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[Shinobi]

I really hate these new tire rules...they don't make a lick of sense.

 

[NLB2]

I hear you man.

 

[Shinobi]

MELBOURNE, March 4 (Reuters) - Times from Friday's practice sessions for Sunday's Australian Formula One Grand Prix.


First session

*1. Vitantonio Liuzzi (Italy) Red Bull, 1:25.967
*2. Pedro de la Rosa (Spain) McLaren 1:26.480
*3. Ricardo Zonta (Brazil) Toyota 1:27.265
4. Juan Pablo Montoya (Colombia) McLaren 1:27.425
5. David Coulthard (Britain) Red Bull 1:27.573
6. Felipe Massa (Brazil) Sauber 1:27.971
7. Mark Webber (Australia) Williams 1:28.269
8. Jarno Trulli (Italy) Toyota 1:28.366
9. Jenson Button (Britain) BAR 1:28.632
10. Christian Klien (Austria) Red Bull 1:28.834
11. Nick Heidfeld (Germany) Williams 1:29.172
12. Rubens Barrichello (Brazil) Ferrari 1:29.227
13. Ralf Schumacher (Germany) Toyota 1:29.285
14. Jacques Villeneuve (Canada) Sauber 1:29.332
*15. Robert Doornbas (Monaco) Jordan 1:29.370
16. Takuma Sato (Japan) BAR 1:31.364
17. Tiago Monterio (Portugal) Jordan 1:32.348
18. Narain Karthikeyan (India) Jordan 1:38.175




Second session

*1. Pedro de la Rosa (Spain) McLaren 1:25.376
2. Kimi Raikkonen (Finland) McLaren 1:25.676
3. Nick Heidfeld (Germany) Williams 1:25.940
4. Michael Schumacher (Germany) Ferrari 1:26.081
5. Juan Pablo Montoya (Colombia) McLaren 1:26.227
6. Felipe Massa (Brazil) Sauber 1:26.357
7. Fernando Alonso (Spain) Renault 1:26.562
8. Jenson Button (Britain) BAR 1:26.611
9. Rubens Barrichello (Brazil) Ferrari 1:26.639
10. Giancarlo Fisichella (Italy) Renault 1:26.667
*11. Ricardo Zonta (Brazil) Toyota 1:26.808
12. David Coulthard (Britain) Red Bull 1:27.017
13. Ralf Schumacher (Germany) Toyota 1:27.017
14. Jarno Trulli (Italy) Toyota 1:27.195
15. Mark Webber (Australia) Williams 1:27.329
16. Jacques Villeneuve (Canada) Sauber 1:27.513
17. Christian Klien (Austria) Red Bull 1:27.544
18. Takuma Sato (Japan) BAR 1:27.891
19. Narain Karthikeyan (India) Jordan 1:28.168
*20. Robert Doornbas (Monaco) Jordan 1:28.620
*21. Vitantonio Liuzzi (Italy) Red Bull 1:28.926
22. Tiago Monterio (Portugal) Jordan 1:29.671

(* denotes test drivers who will not compete in Sunday's race)


Heh, McLaren making an early season statement in that second session...Montoya had the top time for most of it, and Kimi went back out on a one lap flier to try and get the top time. Guess those guys will be happy. Can't help but think that Ferrari's playing a little possum though, not unlike last year...Schumacher pretty much pulled that time out of thin air.

BTW, the only non-Ferrari Bridgestone runners this year is Jordan...even the Ferrari-powered Sabuers are running Michelin rubber now. No surprise I guess...Michelin's clearly the best overall tire, while Bridgestone's got half their R&D team in Modena.

 

[LusDekkar]

Don't Minardi run bridgestone as well?

Anyways I was there today finally got to see the f1 cars back in action on track the engines sound so nice!!

Wasn't the first time i've seen an f1 car this year though. I went to the Street parade on wednesday... the one where they were giong at around 200km\h through city streets lined with 150000 ppl when they were only suppose to do 80km\h. Apprently it was unsafe and there's been quite a media beat up about it. I reckon they're making too much of fuss about it, everyone ther ehad a great time. Pizzonia was going nuts, I think he did around 4 or 5 laps of the 'circuit', which was the most.


http://lusdekkar.customer.netspace.net.au/pizza.avi
http://lusdekkar.customer.netspace.net.au/PICT4752.JPG
http://lusdekkar.customer.netspace.net.au/PICT4754.JPG

Ambrose's V8, he lit up his tyres good, i couldn't breathe
http://lusdekkar.customer.netspace.net.au/PICT4751.JPG


The surprise of the day for me was how good Red Bull went today. Can't read too much into today's times though because i think alot of ppl were conserving their engines for qualy and the race. Rain tomorrow and clearing showers on sunday so sucks to be me out in the cold

Oh here's a picture just for shinobi, I didn't take many pics today beacuse they mostly turned out like this one..
http://lusdekkar.customer.netspace.net.au/PICT4840.JPG

 

[Pimpwerx]

Thanks for the thread Shin. I was gonna start it, but I decided to wait until qualies tonight to post, lest the thread fall off the front page in like an hour. :lol Anyway, I am so geeked right now. I had a shit-eating grin on all last night, epecially once P2 came on SPEED. F1 IS BACK!!! Ah, I really, REALLY missed it. Even the retarded new rules can't dampen my spirits.

Ferrari was sandbagging a little during winter tests, and yesterday. But even then, unless the Macs were doing their usual low-fuel PR stunts, I can't see Michael reeling in Monty and Kimi. Rubens better not get off to a slow start this season too. Anyway, with the new tire regs, it's hard to tell what the situation really is since the Friday practice programs are probably gonna see one driver on a single compound for the entire session to guage wear rates.

The Renaults weren't where I expected them to be. It could be sandbagging, or it could be that they were just the winter testing champs. Too bad it doesn't count for shit. :lol Fisi apparently gave himself the nod to win, so if he's got that much confidence, maybe there's more to the car than we see. The Macs are gonna be challenging for the front row, obviously, but was that just a cheap PR stunt? I mean, PDLR topped the time sheets. That tells me something is amiss. Kimi would have pipped him, but that local yellow compromised his Sector 2 time. The rest of the field is hard to make out right now. It should be interesting tonight.

Anyway, anyone else notice that P1 was utterly forgettable? It might just be me, but the rules and schedule changes made over the last few years have really drained the excitement out of the GP weekend. First they made Saturday qualies damn near meaningless. The only reason I will continue to watch it is b/c I am an F1 enthusiast, not b/c it's any good. The drivers aren't going 100%, so it doesn't quite do it for me. Now Friday practice is becoming meaningless b/c teams will try to limit laps run, except for the 3-car teams. How fucking boring can you get? It's not like any of the changes have made Sunday's race more interesting, so I only hope F1 is eventually reverted back to its pre-2003 format. The non-suck format. :lol

Anyway, at least the Monty-Kimi battle will offer some real excitement. I give Kimi the nod, but JPM has impressed me with how quickly he's come to terms with the car and the team. Maybe this is the big change he really needed to blossom. We'll see. PEACE.

 

[mrklaw]

have they made any changes to qualifying for this year? Last years was stupid, but I think they proposed some half-assed average time thing which will make it even more difficult to follow. I never understood the 'qualify with racing fuel' thing - it just confused things.

Just let them run as fast as they can on almost empty. nice and simple, and easy to see who's fastest.

 

[Pimpwerx]

have they made any changes to qualifying for this year? Last years was stupid, but I think they proposed some half-assed average time thing which will make it even more difficult to follow. I never understood the 'qualify with racing fuel' thing - it just confused things.

Just let them run as fast as they can on almost empty. nice and simple, and easy to see who's fastest.

*sigh* It's changed, but it's not a whole hell of a lot better than before. It seems like an even less entertaining clusterfuck now:

Qualifying will be held over two days, with the final session on Sunday morning. The Sunday and Saturday times will be aggregated.

This will mean more action for the crowd at the circuit on Sunday but the starting grid and pole position will not be decided until shortly before the race.

*snooze* I'm not excited by this news. Practice is worthless. Qualies are worthless. And the races have been worthless going on a full fucking decade now. Oh well, I'll always watch b/c there's always a few gems each season. I just wish that old qualies could return. The truest test of speed should return to F1. PEACE.

 

[Shinobi]

Don't Minardi run bridgestone as well?

Anyways I was there today finally got to see the f1 cars back in action on track the engines sound so nice!!

Wasn't the first time i've seen an f1 car this year though. I went to the Street parade on wednesday... the one where they were giong at around 200km\h through city streets lined with 150000 ppl when they were only suppose to do 80km\h. Apprently it was unsafe and there's been quite a media beat up about it. I reckon they're making too much of fuss about it, everyone ther ehad a great time. Pizzonia was going nuts, I think he did around 4 or 5 laps of the 'circuit', which was the most.


http://lusdekkar.customer.netspace.net.au/pizza.avi
http://lusdekkar.customer.netspace.net.au/PICT4752.JPG
http://lusdekkar.customer.netspace.net.au/PICT4754.JPG

Ambrose's V8, he lit up his tyres good, i couldn't breathe
http://lusdekkar.customer.netspace.net.au/PICT4751.JPG


The surprise of the day for me was how good Red Bull went today. Can't read too much into today's times though because i think alot of ppl were conserving their engines for qualy and the race. Rain tomorrow and clearing showers on sunday so sucks to be me out in the cold

Oh here's a picture just for shinobi, I didn't take many pics today beacuse they mostly turned out like this one..
http://lusdekkar.customer.netspace.net.au/PICT4840.JPG

You're right about Minardi...they're still using Bridgestone. Kinda ironic that Ferrari was the only team that initially didn't vote for them to race this weekend. I was looking at the times graphics posted after practice last night, including the B and M for the tire denotations, and since Minardi didn't run there was obviously no B showing for them.

Heh, seeing those cars doing their thing on the streets must've been a trip. I've been fortunate enough to look at the BAR Honda and it's engine at the auto show the last couple years, along with the Toyota F1 car last year. Also saw the BMW Williams Engine. Just gazing at such ridiculously advanced, expensive tech in person is a thrill.

That's a nice pic BTW all things considered...managed to catch that car dead center. I was able to take some nice shots at the Toronto Indy last year, and many of them were surprisingly blur free. I figure it was a fluke. :lol I need to throw them up sometime, along with this year's auto show pics.

 

[Shinobi]

Might as well post the times for the two Saturday practice sessions...



Saturday first practice times from Melbourne

1. M.SCHUMACHER Ferrari 1m40.540s
2. BARRICHELLO Ferrari 1m41.933s
3. RAIKKONEN McLaren 1m43.526s
4. KARTHIKEYAN Jordan 1m45.641s
5. R.SCHUMACHER Toyota 1m45.687s
6. SATO BAR 1m46.768s
7. COULTHARD Red Bull 1m48.369s
8. ALBERS Minardi 1m48.566s
9. TRULLI Toyota 1m49.623s
10. BUTTON BAR 1m51.364s
11. MONTEIRO Jordan 1m53.457s
12. FRIESACHER Minardi 1m53.507s





Saturday second practice times from Melbourne

1. RAIKKONEN McLaren 1m27.297s
2. ALONSO Renault 1m27.409s
3. MONTOYA McLaren 1m28.256s
4. FISICHELLA Renault 1m28.571s
5. BUTTON BAR 1m29.577s
6. WEBBER Williams 1m30.299s
7. M.SCHUMACHER Ferrari 1m30.533s
8. SATO BAR 1m30.554s
9. COULTHARD Red Bull 1m30.645s
10. BARRICHELLO Ferrari 1m30.715s
11. HEIDFELD Williams 1m31.375s
12. KLIEN Red Bull 1m31.671s
13. TRULLI Toyota 1m31.701s
14. MASSA Sauber 1m31.736s
15. VILLENEUVE Sauber 1m34.031s
16. R.SCHUMACHER Toyota 1m34.924s
17. ALBERS Minardi 1m35.975s
18. FRIESACHER Minardi 1m40.045s
19. MONTEIRO Jordan 1m40.802s
20. KARTHIKEYAN Jordan 1m40.822



First set of times were in the rain...second set in drying conditions. Kimi waited till the last moment to go out when the track was at the driest to secure top spot.

I really can't wait for the race. I love the Melbourne track...it's an absolute blast to drive on in F1 games. I'm just hoping to see something like the 2003 season where there were a lot of winners, and a relatively close battle for the drivers and constructors titles deep into the fall. Schumacher's still the favourite though, and will continue to be until the 2005 car proves to be a bust of McLaren or Williams 04 proportions.

And man, Jacques needs to step up a bit...I really wanna see him get back at least some of his good rep, but I'm beginning to think that's just a pipe dream. Ah well, I'll keep hoping.

 

[Shinobi]

Qualifying's on the way now on Speed Channel...both Minardi cars just ran with 2005 spec adjustments. If you miss it now, it's on again at midnight.

 

[Do The Mario]

Giant WTF is up with the new tire and engine rules?

Let’s slow the cars down, and then make them faster with better aerodynamics!

 

[Shinobi]

:lol I think the top few times yesterday were already faster then the pole time in 2003. I even heard that one of the BAR engineers talked about the new rules taking away 30% of their downforce from last year, and through winter testing and a ton of know how, they've managed to get it all back. :lol I don't know why they bother with these silly new regulations...they never work, and do nothing but add confusion.

 

[Fresh Prince]

:lol Typical Melbourne Weather
Poor Massa :\

 

[CurlySaysX]

poor sato

 

[Fresh Prince]

Well atleast Michael won't get poll now

 

[Shinobi]

:lol :lol :lol And the heavens have opened...

 

[seanoff]

possibly the most bizzare qualifying ever in F1.

track starts wet, dries with each car, pretty dry for webber and the next 2, then F1 boats would have been more useful. :lol :lol

Can't see michael making up 24 seconds in the remaining practice sessions. cracking

 

[Shinobi]

Schumacher might not break Senna's all time pole record till 2009 with this stupid system in place. :lol



First qualifying times from Melbourne

1. FISICHELLA Renault 1m33.171s
2. TRULLI Toyota 1m35.270s
3. WEBBER Williams 1m36.717s
4. VILLENEUVE Sauber 1m36.984s
5. KLIEN Red Bull 1m37.488s
6. COULTHARD Red Bull 1m38.320s
7. HEIDFELD Williams 1m39.717s
8. BUTTON BAR 1m41.512s
9. KARTHIKEYAN Jordan 1m44.357s
10. RAIKKONEN McLaren 1m44.997s
11. MONTOYA McLaren 1m45.325s
12. BARRICHELLO Ferrari 1m45.581s
13. MONTEIRO Jordan 1m46.846s
14. ALONSO Renault 1m47.708s
15. ALBERS Minardi 1m49.230s
16. FRIESACHER Minardi 1m50.684s
17. R.SCHUMACHER Toyota 1m51.495s
18. M.SCHUMACHER Ferrari 1m57.931s
19. SATO BAR no time
20. MASSA Sauber no time


Hell, at least Villeneuve is fourth...shoot, the system isn't half bad after all. :lol It isn't even worth discussing the relative merits of these times, the weather wreaked that much havoc.

 

[fart]

i kind of wish i could watch this :/

 

[Fresh Prince]

:lol @ Minardi. Now the FIA is pretty pissed off with our kangaroo courts.

 

[CurlySaysX]

Toyota :rock

I really hope Toyota does well this year and at least kicks Hondas Automotive ass.

 

[fart]

does renault still have that cool live web telemetry feed?

 

[megateto]

What did it happen to Alonso? He is Renault's leader driver and the newbie steals the thunder???

PUXA ALONSO¡¡¡¡¡¡¡

 

[LusDekkar]

:lol Typical Melbourne Weather
Poor Massa :\

Try being there!! It rained in the morning.. i got soaked.. then i dried out.. then i got soaked, sun came out for lunch time so i dried out and got kinda hot. Just before qualy it rains again, then dries out, then just as massa is about to start his flying lap it starts to pour (about the time it was at the last corner before starting his lap, i'm sitting near the last corner btw). Gotta feel sorry for massa, qualy was a pure lottery but it's good that webber got 3rd .
After F1 was a the v8 race on which was actually pretty good with a few inicdents that happened in front of me for once. THe v8 race was dry, but as soon as the race finished, it rained again, and the commentators mentoined a severe thunderstorm warning so that's when i decided to call it a day and i went home.

4 seasons in one day melbourne goodness

Race day tomorrow can't wait. I'm gonna rug up extra warm because it's gonna rain in the morning again.

Tonight and Sunday
Mostly cloudy with a few showers clearing during the day. Fresh southwesterly
wind moderating.

Min 11 Max 18

http://mirror.bom.gov.au/products/IDR023.loop.shtml#image
Albert Park is halfway between St Kilda and Melbourne.

EDIT: Oh yeah I forgot to mention, if you're a petrol head this weekend is the weekend to be in melbourne. The Melbourne Motor show is also on this weekend, I went on thursday. I went there because on the website they said montoya and kimi was gonna be there, but only Pedro dela rosa turned up, . Apprently the world debut of the new Mazda MX-5 was here as well, like a few hours before Geneva which i though was pretty cool.

 

[mrklaw]

This is a fucked up qualifying method. I'm not going to bother watching qualy1 if it means nothing. And TV won't give airtime to another hour of F1 on Sundays, so you'll end up with only brief highlights of qualy2 before the race, so it'll lose all its 'drama'. I'd much rather have a simple low fuel run - perhaps not all on the track at once, just have Saturday qualifying but only one run in the order they finished the last race. And let them refuel for the race.

Interesting comment by Ross Brawn on ITV's coverage. Talking about the aero changes, he didn't think it would affect much at all, as they've regained most of it. He thinks they need to address the overtaking issue, and thinks they need significant change to the aero rules - he said the cars don't really need it - you could go back to relying on tyres, which would give much better overtaking opportunites because the braking zones become longer and speeds through corners slower.

 

[Shinobi]

I think the times shown during the dry practice sessions show that these guys haven't lost much speed at all. It's all the more remarkable when you consider they're using harder tires that they have to use a lot longer, along with engines that have to survive two full race weekends.

 

[Pimpwerx]

You'd think I would be bitter b/c Ferrari got hosed yesterday, but I'm not. We will be fighting from the back, and ironically, it has nothing to do with the performance of the car. I think it's just karma. :lol No biggy, the team's won enough, and if the race is relatively incident-free, it'll be more exciting to see them move through the field. But this aggregate system may very well shitcan Michael's chances at Senna's pole record. :? He only needs 3 more, but unless the F2005 is a real winner again, he might need some luck on his side.

As klaw and Shinobi said, the teams haven't lost much at all to last year's cars. Pole was a 1:24.4, and fast lap a 1:24.1 last year. This year, PDLR put in a 1:25.3 on Friday. The track hasn't rubbered in much, so you can bet there's less than that 1sec difference right there. And the tires won't change much. A few years back, Renault left the front tires on one of their cars for the entire race at Spa, and it finished with the legal amount of grooves on the tires. Tires were plenty durable before, so lasting a full race distance won't degrade their grip too much. So looks like they'll end up breaking even this season on speed. Max Moseley is an idiot.

Q2 is pointless this weekend. The pole is Fisi's to lose. Webber should keep a front row finish, unless he cocks up really bad. Likewise, Michael is assured of 18th or lower, just too much time to make up. I expect a few cars t forgo their Q2 laps in favor of whatever technical changes the FIA allows. I guess reducing costs involves reducing excitement. I believe there was already discussion of changing the qualies format early in the season if it turned out to suck. I think it's well on its way to suck already, so maybe a better system can be put in place for Imola. I want pre-2002 qualies format again, and I'll never complain again.

Lastly, interesting comments by Brawn. I said it since they changed the front wing in 2001, the cars have mechanical grip in spades. They've made aero changes like 3 times since 2000, and the times keep dropping. They've put more and more emphasis on the tires, but it doesn't matter since the cars can still pull 3G loads on mechanical grip alone. :lol You gotta respect F1 engineering, these guys are fucking gods. The formula needs major changes, not these incremental steps. But the changes should be made to address overtaking, and not speed reduction. Speed reduction only makes the procession slower, it doesn't make for a good race. Fans have been saying this since the late 90's. When will they finally do something about it? I still say steel brakes. Braking efficiency doesn't drop that severely, but the duty cycle on carbon brakes is ridiculous. Steel brakes of the same size will explode halfway through a race. By going to steel brakes, braking distances will have to increase, or compromises will have to made in other areas. Longer braking zones equals more overtaking opportunities. It would be great is something could be done to actually fix the show. Instead, they just keep trying to take away the other things that made the GP weekend interesting. It's been a while since the Sunday race has been a real showcase for F1 IMO.

Oh well, I top Fisi for the race, simply b/c by the time Button , Monty, Rubens or Kimi slips into 2nd, he'll have a 20-30 second lead. Oh yeah, JV needs to step up his game. Massa's been running like the team leader thus far, clowning JV. Jacques been off to a trundling start so far this weekend. You know I had to fit in some JVille bashing in this post. :lol PEACE.

 

[Shinobi]

:lol Hey, nothing I can say about it...I figured Massa would be faster early in the year regardless, but the gap's a bit too wide for this JV fan to be comfortable. Already he's said that the car is more suited to Massa's driving style, and that he has to adapt his own to the car. That may well be true, but I don't think it's something you wanna say out loud...it just sounds like a bad excuse.

I didn't mind the qualifying format of the last couple years...though it brought a real sense of drama seeing the guys go one at a time. One lap to get it right is pretty cool stuff. But I'm all for going back to the old format. Either way, I wanna see these cars run at their maximum speed, meaning carrying as little fuel as possible. The tire and fuel aspects is what made the previous qualifying format look bush.

 

[Fresh Prince]

I bet you Karthekayan(sp?) will cause a first exit crash :lol
Inexperienced, right in the middle and drives like a (relative) maniac

 

[Shinobi]

Second qualifying is on now.