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Doctor Who Series 10 |OT| He's Back, and It's About Time
- Thread starter tomtom94
- Start date
Spectromixer
Member
Chibnall better bring back the Rani tho
BrokenFiction
Member
Who would play her though?
acheron_xl
Member
Olivia Colman, obv
We already have her in Modern Who.
She's a better actress than Classic Series Rani too.
Spectromixer
Member
I need to watch more SJA 
peanutbutterlatte
Member
What time is it on tomorrow?
Nearly missed it at 6:45 last week, so early!
Nearly missed it at 6:45 last week, so early!
That could be a disguise and the true valeyard is Missy. Anything can happen.
no, it can't and won't
I see. All this time we thought Nardole wasn't human because he was partly robot, but actually he was a time lord. Classic Moffat and his word play.
I need to watch more SJA
Do this asap too!
Christ, do I need to organise all your viewing??
paradox121
Member
I think Ruth Wilson would be a solid choice.
After Missy, you need to distinguish her as being the cold, clinical one rather than the batshit insane one. And Ruth Wilson's pretty great at that.
This is of course in the unlikely scenario that they bother to bring the Rani back at all.
Spectromixer
Member
Do this asap too!
Christ, do I need to organise all your viewing??
I'm going to watch the other one tonight hopefully
Pagusas
Elden Member
I need to watch more SJA
I tried to watch it, tried to do a soft intro by watching a 10th Doctor/SJA cross over episode (the wedding of Sarah Jane) but it was just really bad. Figured if they can't make a good episode with the 10th Doctor being in it, the rest of the show is probably worse.
SlipperyFishes
Banned
The Death of the Doctor with Matt Smith was pretty good.
For the audience it's aimed at, it's actually really good. But it's just aimed at a very young audience (and made on a shoestring budget), so it's probably not really of interest to most people here.
Surprising number of deep classic series references though, including seeing the Brigadier again. If he had lived just a little longer, there's no question in my mind he would have had a part in the 50th anniversary. Although his SJA appearance already showed age was really catching up to him, and intensive acting performances really were a thing of the past for him at that point. He still had that lovely voice and commandeering presence though.
But yeah, SJA is really only worth it if you want to introduce very young children to the world of Who, or if you're the kind of fan who needs to see absolutely everything. Like, I'll admit, me.
Pagusas
Elden Member
May need to try catching that one.
I do enjoy Torchwood. Never had the highs of Who but still it's average was pretty decent. 80% of children of earth was super good also, lots of great drama. Part of me feels Arival took influences from it.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
Children of Earth is probably going to be the best thing Russel T. Davies ever does.
Stolen Earth/Journey's End on a purely technical/structural level. Bringing three shows together to crossover while still telling a Doctor specific story while ending a companions story and bringing a classic villain back and somehow giving everyone stuff to do AND writing another send off for Rose AND having to pay off all the S4 stuff.
The shit is absurd in retrospect. Ridiculous he pulled it off semi coherently.
BrokenFiction
Member
Doctor Who BBCA @DoctorWho_BBCA 3m
Pagusas
Elden Member
To be fair to what you are saying, you could have removed Jack, Sarah Jane and Martha Jones from the whole script and barely any of the episode would have changed. The only important players in the episode were Rose, Donna and the Doctor. Everyone else was plot fluff.
The second half of series 4 is easily RTD's greatest achievement. From the Moffat two-parter to the four episodes RTD penned himself, it's probably the strongest stretch of continuous episodes and the most satisfying conclusion to a series.
If we're talking individual stories, Midnight remains my favourite of his. It's incredible how good he is when he eschews the usual faith in humanity's inherent goodness that pervades most of his work.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
Which is why I'm holding to the notion that Children of Earth is the best thing he's ever done, and probably will ever do. Five episodes, not a single stinker, an amazing premise, executed brilliantly.
The moment where Tennant crouches down, mentions the Vashta Nerada by name for the first time, and that little guitar bit kicks in is pretty much one of my favorite Tennant moments. Such a small thing, but it always stayed with me from that first live viewing onwards.
Pagusas
Elden Member
Huh??? Maybe production quality wise (nope not even that way... the framing and shot quality of that last scene where he snaps his fingers is one of many iconic scenes in the 2 episodes). Writing wise it's some of the best work Moffat did, especially compared to the crap we got in season 6 & 7 (and a lot of 5).
I've watched the Library over again several times (pretty much after every major River Song episode, as it always makes me nostalgic for it). The only thing that doesn't hold up are the effects, but even those have a classic doctor who feel to them.
That smile David Tennant gives when he saves River in the very end is amazing. The finger snap. The face he gives River when she says his real name. The musical score and narration at the very end with the 10th running back for the screw driver, all so good.
Not a single episode from seasons 5 - 7 compare in iconic stature to that episode (obviously in my opinion, which May be in the minority as people seem to like season 5 for reasons I can explain)
Rewatching Series 8, and good lord, Danny Pink is worse than I remember, he's boring and a huge dick (sucks, because Samuel Anderson seems nice and should have played a lighter-hearted person). Talking shit to the Doctor about not getting his hands dirty when he spent hundreds of years waging war on Gallifrey (I feel like series 10 Twelve would have snapped back at him). Nardole absolutely crushes that character in terms of how lovable and better he is.
Oh, the Cyber-Brig still pisses me off considering Moffat could have easily written a Chekov's Gun into the painting on the UNIT plane to save Kate from her fall, and maybe even had it contain a letter for the Doctor when he was looking for guidance. That would been way more respectful to the memory of Nicholas Courtney.
Oh, the Cyber-Brig still pisses me off considering Moffat could have easily written a Chekov's Gun into the painting on the UNIT plane to save Kate from her fall, and maybe even had it contain a letter for the Doctor when he was looking for guidance. That would been way more respectful to the memory of Nicholas Courtney.
I agree, it felt weird to me too, but considering who Nicholas Courtney was, how he talked in public and how he poked fun at himself/his own role/the silliness of it all, that ending for him would have gotten a huge laugh out of him.
But yeah it was a bit odd. I think the ending he originally got, with Matt Smith's Doctor getting a phone call, worked a lot better.
(As for Danny, I'll defend that guy to the death as being one of the best written Moffat characters, and bringing a lot of what I loved about the tone and rhythm of series 8. I know I'm the odd one out here on Gaf for that, but I really, really loved that guy and his arc, and how it helped Clara's arc and how it helped series 8 feel a bit more mature in a way that I really liked).
Yeah, I loved the phone call. They should have just left it at that or did a letter.
(Sorry, can't agree about Pink though. He helped Clara's arc and I did like what they did with him dying and his PTSD, but his personality was awful. Give me Jack, Jamie, Ian, Rory or Nardole any day)
Broken Joystick
At least you can talk. Who are you?
I've watched Midnight so many times, it's always a fascinating watch, especially when you focus on one character for the whole episodes.
Also has one of the bleakest endings in a modern Who episode, where Donna tries to lighten the mood and 10 shuts it down.
edit: On the topic of SJA, I grew up coming home to that on CBBC and it was a perfect accompaniment to Doctor Who. I'd love to see The Trickster make an appearance in a Doctor Who episode.
Pagusas
Elden Member
The Doctors mentioned the Trickster and his brigade on several occasions in regular Who episodes.
Broken Joystick
At least you can talk. Who are you?
Turn Left is essentially what I'm imagining I suppose, but with an actual appearance by The Trickster. I just think it's a really simple but effect design for a villain.
CrimsonFist
Member
Got a mention in Torchwood too.
It's a great concept for a villain in a show about time travel. Although Turn Left would be hard to top if they did do another "what if" story.
Kinglypuff
Neo Member
I mean, The Doctor is a way bigger dick to Danny than Danny himself has ever been. He treated him with nothing but comtempt for most of the season because of his hatred of soldier, and Danny rightfully calls on the hypocrisy of this since The Doctor often actually makes soldiers out of people. Of course, he's not perfect and has flaws, but he's not wrong about that.
I feel like Danny (and Clara, and season 8 as a whole too) get more hate than they deserve because they're not afraid to question the protagonist's character and choices. That makes me sad because I love all three of them.
And if that was sanctioned by Chibnall, it would give me a whole lotta faith in him as a showrunner. Gotta respect that troll game xD
Bobby Roberts
Banned
It's weird to think we're less than a day from the end of 12's last season, and we've only got one more hourlong to go.
This has been a pretty good season. I think it's his best, honestly. Doesn't have his best moment (that's still the War speech in the Zygon two-parter), but I think this is the season I'll be returning to most often in a couple years when I wanna get a Capaldi fix.
This has been a pretty good season. I think it's his best, honestly. Doesn't have his best moment (that's still the War speech in the Zygon two-parter), but I think this is the season I'll be returning to most often in a couple years when I wanna get a Capaldi fix.
Exterminieren
Banned
I was super high on the first half of the season, but The Lie of the Land, Empress of Mars and The Eaters of Light really took the wind out of its sails for me. They downplayed my favourite element of the season up until that point; Bill and the Doctor's lovely, teacher-and-student rapport made the first half so fresh, but those episodes recast Bill as a far more generic companion, and really sapped my enthusiasm with it.
Looks to be ending strong, mind.
Looks to be ending strong, mind.
This is about where I'm at. I'd probably put it between 9 (top-tier) and 8 (a few strong episodes but a bit flimsy overall). And if we are discussing series 8 again, I second the complaint that the writing on Twelve aims for "gruff but lovable" but most of the time just comes across as "dick", particularly to Danny.
Solid Sora
Member
Season 8 was the last time I enjoyed Who on a weekly basis. I felt that every episode in that series brought something interesting and felt kinda fresh (except In the Forest of the Night, fuck that episode). Even the goofy Gatiss episode had that "we all become stories" moment which was great.
The only episode that I truly liked in S9 was Heaven Sent, which I consider one of the finest pieces of writing and acting this show had since the revival. Other than that, it was a very forgettable season for me.
As for this season, weirdly enough I actually liked everything Moffatt wrote for it, but other than that it was very lukewarm, and I feel most of the other writers had no idea how to write Bill.
I just hope the finale won't follow the Capaldi pattern this time around with a phenomenal first part and a second part that shits the bed. I'm hoping for a strong finisher this time around.
The only episode that I truly liked in S9 was Heaven Sent, which I consider one of the finest pieces of writing and acting this show had since the revival. Other than that, it was a very forgettable season for me.
As for this season, weirdly enough I actually liked everything Moffatt wrote for it, but other than that it was very lukewarm, and I feel most of the other writers had no idea how to write Bill.
I just hope the finale won't follow the Capaldi pattern this time around with a phenomenal first part and a second part that shits the bed. I'm hoping for a strong finisher this time around.
I actually liked his haircut and look most at the beginning of S8, even the Victorian suit in Deep Breath. He looks older now. As a character he was actually at his most interesting for me too in episodes like Deep Breath, Into the Dalek, and Listen when he was darker, more serious, and less human. I liked the guitar playing and sunglasses of Season 9, but sadly 12 has transitioned more and more into a generic safe Doctor in S10.
I'd stil rank all the series as 5 > 9 > 6 > 8 > 7> 2 > 4 > 1 > 3 > 10.
But Moffat was pretty specific that the Doctor had only thirteen lives, we know all of them, they were all at the final battle at Gallifrey and none of them was a woman. Just stupid IMO.
Yeah, Danny Pink is by far the worst thing about S8.
Final random prediction before it all goes down tonight: I agree that it's very unlikely at this point that any of the companions will continue with the next Doctor, but Bill's apparent death at the end of the last episode is a red herring. She'll survive this season. It's all there to distract you from the real death coming up: Nardole. People sort of forget they're going to have to get rid of him too, and if one of the two of them will be there, alive and well, at christmas, it'll be Bill rather than Nardole.
That was established long before Moffat did though. Everyone referring to the first three Doctors as the first three incarnations in The Three Doctors, Davison referring to himself as the fifth incarnation in the Five Doctors, and a lot of other references all over the show (mainly when multiple Doctors or Timelords were involved, or when an enemy popped back up after not being seen for years).
Brain of Morbius really was the odd one out really, and even within the context of that episode it makes more sense to read that moment as Morbius' own faces, instead of the Doctor's. In fact, Moffat did exactly what you guys are clamoring for with making the Doctor's history more complicated, by introducing the previously unheard of War Doctor between the Classic and Modern Series. That is narratively a lot more satisfying than putting a bunch of Doctors pre-Hartnell (which is an era we should never explore in too much detail anyway). At this point I just see it as honoring that actor by definitely putting him as the first, although, again, that was already done decades before Moffat ever wrote for the show.
You can still put some wiggle room pre-Hartnell if you're so inclined as there's enough mystery left there, but nothing Moffat said on the show changes anything about it. He was just following the show's own rules.
That was established long before Moffat did though. Everyone referring to the first three Doctors as the first three incarnations in The Three Doctors, Davison referring to himself as the fifth incarnation in the Five Doctors, and a lot of other references all over the show (mainly when multiple Doctors or Timelords were involved, or when an enemy popped back up after not being seen for years).
Brain of Morbius really was the odd one out really, and even within the context of that episode it makes more sense to read that moment as Morbius' own faces, instead of the Doctor's. In fact, Moffat did exactly what you guys are clamoring for with making the Doctor's history more complicated, by introducing the previously unheard of War Doctor between the Classic and Modern Series. That is narratively a lot more satisfying than putting a bunch of Doctors pre-Hartnell (which is an era we should never explore in too much detail anyway). At this point I just see it as honoring that actor by definitely putting him as the first, although, again, that was already done decades before Moffat ever wrote for the show.
You can still put some wiggle room pre-Hartnell if you're so inclined as there's enough mystery left there, but nothing Moffat said on the show changes anything about it. He was just following the show's own rules.
N7Commander95
Member
Lie of the land was such a let down, but I loved Empress of Mars and The Eaters on light - The former being a lot of fun and the later being one of my favorite episodes of all time.
I love when Doctor Who gets lyrical and mythological and the fact that the monster was designed after the Pictish Beast made the historian in absolutely overjoyed
I love when Doctor Who gets lyrical and mythological and the fact that the monster was designed after the Pictish Beast made the historian in absolutely overjoyed
Sir_Crocodile
Member
The bit with Sarah Jane and Davros was my favourite part though. And made Davros's point far more emphatic.
Pretty sure out of all of them, The Doctor seeing Martha threaten to destroy the Earth must've been some cold shit.
paradox121
Member
I agree that I think Nardole gets the heroic death. And I know it would be horrible, but at this point I kinda what Bill to be 'fixed' and then refuse to travel with the Doctor anymore. I know it's not the Doctor's fault but he's clearly prioritising Missy over her, which ultimately led to years stuck in some hellish existence with only someone conspiring to kill her for company.
Seeing where things seem to be heading at Christmas, I think you need to end this season with the Doctor at his lowest point, one companion dead the other hating him.
I was always a bit bummed about how they treated Davros in that episode. After the Master, he's pretty much the biggest villain you can have on the show (when talking about individuals, not alien species), and he got pretty much burned on a cameo.
Davros has always been a bit of a problem though - Genesis of the Daleks was (rightly so) one of the biggest and most well-known stories the show had ever done and was highly regarded as soon as it aired, and Davros was a big part of that. But every story that used him afterwards in the classic series (which was pretty much every Dalek story) didn't know how to use him. There's always a bit of basic satisfaction in seeing a verbal showdown between the Doctor and Davros, and on that level it sort of works almost every time, but they were never able to figure out a second story worth telling for him. Series 4 wasted the opportunity way too much for me.
I feel like the series 9 opener is the first time they gave Davros an actual story (and a very fun one at that) since Genesis. Not counting Big Finish etc of course, just talking TV. A story that actually uses him very well, and actually uses his character beyond vaguely ranting about how the Doctor is just as evil as he is.
At the time, Journey's End really pissed me off for wasting one of the show's best villains like that. He was just there because he was the next (maybe last?) of the big well-known villains on the list left for the new series, after Daleks-Cybermen-Master. He didn't get the room or the story someone of his stature deserved.
Very happy they got to correct that in series 9 though. Now that I got the story I wanted, I promise I'll stop being grumpy about it.
Sir_Crocodile
Member
Journey's End was the best he'd been since Genesis (though nowhere near as good as Genesis obviously). He should be even more nutso coming out of the Time War.
Ending with the hand sucked though.
Child Davros in Apprentice/Familiar was urgh
Ending with the hand sucked though.
Child Davros in Apprentice/Familiar was urgh
acheron_xl
Member
Yeah, I think they did some good work in S9. It doesn't hurt that Julian Bleach is amazing as Davros. Really killed it with the casting there.
Sir_Crocodile
Member
Yeah, Bleach is superb. Costume in nuwho is great too. So often in the post-Genesis classic stories, he just looked awful. Especially in Remembrance (which is my all-time favourite who serial).
Best part of that two-parter: hearing a snippet of McCoy ranting about 'unlimited rice pudding!!!'. Of all the old Davros episode audio clips to include, that one is clearly the golden highpoint.
It again reminded me that they could totally still use McCoy as the Doctor. He looks older, sure, but he's still recognizable as his old self (like Davison was in that Tennant short, and how, sadly, Colin Baker maybe isn't anymore). I didn't like the Hobbit films (and only saw the first one, fell asleep during the second one), but McCoy still totally has that energy.
If Davison ever gets around to making a new short, I wouldn't mind the BBC giving them a little bit of a budget just so he can make it a tongue-in-cheek in-universe Doctor Who story. Although it's probably the underdog status that made the first one work so well.
It again reminded me that they could totally still use McCoy as the Doctor. He looks older, sure, but he's still recognizable as his old self (like Davison was in that Tennant short, and how, sadly, Colin Baker maybe isn't anymore). I didn't like the Hobbit films (and only saw the first one, fell asleep during the second one), but McCoy still totally has that energy.
If Davison ever gets around to making a new short, I wouldn't mind the BBC giving them a little bit of a budget just so he can make it a tongue-in-cheek in-universe Doctor Who story. Although it's probably the underdog status that made the first one work so well.
Dr Zhivago
Member
They were going to kill the Trickster off if SJA had continued. Also, Jo Grant was going to reappear and they wanted Ace to show up as well.
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