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[Exotoro]

I'm glad that Apple has a specific view on what they think is compelling, and are willing to test the market with their time and resources to show it. They're out there trying to sell their product like everyone else. Of course they are not going to use the few seconds they have in front of your eyes to talk about the negatives or possible pain points.

I'm not sure where the vitriol about this comes from in general on the internet. Making products that fit everything and everyone is a fools errand in my opinion. Just don't buy the thing if you don't find it useful for your life.

I wish i had this option but i cannot use the apps specifically developed for the iphone on any other given phone. I am literally forced to use an iphone. When this 6 breaks, i cant just get an android or a windows phone.

 

[Uno Venova]

I'm trying to imagine why you would loose the adapter so easily as well. Doesn't it just stay attached the the headphones, and wouldn't you put the adapter with your other cords and accessories when not in use?

I have a lot of tiny accessories, SD cards, USB sticks, for years and they're still here...

 

[Exotoro]

I'm trying to imagine why you would loose the adapter so easily as well. Doesn't it just stay attached the the headphones, and wouldn't you put the adapter with your other cords and accessories when not in use?

I have a lot of tiny accessories, SD cards, USB sticks, for years and they're still here...

People talk from experience though. Just because you dont lose stuff like that doesnt mean its the same for everyone else.

 

[Marty Chinn]

Just leave it attached to your headphones?

This implies you only ever use one audio output device ever. I don't. I leave my headphones at work, I have a connection in the car, I use something else at home and that's just for me alone. There are times I'm in another car and want to hook it up, or I'm at someone else's house and want to hook it in. There are numerous situations where simply leaving it attached to your one set of headphones would not cover that having a standardize connection would.

 

[Cizard]

I'm trying to imagine why you would loose the adapter so easily as well. Doesn't it just stay attached the the headphones, and wouldn't you put the adapter with your other cords and accessories when not in use?

I have a lot of tiny accessories, SD cards, USB sticks, for years and they're still here...

That would work if you only use it on your iPhone. If i'm also using the headphones on other devices and switching it on and off i'm way more likely to lose it. Wouldn't happen every day but it would get annoying. Doesn't seem worth the hassle to me.

 

[EatinOlives]

I'm trying to imagine why you would loose the adapter so easily as well. Doesn't it just stay attached the the headphones, and wouldn't you put the adapter with your other cords and accessories when not in use?

I have a lot of tiny accessories, SD cards, USB sticks, for years and they're still here...

You're not storing the adapter, you're taking it with you because you're going to presumably be using earbuds outside.

 

[Deleted member 12837]

This implies you only ever use one audio output device ever. I don't. I leave my headphones at work, I have a connection in the car, I use something else at home and that's just for me alone. There are times I'm in another car and want to hook it up, or I'm at someone else's house and want to hook it in. There are numerous situations where simply leaving it attached to your one set of headphones would not cover that having a standardize connection would.

At that point I'd suggest just buying a few. People buy multiple chargers at like $90 each to avoid not having to carry one around between work and home. Buying a few $9 accessories if you have multiple headphones seems harmless to me ¯_(&#12484_/¯

Also I'm going to go out on a limb and guess us multi-headphone owners are in the minority.

Anyway, I was curious about others specific thoughts on this and got them (and appreciate the responses). Seems like it's mostly a difference in perception of inconvenience.

 

[Marty Chinn]

At that point I'd suggest just buying a few. People buy multiple chargers at like $90 each to avoid not having to carry one around between work and home. Buying a few $9 accessories if you have multiple headphones seems harmless to me ¯_(&#12484_/¯

Also I'm going to go out on a limb and guess us multi-headphone owners are in the minority.

Anyway, I was curious about others specific thoughts on this and got them (and appreciate the responses). Seems like it's mostly a difference in perception of inconvenience.

If it's no big deal, why don't you pay for all my adapters then? Asking the consumer to spend an extra amount of money for something that was once built in to have the same functionality is never going to go over well when it doesn't seem like the removal comes with benefits. Plus, buying multiple adapters to attach to all your personal devices doesn't solve the problem when you're out and you don't have an adapter and want to plug something into it. All of these problems were non issues when the adapter was just standard.

 

[Deleted member 752119]

I'm not sure where the vitriol about this comes from in general on the internet. Making products that fit everything and everyone is a fools errand in my opinion. Just don't buy the thing if you don't find it useful for your life.

With phones it's not that simple as to switch away from
iPhone people have to give up their paid apps, re-enter contacts etc.

Is the adapter permanent? You can't remove it temporarily?

The talk was about worry over losing the dongle. You can't just leave it on your headphones and forget about it if you 1) have multiple headphones you use with your phone, or, 2) use your one set of headphones with more than your iPhone.

 

[EatinOlives]

At that point I'd suggest just buying a few. People buy multiple chargers at like $90 each to avoid not having to carry one around between work and home. Buying a few $9 accessories if you have multiple headphones seems harmless to me ¯_(&#12484_/¯

Also I'm going to go out on a limb and guess us multi-headphone owners are in the minority.

Anyway, I was curious about others specific thoughts on this and got them (and appreciate the responses). Seems like it's mostly a difference in perception of inconvenience.

Not "perception" of inconvenience, flat out inconvenience.

 

[shenglongdong]

So is this a situation where a couple of iPhone iterations from now they will bring the jack back, or are we gonna start seeing Android devices drop the jack here in the next year or so?

I'm hoping the former happens

 

[faceless007]

At that point I'd suggest just buying a few.

OK try imagining talking to a support person for anything in the world because you're having a problem with their product and hearing them say this to you. If that doesn't immediately strike you as an eye-rollingly ridiculous request you should recalibrate your expectations as a consumer.

(You also didn't acknowledge the post I made about the adapter's durability.)

 

[Deleted member 12837]

If it's no big deal, why don't you pay for all my adapters then?

Sure. How many pairs of headphones do you own?

The talk was about worry over losing the dongle. You can't just leave it on your headphones and forget about it if you 1) have multiple headphones you use with your phone, or, 2) use your one set of headphones with more than your iPhone.

1) See the chain from above
2) If it's attached to your primary pair most of the time, the odds of losing it are dramatically reduced even if you have to remove it occasionally. That's all I'm saying.

 

[Marty Chinn]

Sure. How many pairs of headphones do you own?

I'll take 8 adapters then. Wait, you're in luck, one comes with it, so seven adapters, at $9 a piece, plus tax, that'll be $68.98. How do you want to send me the money?

 

[Deleted member 12837]

OK try imagining talking to a support person for anything in the world because you're having a problem with their product and hearing them say this to you. If that doesn't immediately strike you as an eye-rollingly ridiculous request you should recalibrate your expectations as a consumer.

(You also didn't acknowledge the post I made about the adapter's durability.)

Actually I did. I said I have never had cable issues with Apple in terms of durability, but acknowledged I might be an outlier.

Also I don't think many people call support when they lose an accessory or need to complain about buying one, so not sure how that applies.

Not "perception" of inconvenience, flat out inconvenience.

Inconvenience is subjective.

I'll take 8 adapters then. Wait, you're in luck, one comes with it, so seven adapters, at $9 a piece, plus tax, that'll be $68.98. How do you want to send me the money?

I'm sure 8 headphones is close to the mean of ownership, lol. I'll need your address to ship these bad boys, otherwise how do I know you'll actually buy them?

 

[KingV]

If it's no big deal, why don't you pay for all my adapters then? Asking the consumer to spend an extra amount of money for something that was once built in to have the same functionality is never going to go over well when it doesn't seem like the removal comes with benefits. Plus, buying multiple adapters to attach to all your personal devices doesn't solve the problem when you're out and you don't have an adapter and want to plug something into it. All of these problems were non issues when the adapter was just standard.

"Hey let me see your aux cord... Oh"

 

[Uno Venova]

If it's no big deal, why don't you pay for all my adapters then? Asking the consumer to spend an extra amount of money for something that was once built in to have the same functionality is never going to go over well when it doesn't seem like the removal comes with benefits. Plus, buying multiple adapters to attach to all your personal devices doesn't solve the problem when you're out and you don't have an adapter and want to plug something into it. All of these problems were non issues when the adapter was just standard.

Maybe he's saying it's not a big deal because that many headphones is more of a unique situation.

It's also not unlikely that a person investing that much in headphones will bother with a couple cheap adapters.

 

[Deleted member 752119]

Sure. How many pairs of headphones do you own?



1) See the chain from above
2) If it's attached to your primary pair most of the time, the odds of losing it are dramatically reduced even if you have to remove it occasionally. That's all I'm saying.

I don't have a primary pair, but raw headphones I leave multiple places, and posted a list of my headphones earlier in the thread.

Meh. Whatever. Apple can fuck off if they think I'll buy a phone without a headphone jack. Thankfully I've bought very few apps and have no paid iPhone apps I use regularly so at least it will be easy for me to switch when my 6s kicks the bucket.

 

[Marty Chinn]

I'm sure 8 headphones is close to the mean of ownership, lol. I'll need your address to ship these bad boys, otherwise how do I know you'll actually buy them?

I can break it down to you if you want:

Work
Home
Daughter's headphones
Son's headphones
Home Stereo
My Car
My Wife's Car
One for the road to have on hand in case I want to plug in anywhere else or someone else needs to plug into it since all my other adapters are tied up.

That's not unreasonable.

Maybe he's saying it's not a big deal because that many headphones is more of a unique situation.

It's also not unlikely that a person investing that much in headphones will bother with a couple cheap adapters.

Is it? See above. That's not an odd number or unique of a situation to have something to plug into.

 

[Wowfunhappy]

If Apple used microUSB or USB-C or some other open spec they would have a completely acceptable argument.

But that's not what they did.

 

[Deleted member 12837]

I can break it down to you if you want:

Work
Home
Daughter's headphones
Son's headphones
Home Stereo
My Car
My Wife's Car
One for the road to have on hand in case I want to plug in anywhere else or someone else needs to plug into it since all my other adapters are tied up.

That's not unreasonable.

So that's only $18 per person, which I agree isn't unreasonable. That was my whole point. The majority of people will probably not need another adapter at all,
or at most 1 extra.

Are you planning on buying flagship smartphones for all 4 of you?

If Apple used microUSB or USB-C some other open spec this would be a completely acceptable argument.

But that's not what they did.

Now this I agree entirely with. If they'd used this opportunity to use USB-C instead of Lightning that would've been awesome.

 

[Deleted member 752119]

If Apple used microUSB or USB-C some other open spec this would be a completely acceptable argument.

But that's not what they did.

That's the biggest problem. If the headphone jack gets replaced it needs to be by something that's a new universal standard and offers a clear improvement.

 

[Marty Chinn]

So that's only $18 per person, which I agree isn't unreasonable. That was my whole point. The majority of people will probably not need another adapter at all,
or at most 1 extra.

Are you planning on buying flagship smartphones for all 4 of you?

Why is that $18 a person? That's dismissing the fact that I would need 8 adapters even if I only have one device. You're suggesting I have adapters for every device handy so that I'm not in some unique situation where I have a device that can't be plugged in and won't end up in a situation where I've misplaced or lost an adapter. I don't need four flagship phones to have that need according to your solution that I should just have adapters on everything.

 

[Cipherr]

Is the adapter permanent? You can't remove it temporarily?

Now we are back to "Where did I leave that thing".

I refuse to believe you don't see other peoples side of this. People dont WANT to have to attach a fucking adapter for something like this. They havent had to before, and the 'replacement' tech isnt even as good as the Aux cable any damn way.

Theres absolutely no way you cant see this from other peoples point of view. I dont think you are being honest here.

 

[Rest]

The fact that he doesn't even know how old patch cables are when he uses their age as a justification for getting rid of them says a quite a bit.

 

[Frodo]

I'm actually surprised Apple included the dongle. I expected it to be sold separately for $15.

Expect most adaptors to break within a couple of weeks of use.




I'm not letting go of my headphone jack. I commute a lot and I don't want to worry about batteries (both phone and headphones) being needlessly drained.I just hope the Pixel line of phones keep the jack there.

 

[Deleted member 12837]

Why is that $18 a person? That's dismissing the fact that I would need 8 adapters even if I only have one device. You're suggesting I have adapters for every device handy so that I'm not in some unique situation where I have a device that can't be plugged in and won't end up in a situation where I've misplaced or lost an adapter. I don't need four flagship phones to have that need according to your solution that I should just have adapters on everything.

So your son and daughter plug headphones into your phone to listen to music? That seems like a stretch, and that you're purposely missing the general point.

Now we are back to "Where did I leave that thing".

I refuse to believe you don't see other peoples side of this. People dont WANT to have to attach a fucking adapter for something like this. They havent had to before, and the 'replacement' tech isnt even as good as the Aux cable any damn way.

Theres absolutely no way you cant see this from other peoples point of view. I dont think you are being honest here.

I don't know what to tell you, then. This isn't a bulky dongle, it's basically just a short cable extender. I already carry small items like keys, USB sticks and SD cards and don't lose them. I don't see this as being very different.

I know there are people that will take issue. I just think overall there's a lot of faux outrage over hypothetical situations and/or that's being blown way out of proportion.

Time will tell, I suppose.

 

[riotous]

The issue for me is I both switch between my phone and laptop a lot, and also switch between headsets at different locations. I specifically leave a headset at work, at home in my office where I sometimes work, and at home in my living room where I sometimes work, and in my backpack for when I'm on the road. I do this out of the experience of it being not that hard to forget to put my headset in my backpack, or being in a room without a headset and having to awkwardly fumble with my phone as I take a call.

And while that sounds minor, it isn't. I might be somewhere I can't use speakerphone but might need to be on the phone for up to 2 hours straight. And I often need to be on my laptop while I'm on a call, as it's often a skype or other online meeting where I'm showing some code or something.

Throw adapters in the mix and it just gets that much more likely that at some point i'd be stuck in a situation where I didn't have an adapter on me. Not that I'd outright "lose" them, but I might leave one somewhere... in my car, in another room, burried at the bottom of my backpack,etc.

I tried using BT headsets for a long time and they ended up being too finicky and prone to batteries dying in the middle of calls, etc.

I'm NOT outraged over the decision; but it's definitely making me question leaving the iphone behind as my primary phone. And I'm lucky in that I haven't bought into Apple's proprietary ecosystems too much; someone in my shoes who uses an MBP daily and uses notes and other sync'd features between their iPhone, has bought a lot of music or video on iTunes, etc. might be that much more annoyed.

 

[faceless007]

Actually I did. I said I have never had cable issues with Apple in terms of durability, but acknowledged I might be an outlier.

You've never used a lightning cable with the frequency and strenuousness that people are going to be subjecting this adapter to, so your personal lack of historical problems isn't much to go on. Apple's own checkered history of cable construction, however, is already evident and visible just by looking at the reviews on their own site.

Also I don't think many people call support when they lose an accessory or need to complain about buying one, so not sure how that applies.

Jesus the point was imagine a company representative suggesting that as a solution. Or imagine one of the Apple execs saying it at the conference yesterday. Or imagine one of them saying it to a reporter when asked the question. My point was that that suggestion when coming from a corporation should immediately provoke an instinctual reaction of disgust and frustration to any rational consumer and if you don't share that reaction you should recalibrate the extent to which you consider yourself a rationally self-interested consumer.

Inconvenience is subjective.

Even in your best-case scenario, with a dongle I now have two portable thingies to worry about losing/finding/replacing/breaking/connecting/storing/managing whereas I previously just had one. That's objectively less convenient.

 

[Marty Chinn]

So your son and daughter plug headphones into your phone to listen to music? That seems like a stretch, and that you're purposely missing the general point.

My son and daughter will use my phone to watch Netflix or other videos. Why is it a stretch to think that kids use parents phones? How is it missing the point when they would plug their headphones into it to use and now suddenly need a dongle to be compatible?

 

[DOWN]

So that's only $18 per person, which I agree isn't unreasonable. That was my whole point. The majority of people will probably not need another adapter at all,
or at most 1 extra.

Are you planning on buying flagship smartphones for all 4 of you?



Now this I agree entirely with. If they'd used this opportunity to use USB-C instead of Lightning that would've been awesome.

USB C is fatter than lightning so not really an option

 

[Jeffrey]

The issues is that even with adapters, everything ends up being more of a hassle than before in terms of 'steps' needed to replicate your old routine.

And its not like the new iphone has some specific tech that solves all the previous problems, or really any unique tech that makes audio listening 'easier' compare to say an iphone 6S.

Really is the first iphone with a 'trade-off'. Better specs and camera water resistance etc, BUT no headphone jack. It's not a pure net gain compare to the previous years.

 

[samn]

Expect most adaptors to break within a couple of weeks of use.




I'm not letting go of my headphone jack. I commute a lot and I don't want to worry about batteries (both phone and headphones) being needlessly drained.I just hope the Pixel line of phones keep the jack there.

bluetooth audio barely drains battery anymore than a headphone jack does

 

[mrkgoo]

Now we are back to "Where did I leave that thing".

I refuse to believe you don't see other peoples side of this. People dont WANT to have to attach a fucking adapter for something like this. They havent had to before, and the 'replacement' tech isnt even as good as the Aux cable any damn way.

Theres absolutely no way you cant see this from other peoples point of view. I dont think you are being honest here.

Then don't get the adaptor.

The thing is this - ther jack is gone and it creates an inconvenience. Yes the question is why, but at a certain point that becomes moot because for the iPhone 7, it is done.

So moving on from there, IF you were going to get a 7, you have to make some kind of workaround to get the setup you want. The solutions may all be kind of crappy or inconvenient but we all make these kinds of decisions all the time. Every user has to prioritise whatever part of the equation is most important to them, be it carrying an adaptor, changing ecosystems, using wireless, using lightning incorporated headphones.

If ALL situations are insurmountable issues - "there's no way I can move away from iPhone, AND I'm NOT carrying an adaptor or I want to charge and listen at the same time and other singles and socks don't cut it, AND wireless sucks or is too expensive, AND I want to use my own headphones that don't come in lightning" - then, well, I dunno, I guess it's end of the road for you, your smartphone journey has ended here.

Seriously, the issues are real and can be inconveniences, how much of an inconvenience can be entirely up to the individual. Everyone likes to complain and act as if all solutions are not possible. But fact of the matter is you will have to choose something. I agree it's the having to choose that bugs people, but it shouldn't be the first nor last time you're going to have to make a compromise to use something the way you want.

Am I an apologising fanboy? Perhaps. But at least I'm going to be content.






(I don't even know if I'm getting an iPhone 7)

 

[YuriLowell]

They did it so they can get an extra license fee for every device made.

 

[Deleted member 12837]

edit: mrkgoo summed up my thoughts well above

My son and daughter will use my phone to watch Netflix or other videos. Why is it a stretch to think that kids use parents phones? How is it missing the point when they would plug their headphones into it to use and now suddenly need a dongle to be compatible?

You can't just let them borrow the adapter attached to your headphones that aren't in use (since they're using your phone)?

Jesus the point was imagine a company representative suggesting that as a solution. Or imagine one of the Apple execs saying it at the conference yesterday. Or imagine one of them saying it to a reporter when asked the question. My point was that that suggestion when coming from a corporation should immediately provoke an instinctual reaction of disgust and frustration to any rational consumer and if you don't share that reaction you should recalibrate the extent to which you consider yourself a rationally self-interested consumer.

I think I'd have other things to worry about if a consumer company's comments concerning an accessory provoked disgust, TBH.

All sorts of devices require or encourage the use of tiny items that could be lost. There's nothing special about the adapter. I wouldn't expect there to be any serious questions either asked or answered concerning that specific point.

 

[Wowfunhappy]

That's the biggest problem. If the headphone jack gets replaced it needs to be by something that's a new universal standard and offers a clear improvement.

Exactly, and I'll add that said "clear improvement" could be something as simple as "takes up less space inside the phone, so we could add a bigger battery/camera/etc" What matters is that it's universal, or at least has the potential of becoming universal in the near future, so we aren't stuck in some incompatible limbo forever.

As is, we're stuck with a port that is only used on three product lines in the world: the iPhone, the iPad, and the iPod Touch. Want to plug your new lightning headphones into your laptop? Too bad.

Apple may well have had a number of different reasons for removing the headphone jack, but if a side effect of doing so just happens to be that everyone is further locked into Apple's ecosystem? I'm sure they know what they're doing.

 

[cbox]

It's already dongle hell in the mac laptop world, so this is really no different. They sure want to embrace wireless but refuse to include wireless charging, odd.

 

[Marty Chinn]

edit: mrkgoo summed up my thoughts well above



You can't just let them borrow the adapter attached to your headphones that aren't in use (since they're using your phone)?

Well, which is it? Do I leave adapters attached to all devices so I'm not in a situation where I might want to plug something in and not have the adapter or do I move my adapter around and get in the scenario where I might not have the adapter handy or it gets misplaced? You can't have it both ways. Or is your suggestion an option number three where I just leave the dongle hanging off my phone 24/7?

edit: mrkgoo summed up my thoughts well above

There's a big difference though; mrkgoo admits it's an issue, problem and inconvenience; you on the otherhand dismissed it as such. That's the rub.

 

[Deleted member 12837]

Well, which is it? Do I leave adapters attached to all devices so I'm not in a situation where I might want to plug something in and not have the adapter or do I move my adapter around and get in the scenario where I might not have the adapter handy or it gets misplaced? You can't have it both ways. Or is your suggestion an option number three where I just leave the dongle hanging off my phone 24/7?



There's a big difference though; mrkgoo admits it's an issue, problem and inconvenience; you on the otherhand dismissed it as such. That's the rub.

Depends on your situation, headphone:device ratio, etc.

And I'm not dismissing it entirely. I said I think people are vastly overreacting.

 

[Marty Chinn]

Depends on your situation, headphone:device ratio, etc.

The thing though is either situation comes with problems and both situations end up being worse than what people had before. There isn't a solution that is as good as what we had before.

 

[maxiell]

I understand this is a major inconvenience for some people. In which case, why would they bother with the 7? Wouldn't they just stick to their 6s or upgrade to a 6s?

Outside of a waterproofing and a faster processor what would possibly make the 7 a must buy?

 

[Marty Chinn]

I understand this is a major inconvenience for some people. In which case, why would they bother with the 7? Wouldn't they just stick to their 6s or upgrade to a 6s?

Outside of a waterproofing and a faster processor what would possibly make the 7 a must buy?

Even if someone isn't in the market for an iPhone 7, you can bet that this is going to be applied to everything moving forward and people will at some point need to upgrade with a device that won't have it.

 

[Deleted member 12837]

The thing though is either situation comes with problems and both situations end up being worse than what people had before. There isn't a solution that is as good as what we had before.

But not everyone is going to find those same things to be problematic. Just different from the way things were. Some people are going to be very inconvenienced, and they just won't buy the phone. Others won't mind at all. Like every other controversial tech change decision.

Is the lack of a headphone port objectively worse for someone who doesn't use their phone for music or media at all?

 

[Rand0m TAG]

lets play this backwards,
what if apple decided to bring back the headphone jack for their next phone but decide to remove the bluetooth receiver to compensate. would people with airbuds and bluetooth headphones be cool with it?

 

[Rand0m TAG]

But not everyone is going to find those same things to be problematic. Just different from the way things were. Some people are going to be very inconvenienced, and they just won't buy the phone. Others won't mind at all. Like every other controversial tech change decision.

Is the lack of a headphone port objectively worse for someone who doesn't use their phone for music or media at all?

so remove all ports, speakers, cameras and make it so you need to purchase additional items to use those features

 

[emag]

I understand this is a major inconvenience for some people. In which case, why would they bother with the 7? Wouldn't they just stick to their 6s or upgrade to a 6s?

Outside of a waterproofing and a faster processor what would possibly make the 7 a must buy?

The camera.

It's already dongle hell in the mac laptop world, so this is really no different. They sure want to embrace wireless but refuse to include wireless charging, odd.

Current wireless charging technology is trash. Apple's researching (see published patents/patent applications) longer-range wireless charging technologies that do not require direct contact or flat placement. Perhaps we'll see something along those lines in next year's product.

 

[EatinOlives]

Inconvenience is subjective.

These are luxury devices. Literally anything other than SMS and making calls is technically a bell/whistle for a mobile phone.

That doesn't mean that one can handwave any and all complaints when things are made inconvenient. It may not be inconvenient to you, but it is inconvenient to others. And these are multi-hundred dollar mobile devices specifically designed to make things as convenient as possible.

It's OK to acknowledge when the manufacturer of a phone screws something up and makes something more inconvenient for a chunk of its customers. You won't lose anything by acknowledging that Apple simply doesn't have an answer to people who want to keep doing what they're doing without having to keep track of and/or buy new adapters.

 

[Deleted member 12837]

so remove all ports, speakers, cameras and make it so you need to purchase additional items to use those features

I wouldn't care if they removed the speakers. I wouldn't buy the phone at all without a camera, because that's personally a criteria of mine. Not sure what you're point here is?

 

[excelsiorlef]

They literally have everything to lose. Nobody is forced to buy any of their products, and judging by the uproar, they've lost a decent number of customers over this decision. If they piss enough people off, it could cost them massively.

As for innovation, that comes more from what's taking the place of that jack inside the phone. We don't 100% know what it is yet or what they have planned, so it's far too early to declare that it's "not innovative."

I tend to believe the people who actually build the thing when they say they needed the room for other things. Not because I believe everything a company tells me, but because I'm not the one building the damn thing. No amount of stamping my feet and shouting until I piss my pants is going to give me foresight and knowledge into Apple's plans for that space, so I'll wait and see.

And in the meantime, if I dislike what they're doing, I'll go elsewhere. I've done it in gaming with Nintendo, Microsoft, and am damn close with Sony. I've done it with phones with Samsung and Google. And if I feel the need, I'll drop Apple too. No company gains customers by keeping them unhappy. To pretend people are just "locked" into an ecosystem is just silly when so many other options exist for phones and for the transfer of content from one ecosystem to another.

Fortunately, this headphone jack removal has zero effect on me. And that makes it a good thing.

No it won't because it's still the only futute source of the Apple ecosystem. There is no rival Apple based phone with headphone jack to run to. Some people might go Android but most have iPhones because of the ecosystem, iTunes, the apps, etc... Like I said they can do pretty much what they want because there's only one iPhone.