CDPR: Switch 2 way better memory/performance situation for the devs than they had for PS4/Xbox One

Tams said:
That you can throw in a bag and play on the bus/train/plane, etc.
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Ive owned the switch since release and never even used it out and about despite using it as one reason to buy it mainly due to build quality doesn't feel sturdy, the OLED i have now is a great little console but is only used if i have no access to my pc or xbox/ps5 or if i just want to play Mario kart.

I still feel the switch 2 is level with the OG xbox one and ps4.
 
I mean it's on par with a console from a decade ago with the help of DLSS, refined tech and new graphical technology
It's good, but let's not get carried away here.
 
I could've predicted that.

Switch 2 performance-wise is exactly where it needed to be. They didn't "pull a Nintendo" this time around in the same way that they usually do. I think the Switch 1's success gave them the chutzpah they needed to at least attempt a proper generational leap this time around, tech wise.

The "pull a Nintendo" version of Switch 2 that would have been predictable would look more like:
  • 60fps, non-HDR, non-VRR LCD with an inch wide bezel.
  • No fan in the dock and 10w power budget when docked.
  • 8GB of RAM at about half the bandwidth of what it ended up with.
  • No tensor cores on the custom SoC to shave pennies off the dollar in fab.
  • 16nm node because of some stupid contractual thing they worked out years ago to again shave pennies off the dollar (and to be fair, it's still not clear if we're at 8nm or 5nm, so they might have Nintendo'd us all into an 8nm compromise yet)
 
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winjer said:
What clocks does it get to?

But still, with RDNA2 having a 40+ IPC advantage, it would still mean the Deck is faster than the PS4.

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Well, this Cyberpunk video seems to show the unlocked GPU clock hovering between 1200 MHz-1400 MHz in regular Cyberpunk and around 1200 MHz in Dogtown. You can lock it directly to 1600 MHz but that affects frame times in CPU limited sections, and the YouTuber recommends a lock to 1200 MHz as the best balance. Of course, the PS4 doesn't run PL and has a way worse CPU anyway, so in that sense the Steam Deck is better.



This Spider-Man 2 video seems to show the GPU clock hovering around 1450 MHz in the traversal sections, and closer to 1600 MHz in the cutscenes.



So in that case it should be slightly faster than the PS4, not accounting for memory bandwidth, console vs. PC w/translation layer etc. In practice, Playstation 4 ports run at similar settings at a lower resolution, so the end user is not getting PS4 class performance.
 
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FireFly said:
Well, this Cyberpunk video seems to show the unlocked GPU clock hovering between 1200 MHz-1400 MHz in regular Cyberpunk and around 1200 MHz in Dogtown. You can lock it directly to 1600 MHz but that affects frame times in CPU limited sections, and the YouTuber recommends a lock to 1200 MHz as the best balance. Of course, the PS4 doesn't run PL and has a way worse CPU anyway, so in that sense the Steam Deck is better.



This Spider-Man 2 video seems to show the GPU clock hovering around 1450 MHz in the traversal sections, and closer to 1600 MHz in the cutscenes.



So in that case it should be slightly faster than the PS4, not accounting for memory bandwidth, console vs. PC w/translation layer etc. In practice, Playstation 4 ports run at similar settings at a lower resolution, so the end user is not getting PS4 class performance.
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yup, this is why it's hard to compare the Deck to the PS4.
if you play a game that needs little to no CPU clocks to run fine, you can get to PS4 like GPU performance.
if you run a very CPU heavy title you suddenly drop below Xbox One GPU performance.

1.2ghz = 1.2 TFLOPS as due to the amount of CUs the Deck has the ghz number can almost 1 for 1 be translated into TFLOPS... makes gauging performance easy 😅
 
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The people saying that it's impressive that the switch 2 is more powerful than a ps4 because it's portable will be the same people who rarely if ever use the switch 2 in portable mode or take it out in public because it's inconvenient compared to a smartphone.
 
Celine said:
Yes, in 2025 Switch 2 with a power budget of 9.8W is outperforming the PS4 released in 2013 that had a power budget of 137.3W.

By the way do you remember the PlayStation guys proudly touting "We believe in generations" during the introduction of the PS5?
Well, it was bullshit: we ended up experiecing the longest cross gen phase until now.
The reason is that the economic forces in place these days push for a total multiplatform strategy and the development of highly scalable games to try to cater to the widest addressable consumer base.
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People still don't understand what this quote really meant, I see. :(
 
Like i said in another thread it's like comparing ps vita to
ps2/gamecube. Switch is pretty weak but compared to og Switch it will look good i just wish I could get a 10-15 Tflop Nintendo home console.
 
Xdrive05 said:
I could've predicted that.

Switch 2 performance-wise is exactly where it needed to be. They didn't "pull a Nintendo" this time around in the same way that they usually do. I think the Switch 1's success gave them the chutzpah they needed to at least attempt a proper generational leap this time around, tech wise.

The "pull a Nintendo" version of Switch 2 that would have been predictable would look more like:
  • 60fps, non-HDR, non-VRR LCD with an inch wide bezel.
  • No fan in the dock and 10w power budget when docked.
  • 8GB of RAM at about half the bandwidth of what it ended up with.
  • No tensor cores on the custom SoC to shave pennies off the dollar in fab.
  • 16nm node because of some stupid contractual thing they worked out years ago to again shave pennies off the dollar (and to be fair, it's still not clear if we're at 8nm or 5nm, so they might have Nintendo'd us all into an 8nm compromise yet)
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It's been 8 years. WE were always going to get a big leap for a Switch 2.

They always weigh cost vs benefit.
The S2 screen specs are likely just more standard now. ie cheap.
Faster ram is something Nintendo has done many times before. GC had RAM than the competition.
FAn in dock is cheap and probably deemed a necessity. Maybe minor issues with the Switch in the dock.
And it's same with the SoC and the node...it's going to be cost vs benefit vs availability.
 
Sebastian1295 said:
The people saying that it's impressive that the switch 2 is more powerful than a ps4 because it's portable will be the same people who rarely if ever use the switch 2 in portable mode or take it out in public because it's inconvenient compared to a smartphone.
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Huh? I feel like you've built a fictional person out of nothing here.

I know I find it impressive that the Switch 2 is a portable PS4+ and I will almost certainly use mine in handheld mode at least 50% of the time. I use my Switch as a handheld probably close to 80% (or even 90%) of the time now, but I will probably use the S2 docked more often since I will want to test out TV performance and play around with the joy-con mouse functionality.

That said, one of the Switch 2's biggest selling points is the new HDR/VRR screen, so I would imagine that the vast majority of those who buy one are going to spend a fair amount of time using it as a handheld.
 
blacktout said:
Huh? I feel like you've built a fictional person out of nothing here.

I know I find it impressive that the Switch 2 is a portable PS4+ and I will almost certainly use mine in handheld mode at least 50% of the time. I use my Switch as a handheld probably close to 80% (or even 90%) of the time now, but I will probably use the S2 docked more often since I will want to test out TV performance and play around with the joy-con mouse functionality.

That said, one of the Switch 2's biggest selling points is the new HDR/VRR screen, so I would imagine that the vast majority of those who buy one are going to spend a fair amount of time using it as a handheld.
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I've seen almost 0 people in public using an original switch since it launched and i doubt i'll see people with a switch 2 in public when it launches. It's inconvenient to carry a giant ass tablet with you and need a carrying case as well when you can just carry a smartphone. The rise of smartphones have killed the portable aspect of the switch and switch 2 because of form factor, features, convenience etc. The people who claim to use the switch in portable mode most likely use it at home, but if you have a giant ass TV then i don't see a reason to use it in portable mode at home either. Outside of maybe using the switch 2 while flying 'very rare circumstance for a majority of people' i don't see a point to the portability of it.
 
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Sebastian1295 said:
The people saying that it's impressive that the switch 2 is more powerful than a ps4 because it's portable will be the same people who rarely if ever use the switch 2 in portable mode or take it out in public because it's inconvenient compared to a smartphone.
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use portimble modes in my place cus its waaaay more fun annnnd relaxing

giphy.gif
 
Those Nintendo only fans who can now proclaim Switch 2 competes with 14/15y old HW can really stand on their HW perch. You're in the high end boys. Relish in the 2011 glory!
 
Sebastian1295 said:
I've seen almost 0 people in public using an original switch since it launched and i doubt i'll see people with a switch 2 in public when it launches. It's inconvenient to carry a giant ass tablet with you and need a carrying case as well when you can just carry a smartphone. The rise of smartphones have killed the portable aspect of the switch and switch 2 because of form factor, features, convenience etc. The people who claim to use the switch in portable mode most likely use it at home, but if you have a giant ass TV then i don't see a reason to use it in portable mode at home either. Outside of maybe using the switch 2 while flying 'very rare circumstance for a majority of people' i don't see a point to the portability of it.
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I agree that the early days of Switch 1 novelty where people would bring it out to bars and shit are long over, but I also think most handheld use cases aren't "in public." I certainly have used my Switch when traveling or visiting friends or family, but mostly I just enjoy the convenience of not having to be tethered to a TV when gaming or of being able to play a grindy JRPG or brain-off timesink (like Vampire Survivors or Tetris) with YouTube on in the background. Hell, there are plenty of times when I've used it in the backyard or on the patio because it was a nice day and I wanted to be outside.


Sebastian1295 said:
My dad uses portable mode too on his couch because he says it's easier to read stuff when the screen is by his face and he enjoys it. I guess my posts were slightly hyperbolic lol.
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I hate to admit this because it shows my age, but I do the same thing. My eyesight has always been bad and I have an old injury to my left eye that has been deteriorating in recent years and makes reading text or focusing on small details on a TV screen from a distance difficult or even painful. So it's just a lot more comfortable to play with my glasses off and the screen a few inches from my face, lol.
 
I play handheld on my couch quite a bit. I tend to do that while letting the TV play something that doesn't demand much of my attention (revisiting a movie I've already seen, Youtube, spotify, etc).
 
We had a few topics about the switch 2 specs in the previous months/year... there were people expecting less, there were also a lot of people expecting more specially in docked mode ... so, lets not pretend that a lot of fans were just expecting to pay 499 for a ps4+ and are super happy. We have some heavy cope running around too.
 
The fact that there is a performance mode is already impressive in itself.
With that being said, Witcher 3 on switch improved greatly after launch, so I'll probably wait a few months before play Cyberpunk as similar improvements will surely come.
 
The associate game director mentions that the switch2 port has been a 'FUCKTONE' of work. Here's to hoping other third parties are up for the challenge..

jsd57Hi.jpeg
 
Wonder if streets will have the same quantity of NPCs , And how draw distance and other performance factors behave on SW2.
 
Bitstream said:
The associate game director mentions that the switch2 port has been a 'FUCKTONE' of work. Here's to hoping other third parties are up for the challenge..

jsd57Hi.jpeg
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That's due the short period of time that they have to work in the port 🙄… also you can read that they are pretty pleased with the outcome and the Switch power… It's not a bad thing at all.
 
Boy bawang said:
The fact that there is a performance mode is already impressive in itself.
With that being said, Witcher 3 on switch improved greatly after launch, so I'll probably wait a few months before play Cyberpunk as similar improvements will surely come.
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the Witcher 3 improved due to the fact that people found a way to get into the game's graphics settings and just change settings to make it look better.

it was one of many examples where the devs made really stupid choices that made the game look and run worse for no good reason.
thankfully in this case there was empirical proof for that die to that settings menu being found. so the devs had to react to this and offer an update to use these settings without glitching into the settings

it's one of the reasons why I am an advocate to normalise graphics settings menus on console. hide them behind cheat codes so that the casuals don't see them, but please let me fix your stupid settings choices!
 
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REDRZA MWS said:
Sad we are praising memory performance over 13 year old consoles.
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Because of how many have been moving the goal post:
- Less powerful than PS4 -> Console is more powerful, around Pro ballpark
- LOL not even close to PS4 Pro -> Console is around this but with current gen features. Run current gen versions of the games and even stuff the Pro can't
- LOL it needs DLSS to the same than PS4 -> Literally running current gen versions of games at way better performance, loading times, etc. And stuff it can't run
- LOL of course it's more powerful than a 2013 console -> Well, no shit, it's a current gen console, we've been saying it since Nvidia leaks

And now also:

- Ok but memory bandwidth is gonna make games run worse than even on PS4 -> Memory bandwidth not only is more than good enough for console requirements but also has SSD, Nvidia compression, etc. to not require as much access to it

That's basically the goal post moving roadmap when trying to compare it to PS4 so far, I wonder what's next?
 
Xdrive05 said:
I could've predicted that.

Switch 2 performance-wise is exactly where it needed to be. They didn't "pull a Nintendo" this time around in the same way that they usually do. I think the Switch 1's success gave them the chutzpah they needed to at least attempt a proper generational leap this time around, tech wise.

The "pull a Nintendo" version of Switch 2 that would have been predictable would look more like:
  • 60fps, non-HDR, non-VRR LCD with an inch wide bezel.
  • No fan in the dock and 10w power budget when docked.
  • 8GB of RAM at about half the bandwidth of what it ended up with.
  • No tensor cores on the custom SoC to shave pennies off the dollar in fab.
  • 16nm node because of some stupid contractual thing they worked out years ago to again shave pennies off the dollar (and to be fair, it's still not clear if we're at 8nm or 5nm, so they might have Nintendo'd us all into an 8nm compromise yet)
Click to expand...

Yeah pretty much. When I read the rumours about the 120hz screen, the 12Gb of RAM and 256Gb of storage, I was like "yeah, right". If Nintendo put 4Gb of memory only because Capcom asked them that below that it wouldn't be running the RE engine said enough. At least back then. I guess since 2015, people in charge have changed a bit and they embraced more technology.
 
LordOcidax said:
That's due the short period of time that they have to work in the port 🙄… also you can read that they are pretty pleased with the outcome and the Switch power… It's not a bad thing at all.
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There's actually no inclination of how long they've had to work on the port. Previous rumors of them only working in the port for 7 weeks have been debunked, and it was clarified that the build that was playable at the nintendo event was itself finished 7 weeks prior to the event, meaning an additional 7 weeks of work was done since that build.
 
Bitstream said:
There's actually no inclination of how long they've had to work on the port. Previous rumors of them only working in the port for 7 weeks have been debunked, and it was clarified that the build that was playable at the nintendo event was itself finished 7 weeks prior to the event, meaning an additional 7 weeks of work was done since that build.
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Debunked by who? DF 🤣🤣🤣 So convenient…
kXvmt57.gif
 
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LordOcidax said:
Debunked by who? DF 🤣🤣🤣 So convenient…
kXvmt57.gif
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There's a thin line between being optimistic and blindly believing in things that don't make any sense. I'm not sure how much software development you do, but if you think 7 weeks is enough for a code re-write of this magnitude, I have a bridge I'd love to sell you.
 
Bitstream said:
There's a thin line between being optimistic and blindly believing in things that don't make any sense. I'm not sure how much software development you do, but if you think 7 weeks is enough for a code re-write of this magnitude, I have a bridge I'd love to sell you.
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Tell that to CDPR representatives…not me.
 
Codeblew said:
Please tell me you don't expect many, if any 120fps games on NS2.
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There are already 120 fps games confirmed... It's gonna depend on game hardware budget of course, just like there's barely any game running at 120 fps on PS5/XSX. So far these are confirmed afaik:
- MKW
- Fortnite
- MP4
- Fast Fusion
 
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