The UK politicians asked for it not the UK population. And EU, the undemocratic institution governed basically by the Council isn't more left-leaning, it's the same shit, the front they use to improve EU's reputation, the Parliament is, which was crippled though from the beginning of the union and it's basically useless. CETA is just another step towards the slow dissolution of any social democracy left in Europe and the marginalization of the middle class just like it happened in the US (the second part not the first, US was always the puppet of corporations ever since they became powerful enough to influence governments).
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EU & Canada to sign free-trade agreement (CETA) on Sunday
- Thread starter chadskin
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The UK politicians asked for it not the UK population. And EU, the undemocratic institution governed basically by the Council isn't more left-leaning, it's the same shit, the front they use to improve EU's reputation, the Parliament is, which was crippled though from the beginning of the union and it's basically useless. CETA is just another step towards the slow dissolution of any social democracy left in Europe and the marginalization of the middle class just like it happened in the US (the second part not the first, US was always the puppet of corporations ever since they became powerful enough to influence governments).
Royal_Phalanx
Member
Free movement with Canada would be great. I hope one day the conditions will be right for developed countries in the West to form these kinds of deals with each other. Imagine the opportunities for citizens+ the close economic links making it easier to do business
Buba Big Guns
Banned
Although still a ways off, I think we're headed towards that direction. As the world becomes more globalized, it seems like this is the rational eventual outcome.
UK stays losing yet again, although a Canada/UK/Aus/NZ pact would be pretty good if it ever happened.
gutter_trash
Banned
Killer Queen
Banned
Is this going to make our dollar not shit any time soon?
I'd like to go back to having reasonably priced videogames
I'd like to go back to having reasonably priced videogames
Royal_Phalanx
Member
as a dual citizen, I can tell you it is the shit
As a UK citizen I'll get fucked by brexit because I want to work in Europe, I'm jealous of your dual-citizenness
Jesus christ what. How can milk cost that little, what do you even feed the cows?
Fuck me sideways, I would kill to be able to buy milk that cheap.
I pay, at minimum, at least double to triple that.
Also I guess milk prices in Halifax are well above the national average. For whatever reason.
Uh-huh. How does CETA do this exactly?
killer rin
Member
Is this going to make our dollar not shit any time soon?
I'd like to go back to having reasonably priced videogames
Don't worry, even if our Dollar went back to par tomorrow, companies wouldn't reduce prices for another couple of years
yeah, just ask the US how they feel about getting sued by that canadian oil company through nafta
Ask Canada how it feels about being one of the most sued countries in the world, or how it barely ever wins NAFTA cases against the USA or how even if it does win them, the USA shrugs the ruling off and decides to not comply.
Killer Queen
Banned
I didn't post the second quote lol.
As for the first one though, fml
NuffDREW4two
Member
Please let it make a difference.
Edit: Aw crap, it looks bad on mobile dark theme.
Mechanized
Member
Will this make our dollar any stronger at all?
Farmers are heavily subsidized. It used to cost 0,65 2 years ago. Then 0,55 and now that. I don't understand it myself really.
killer rin
Member
:lol I don't even know how that happened. Fixed it
curiouscharles
Member
I sell clothes imported from Italy and Belgium for a living, and CETA will save me $60,000 CAD a year in import duties, while allowing me to lower my prices by ~25%, obviously leading to more sales, etc.
Essentially, HALLELUJAH MOTHERFUCKER.
Essentially, HALLELUJAH MOTHERFUCKER.
If I relember well we have an overproduction issue in EU. We had production quota but it was removed few years ago.
I don't drink much milk being mildly lactose intolerant (used to be worse so I became accustomed to not having it) but I will say that my preferred brand of lactose-free milk is around $2.75 a liter.
It's kinda ridiculous. The regular stuff is around $2. Everything dairy kinda sucks price-wise but we do have pretty great variety in cheeses everywhere at least! (Quebec).
And although I see it, we never ever buy bagged milk. I so rarely see that now at anyone's house. Saw it a lot when I was a kid but it's not nearly as popular now. I hated it. Cut too small, cut too big, floppy bag over edge. It's a science and it's annoying. Giant ass bag (they come in a big bag of three milk bags) taking up all kinds of space in the fridge too. You prop it up or lay it flat. Fuck all that. Gimme a carton with a plastic pour spout all day.
Booze, dairy, gas, etc. All kinda pricey here when compared to the USA. Even when our dollar is close.
It's kinda ridiculous. The regular stuff is around $2. Everything dairy kinda sucks price-wise but we do have pretty great variety in cheeses everywhere at least! (Quebec).
And although I see it, we never ever buy bagged milk. I so rarely see that now at anyone's house. Saw it a lot when I was a kid but it's not nearly as popular now. I hated it. Cut too small, cut too big, floppy bag over edge. It's a science and it's annoying. Giant ass bag (they come in a big bag of three milk bags) taking up all kinds of space in the fridge too. You prop it up or lay it flat. Fuck all that. Gimme a carton with a plastic pour spout all day.
Booze, dairy, gas, etc. All kinda pricey here when compared to the USA. Even when our dollar is close.
When people applaud a trade agreement like this they applaud multinationals. This isn't for citizens at all this is just the tip of the mountain of worse things to come and TTIP is right behind it.
I am against these deals all terrible backdoor stuff. There is no transparency and this isn't democracy at all.
I am against these deals all terrible backdoor stuff. There is no transparency and this isn't democracy at all.
This right here and everyone who thinks it is for you? You are wrong in every single way. It is multinationals not you because fuck you.
ClosingADoor
Member
Production quota got removed. Lots of farmers bought more cows after that and produce more. It's actually too cheap now and a problem for farmers. They need to produce more to make money, but that also lowers the price even more.
It was passed by all national governments and the bills text could be seen by all. How isn't this democracy? You want a referendum on all trade deals?
Given the text of CETA is available and has been since 2014, what specifically do you have an issue with?
Ceta is unconstitutional in this state in france and Germany, fortunately it will stop the treaty
For those worried about the ISDS provisions and possible sovereignty issues regarding the provision of public goods and regulation of the environment and labour markets, CETA has all the bases covered. From the Joint Interpretative Declaration on the Comprehensive Economic and Trade Agreement (CETA) between Canada and the European Union and its Member States:
- CETA preserves the ability of the European Union and its Member States and Canada to adopt and apply their own laws and regulations that regulate economic activity in the public interest, to achieve legitimate public policy objectives such as the protection and promotion of public health, social services, public education, safety, the environment, public morals, social or consumer protection and the promotion and protection of cultural diversity.
- The European Union and its Member States and Canada affirm and recognise the right of governments, at all levels, to provide and support the provision of public services including in areas such as public health and education, social services and housing and the collection, purification and distribution of water.
- CETA does not prevent governments from regulating the provision of these services in the public interest. CETA will not require governments to privatise any service nor prevent governments from expanding the range of services they supply to the public.
- CETA will not prevent governments from providing public services previously supplied by private service suppliers or from bringing back under public control services that governments had chosen to privatise. CETA does not mean that contracting a public service to private providers makes it irreversibly part of the commercial sector.
- CETA includes modern rules on investment that preserve the right of governments to regulate in the public interest including when such regulations affect a foreign investment, while ensuring a high level of protection for investments and providing for fair and transparent dispute resolution.
- CETA will not result in foreign investors being treated more favourably than domestic investors. CETA does not privilege recourse to the investment court system set up by the agreement.
- CETA clarifies that governments may change their laws, regardless of whether this may negatively affect an investment or investor's expectations of profits. Furthermore, CETA clarifies that any compensation due to an investor will be based on an objective determination by the Tribunal and will not be greater than the loss suffered by the investor.
- CETA includes clearly defined investment protection standards, including on fair and equitable treatment and expropriation and provides clear guidance to dispute resolution Tribunals on how these standards should be applied.
- CETA requires a real economic link with the economies of Canada or the European Union in order for a firm to benefit from the agreement and prevents “shell” or “mail box” companies established in Canada or the European Union by investors of other countries from bringing claims against Canada or the European Union and its Member States. The European Union and Canada are committed to review regularly the content of the obligation to provide fair and equitable treatment, to ensure that it reflects their intentions (including as stated in this Declaration) and that it will not be interpreted in a broader manner than they intended.
And, most importantly:
- CETA moves decisively away from the traditional approach of investment dispute resolution and establishes independent, impartial and permanent investment Tribunals.
- The members of these Tribunals will be individuals qualified for judicial office in their respective countries, and these will be appointed by the European Union and Canada for a fixed term. Cases will be heard by three randomly selected members. Strict ethical rules for these individuals have been set to ensure their independence and impartiality, the absence of conflict of interest, bias or appearance of bias.
- The European Union and its Member States and Canada have agreed to begin immediately further work on a code of conduct to further ensure the impartiality of the members of the Tribunals, on the method and level of their remuneration and the process for their selection. The common aim is to conclude the work by the entry into force of CETA.
- CETA is the first agreement to include an Appeal mechanism which will allow the correction of errors and ensure the consistency of the decisions of the Tribunal of first instance.
There's more, but this is most of the issues people have had covered. Clearly negotiators were listening to the problems people were having with these agreements and changed the structure of the agreement to pre-empt pushback against globalisation and agreements that foster it.
- CETA preserves the ability of the European Union and its Member States and Canada to adopt and apply their own laws and regulations that regulate economic activity in the public interest, to achieve legitimate public policy objectives such as the protection and promotion of public health, social services, public education, safety, the environment, public morals, social or consumer protection and the promotion and protection of cultural diversity.
- The European Union and its Member States and Canada affirm and recognise the right of governments, at all levels, to provide and support the provision of public services including in areas such as public health and education, social services and housing and the collection, purification and distribution of water.
- CETA does not prevent governments from regulating the provision of these services in the public interest. CETA will not require governments to privatise any service nor prevent governments from expanding the range of services they supply to the public.
- CETA will not prevent governments from providing public services previously supplied by private service suppliers or from bringing back under public control services that governments had chosen to privatise. CETA does not mean that contracting a public service to private providers makes it irreversibly part of the commercial sector.
- CETA includes modern rules on investment that preserve the right of governments to regulate in the public interest including when such regulations affect a foreign investment, while ensuring a high level of protection for investments and providing for fair and transparent dispute resolution.
- CETA will not result in foreign investors being treated more favourably than domestic investors. CETA does not privilege recourse to the investment court system set up by the agreement.
- CETA clarifies that governments may change their laws, regardless of whether this may negatively affect an investment or investor's expectations of profits. Furthermore, CETA clarifies that any compensation due to an investor will be based on an objective determination by the Tribunal and will not be greater than the loss suffered by the investor.
- CETA includes clearly defined investment protection standards, including on fair and equitable treatment and expropriation and provides clear guidance to dispute resolution Tribunals on how these standards should be applied.
- CETA requires a real economic link with the economies of Canada or the European Union in order for a firm to benefit from the agreement and prevents “shell” or “mail box” companies established in Canada or the European Union by investors of other countries from bringing claims against Canada or the European Union and its Member States. The European Union and Canada are committed to review regularly the content of the obligation to provide fair and equitable treatment, to ensure that it reflects their intentions (including as stated in this Declaration) and that it will not be interpreted in a broader manner than they intended.
And, most importantly:
- CETA moves decisively away from the traditional approach of investment dispute resolution and establishes independent, impartial and permanent investment Tribunals.
- The members of these Tribunals will be individuals qualified for judicial office in their respective countries, and these will be appointed by the European Union and Canada for a fixed term. Cases will be heard by three randomly selected members. Strict ethical rules for these individuals have been set to ensure their independence and impartiality, the absence of conflict of interest, bias or appearance of bias.
- The European Union and its Member States and Canada have agreed to begin immediately further work on a code of conduct to further ensure the impartiality of the members of the Tribunals, on the method and level of their remuneration and the process for their selection. The common aim is to conclude the work by the entry into force of CETA.
- CETA is the first agreement to include an Appeal mechanism which will allow the correction of errors and ensure the consistency of the decisions of the Tribunal of first instance.
There's more, but this is most of the issues people have had covered. Clearly negotiators were listening to the problems people were having with these agreements and changed the structure of the agreement to pre-empt pushback against globalisation and agreements that foster it.
As long as interest rates remain low and commodity prices are battered i doubt it. However this should give an economic boost which may help a little.
ClosingADoor
Member
Source?
Germany ruled earlier this month it was not http://www.dw.com/en/germanys-top-court-allows-ceta-trade-deal-to-go-ahead/a-36029183
Can't find a thing about France.
HarryHengst
Member
At least here in the Netherlands all political parties are pretty much the same so it really doesnt matter who you vote for, the differences are marginal in the end. Every single party embraces neoliberalism and capitalism because There Is No Alternative in their eyes. So no, its not really democracy because they dont listen to voters, they listen to the lobbies of corporations. All parties feel that we need to bend to the will of corporations or else they will leave and take their jobs with them, so its pretty much a race to the bottom. Its not a coincidence that the Netherlands is a favorite of multinationals for tax avoidance reasons.
US would put so much pressure on Canada, in our paranoia of terrorists coming freely over our border.
robertsan21
Member
so what does this mean as a consumer?
Can I order goods" videogames, clothes etc" from Canada and not have to pay some crazy sales tax when it enters sweden?
Is it easier for EU members to move to Canada and work?
Can I order goods" videogames, clothes etc" from Canada and not have to pay some crazy sales tax when it enters sweden?
Is it easier for EU members to move to Canada and work?
ClosingADoor
Member
You'd think that if the population wanted it so bad, then there would be political parties with those stances. And look, there are: SP, PVV, ChristenUnie, GroenLinks and SGP voted against it. So who is not listening to voters exactly?
And yes, everyone embraced capitalism, because well, it is a very effective system. Any alternatives out there are at the moment that have increased living quality as much for regular people? I haven't seen them.
Yea they could just switch to all these other workable systems:
Liberation (in french) https://www.google.fr/amp/www.liber...stitutionnel_1524486?client=ms-android-google
And for germany in your link :
Well, you asked:
Make mcdonalds seem like groumet
Nope, tax isn't covered by free trade agreements, only duty.
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