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Game of Thrones - Season 2 - George RR Martin's Song of Ice and Fire - Sundays on HBO

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L

LuchaShaq

Banned
Fuzzy said:
That's exactly how I read it also.

[ASoS]
The majority of the wildling army staying in the forest in a spread out camp while a small amount of them shoot at the wall or try to get through the gate. The ones in the camp are just chillin' and waiting to relieve the ones attacking when they're tired.


As per Cornballer's wish, I won't post in the other thread at all any more.
Click to expand...

Spoilers related to above spoilers

yeah only so many people can attack the gates at once. Not to mention that due to a lack of men the Night's watch hasn't been able to cut the forest as far back as needed so forest can cover 95%+ of their army without it being LOL BUDGET like Dany's dragons in their covered cages. If you are referring to the Thens that climbed the wall, that's not even that many men.
 
B

Basileus777

Member
LuchaShaq said:
People posting out and out spoilers in the other thread.

So glad I never checked that thread before reading all of the books, assholes ruin everything.
Click to expand...

It's not clear he is doing that. Everything he said has been in the show. Let's not pretend that GOT is subtle about its foreshadowing, it basically browbeats you with its "hints."
 
F

Forsaken82

Member
Amir0x said:
it's the first episode I saw her as Cersei. I really haven't liked her performance up until now, but she plays a plausible embittered wine drinking momma. It's like tailor made for her particular brand of acting. I just don't think Lena can play the conniving, dagger-in-the-back stuff as well.
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I don't think the script has really focused much on that side of Cersei. I Feel like the show has up to this point, painted her as a sympathetic mother who hates the life she was basically forced into. (a complete contrast to Dany ironically)

This was the second episode (the first being the beginning of You win or you die when she opens up to ned about Jaime) that I feel they nailed her true character
 
D

duckroll

Member
Just watched Blackwater. Holy shit. Is this real life? A non-shitty script. Great direction. Tight solid pace. REALLY good character scenes. Good sense of combat scope. And NO DANY!!!!!!!!!!!

I really liked the various touches throughout the episode with the songs, the tense character moments, and subtle emotes. This is the first episode possibly ever in the entire series where I'm convinced that Sansa's actress might actually be able to act. Whoever directed this episode knew what the fuck he was doing.

I've been bitching a lot this season, because I honestly feel that a lot of the writing is poor, the overall direction is lacking, and the budget is really laughable for a show of this scale. No complaints all this week. Except maybe the effects for the wildfire. Looked kinda.... I dunno... campy. But it mostly worked still. The explosion was GREAT.
 
Z

Zoibie

Member
Absolutely incredible episode. I went into this episode a little sceptical, thinking that it would mainly be a lot of action scenes patched together by some throwaway dialogue but I couldn't be more wrong. It was very well structured and a lot more happened than I was expecting. Dinklage was exceptional in this episode and I really hope he doesn't stay out of action for too long.
 
F

Fuzzy

I would bang a hot farmer!
LuchaShaq said:
Spoilers related to above spoilers

yeah only so many people can attack the gates at once. Not to mention that due to a lack of men the Night's watch hasn't been able to cut the forest as far back as needed so forest can cover 95%+ of their army without it being LOL BUDGET like Dany's dragons in their covered cages. If you are referring to the Thens that climbed the wall, that's not even that many men.
Click to expand...
[ASoS]
No, I wasn't talking about them at all because once Jon starts defending the wall against the wildlings in the forest all of the Thens that climbed that wall are already killed. Jon mentioned in one of his chapters that the wildling army are taking shifts in attacking the wall while the Night's Watch don't have the numbers to comfortably do the same in defending the wall.
 
F

Forsaken82

Member
duckroll said:
Just watched Blackwater. Holy shit. Is this real life? A non-shitty script. Great direction. Tight solid pace. REALLY good character scenes. Good sense of combat scope. And NO DANY!!!!!!!!!!!

I really liked the various touches throughout the episode with the songs, the tense character moments, and subtle emotes. This is the first episode possibly ever in the entire series where I'm convinced that Sansa's actress might actually be able to act. Whoever directed this episode knew what the fuck he was doing.

I've been bitching a lot this season, because I honestly feel that a lot of the writing is poor, the overall direction is lacking, and the budget is really laughable for a show of this scale. No complaints all this week. Except maybe the effects for the wildfire. Looked kinda.... I dunno... campy. But it mostly worked still. The explosion was GREAT.
Click to expand...

That would be the guy responsible for a bunch of low budget Horror films including Dog Soldiers and The Descent :p
 
Jibbajabbawockky

Jibbajabbawockky

Member
Amir0x said:
i am pretty sure they're going to find a way around <ASoS>
The Battle at the Wall. There's simply no way they can possibly even come within the ballpark of that battle. So I'm guessing fade to black. Maybe a quick shot of the amassing armies with their mammoths, shadowcats and giants and that's it...
Click to expand...

They'll no doubt have to trim it down, but (ASOS)
I can't picture them just straight up fading to black. If anything, the battle at the wall was more like a prolonged siege- while Blackwater took one evening/night, I always had the impression that the Battle at the Wall took days, with Mance and the Wildlings making repeated attempts to get through. I don't know how you could just fade to black for something that prolonged.

I mean, you have to deal with Ygritte and the Thenns who scale the Wall and attack from the rear. Then you have the Wildlings' initial attack, then attempting to use the turtle, Mag the Mighty down in the tunnel, then Janos Slynt arriving and then Stannis coming in to save the day. Considering its mostly the Night's Watch guys chucking arrows and then the battle in the tunnels and then Stannis, they could spread that out a bit I think and not need to condense all of it.
 
D

duckroll

Member
Forsaken82 said:
That would be the guy responsible for a bunch of low budget Horror films including Dog Soldiers and The Descent :p
Click to expand...

I'm not really familiar with his work. But he definitely brought a very different atmosphere to the show this week. Even the lighting felt right. Really impressed.
 
C

Cornballer

Member
Amir0x said:
It seems HBO will provide an extra budget if the showrunners can prove that the story requires it... so it's a matter of them convincingly arguing for the events in question.
Click to expand...
I imagine that they'll get the same amount or slightly more for S3. I get the feeling that requests for additional cash might be met with "Well, we're giving you twenty episodes instead of ten for this book, so we're sure you'll figure something out..."
 
Lactose_Intolerant

Lactose_Intolerant

Member
duckroll said:
Just watched Blackwater. Holy shit. Is this real life? A non-shitty script. Great direction. Tight solid pace. REALLY good character scenes. Good sense of combat scope. And NO DANY!!!!!!!!!!!

I really liked the various touches throughout the episode with the songs, the tense character moments, and subtle emotes. This is the first episode possibly ever in the entire series where I'm convinced that Sansa's actress might actually be able to act. Whoever directed this episode knew what the fuck he was doing.

I've been bitching a lot this season, because I honestly feel that a lot of the writing is poor, the overall direction is lacking, and the budget is really laughable for a show of this scale. No complaints all this week. Except maybe the effects for the wildfire. Looked kinda.... I dunno... campy. But it mostly worked still. The explosion was GREAT.
Click to expand...

lol, the director was hired one week before shooting because the 1st director had a family emergency. The new director had never seen Game of Thrones.
 
L

LProtag

Member
Jibbajabbawockky said:
They'll no doubt have to trim it down, but (ASOS)
I can't picture them just straight up fading to black. If anything, the battle at the wall was more like a prolonged siege- while Blackwater took one evening/night, I always had the impression that the Battle at the Wall took days, with Mance and the Wildlings making repeated attempts to get through. I don't know how you could just fade to black for something that prolonged.

I mean, you have to deal with Ygritte and the Thenns who scale the Wall and attack from the rear. Then you have the Wildlings' initial attack, then attempting to use the turtle, Mag the Mighty down in the tunnel, then Janos Slynt arriving and then Stannis coming in to save the day. Considering its mostly the Night's Watch guys chucking arrows and then the battle in the tunnels and then Stannis, they could spread that out a bit I think and not need to condense all of it.
Click to expand...

ASoS
Really we need Noye (they had him on screen for a few seconds, didn't they? Can't remember) going down somehow and command shifting to Jon. Then some shots of Jon leading the men on top of the wall as they continue to rain arrows and barrels of ice and rocks down on the wildings. Then Stannis' knights overrunning all the wildlings. The battle is pretty important for Jon's development, so it has to happen somehow.
 
A

apana

Member
InsertNameHere said:
ASoS
Really we need Noye (they had him on screen for a few seconds, didn't they? Can't remember) going down somehow and command shifting to Jon. Then some shots of Jon leading the men on top of the wall as they continue to rain arrows and barrels of ice and rocks down on the wildings. Then Stannis' knights overrunning all the wildlings. The battle is pretty important for Jon's development, so it has to happen somehow.
Click to expand...

[series spoiler]
Just like Qhorin was a huge part of Jon's development. That all turned out well. :(
 
D

duckroll

Member
Zeliard said:
GRRM writing the episode probably didn't hurt.
Click to expand...

Definitely. The writing was really sharp, and scenes felt really tight. Although, to be honest, I think aside from the direction and the writing, what probably helped the most was the entire episode episode focused on one thing. 56 minutes of just King's Landing made for a really focused event, which is what the rest of the series generally lacks.
 
B

Basileus777

Member
InsertNameHere said:
ASoS
Really we need Noye (they had him on screen for a few seconds, didn't they? Can't remember) going down somehow and command shifting to Jon. Then some shots of Jon leading the men on top of the wall as they continue to rain arrows and barrels of ice and rocks down on the wildings. Then Stannis' knights overrunning all the wildlings. The battle is pretty important for Jon's development, so it has to happen somehow.
Click to expand...

IIRC Noye wasn't in season 1 and they gave his lines to other characters.
 
Z

Zeliard

Member
duckroll said:
Definitely. The writing was really sharp, and scenes felt really tight. Although, to be honest, I think aside from the direction and the writing, what probably helped the most was the entire episode episode focused on one thing. 56 minutes of just King's Landing made for a really focused event, which is what the rest of the series generally lacks.
Click to expand...

Well it's probably difficult when they have so many characters and sub-plots to go through and so little overall time to do it. With an episode like Blackwater they have the benefit of having a single event being so dominant and central to the proceedings. I don't know if they necessarily have that luxury with the other episodes.

I think next season will be much more effective in naysayers' eyes since they can spend two seasons plotting out a single book. They were severely constrained with Seasons 1 and 2 but they have more leeway now and that will probably be used to great effect.
 
F

Fuzzy

I would bang a hot farmer!
Poimandres said:
Neil Marshall is awesome. I've been a fan since Dog Soldiers.

Who was originally planned to direct the episode?
Click to expand...
I don't think the director's name has ever been given.

Weiss: We always wanted to do it and we didn’t know if we’d be able to pull it off. I mean, it’s a massive battle and it’s a naval battle and involves so much visual effects. And at the last minute due to a personal emergency the director had to drop out. So we were left without a director and about a week before.
Click to expand...
http://insidetv.ew.com/2012/05/20/game-of-thrones-blackwater/
 
D

duckroll

Member
Fuzzy said:
From a fan favourite to the show's goat in less than a season. Amazing.
Click to expand...

In which dimension was she ever a fan favorite? She was pretty bad even in S1, except we could make fun of her misery back then because there was HOT DROGO to support the scenes!
 
L

LM4sure

Banned
The wildfire was kind of lame. I thought in the book the wildfire spread from the water to land, but it seems like it in the episode it was contained to the water and the fire at the gate was from the archers shooting flaming arrows. I didn't like that. And why were the archers shooting flaming arrows? Because they're cooler than regular arrows?! Kinda dumb I thought. If a regular arrow hits you in the chest it'll kill you as easily as a flaming arrow.
 
E

EatChildren

Currently polling second in Australia's federal election (first in the Gold Coast), this feral may one day be your Bogan King.
I like the idea of Dany's story, and she's hot, but this season it has gone nowhere. Pretty much nothing of value has happened and every dialogue with her consists of "I AM THE MOTHER OF DRAGONS GIVE ME WHAT I WANT" and "WHERE ARE MY DRAGONS?". They've run that into the ground, hard.
 
Z

Zeliard

Member
I've noticed that a lot of ASOIAF fans hate Dany, which makes me wonder how GRRM managed to fuck up the storyline of a girl who commands dragons. Seems like he should have knocked that one out of the ballpark.
 
D

duckroll

Member
EatChildren said:
I like the idea of Dany's story, and she's hot, but this season it has gone nowhere. Pretty much nothing of value has happened and every dialogue with her consists of "I AM THE MOTHER OF DRAGONS GIVE ME WHAT I WANT" and "WHERE ARE MY DRAGONS?". They've run that into the ground, hard.
Click to expand...

A MOTHER DOES NOT LEAVE HER CHILDREN.

I AM A MOTHER.

MOTHER OF DRAGONS.

THE DRAGONS ARE MY CHILDREN.

A MOTHER DOES NOT LEAVE HER CHILDREN.

I AM THE MOTHER OF DRAGONS.
 
L

Lothar

Banned
Zeliard said:
I've noticed that a lot of ASOIAF fans hate Dany, which makes me wonder how GRRM managed to fuck up the storyline of a girl who commands dragons. Seems like he should have knocked that one out of the ballpark.
Click to expand...

A lot of ASOIAF fans hate Dany in the TV show. I don't think a lot hate her in the books. She's one of my favorite 3 characters in the books. I can't stand her in the show.
 
G

Gruco

Banned
So given that the single-focus episodes seem to be a great way to focus the narrative and add importance to certain events, what would make sense for a more focused episode from Storm?

My ideas [SoS]:

1)
Arya's journey through the riverlands with the Brotherhood. Something like from first getting involved with them to the duel between Clegane and Beric. Important story arc (Arya has the most chapters in Storm) but might be too narrow for this kind of thing

2)
Tyrion's trial. Arrest to the Viper/Mountain duel, or even the privy scene. Given what a favorite Tyrion is and the variety of players in this sequence, I could see it working

3)
Battle at the wall. Something like "the wall is yours Jon Snow" until "Stannis!"?

At any rate, would definitely love to see more episodes like this going forward. Much more fun than mechanically powering through the checklist of key events.

Oh yeah, and I agree that Danys rants have been overdone. Given that she has such a small role in Clash I guess the writers wanted to build it up and give one of the bigger characters something more to work with. I think if they toned down her rants after the first one getting into Quarth, it wouldn't have been quite as bad.
 
P

Pkaz01

Member
duckroll said:
A MOTHER DOES NOT LEAVE HER CHILDREN.

I AM A MOTHER.

MOTHER OF DRAGONS.

THE DRAGONS ARE MY CHILDREN.

A MOTHER DOES NOT LEAVE HER CHILDREN.

I AM THE MOTHER OF DRAGONS.
Click to expand...

i think she says i will take what is mine with fire and blood every episode she is in.
 
M

Moaradin

Member
Not many people hated Dany in Season 1. I think it's just because her plot goes nowhere in S2, but if it's the same in the source material, what could HBO do?
 
L

LuchaShaq

Banned
InsertNameHere said:
ASoS
Really we need Noye (they had him on screen for a few seconds, didn't they? Can't remember) going down somehow and command shifting to Jon. Then some shots of Jon leading the men on top of the wall as they continue to rain arrows and barrels of ice and rocks down on the wildings. Then Stannis' knights overrunning all the wildlings. The battle is pretty important for Jon's development, so it has to happen somehow.
Click to expand...

Related to what I quoted.

Noye is one of my favorite characters who truly isn't very important. Noye and Maester Cressen let us know everything you need to know about the three baratheon brothers.


Moaradin said:
Not many people hated Dany in Season 1. I think it's just because her plot goes nowhere in S2, but if it's the same in the source material, what could HBO do?
Click to expand...

Maybe not have the stupid kidnapping twist?

Maybe show how grueling the trip across the wastes is beyond two 2 minute scenes one where she just sends guys out after her horse dies, the other that quickly turned into a budget joke?

All she has done this season is make herself look as worthless/dumb/entitled as her brother but with three baby dragons.
 
F

Fuzzy

I would bang a hot farmer!
Moaradin said:
Not many people hated Dany in Season 1. I think it's just because her plot goes nowhere in S2, but if it's the same in the source material, what could HBO do?
Click to expand...
Not drag it out over the entire season and move what's about to happen next episode up a few episodes.

Massa said:
Cut her screen time in half.
Click to expand...
Another good suggestion.
Did we really need to see her in episode 8? No, they just didn't want two episodes in a row without her.
 
V

Violater

Member
duckroll said:
The biggest problem with GoT is Dany. Can't wait to see how awful it gets in next week's finale. Lol.
Click to expand...

You are wrong... just wrong...
Danny, Tyrion and Arya are the only characters that I am rooting for.
So far she sounds exactly as portrayed in the books.
Mother of Dragons you all need to deal with it.

Fuzzy said:
Not drag it out over the entire season and move what's about to happen next episode up a few episodes.

Another good suggestion.
Did we really need to see her in episode 8? No, they just didn't want two episodes in a row without her.
Click to expand...
Her journey is dragged out even more in the books, so I would say there was some abbreviation.
 
Z

Zeliard

Member
Lothar said:
A lot of ASOIAF fans hate Dany in the TV show. I don't think a lot hate her in the books. She's one of my favorite 3 characters in the books. I can't stand her in the show.
Click to expand...

Yeah as someone who's generally enjoyed the show quite a bit I can't say that Dany does much for me, outside of being played by an actress who is decidedly not unattractive.

I loved the final scene in the first season and some of her interactions with Drogo, but outside of that they haven't really done much with the character at all, and in Season 2 her scenes are just overly repetitive and poorly-paced.
 
C

CLEEK

Member
Having only read the first book (after seeing season 1), I expected Dany's plot line to be far more eventful in season 2. But really, nothing of importance has happened. If see leaves Qarth (sp?) with her dragons, she'll be back to where she was at the start of the season.

The limited acting ability of Emilia Clarke is just the final nail in the coffin. The times she needs to project anger or authority, she just comes of all whiney and annoying.
 
R

RamzaIsCool

The Amiga Brotherhood
Moaradin said:
Not many people hated Dany in Season 1. I think it's just because her plot goes nowhere in S2, but if it's the same in the source material, what could HBO do?
Click to expand...

series spoiler
Imo the plot goes nowhere in the books either, we are 5 books in and she still hasn't crossed the ocean. Book 5 is the biggest offender with her angsty teenage love bs. They better cast Daario perfect to make those parts bareble later on.
 
V

Violater

Member
RamzaIsCool said:
series spoiler
Imo the plot goes nowhere in the books either, we are 5 books in and she still hasn't crossed the ocean. Book 5 is the biggest offender with her angsty teenage love bs. They better cast Daario perfect to make those parts bareble later on.
Click to expand...

series spoiler
I sat today wondering how will they get the dragons across the ocean
 
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