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[Screaming Meat]

Help me understand how weapons work.

I found the Ugikatana and the Deep Battle Axe. Ugi has 112+16 physical attack and scales with Dex and Str. The Deep Axe has 103 physical and 103 dark with - scaling. Does that mean the axe has a total of 206 totL attack, with half of that being physical and half being dark?

Yes, but each damage type has to go through the corresponding resistance. Rather than 206 going through one resistance and losing a single set amount, 103 Physical damage has to get through the enemy's physical resistance, and then 103 Dark damage has to get through the enemy's Dark resistance as well.

And the +16 on the Ugi is the bonus from the Dex and Str scaling? So at this point in the game the axe is stronger, but if I level up the scaling, my Dex, and my Str, then eventually the Ugi will become stronger?

That's the idea. With the Uchi you should probably just focus on DEX, though. I think it has an E scaling on STR which is borderline worthless.

 

[Akuun]

In Bloodborne, generally speaking, weapons were not objectively better or worse than other weapons. Each was unique. Is it the same way in DS3, or are there objectively inferior weapons? I am just starting and cannot tell yet.

And on topic, I chose Mercenary as my starting class which appears to be Dex based, right? I realize it's not set in stone. I killed that naked master dude by pushing him off the cliff and got a katana for the trouble. Seems better than my starter twin blades, but the moveset is so different I can't really tell yet.

Sorry, first DS game really, but coming from Bloodborne and I don't fully grasp the differences.

I think while many weapons are viable in the game, there are definitely cases where a certain weapon or shield is just objectively better than another. A shield may simply be lighter/more stable/have better block percentages than another. A weapon of one class may just have higher attack power than another weapon with a similar moveset and type. Stuff like that. It's one of the drawbacks of having so much more equipment variety than in Bloodborne.

But one thing to note is that DS is also about scavenging and finding whatever you can get, so those crappy shields/weapons might still be good for you in the early game if you can't get your hands on anything better at that point. Unlike Bloodborne, you rarely find someone going through the all of a Dark Souls game with their starting weapon as their weapon of choice.

 

[grmlin]

I think while many weapons are viable in the game, there are definitely cases where a certain weapon or shield is just objectively better than another. A shield may simply be lighter/more stable/have better block percentages than another. A weapon of one class may just have higher attack power than another weapon with a similar moveset and type. Stuff like that. It's one of the drawbacks of having so much more equipment variety than in Bloodborne.

But one thing to note is that DS is also about scavenging and finding whatever you can get, so those crappy shields/weapons might still be good for you in the early game if you can't get your hands on anything better at that point. Unlike Bloodborne, you rarely find someone going through the all of a Dark Souls game with their starting weapon as their weapon of choice.

Considering the sheer amount of weapons/tools, I think it's pretty amazing how many of them will carry you through the whole game without problems.

I think it's a lot about personal taste. I loved Bloodborne and it it did something to me I never felt before playing videogames. But I replayed DS3 much more often, as I can play it in so many different ways.

 

[Akuun]

A lot of the weapons are perfectly viable, and that is definitely a credit to the game. .

I might go with the bandit's knife for one playthrough just for maximum tiny knife hilarity.

But twin swords are fun too. Hm.

 

[Chitown B]

Claymore got nerfed hard in DS3. only C/D scaling, down from C/C in DS1 and DS2. And dropped from 290 on +10 DS2 to 276 +10 DS3. Ugh.

 

[Akuun]

Claymore got nerfed hard in DS3. only C/D scaling, down from C/C in DS1 and DS2. And dropped from 290 on +10 DS2 to 276 +10 DS3. Ugh.

Hollowslayer has the same moveset as the Claymore, and it's arguably one of the best swords in the game.

 

[Massa]

Claymore got nerfed hard in DS3. only C/D scaling, down from C/C in DS1 and DS2. And dropped from 290 on +10 DS2 to 276 +10 DS3. Ugh.

Still pretty good though, I think my first playthrough was almost entirely with it.

 

[Chitown B]

Hollowslayer has the same moveset as the Claymore, and it's arguably one of the best swords in the game.

Thanks, I'll look for that. Claymore was my bread and butter in 1&2. Though I did use the Fire Longsword (noob) in DS2 for awhile

 

[Parmadillo Marshmallow]

Ok thanks for all the replies guys. It's making more sense now.

Do all of the weapons in a particular weapon class have the same basic move set?

 

[Relaxed Muscle]

Hollowslayer has the same moveset as the Claymore, and it's arguably one of the best swords in the game.

Is the same except for the 2H R1 which works a bit differently on the Hollowslayer.

Ok thanks for all the replies guys. It's making more sense now.

Do all of the weapons in a particular weapon class have the same basic move set?

As you can see on my reply above, I think most if not all, weapon classes has different movesets.

Sometimes the difference is minimal, sometimes is considerable.

 

[Akuun]

Ok thanks for all the replies guys. It's making more sense now.

Do all of the weapons in a particular weapon class have the same basic move set?

Not really. They tend to have similar movesets, but there are often deviations for certain moves. For example, most longswords do a stab when you do 1H R2, but the broadsword's 1H R2 is a sweep. Some greatsword 1H R2s are a stab, and some do an overhead smash.

The skill (L2) moves also have a good bit of variety between them too.

 

[Jobbs]

Do all of the weapons in a particular weapon class have the same basic move set?

No.

Some weapons have similar movesets as others, or even the same, but there's no firm rule. The game has a lot of weapons in it, and, interestingly enough, most of them are totally viable.

Claymore got nerfed hard in DS3. only C/D scaling, down from C/C in DS1 and DS2. And dropped from 290 on +10 DS2 to 276 +10 DS3. Ugh.

Yeah I use the bastard sword frequently. Claymore is so stamina heavy.

Fixed.

I don't think it's the easiest... I think a lot of us just had an easier time with it because we're so good at Souls games by this point.

I'd say its difficulty is comparable to DS1. DS2 is the hardest in terms of combat difficulty because the designers seemed to make this a priority and - in my opinion thoughtlessly - had a tendency to throw way too much at the user at once, to the extnet that it wasn't particularly fun because multi target combat doesn't cater to the strength of the game's mechanics.

 

[Parmadillo Marshmallow]

Not really. They tend to have similar movesets, but there are often deviations for certain moves. For example, most longswords do a stab when you do 1H R2, but the broadsword's 1H R2 is a sweep. Some greatsword 1H R2s are a stab, and some do an overhead smash.

The skill (L2) moves also have a good bit of variety between them too.

Got it thanks. Dang, with so many different weapons and move sets, it seems particularly challenging to know what weapon I want to go with and set up my stats accordingly.

Also, I went through the High Wall of Lothric level last night and beat the boss on my 2nd try. I just looked at a guide for the level today and, yeah, I missed like half the level. I never picked up the banner either, which I guess I need to progress? I'm going to go back tonight to see if I can find some of the things I missed. Man this game is crazy, glad I picked it up.

 

[Mentosrock]

Okay, so I'm checking in to see if anyone has any earthly idea how the hell I can beat Friede. I have tried for months now. I am on NG at SL 105, and I just cannot beat this bitch. I even respecced to a cheezy dex + luck bleed build. Her third form is on another plane of reality for me. I can't seem to hit her enough consecutively to make bleed worth it, and I can't currently equip enough armor to be safe from hits. I don't know what to do.

 

[Mistel]

Thanks, I'll look for that. Claymore was my bread and butter in 1&2. Though I did use the Fire Longsword (noob) in DS2 for awhile

Try the executioner's greatsword and a refined flamberge both a pretty decent replacements.

 

[Jobbs]

Okay, so I'm checking in to see if anyone has any earthly idea how the hell I can beat Friede. I have tried for months now. I am on NG at SL 105, and I just cannot beat this bitch. I even respecced to a cheezy dex + luck bleed build. Her third form is on another plane of reality for me. I can't seem to hit her enough consecutively to make bleed worth it, and I can't currently equip enough armor to be safe from hits. I don't know what to do.

Took me 16 tries. I think the only easy answer is get good

 

[Mentosrock]

Took me 16 tries. I think the only easy answer is get good

I am past the 16 tries mark. Way... Way past. I went for a period of weeks trying 4 attempts a day. I've tried a great shield and a strength weapon. I have the chillbite ring on, I have tried frost resist armor, I've tried fire resist. Nothing works. I am super overleveled for her as well. I just can't see what is going so wrong in that third phase.

 

[Akuun]

I am past the 16 tries mark. Way... Way past. I went for a period of weeks trying 4 attempts a day. I've tried a great shield and a strength weapon. I have the chillbite ring on, I have tried frost resist armor, I've tried fire resist. Nothing works. I am super overleveled for her as well. I just can't see what is going so wrong in that third phase.

Keep in mind I don't have the DLC so I've never seen this boss before, but I think you may be may be changing up your strategy too often.

Every respec and gear change takes some time to get used to, and trying out an entirely new playstyle on a boss you're already struggling with means that you are pretty much guaranteed to get destroyed a few times just getting used to your new playstyle. Your 4 attempts a day are probably being spent just getting used to your new gear and build each time.

You might want to try to go to something you're comfortable with, then stick to it. Try to do more than 4 attempts a day. Practice makes perfect. If you're not sure what's going on in the last phase, try to play it safe and just dodge/block without trying to attack back so that you can see what's going on and where you can stay safe. Once you're more comfortable with that, try to start sneaking in ways to do damage. Repeat until you can defend more attacks consistently and start doing damage.

 

[Doomsayer]

Had a good session last night, beat

Spoiler

Yhorm the Giant and Dancer of the Boreal Valley. I had heard the Dancer is one of the hardest bosses of the game, but I didn't see it. She hit me twice the entire fight. Aldrich was way more difficult.

Also a cool little thing I did yesterday.

Spoiler

In the area of the Irithyll Dungeon with all the jailers and Karla if you sprint to the room with the Crucified Hollowed enemy inside and open it. He will attack all of the jailers while you just hang out on the side. After they are dead take him out to easily clear the room.

I'm having a ton of fun with this game.

 

[RubberLuffy]

Haven't played since June, decided to try to finish my Star Platinum run (for those who don't watch JoJo, I'm a blue-ish skinned cestus punchman with minimal armor, the Nameless King helm really helps with the look lol), and I've sorta hit a wall with the Devourer. Punching ain't great against it, plus I'm rusty as hell. Got real close but my summonbuddy died when it had about 15% left, and then I got run through from halfway across the room.

Oh well, maybe I'll have some luck later.

 

[Akuun]

I feel like Dancer is a hard boss for slow melee people, but easy for either fast or ranged builds. She hits hard, but she's not all that aggressive. Her damage mostly comes from delayed attacks and/or unexpected combo continuations that punish panic rolling or committing to attacks at bad times. She hurts you mostly by punishing your attempts to hurt her, rather than getting in your face and just fucking your shit up.

I definitely thought she was one of the harder bosses in the game for me, because I was using a zweihander at the time and had trouble finding good points to hit her without taking damage myself.

 

[grmlin]

I feel like Dancer is a hard boss for slow melee people, but easy for either fast or ranged builds. She hits hard, but she's not all that aggressive. Her damage mostly comes from delayed attacks and/or unexpected combo continuations that punish panic rolling or committing to attacks at bad times. She hurts you mostly by punishing your attempts to hurt her, rather than getting in your face and just fucking your shit up.

I definitely thought she was one of the harder bosses in the game for me, because I was using a zweihander at the time and had trouble finding good points to hit her without taking damage myself.

absolutely, it was a pretty tough fight with the great club, as it was too slow and I got almost always punished trying to land a hit.

My mage on the other hand was easy as f, always move a way, wait for the opening, cast souls arrows.

 

[Jobbs]

Can a weapon's wacry art still work if the weapon has been infused by lightning?

 

[Jedi2016]

Can a weapon's wacry art still work if the weapon has been infused by lightning?

It should, yeah. The only thing infusing changes is damage and scaling (for Raw/Refined/etc gems).

Then again, I've never done an elemental infusion (running a Quality build right now), so you might want to wait for a second opinion.. lol.

 

[Jobbs]

It should, yeah. The only thing infusing changes is damage and scaling (for Raw/Refined/etc gems).

Then again, I've never done an elemental infusion (running a Quality build right now), so you might want to wait for a second opinion.. lol.

You can't buff infused weapons, and you can't warcry on buffed weapons, so I'm not sure.

 

[Lethal]

Uh...guys? No cloud saves on Steam?

 

[Sarcasm]

Uh...guys? No cloud saves on Steam?

Nope! Use gamesave manager + cloud service

 

[Akuun]

Are there twin swords that are good against armor? Sellsword twinblades are kind of bad against those.

I feel like I'm doing fine in the early areas where people aren't armored, but I'm gonna get wrecked when I get into areas full of knights.

And is the Bandit's dagger any good? It seems like one of the fastest weapons I can find.

 

[Chitown B]

So what is Eygon of Carim good for? I'm reading his page and it seems like it's basically for two boss fight summons, and that's about it - right? And if you kill him you get his armor.

 

[grmlin]

Remembered that I can get the Moonlight GS now, and oh boy, I really like it. I didn't like playing with the Estoc, that R1 spam is not my thing.

And, additionally, I finally know why there is weapon repairing.

 

[Relaxed Muscle]

Are there twin swords that are good against armor? Sellsword twinblades are kind of bad against those.

I feel like I'm doing fine in the early areas where people aren't armored, but I'm gonna get wrecked when I get into areas full of knights.

And is the Bandit's dagger any good? It seems like one of the fastest weapons I can find.

Which twin swords? The twin blades can be quite powerful a R1 + L2 battle art can deal some damage, specially if you buff them. Most weapons early in the game aren't gonna feel that powerful compared to weapons that deals way more raw damage.

Daggers are fast, but they don't do a lot of damage early on as well. bandit's dagger has the benefit of adding bleed so is cool I guess.

I wouldn't worry too much, most weapons are perfectly viable. Just choose whta you like more

So what is Eygon of Carim good for? I'm reading his page and it seems like it's basically for two boss fight summons, and that's about it - right? And if you kill him you get his armor.

Well, he's part of an NPC quest, you have to do that quest in a very specific way if you want his shield and weapon.

 

[Akuun]

Which twin swords? The twin blades can be quite powerful a R1 + L2 battle art can deal some damage, specially if you buff them. Most weapons early in the game aren't gonna feel that powerful compared to weapons that deals way more raw damage.

Daggers are fast, but they don't do a lot of damage early on as well. bandit's dagger has the benefit of adding bleed so is cool I guess.

I wouldn't worry too much, most weapons are perfectly viable. Just choose whta you like more

I've been using the sellsword twin swords. Mercenary starter weapon, I think. I'm trying to make a fast rolling dex character, and I haven't decided what weapon I want to settle on. Also not sure if I want to incorporate enchantments into it either.

R1 > L2? I've been doing L2 > R2 for the skill followup, but didn't know that R1 > L2 was a thing.

I have my eye on the Dancer's twin swords too, but it sucks that they're an endgame weapon. Basically I'm torn between having slightly slower weapons in twin blades for style points, or just something super small and fast like the bandit's dagger.

Actually, my only gripe with this game is how a lot of key things in the game like certain weapons, tomes, and covenant stations are only available in the final areas.

Spoiler

It's kind of dumb that you only get lightning spears at pretty much the end of the game.

 

[Chitown B]

Well, he's part of an NPC quest, you have to do that quest in a very specific way if you want his shield and weapon.

OK. But not tied to any achievement I guess.

 

[kanamechan]

Fixed.

I've only played 15 hours but this game is cake compared to 1 & 2. You don't have to get embers to start upgrading your weapons, you don't have to go through 1/3 of the game before you can warp to bonfires, you can sell items any time and right away, you get the white soapstone immediately, your health doesn't diminish with each subsequent death..... So far 3 is like a baby game. Playing 3 first and going back to play 1 or 2 would be really rough for a new player.

This is an interesting perspective. I ended up buying DS1, 2 and Bloodborne after finishing 3 (I gave DS a pass forever due to the git gud reputation - I expected something akin to I wanna Be the Guy or the like, not a modern Ultima Underworld crossed with Zelda combat - gee, I wanted a modern Ultima Underworld since forever, and nobody told me this was it)

And to me, DS2 is *so* much easier so far. (Currently I'm in the snow city at the very end of the bonfire list). I mean, it had some "okay..." moments like the fat rhinos being able to grab you from a mile away, the Pursuer spawning in three dogs and three archers, or the eight katana guys before that ginormous dragon boss, but overall it was a lot less twitchy.

Not *easy* as such, but significantly easier than DS3 for sure.

 

[Chitown B]

This is an interesting perspective. I ended up buying DS1, 2 and Bloodborne after finishing 3 (I gave DS a pass forever due to the git gud reputation - I expected something akin to I wanna Be the Guy or the like, not a modern Ultima Underworld crossed with Zelda combat - gee, I wanted a modern Ultima Underworld since forever, and nobody told me this was it)

And to me, DS2 is *so* much easier so far. (Currently I'm in the snow city at the very end of the bonfire list). I mean, it had some "okay..." moments like the fat rhinos being able to grab you from a mile away, the Pursuer spawning in three dogs and three archers, or the eight katana guys before that ginormous dragon boss, but overall it was a lot less twitchy.

Not *easy* as such, but significantly easier than DS3 for sure.

I think the ease is subjective. DS2 has a lot more open spaces, at least from what I've noticed so far in DS3. What I mean by "easy" is that there are so many fewer hoops and processes to go through in DS3 vs. the first two. You just get most stuff handed to you. Like for instance in DS1 you could completely accidentally miss out on Estus upgrades if you use the Firekeeper Soul without knowing about that.

 

[kanamechan]

Hm. I actually see what you mean comparing 3 to 2.

Spoiler

It took me a while to figure out how to rotate that stupid wheel room with the contraption in Majula, for example - I genuinely thought I missed something until I went back there and had a random NPC open it for me.

And it's probably easy to miss that there's a NPC randomly selling ladders so you can climb down that pit without dying to the fall damage xD; I guess that fall damage ring might work too?

A lot of it really seems "old game obtuse", like (excuse me drawing comparisons to Ultima Underworld again) not learning a language from a seemingly random monster you may not even talk to = you probably are not gonna finish this game obtuse. 3 didn't really have that, that's true. Tho I guess hiding a whole area behind an invisible wall

Spoiler

(after the weird dragon boss with the invisible baby)

comes close. Thankfully I was hitting every damn wall in the game anyway.

 

[grmlin]

I think the games evolved into something more consumer friendly. I tried to play DS1 after beating Bloodborne + DLC (multiple times) and I just couldn't get over the archaic game mechanics.

I think this is completely different if it was your first game in the series, but it's not for me.


DS3 on the other hand might seem easy for a "veteran" souls player, but for a newbie it can be very hard. Maybe not Bloodborne levels of hard, it's much more streamlined and not nearly as hard to understand, but still.

 

[Chitown B]

Hm. I actually see what you mean comparing 3 to 2.

Spoiler

It took me a while to figure out how to rotate that stupid wheel room with the contraption in Majula, for example - I genuinely thought I missed something until I went back there and had a random NPC open it for me.

And it's probably easy to miss that there's a NPC randomly selling ladders so you can climb down that pit without dying to the fall damage xD; I guess that fall damage ring might work too?

A lot of it really seems "old game obtuse", like (excuse me drawing comparisons to Ultima Underworld again) not learning a language from a seemingly random monster you may not even talk to = you probably are not gonna finish this game obtuse. 3 didn't really have that, that's true. Tho I guess hiding a whole area behind an invisible wall

Spoiler

(after the weird dragon boss with the invisible baby)

comes close. Thankfully I was hitting every damn wall in the game anyway.

Yup. But I feel like that's how the games used to be me, on purpose. It's not like these were made in the 90s. They meant them to be obtuse. It's Monkey Island obtuse sometimes (but because they wanted it to be).

 

[Akuun]

I think the games evolved into something more consumer friendly. I tried to play DS1 after beating Bloodborne + DLC (multiple times) and I just couldn't get over the archaic game mechanics.

I think this is completely different if it was your first game in the series, but it's not for me.


DS3 on the other hand might seem easy for a "veteran" souls player, but for a newbie it can be very hard. Maybe not Bloodborne levels of hard, it's much more streamlined and not nearly as hard to understand, but still.

FromSoft definitely found a difficulty point that wanted in DS3, and hit it with far more accuracy than they did in any other Souls game.

For example, shortcut/bonfire placement is much more consistent and predictable in DS3, while in DeS/DS1/DS2 you still had the odd stretch where you never knew if you had a bonfire right next to a boss door, or had to run halfway through a level to retry a boss. Boss tuning is also set in such a way that was fairly consistent - you were either fighting a boss that seemed to fit an appropriate difficulty for the boss' stature, or it was an obvious gimmick fight.

It feels easier for a Souls game veteran, but it still keeps the Souls feel while probably becoming easier to get into for someone new to the series.

It's one of the reasons why I like the game. It feels like a natural refinement of the previous Souls game formula, and it comes out as a much more consistently enjoyable experience as a result.

 

[Relaxed Muscle]

I've been using the sellsword twin swords. Mercenary starter weapon, I think. I'm trying to make a fast rolling dex character, and I haven't decided what weapon I want to settle on. Also not sure if I want to incorporate enchantments into it either.

R1 > L2? I've been doing L2 > R2 for the skill followup, but didn't know that R1 > L2 was a thing.

I have my eye on the Dancer's twin swords too, but it sucks that they're an endgame weapon. Basically I'm torn between having slightly slower weapons in twin blades for style points, or just something super small and fast like the bandit's dagger.

Actually, my only gripe with this game is how a lot of key things in the game like certain weapons, tomes, and covenant stations are only available in the final areas.

Spoiler

It's kind of dumb that you only get lightning spears at pretty much the end of the game.

I mean R1 > L2 > R2, with humanoid enemies you should be able to get a full staggered 3 hit combo, which is quite powerful.

And I don't see why not you can't use both and change them depending of the enemy or to your preference. The game gives you enough materials to upgrade several weapons.

I have my eye on the Dancer's twin swords too, but it sucks that they're an endgame weapon.

lol you can try to get them as soon you reach the old lady, but prepare for a lot of pain.
(and they are not that good)

 

[Akuun]

I mean R1 > L2 > R2, with humanoid enemies you should be able to get a full staggered 3 hit combo, which is quite powerful.

lol you can try to get them as soon you reach the old lady, but prepare for a lot of pain.
(and they are not that good)

Damn, but the Dancer's swords look cool.

Will try R1 > L2 > R2 though. I've been doing just L2 > R2 on big openings.

 

[Morrigan Stark]

Are there twin swords that are good against armor? Sellsword twinblades are kind of bad against those.

Warden twinblades have bleed, so that works well against tankier enemies with higher HP bars at least.

 

[Lethal]

Nope! Use gamesave manager + cloud service

Damn...too late. Upgraded my rig a few weeks ago. Reinstalled windows. 36 hour save down the drain. Bummer

 

[Sarcasm]

Damn...too late. Upgraded my rig a few weeks ago. Reinstalled windows. 36 hour save down the drain. Bummer

Will if you need a coop buddy hit me up. Trust me it will be slightly different on your new playthrough. Think positive, you can try a new build!

 

[Lethal]

Will if you need a coop buddy hit me up. Trust me it will be slightly different on your new playthrough. Think positive, you can try a new build!

My last playthrough was all solo. I don't even know how co-op works tbh. Wouldnt it require repeated summonings every time a boss is beaten?

 

[Chitown B]

My last playthrough was all solo. I don't even know how co-op works tbh. Wouldnt it require repeated summonings every time a boss is beaten?

http://www.gamerevolution.com/faq/dark-souls-iii/how-to-co-op-using-the-white-sign-soapstone-123519

 

[Chitown B]

I prefer co-op because even though it makes it easier, it changes the game and makes it less stressful and more fun - for me. I can do it solo, but after 2 100% games, it's nice to relax a bit and have fun playing instead of worrying so much.

 

[Sarcasm]

Well it adds HP and certain areas you get invaded by many lol

 

[Chitown B]

Well it adds HP and certain areas you get invaded by many lol

True, but usually the monsters can only attack one direction at a time, so you can bait and backstab. So far as the invasions, yes. I actually got invaded by a red, a purple, and two blue/reds in the woods area last night. lol

 

[kanamechan]

Yup. But I feel like that's how the games used to be me, on purpose. It's not like these were made in the 90s. They meant them to be obtuse. It's Monkey Island obtuse sometimes (but because they wanted it to be).

Oh, this was definitely not a complaint,I am fine with things like that. My favorite game 2015/2016 was Legend of Grimrock II, which had some really obscure puzzles that took a lot of thinking to figure out, and I grew up with RPGs that were like that as well.

I find it refreshing and certainly quite engaging - enough to buy the whole series at once, pretty much. Will probably play DS1 or Bloodborne next after I am done with my next game.

Wish there'd be more games like that, really. Particularly the adventuring/exploring aspects, less the combat itself.