

MLK used here does not imply that only some Great Person can further the struggle of black people, but rather that the Civil rights movement was strong not just because of protest but because of the organization and leadership of the movement.
Whether through some leader stepping up, or a greater organization of the BLM movement, they can do more to make their protests work a lot better.

Acknowledging weaknesses is a strength. They'd be wise to look into improving their protests.

 

[Beefy]

Wish there was a Muslim lifes matter and European lives matter as well. I see both of them as having far bigger problems then BLM. Still BLM is a good thing, all I hope is if a person did miss their flight the companies paid up instead of the person having to.

 

[dalin80]

Pretty much. Some of their numbers are very cherry picked. I think it dilutes the BLM movement and need to be looked at in context.

'Cherry picked' is a very nice way of putting it, they aren't doing their cause much good when the stats they release are complete BS.

 

[Htown]

Poor BLM desperately needs their own MLK.

Why? So they can be hated as much as MLK was hated in his own time?

Let's stop with this fiction that MLK was universally beloved back when he was actually alive and dangerous, and that everybody but the KKK agreed with what he was doing.

White people said the same shit about MLK and his movement then as they're saying about Black Lives Matter now.

It's okay. I'm sure your kids will pretend you were on board, too.

 

[CyclopsRock]

The name's a mistake.

 

[Bleepey]

'Cherry picked' is a very nice way of putting it, they aren't doing their cause much good when the stats they release are complete BS.

Yeah I am more annoyed by them than anything. If there was a black dollars or black pounds movement I'd be there with them. This bullshit with flights, using statistics that people who might be sympathetic to them can't defend, the right wing press will have a field day with it and I can't really blame them to be honest.

 

[Mesousa]

Yeah I am more annoyed by them than anything. If there was a black dollars or black pounds movement I'd be there with them. This bullshit with flights, using statistics that people who might be sympathetic to them can't defend, the right wing press will have a field day with it and I can't really blame them to be honest.

What would a black pounds movement look like?

 

[Opus Angelorum]

Seems like a number of people still don't understand that causing inconvenience for privileged groups is the core of how civil disobedience works. It takes a special kind of ignorance to bemoan a minority group protesting in the weeks following a 500-600% increase in hate crimes against anyone deemed "foreign".

So being white and working a 36 hour job makes me privileged?

Don't think so.

 

[travisbickle]

So being white and working a 36 hour job makes me privileged?

In this context, yes.

 

[daviyoung]

Seems like a number of people still don't understand that causing inconvenience for privileged groups is the core of how civil disobedience works. It takes a special kind of ignorance to bemoan a minority group protesting in the weeks following a 500-600% increase in hate crimes against anyone deemed "foreign".

let's hope there were no black people travelling that day then

 

[MikeBreezy92]

let's hope there were no black people travelling that day then

Let's not pretend Minorities can't get caught in the same logic that harms them on a day to day.

 

[Infinite]

So being white and working a 36 hour job makes me privileged?

Don't think so.

lol being white period makes you privileged in this society, boo.

 

[Bleepey]

What would a black pounds movement look like?

Encouraging patronising black owned businesses.

 

[Jacobi]

UK BLM seems pointless and stupid to me

 

[Mesousa]

Encouraging patronising black owned businesses.

Ah I see.

 

[jem0208]

Seems like a number of people still don't understand that causing inconvenience for privileged groups is the core of how civil disobedience works. It takes a special kind of ignorance to bemoan a minority group protesting in the weeks following a 500-600% increase in hate crimes against anyone deemed "foreign".

42% over a period in June.

The National Police Chiefs’ Council said in a report earlier this month that the figures for the last two weeks in June represent a 42 per cent rise on this time last year.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-36746763

20% over a period in July.

There was a slight fall in reports in the first half of Julycompared with an initial spike in the days before and after the 23 June vote, the National Police Chief's Council said.

But the overall level was up 20% on the same period inJuly 2015.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-36869000


I’m all for trying to decrease racism in this country but people need to start getting their stats right.

 

[guggnichso]

That gif that aaron just posted. Gif

Europe is worried about white syrians now? What white migrants are we talking about?

Polish migrants. Brexit has fuck all to do with Syrians, because the U.K. already controlled the influx of non-EU citizens themselves.

Brexit is about white polish migrants.

 

[dalin80]

42% over a period in June.


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-36746763

20% over a period in July.


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-36869000


I’m all for trying to decrease racism in this country but people need to start getting their stats right.

Yeah, slightly inconvenient facts for them there, also the list of crimes now put into that category has been increased over the past year so it's hard to know if crime has gone up at all or if recategorising has skewed the numbers.