Seriously why isn't Donna removed yet? I guess Hillary doesn't want to make yet another negative headline with this little time left. If she doesn't get removed before election day, I expect her gone immediately after Hillary secures victory.
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CNN severs ties w/ DNC chair Brazile for sharing Dem primary debate q's with Clinton
- Thread starter Yamauchi
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Seriously why isn't Donna removed yet? I guess Hillary doesn't want to make yet another negative headline with this little time left. If she doesn't get removed before election day, I expect her gone immediately after Hillary secures victory.
Sanders understands the only way to have a voice in politics, to actually be heard is to run under the banner of one of the two major parties, and he wasn't going to be running under the GOP.
Also, I think as a candidate you have to take responsibility for your campaign. There is no disclosure or answer for cheating. I don't need to see a video tape of Clinton asking for Donna to steal questions or information for her. That may be the standard for some people. My opinion is that having a difficult question or questions ahead of time was something that could benefit her, and her people were able to get that information for her.
EDIT: I would also add, no one expected these emails to be consumed by the public. There's no way they would have expected to actually face any consequences from the public or the party for doing this. I would imagine this is something that is done without much thought or remorse.
I can see that poster's point.
I wouldn't consider someone who beat his mother because he couldn't watch South Park and later siphoned e-begged funds for said mother's health for drugs as somebody worthy of respect, much less someone who continuously considers themself a moral arbiter.
But to each their own.
Hari Seldon
Member
This is seriously the worst two candidates in the history of modern politics.
TestOfTide
Banned
Probably something planned for AFTER the election.
There's a really cool Slate article you should read about this.
Much like Trump and his grotesque supporters, you have a framework yet lie about all the details. You guys really should try harder. Like did you think this was going to cause me to get upset lol.
I miss the days when the people i was debating with tried.
This made me laugh my ass off. Mostly because you're taking a freenudemacusers post and avatar seriously.
No a cat just likes playing with yarn sometimes.
Obviously (for your last part).
But as was already pointed out many times, the discourse is also singularly one sided due to only one candidate having had troves of private documents outted to the public for review.
What kind of private embarrassing stuff would we now be sifting through if Sander's emails had been revealed?
Let alone Trump, which would probably amount to a giant bag of smelly garbage.
But the fact is that it's completely one sided, and apparently thanks to a foreign power trying to influence our election.
Ziltoidia 9
Member
I was and still am a huge Bernie supporter. This episode or the other question she leaked didn't cause him to lose, but when I look at everything from the DNC leaks to these new leaks, the outrage is more about everything as a whole, not just one individual instance. Fact is she shouldn't be giving questions to a candidate's campaign before a debate. It being a primary is diffrent then a GE. Those debates are more party ran. If it happened in a GE, it would be a much much bigger deal.
Oh, and if someone at Fox had been/was discovered to have been giving Rubio or Bush questions in advance, it would probably get less defense around here.
All in all, primary is long over, but we should still try our best to make the next primary fairer.
Oh, and if someone at Fox had been/was discovered to have been giving Rubio or Bush questions in advance, it would probably get less defense around here.
All in all, primary is long over, but we should still try our best to make the next primary fairer.
Another unsubstantiated "both sides" argument. I should go into Bridge selling because I'd make a fucking killing selling to posters like you.
I'm voting for Hillary because I know she is the most qualified candidates and absolutely destroyed everyone who debated her.
Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
It's when you have a preconceived notion in your brain, and then all of a sudden get evidence that maybe it's not what you thought. But, instead of altering your preconceived notion, you instead rationalize the evidence and spin it so that your worldview stays unchanged, despite the evidence. There's people in this thread saying how it wasn't a big deal or it's not technically cheating or she didn't need help anyway. Justifications. Rationalizations. i.e. cognitive dissonance.
I don't know why you think I want this thread closed, I didn't say anything to that effect. I also didn't say anything as harshly as "shut up", either. All I'm saying is, the cover up is worse than the crime, and the more we hem and haw about how bad this is the worse it looks. I'm not sure why you seem so annoyed by my comment.
I don't know, with her being so brazen with her latest tweet, I doubt seriously she is worried. Maybe they'll have some serious discussions now though.
shoplifter
Member
And yet my tax dollars pay for primaries here in Ohio
Ziltoidia 9
Member
How is that a "both sides" argument? hes saying both candidates are just flawed, he isn/'t talk about the general stances of the two parties.
I didn't know public funds went towards the primaries, if so then CNN and the DNC should definitely be called out on or stop accepting public funds during primaries.
When they are going with personal attacks, they already lost, especially when it violates the TOS and they know it.
It is true. I do hope Hillary doesn't try to let the story ride and fails to punish Donna. I don't think it's the end of the world (albeit goddamn dumb), but I think the sheer incompetence of the move proves she has no business being head of the DNC. Then to double down on it...yikes. Just no sense of the political mood at all. Bad for business.
Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
Kasich and Rubio don't have the anti-establishment cred that would push them over the top in key states. This is key here. This is what Bernie tapped into and this is what Trump is tapping into. Just my observation.
Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
Slate is a fine source, IMO.
Jesus, that tweet. Donna showing that she clearly doesn't have any reflection for these events. She needs to go after this election ends (if not before).
I mean, you clearly went for the ad hominem, but do you actually have a rebuttal to his argument?
Dude Abides
Banned
Saying "Yes what she did was improper but it's not a big deal because it did not affect the outcome" is actually not self-contradictory. What preconceived notion do you think people had? That Donna Brazile is infallible?
You told "guys" to "move on." Now you're saying we shouldn't "hem and haw" about it. If you didn't mean that posters should stop expressing opinions on this topic that you don't agree with, what did you mean? And what cover up? The worse it looks to who? What is the actual concern here?
Hari Seldon
Member
When the best thing that either side can do is shut the fuck up and not say a god damn thing between now and the election, you know that the candidates are flawed. As for Hilary, it is completely anecdotal but Neogaf.com is literally the only place virtual or in real life that I have seen anyone enthusiastically support her. Obama stickers and signs outnumbered Hilary signs about 984391:1*.
* source: my ass
TestOfTide
Banned
Except he was responding to someone who literally said that Trump and Hillary are the worst two presidential candidates ever.
Of course Hillary has her flaws, but anyone that claims she is, at best, the second worst POTUS candidate ever is definitely doing the "both sides" bullshit.
Thanks for showing you haven't paid attention to Hillary's speeches or even the 3 General POTUS debates.
Hillary doesn't do best when she is quiet. She does best when she gets the opportunity to explain her detailed policy plans on how to actually fix problems.
My point was what I posted.
That if someone thinks they can still respect someone (ex: family/close friend) they can choose to do so. Morality is relative, if some internet poster deems their family OK to associate with, it doesn't matter what Amir0x says.
It might be absurd to us, but if some persons parent or cousin voted Trump purely for religion or whatever that we shouldn't force people to shun them. It's their decision.
BTW, not a Trump supporter in any respect.
CyclopsRock
Member
He just sounds exactly like people on speed do. Every post has a snarky one liner at the bottom like he's auditioning for an Aaron Sorkin show. And I basically agree with him! He just sounds manic.
Hellwarden
Member
The funny thing about this is, Clinton could have answered that question in her sleep.
It's not like it's a curveball or anything.
It's not like it's a curveball or anything.
Seriously. Makes you wonder why Brazile would even bother.
They can choose to. I do not have to choose to respect them, however. That is a distinction of import. Actually where did I even say they shouldn't deem it OK to associate with their family? You are reading in between some deep ass lines lol
I do not and will not respect Trump supporters, because he has demonstrated enough vile, reprehensible shit that there is no excuse except intentional ignorance or racism, misogyny, bigotry or xenophobia. Just like you can choose not to respect me because of mistakes I've made in the past (albeit comically distorted beyond recognition of the reality) and I don't begrudge you that one bit. I made my bed. I don't get to say it's unfair how the narrative got out of control or people are being mean to me. I fucked up and this is the result. I take responsibility. So must Trump supporters. Now they get to lie in it and be judged for it, just like I am.
Seriously??
To me more than anything that is what pisses me off. Like goddamn Donna, really? You went to bat for that shit? You are going to Michigan, where Flint was a national story for weeks. Because of lead poisoning and water pollution. Like, that wasn't going to come up? It's the only big story about Michigan I can even remember this year lol
My respect for Donna.
Yeah, me too, really disappointed.
freenudemacusers
Member
some of the more recent ones with more measured content to them. some of the ones a decade ago are definitely rough, but people change and grow. same with other artists and their attacks against women and super predators.
Isaac Otherworld
Member
Dude, Hillary has had years to prepare and she still can't give a decent answer on her uncomfortably close ties with Wallstreet.
Word. Remember ya'll, Hillary couldn't even answer whether or not she lied to the American public without goofing it up: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y0H1AosZdv0
Oh. No. Not. Ties. To. Wall. Street.
Like do people think everybody and every company on Wall Street is comically villanous? A gargantuan portion of the worlds finances go through Wall Street. Almost anyone with decent wealth has some connection. Yet there are good people with wealth (Warren Buffet, say) and bad and everything in between. Is there any evidence any of her dealings with Wall Street are sinister? Cause we seen her speeches, they were pathetically innocuous.
Like do people think everybody and every company on Wall Street is comically villanous? A gargantuan portion of the worlds finances go through Wall Street. Almost anyone with decent wealth has some connection. Yet there are good people with wealth (Warren Buffet, say) and bad and everything in between. Is there any evidence any of her dealings with Wall Street are sinister? Cause we seen her speeches, they were pathetically innocuous.
diablos991
Can’t stump the diablos
Is that your public position or your private position?
TestOfTide
Banned
Probably because the far left won't like an honest answer of "Yeah I try to court business types. I'm not some dumbass that tries to minimize how many people will vote for me by only supporting those that are perfectly aligned with my party on every single issue. If you want Democrats to be able to actually get done then stop it with this party purity bullshit."
I absolutely wish she could give that answer, but unfortunately the far left seems to not get how politics work and would feel "betrayed" by the idea that Hillary gets shit done by appealing to more than just liberals and progressives.
Let's call it what it is: a combination of party purity bullshit and obsession with having an "establishment" to be opposed to.
Yeah Wallstreet has done some fucked up things. But you don't win as many seats as possible by sticking to everyone who doesn't 100% align with your base. Business Type conservatives and Moderate Conservatives have the potential to become part of the democratic Big Tent for a generation. You don't respond to such an opportunity by going "well you don't align with me on everything, so fuck off".
If you think it is a bad idea for someone to have private opinions that differ from public opinions then politics is not your forte.
I can guarantee you that there were a SHITLOAD of democratic politicians running for office in 2008 that were privately for Gay Marriage but wouldn't come out in favor of it until AFTER the Defense of Marriage Act got struck down.
You know why? Because Gay Marriage being a key issue in 2004 caused an uptick in Christian conservative turnout. Many of those Democrats who won congressional seats in 2008 could have easily lost if they had come out in support of gay marriage in that year.
EatinOlives
Member
The fact that people think that statement was some kind of smoking gun is absolutely comical.
Yeah she was literally talking about the way Lincoln had to maneuver between two diametrically opposed sides and the public perception of things in order to pass groundbreaking legislation. Which is, ya know, basic politics and not remotely controversial to anyone who finished Civics 101.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/poli...3da8f6-8e91-11e6-bc00-1a9756d4111b_story.html
But dont let me get in the way of you. I like how you get ever more creative in your flailing attempts to get something to stick.
TestOfTide
Banned
Another question that, like the Wallstreet question, only had an awkward answer because the honest answer would have been perfectly fine to sane people, but turns off ridiculous extremists who make up way too much of this country.
She was probably thinking in her head "Yes I fucking lie. Literally everyone lies to varying degrees for different reasons. I'm not the habitual liar that the extremists make me out to be, but anyone who says they never lie is full of shit. If Joe Schmoe asks me in May of 2011 if the White House has figured out where Osama Bin Laden is, am I supposed to just come out and tell them?"
Dr. Feel Good
Banned
Ok let me try an example just to see how you feel about it. I would appreciate non aggressive replies and respect. My soon to be Mother in Law is voting from Trump. She is in her 50's, not college educated, and has lived in a town in Iowa with a population of less than 10,000 which has declined from maybe 2.5x that over the course of the last 30 years.
Her rationale for voting Trump is not morivated by any of the terms you have thrown out. Her town which used to be growing as she transitioned from child to adult was largely blue collar and revolved around a major manufacturing company. It was by far their major employer.
In the mid-90s through the early 00's the major company made the decision to relocate overseas which would be done over the course of ten years but promised people would be ok. Most of her friends and family however ended up losing their jobs and the vast majority of the company was displaced with a very select few (upper management and college educated) transitioning to new operations in bigger cities in Michigan and Illinois. She watched people lose most of their savings and unable to get new jobs. Those who did relocate were forced out of her hometown. No one stepped in. No one cared. End of the day it was cheaper to manufacture their product elsewhere. Politicians and corporations had placed limits on the economy that resulted in the deterioration of their workforce and family life. Strike 1.
Additionally over this time she saw the youth become more pushed towards drugs and alcohol abuse to the inability to fund proper educational and community programs. As the city slid into shit so did the funds and respectable people in office to make a stand for change. She has nieces and nephews who have grown up and resorted to things such as meth because they had no where else to go. No one pushing them to tell them they could make it in life. Strike 2.
Additionally during this time certain programs were put in place by both state and federal government iniatives to help immigrants find a footing within the United States, often times in cities that struggle to grow or have declining populations. What she saw was an influx of people, largely Mexican with some Middle Eaatern, who didn't care about the city or how to help it grow but rather as a temporary resting place to move onto the next thing. Unfortantely this meant the city also saw an influx of illegal immigrants as legal immigrants made their way into the city. Illegal immigrants took jobs from the same friends she had who struggled to find any jobs at all. The clinic she worked at saw people who didn't speak English and didn't care about their patients take work. I understand this scenario can come off as racist but she has a Latino grandson that she deeply loves and cares about. Either way this was her strike 3.
At that point she understands that what Trump says and does to certain groups is hurtful but she also has to care for herself and the people she loves in a city that she loves and to her that's more important. What Trump also says about bringing back jobs, reducing illegal immigration, and helping our youth resonates with her. Does she know every detail about his policy? Of course not, which is the same for most voters. If she knew everything would she change her mind and go Hillary? I can't answer that. Yes I disagree with her but fuck I can at least have empathy for what has happened to the people she cares about.
If people would start just listening and understanding one another and stop focusing so much on hate, name calling, and simply categorizing people into stereotypes maybe things can get better. This applies to both parties.
freenudemacusers
Member
I expect my political leaders to operate with integrity and consistency, no matter the cost. is that too much to ask?
if someone asked you to support homophobic legislation in 2004 would you?
I dont have empathy for her if what you describe is 100% accurate because from what you wrote ignorant is at least a term that can be used to describe her. Though you couched it in pleasant language, the way she turned against immigrants is precisely the type of rationale used to hide inherent racism.
She is likely both, and you are too close to her to want those negative labels assigned to her. What makes me even want to cast off even the gentlest of those labels - sheer ignorance - is that she knows Trump is hurting those groups. You want me to have empathy for her when she is incapable of doing it for immigrants?
I dont know her so i can only go by what you wrote. I tried to genuinely be as kind as possible about your description. There are tons of devastated communities like that in Ohio and PA. And yet just because your community has gone through shit doesnt make it ok or understandable to turn to nativist racism.
Even on your part, the idea that having a latina grandkid and loving them makes it unlikely motivated by racism is kind of racist. People often have blindspots for their own family, and yet exercise reprehensible racist views outside. It is essentially equivalent to "I have a black friend.".
That there were viable concerns that led to racist or xenophobic views does not actually change what the views are.
And i have no patience for it in my own family. I dont talk to my brother because he is racist and a Trump supporter. And dude, he and I are 50% puerto rican, 50% italian jewish. And sure, there was something that i can say led him there - a horribly violent experience with African Americans when he was in prison. Guess what though? He is still racist, still ignorant and still reprehensible for voting Trump.
She is likely both, and you are too close to her to want those negative labels assigned to her. What makes me even want to cast off even the gentlest of those labels - sheer ignorance - is that she knows Trump is hurting those groups. You want me to have empathy for her when she is incapable of doing it for immigrants?
I dont know her so i can only go by what you wrote. I tried to genuinely be as kind as possible about your description. There are tons of devastated communities like that in Ohio and PA. And yet just because your community has gone through shit doesnt make it ok or understandable to turn to nativist racism.
Even on your part, the idea that having a latina grandkid and loving them makes it unlikely motivated by racism is kind of racist. People often have blindspots for their own family, and yet exercise reprehensible racist views outside. It is essentially equivalent to "I have a black friend.".
That there were viable concerns that led to racist or xenophobic views does not actually change what the views are.
And i have no patience for it in my own family. I dont talk to my brother because he is racist and a Trump supporter. And dude, he and I are 50% puerto rican, 50% italian jewish. And sure, there was something that i can say led him there - a horribly violent experience with African Americans when he was in prison. Guess what though? He is still racist, still ignorant and still reprehensible for voting Trump.
GameAddict411
Member
This is seriously the most ignorant post in this thread.
Only one party seems to be normalizing this:
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1305183
I'm sorry but his hateful rhetoric isn't hidden away, it is front and center, more than every single policy position he has taken (which often shift more than quicksand). One can't simply shrug it away and pretend that favourable economic promises (which he can't keep) justify this.
GameAddict411
Member
I am just speechless...
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