norinrad21
Banned
God i miss Taito
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Developers who fell from grace...
- Thread starter jarrod
- Start date
Pretty much, yeah, a ton of people left to Planet Moon and other devs.
Rare is an obvious drop off. I'd include Nintendo, and as much as it pains me as a big Square fan, Squaresoft. Sega is the worst of the bunch, no where in sight of what they used to be. Going 3rd party has, if anything, hurt them.
Capcom I think pretty well avoids the list. Onimusha, Power Stone, Viewtiful Joe, Devil May Cry, Maximo, RE4, and Breath of Fire: Dragon Quarter all were exceptional quality. I feel bad for how poorly their titles have sold this generation, they don't deserve it, though they've been pretty weak in terms of marketing this gen.
Volition started with a lot of promise (Summoner, Red Faction) but after two sequels that did nothing to build off those two innovative titles, they've pretty well faded out of the picture.
Namco is a major power that has in my opinion disapointed this generation. Tekken 4 was very lackluster, and they've done little outside of a solid RRV and two good Soul Calibur's to merit their elite status among the 3rd party publishers. Xenosaga 1 & 2 are both big hits against their rep. Not even so much that they're bad games as that they're worse than Xenogears, with most all the same staff. They get the sales, and Tekken 5 looks to be a good step in the right dirction, but they aren't turning out much in the way of diverse quality.
Activision also looked to have some promise last generation, producing quality like Tony Hawk and Spider-man. Instead of building on that though they've actually drug those two series down into the rest of their mediocrity.
Cold-Steel
Member
Drek said:
I agree on all points. The last great Namco in-house original title was Soul Calibur for Dreamcast, Volition has suffered in the quality department, Rare's output this generation has been disastrous and I'm not a fan of the direction Tony Hawk is going.
Koei.
basically.. they produce 1 game. Dynasty Warriors. Everything else is crap. Why aren't they dead and over with yet?
SEGA
as a whole. I can't think of any game on this gen console that I would class as AAA. Thanks for the butchered sequels and the hokey crap sequels.
RARE
nuff said
basically.. they produce 1 game. Dynasty Warriors. Everything else is crap. Why aren't they dead and over with yet?
SEGA
as a whole. I can't think of any game on this gen console that I would class as AAA. Thanks for the butchered sequels and the hokey crap sequels.
RARE
nuff said
Cold-Steel
Member
Yes, I forgot Sega.
Biggest disaster this generation IMO. They take the cake over even Rare.
Biggest disaster this generation IMO. They take the cake over even Rare.
I still can't understand why anybody labeling SEGA as a software developer how have "fallen from grace".
If you actually been fallowing SEGA for the last 20+ years or actually know about outside from console games,you would've known that SEGA is pretty much known for churning out medicore titles. SEGA as theyr'e today is nothing but SEGA as they've always been when it comes to the quality of thier titles.
If you actually been fallowing SEGA for the last 20+ years or actually know about outside from console games,you would've known that SEGA is pretty much known for churning out medicore titles. SEGA as theyr'e today is nothing but SEGA as they've always been when it comes to the quality of thier titles.
Go Go Ackman!
Banned
An unlikely candidate, but I'm inclined to mention Square. I enjoyed FFX much less than FF6 or FF7 (although it was quite pretty for early PS2), FFTA had no plot whatsoever, and I wouldn't touch Kingdom hearts with a 10 foot stolen dick. I had an amazing time with Front Mission 4, it's the only new iteration of a Square series that has satisfied me yet. That said, I look forward to FFXII as it looks to have many smooth-assed rabbit chicks.
My regrets go out to Capcom, as they reportedly struggling despite putting out some fantastic software (RE4, Oni3 being true artistic acheivements). When a title with the degree of engineering and design that RE4 does fails to generate fat numbers, seems to me ike they just can't catch a break.
Finally, while never having played Mario 64, I still can't believe that people still be on Mario Sunshine's jock. I think it had every drop of imagination, aptmosphere and fun gameplay you can squeeze into a platformer.
My regrets go out to Capcom, as they reportedly struggling despite putting out some fantastic software (RE4, Oni3 being true artistic acheivements). When a title with the degree of engineering and design that RE4 does fails to generate fat numbers, seems to me ike they just can't catch a break.
Finally, while never having played Mario 64, I still can't believe that people still be on Mario Sunshine's jock. I think it had every drop of imagination, aptmosphere and fun gameplay you can squeeze into a platformer.
Musashi Wins!
FLAWLESS VICTOLY!
Speevy said:
And still the question stands...what have they done?
Go Go Ackman!
Banned
Bebpo said:
Dude, Koei is the best they've ever been. They've gone from total obscurity (in NA) to having million-sellers yearly (because every March there's a new DW). Rot3k ain't no final fantasy, yet they've continued to improve the series since NES days. Don't forget DW Tactics and Crimson Sea. Kessen still sucks shit, of course.
Now that I think about it, they've 1. Breathed life into the beat-em-up genre, 2. Created a new franchise that sells in the millions, yet stays true to their original stuff, 3. Improved their graphics and gameplay with each title (except those damned castles in SW, fuck those things) and finally 4. Branched out into new ventures without abandoning their hardcore fanbase. All this without money hats (tecmo) farming shit out to america (nintendo) or relying on a lot of liscenced stuff (konami).
Go Go Ackman!
Banned
norinrad21 said:
So what happened to them?
Musashi Wins!
FLAWLESS VICTOLY!
DavidDayton said:
And given the results, that's clearly not what needed fixin'.
The short flying bits are alright, though. Still quite sub-par.
Prince of Space
Banned
Square. Aside from FFX and XI, their output has been substandard this gen.
ButtonMasher
Member
Koei also has GitarooMan and those's badass Navy opps games. How could anyone say Koei?
boutrosinit
Street Fighter IV World Champion
1. RARE
2. Nintendo Japan (Mario, Zelda series developers)
3. Sonic Team
2. Nintendo Japan (Mario, Zelda series developers)
3. Sonic Team
boutrosinit
Street Fighter IV World Champion
Speevy said:
Which is a massive heaping steam-pile of grade A CRAP.
MS Studios' Brit output has been dreadful. Sudeki + Grabbed by the Ghoulies = making Britain look shit.
jarrod said:
I'd like to point out that a fair few of those games Sonic Team didn't make. Sonic Mega Collection was done in collaboration with Sonic Team, and Shakka Tambourine was not made by them, but I think it used the same engine. I'm not sure if they made Sonic N, it may have been made by the people who did Sonic Advance 1 and 3.
However, you've got to admit that considering the stuff they've been pushing out, they're still going strong. I mean they only REALLY made 2 games in the entire Saturn generation, one 'demo' with extras, and one compilation. Meanwhile Sonic Adventure, Sonic Adventure 2, Chu Chu Rocket and the Phantasy Star Online
At least they added to it with updated graphics, or in the case of Chu Chu GBA, 2000+ puzzles.To al those who bash Sonic Heroes: Do NOT play the PS2 version. It's shockingly bad. Play the GC version.
Puyo Pop fever was a test on just how much they could port a game. It's on every console or phone you could imagine
lochnesssnowman
Member
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Greenpanda
Banned
Lucifer Games, Inc.
Microcabin made Naval Ops, not Koei.ButtonMasher said:
Koei hasn't really done much of anything besides recycle 3 or 4 formulas endlessly. Not just this generation but the past 2 decades. :/
That's another good one. Last gen Grandia and GunGriffon were top of the line, same with Lunar the generation before. I think we can probably blame Square Enix for mucking up GA though.jiggle said:
Shakka no Tambourine was made by Sonic Team, though Hitmaker handled the PS1 port. I'm not aware of any collaberation for Mega Collection (what would there be to collaberate on?) and all resources point to Sonic Team handling Sonic N internally rather than Dimps again.Rlan said:
Rlan said:
Well, that was mainly Sega's doing by truncating Saturn's lifespan. Sonic Team didn't even start releasing Saturn titles until 2 years in due to extended Genesis R&D, meanwhile things were shifted to DC immediately in comparison. Sonic Adventure started life as a Saturn game actually, under the codename Sonic RPG. Had Saturn been given the same courtesy as Genesis, Sonic Team's first DC game would've been Chu2.
Sonic Team also worked closely with Travelers Tales on Sonic R and Sonic 3D Blast for Saturn, contributing their NiGHTS engine, code support, design support and the soundtracks. I left out contracted development though, otherwise there'd be stuff from Dimps, Traveler's Tales and Carat House up there.
There's still N-Gage waiting.Rlan said:Puyo Pop fever was a test on just how much they could port a game. It's on every console or phone you could imagine
Sorry, as a long time Koei fan I have to disagree with you completely. Nobunaga's Ambition wasn't nearly as good as the RoTK series, so I personally don't miss it one bit. RoTK is continually getting better with every iteration. On top of that Dynasty Warriors has made Koei more than just an obscure 3rd party living on the brink of collapse. Kessen was even a decent effort to try something new, despite it's failure. They'd go a long ways towards improving Kessen by taking a look at the Total War series. Hell, I wish they owned The Creative Assembly instead of Activision.
Overall Koei went from last generation being a company with almost no fanbase and very little room to expand to one of the few 3rd parties who can say they established a new million seller franchise in this generation. If anything they've delivered more than anyone could have predicted, in terms of sales and diverse quality games. They could do better, namely by making a quality competitor for the Total War series, expanding away from the Three Kingdom's setting (don't abandon it, but diversify), and overall adding a more genre diverse library. I'd also love a new AeroBiz, though I don't see that happening. ;P They're definately on the rise from where they were last generation, though they still aren't anything close to an elite 3rd party.
For me, the big tragedy was Dream Factory.
As a long time fighting game fan, I felt that DF was really pushing the boundaries of fighting game design in a big way. We've seen how some of their innovations from Tobal No. 1 and Tobal 2 like the superb method of 3D movement and the Just Frame system have been incorporated into current fighters. I also felt that Ehrgeiz, for all its flaws, was another brilliant step forward. Up until then, fighting games had pinned the fighters onto a 2D line. That line could be adjusted with sidestepping and free run in more recent games, but it was still modal and restrictive. Ehrgeiz destroyed that paradigm. You had complete freedom of movement all the time, while still retaining the full moveset of a complex fighter. I believed that much like the refinement that occurred between Tobal No. 1 and Tobal 2, an Ehrgeiz 2 that fixed problems like the braindead easy counters would have heavily influenced a new generation of fighting games in much the same way Tobal 2 did.
Unfortunately, Dream Factory destroyed itself over The Bouncer, and we never got an Ehrgeiz 2. And now the top 3D fighters are still stuck on that 2D line, and I'm left dreaming about what might have been. :/
As a long time fighting game fan, I felt that DF was really pushing the boundaries of fighting game design in a big way. We've seen how some of their innovations from Tobal No. 1 and Tobal 2 like the superb method of 3D movement and the Just Frame system have been incorporated into current fighters. I also felt that Ehrgeiz, for all its flaws, was another brilliant step forward. Up until then, fighting games had pinned the fighters onto a 2D line. That line could be adjusted with sidestepping and free run in more recent games, but it was still modal and restrictive. Ehrgeiz destroyed that paradigm. You had complete freedom of movement all the time, while still retaining the full moveset of a complex fighter. I believed that much like the refinement that occurred between Tobal No. 1 and Tobal 2, an Ehrgeiz 2 that fixed problems like the braindead easy counters would have heavily influenced a new generation of fighting games in much the same way Tobal 2 did.
Unfortunately, Dream Factory destroyed itself over The Bouncer, and we never got an Ehrgeiz 2. And now the top 3D fighters are still stuck on that 2D line, and I'm left dreaming about what might have been. :/
jarrod said:
In all due respect jarrod, would you care to explain? I thought the bolded titles were Top-Notch, and the new Legend of Zelda hasn't even come out yet... Hell, not much information has even been released about it.
I respect your opinion and would just like to hear why you chose these titles.
Cheers.
Their games simply aren't as good anymore. That simple. Instead of leading the industry, EAD can barely keep up with it these days.Artanisix said:
I do like Pikmin alot, but it just isn't enough. I have high hopes for Zelda too and in all fairness EAD seems to have been turning around the past year or so (which I mentioned) but overall they've been knocked down a few notches this generation. Honestly, I'd say their N64 lineup is their best while GC was their worst.
jarrod said:
You sure? From what I can tell, the official site never mentions Sonic Team, and Sonic Team have never recognised it as their own. They have seperate sites for every game they've made on sonicteam.com, and nothing for Shakka. http://www.syakatan.com
As for Sonic Mega Collection, It was made by a company called VR-1 Japan. If you boot up the game it says "Under supervision of Sonic Team", not just "Made by". Not sure about SMC+ though.